ADVERTISEMENT

“Too many guys think they are Aaron Donald”

The Spin Meister

Well-Known Member
Gold Member
Nov 27, 2012
35,515
45,980
1
An altered state
“And there is only one Aaron Donald” Or so says. Arch Franklin. An interesting comment requiring clarification as to what he meant. Have to assume the d linemen think they can copy Donald’s style and be successful.

Well, it’s the coaching staff’s job to teach them proper technique that is successful for them. And if players don’t learn or ignore their coaching they should be benched and play kids that accept coaching, learn, and follow instructions. Even if you bench a more talented player it necessary and the player will get the message as will,others. Pretty simple.

And the players themselves should be smart enough to improvise and adapt within a game. Try different things. Mix it up. See what works for a particular opponent.

I played D end at a small school back in the dinosaur years. ......Fred Flintstone was our fullback and Nernst Rubble a slot receiver! Anyway.......I was 5’ 10” and 172 lbs. Played against a lot of guys 30-40 lbs heavier and taller. But could always figure out a way to play them. Used quickness, technique, and angles. Once played against a TE that made all state as a junior. Was 6’3” about 230, no fat. Figured I could be quicker......on first play he fired out and drove me eight yards off the ball on a power sweep. Next play I tried to shot a gap and he drove me four yards sideways. I quickly realized I needed to do something or otherwise it would a long night.

Fourth play, I submarined car walking on my toes and hands into his feet fast as I could, got under him, and reached out to make a tackle. Next play, did the same and forced the running back back to go wider so linebacker made the tackle. Kept tying up the TE so he couldn’t go out on pass routes. I did make many tackles but he did have a stellar game.

Same here with Mich. Our d line was getting pushed straight back the whole game. They kept going chest to chest or shoulder to shoulder when they should have dropped down low into the lineman’s legs, tied up the lineman and allowed the LBs to roam the field. Keep the gains much shorter and force some errors.
 
  • Like
Reactions: PSUfiji and jimarnp
Was thinking about this BS quote too. It is a square shot at Beamon. He is playing at DL at 265. It ain't PJ at 315. Ridiculous to blame the kid when you recruited him, coached him and started him.
 
Agreed Rip, but it was a really, really, really bad game!
No doubt. Among the top five worst I have seen... and I have been a fan for 60 years.

Beside the OL and DL being AWOL.
The youth made few mistakes... Abdul Carter made one bad read... a true freshman mistake... forgiven...young player plays his ass off.

Also did Manny or Yurchick change the game plan from the Purdue game? Just WTF were the thinking?
 
No doubt. Among the top five worst I have seen... and I have been a fan for 60 years.

Beside the OL and DL being AWOL.
The youth made few mistakes... Abdul Carter made one bad read... a true freshman mistake... forgiven...young player plays his ass off.

Also did Manny or Yurchick change the game plan from the Purdue game? Just WTF were the thinking?
It's up there, but I'm not sure it makes the top 5. Some candidates are 1979 Nebraska, 1983 Nebraska, 1984 Notre Dame, 1987 Syracuse, 1992 Stanford, 1996 Ohio State, 1997 Michigan, 1997 Michigan State, 1998 Michigan, 2000 Ohio State, 2016 Michigan, 2018 Michigan. Also the Michigan shutout losses 27-0 and 20-0.

My top 5 is probably more like this:

#1 - 1997 Michigan - The Big Hit, Pre-Season #1 just thoroughly demolished
#2 - 1983 Nebraska - Defending national champs dethroned in first game
#3 - 1997 Michigan State - (allowed 2 200-yard rushers)
#4 - 1996 Ohio State - what turned out to be a good team just dominated up front
#5 - 2000 Ohio State - thoroughly dominated and one our top freshman has his football career ended

We have a tendency not to match up with Michigan well, especially in games played there. I'm not sure this loss stands out much worse than any of the other bad losses for me. At least we scored in the first half. They didn't punt, though. Not sure I remember that happening before.
 
Was thinking about this BS quote too. It is a square shot at Beamon. He is playing at DL at 265. It ain't PJ at 315. Ridiculous to blame the kid when you recruited him, coached him and started him.
I thought it was a shot at himself for recruiting Aaron Donald type size and expecting them to play like him, considering he also said they need to get bigger on the DL.

“It’s all of it. We got to develop, we got to recruit. We got to get bigger. We’re undersized at some spots. Everybody thinks they’re Aaron Donald,” Franklin, invoking the All-Pro defensive end/tackle. “They’re not. Everybody sees Aaron Donald playing undersized. Everybody thinks they’re that guy. And there’s been one of those guys in the last 100 years of football. We need to be more physical. Work on our technique, our fundamentals. It’s all of it. We own all of it. But, give them credit for what they were able to do today.”
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: GregInPitt
IIRC the 2006 game against Mich at the Beav. The score was not a good read on Mich overall performance. Again, they physically dominated us, knocking both Morelli and Clark out of the game. We had to go with Cianciolli (sp) to finished out the game at QB.
 
Add Miami 2001 as one of top 5 destructions. Home game, emotions super-high with Adam walking out. We got absolutely dominated from kick-off. They were a great, great team.
 
  • Like
Reactions: christoph
I thought it was a shot at himself for recruiting Aaron Donald type size and expecting them to play like him, considering he also said they need to get bigger on the DL.

“It’s all of it. We got to develop, we got to recruit. We got to get bigger. We’re undersized at some spots. Everybody thinks they’re Aaron Donald,” Franklin, invoking the All-Pro defensive end/tackle. “They’re not. Everybody sees Aaron Donald playing undersized. Everybody thinks they’re that guy. And there’s been one of those guys in the last 100 years of football. We need to be more physical. Work on our technique, our fundamentals. It’s all of it. We own all of it. But, give them credit for what they were able to do today.”
It seems more like calling someone out to me. He could have said that we have been recruiting like another Aaron Donald. He said 'everybody'. I can't think of anytime in my life where the commenter was not going after someone specifically with that statement
 
At first it was more time needed to build a team, than no depth and now not heavy enough. What will it be next year?
Let me guess: We are an awfully young team. Ugh….
 
It's up there, but I'm not sure it makes the top 5. Some candidates are 1979 Nebraska, 1983 Nebraska, 1984 Notre Dame, 1987 Syracuse, 1992 Stanford, 1996 Ohio State, 1997 Michigan, 1997 Michigan State, 1998 Michigan, 2000 Ohio State, 2016 Michigan, 2018 Michigan. Also the Michigan shutout losses 27-0 and 20-0.

My top 5 is probably more like this:

#1 - 1997 Michigan - The Big Hit, Pre-Season #1 just thoroughly demolished
#2 - 1983 Nebraska - Defending national champs dethroned in first game
#3 - 1997 Michigan State - (allowed 2 200-yard rushers)
#4 - 1996 Ohio State - what turned out to be a good team just dominated up front
#5 - 2000 Ohio State - thoroughly dominated and one our top freshman has his football career ended

We have a tendency not to match up with Michigan well, especially in games played there. I'm not sure this loss stands out much worse than any of the other bad losses for me. At least we scored in the first half. They didn't punt, though. Not sure I remember that happening before.
Agree those were worse losses. To me though the OL and DL non existence in the game made it worse from that perspective. All teams have bad losses but other factors play a roll... turn overs, dropped passes or interceptions, fumbles at key points... etc...
But in this case the OL and DL could have just stayed on the bus.
 
One bad game and the worms come out in droves.
Rip: The Lions can still have a very successful season. I think ten wins is a very realistic target, and still hold onto the hope that the Lions might upset Ahia State.

But the loss to Michigan was painful, and a bit ugly., so it's no surprise that some posters are coming in negative in its wake. Franklin has GOT to focus on recruiting more talented and physical offensive lineman. I'm far less concerned about the DL. PSU has always recruited well when it comes to defensive linemen.
 
Jimmy seems to recruit plenty of fat non-athletic, soft lineman. Don’t get the size thing as the big guys you select are just softies and on the staff.
 
Was thinking about this BS quote too. It is a square shot at Beamon. He is playing at DL at 265. It ain't PJ at 315. Ridiculous to blame the kid when you recruited him, coached him and started him.
I'm guessing the coaching staff has playing weight targets for linemen and we've got some who aren't doing what they've asked.
 
I'm guessing the coaching staff has playing weight targets for linemen and we've got some who aren't doing what they've asked.
Or maybe those targets need to be, and could be very soon, updated in the upward direction.........

I'm made the comment a number of times over the years that Franklin's DE's are too light to hold up against the power running teams that are the top BIG10 teams most years. Players such as Courtney Brown were the exception as if I remember correctly he was 270+. OSU usually has DE's that are at least 15-20 lbs more stout than what Franklin puts on the field. The super quick DE's in Franklin's scheme look great against the average and weak teams on the schedule but don't hold up against teams like this year's Michigan team and OSU most years.

For a defense with Franklin's light DE's to succeed against top offenses the DL has to be backed up by All-American LB's, and obviously with this year's LB group that recipe is a recipe for disaster. So I hope Franklin starts to recruit bigger DE's. Lyons, the only 2023 DE commit, looks like a bigger framed player listed at 6'4" 255 in H.S., but from past experience it seems like instead of fielding a 265-270 lb DE Franklin moves that type of player to DT where he is an under sized DT. That has to change if the future PSU defenses are going to keep from getting run over by the best teams on the schedule.
 
Last edited:
I thought it was a shot at himself for recruiting Aaron Donald type size and expecting them to play like him, considering he also said they need to get bigger on the DL.

“It’s all of it. We got to develop, we got to recruit. We got to get bigger. We’re undersized at some spots. Everybody thinks they’re Aaron Donald,” Franklin, invoking the All-Pro defensive end/tackle. “They’re not. Everybody sees Aaron Donald playing undersized. Everybody thinks they’re that guy. And there’s been one of those guys in the last 100 years of football. We need to be more physical. Work on our technique, our fundamentals. It’s all of it. We own all of it. But, give them credit for what they were able to do today.”
The sad thing about Franklin's quote is that fixing all of that will take a couple of years, if everything is fixed in a timely manner. The issues are recruiting, strength and conditioning, technique and fundamentals, play calling and execution, and mindset training and conditioning. These issues are not fixed overnight.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Gitzit
It's up there, but I'm not sure it makes the top 5. Some candidates are 1979 Nebraska, 1983 Nebraska, 1984 Notre Dame, 1987 Syracuse, 1992 Stanford, 1996 Ohio State, 1997 Michigan, 1997 Michigan State, 1998 Michigan, 2000 Ohio State, 2016 Michigan, 2018 Michigan. Also the Michigan shutout losses 27-0 and 20-0.

My top 5 is probably more like this:

#1 - 1997 Michigan - The Big Hit, Pre-Season #1 just thoroughly demolished
#2 - 1983 Nebraska - Defending national champs dethroned in first game
#3 - 1997 Michigan State - (allowed 2 200-yard rushers)
#4 - 1996 Ohio State - what turned out to be a good team just dominated up front
#5 - 2000 Ohio State - thoroughly dominated and one our top freshman has his football career ended

We have a tendency not to match up with Michigan well, especially in games played there. I'm not sure this loss stands out much worse than any of the other bad losses for me. At least we scored in the first half. They didn't punt, though. Not sure I remember that happening before.
Not sure of the year, but there was a season opening loss in 90 degree heat 14-3 Cincinnati before they were good.
 
I rewatched parts of Michigan's games against Iowa, Indiana and PSU and while everybody - right ow on this site - is pointing fingers at the DL (they were an issue), the real glaring problem was the PSU LBs not filling the running gaps. They were basically non-existent. The Iowa and Indiana LBs did a far, far better job and both teams held Michigan to around 160 to 170 yards rushing - and both were very competitive games. Keep in mind, Maryland also had Michigan on the ropes for a good part of their game.

My point - yes, Michigan has a rock solid team and that should be a heck of a game this year in Columbus. But I think the PSU-Michigan game was more about PSU shortcomings and failures.
 
  • Like
Reactions: GregInPitt
But I think the PSU-Michigan game was more about PSU shortcomings and failures.

Diaz actually used our DL pretty good. He schemed open gaps for LBs to full. The LBs failed to do so or when they did get there, they failed to wrap up and tackle.

I still would have liked some adjustments such as going 5 DL, but at the end of the day our LBs just got schooled.
 
Diaz actually used our DL pretty good. He schemed open gaps for LBs to full. The LBs failed to do so or when they did get there, they failed to wrap up and tackle.

I still would have liked some adjustments such as going 5 DL, but at the end of the day our LBs just got schooled.
And that's being kind. I was shocked on how non-existent they were.
 
And that's being kind. I was shocked on how non-existent they were.
We knew the LB group was going to be the problem all year long. It is surprising nobody really exploited that until UM. I think Diaz ran a really aggressive D to try and stop the bleeding/run game. Doing that left nobody back when a RB broke through the first line of defense. That happened twice in the 3rd and our team must lost their will.
 
Not sure of the year, but there was a season opening loss in 90 degree heat 14-3 Cincinnati before they were good.
That was 1983 after we lost the Kickoff Classic to Nebraska 44-6. Cincinnati had just been dropped to I-AA status that year due to low attendance (fewer than 20,000 per game).
 
We knew the LB group was going to be the problem all year long. It is surprising nobody really exploited that until UM. I think Diaz ran a really aggressive D to try and stop the bleeding/run game. Doing that left nobody back when a RB broke through the first line of defense. That happened twice in the 3rd and our team must lost their will.
I do watch a ton of CF and after the Michigan-PSU game I watched parts of the Iowa game against Michigan on You Tube and their LBs did a really nice job of filling the gaps once those Michigan RBs got past their DL. Now, were they better than Michigan? No, but they kept that game somewhat competitive. Kind of shocking - with PSU's yearly top 10 recruiting - that they can't field LBs like Iowa - or at least close
 
“And there is only one Aaron Donald” Or so says. Arch Franklin. An interesting comment requiring clarification as to what he meant. Have to assume the d linemen think they can copy Donald’s style and be successful.

Well, it’s the coaching staff’s job to teach them proper technique that is successful for them. And if players don’t learn or ignore their coaching they should be benched and play kids that accept coaching, learn, and follow instructions. Even if you bench a more talented player it necessary and the player will get the message as will,others. Pretty simple.

And the players themselves should be smart enough to improvise and adapt within a game. Try different things. Mix it up. See what works for a particular opponent.

I played D end at a small school back in the dinosaur years. ......Fred Flintstone was our fullback and Nernst Rubble a slot receiver! Anyway.......I was 5’ 10” and 172 lbs. Played against a lot of guys 30-40 lbs heavier and taller. But could always figure out a way to play them. Used quickness, technique, and angles. Once played against a TE that made all state as a junior. Was 6’3” about 230, no fat. Figured I could be quicker......on first play he fired out and drove me eight yards off the ball on a power sweep. Next play I tried to shot a gap and he drove me four yards sideways. I quickly realized I needed to do something or otherwise it would a long night.

Fourth play, I submarined car walking on my toes and hands into his feet fast as I could, got under him, and reached out to make a tackle. Next play, did the same and forced the running back back to go wider so linebacker made the tackle. Kept tying up the TE so he couldn’t go out on pass routes. I did make many tackles but he did have a stellar game.

Same here with Mich. Our d line was getting pushed straight back the whole game. They kept going chest to chest or shoulder to shoulder when they should have dropped down low into the lineman’s legs, tied up the lineman and allowed the LBs to roam the field. Keep the gains much shorter and force some errors.
43 and 0 can't roam anywhere. This only works if they aren't on the field.
 
Or maybe those targets need to be, and could be very soon, updated in the upward direction.........

I'm made the comment a number of times over the years that Franklin's DE's are too light to hold up against the power running teams that are the top BIG10 teams most years. Players such as Courtney Brown were the exception as if I remember correctly he was 270+. OSU usually has DE's that are usually at least 15-20 lbs more stout than what Franklin puts on the field. The super quick DE's in Franklin's scheme look great against the average and weak teams on the schedule but don't hold up against teams like this year's Michigan team and OSU most years.

For a defense with Franklin's light DE's to succeed against top offenses the DL has to be backed up by All-American LB's, and obviously with this year's LB group that recipe is a recipe for disaster. So I hope Franklin starts to recruit bigger DE's. Lyons, the only 2023 DE commit, looks like a bigger framed player listed at 6'4" 255 in H.S., but from past experience it seems like instead of fielding a 265-270 lb DE Franklin moves that type of player to DT where he is an under sized DT. That has to change if the future PSU defenses are going to keep from getting run over by the best teams on the schedule.
I believe Mike Morris UM DE hovers close to 300 lbs.
 
Since the OL left the DL on the field for 3.9 qtrs...what did Franklin expect them to do... bull rush for two full games...
In one and go against there strengths. Franklin Tràut and Manny pulled the boner here... not the DL.. He needs to Man up to their epic coaching failure. If he does they might rallyband rebound...if not...we shall see.
 
The sad thing about Franklin's quote is that fixing all of that will take a couple of years, if everything is fixed in a timely manner. The issues are recruiting, strength and conditioning, technique and fundamentals, play calling and execution, and mindset training and conditioning. These issues are not fixed overnight.
Just ask Marshall - he has had 9 years already and has 9 more. Good grief, I will be on social security by then.

Bring in a kick-a$$ Coach - completely different from Franklin. Could it get any worse? We continue the downward trend. Maybe if one of the Villanova-type teams who slug it out with us in the trenches upsets us then this misery can end.

Franklin reached his peak early in the 4th in Columbus in 2017…and it’s been all down hill since then.

it is time.
Kraft - save us!
 
It's up there, but I'm not sure it makes the top 5. Some candidates are 1979 Nebraska, 1983 Nebraska, 1984 Notre Dame, 1987 Syracuse, 1992 Stanford, 1996 Ohio State, 1997 Michigan, 1997 Michigan State, 1998 Michigan, 2000 Ohio State, 2016 Michigan, 2018 Michigan. Also the Michigan shutout losses 27-0 and 20-0.

My top 5 is probably more like this:

#1 - 1997 Michigan - The Big Hit, Pre-Season #1 just thoroughly demolished
#2 - 1983 Nebraska - Defending national champs dethroned in first game
#3 - 1997 Michigan State - (allowed 2 200-yard rushers)
#4 - 1996 Ohio State - what turned out to be a good team just dominated up front
#5 - 2000 Ohio State - thoroughly dominated and one our top freshman has his football career ended

We have a tendency not to match up with Michigan well, especially in games played there. I'm not sure this loss stands out much worse than any of the other bad losses for me. At least we scored in the first half. They didn't punt, though. Not sure I remember that happening before.
All those you referenced were like this if not worse. O$U beat us 63-14 in 2013 although sanctions played a role.
 
I do watch a ton of CF and after the Michigan-PSU game I watched parts of the Iowa game against Michigan on You Tube and their LBs did a really nice job of filling the gaps once those Michigan RBs got past their DL. Now, were they better than Michigan? No, but they kept that game somewhat competitive. Kind of shocking - with PSU's yearly top 10 recruiting - that they can't field LBs like Iowa - or at least close
No talent development is the problem. Raw talent is there yet they don't improve much.
 
No talent development is the problem. Raw talent is there yet they don't improve much.
Exactly!. How do you explain what Bilema has done at Illinois with a team far less talented coming out of high school? I'm beginning to think we need a coach like BOB l to teach "f******" how to play and pIay mean.
Hack's only good year was playing for BOB. BOB's OL coach got the job done, taking a slower back like Zwinak to Wisky and destroying their DL. The biggest word lacking on Franklin's teams seems to be TOUGH.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: MacNit07
Exactly!. How do you explain what Bilema has done at Illinois with a team far less talented coming out of high school? I'm beginning to think we need a coach like BOB l to teach "f******" how to play and pIay mean.
Hack's only good year was playing for BOB. BOB's OL coach got the job done, taking a slower back like Zwinak to Wisky and destroying their DL. The biggest word lacking on Franklin's teams seems to be TOUGH.
A-freaking-men.
 
Exactly!. How do you explain what Bilema has done at Illinois with a team far less talented coming out of high school? I'm beginning to think we need a coach like BOB l to teach "f******" how to play and pIay mean.
Hack's only good year was playing for BOB. BOB's OL coach got the job done, taking a slower back like Zwinak to Wisky and destroying their DL. The biggest word lacking on Franklin's teams seems to be TOUGH.
Bert is a fat piece of crap, but he can coach. He doesn’t get top talent as he’s an ass, but is just perfect for making middling teams good with solid coaching of fundamentals and taking advantage of their strengths.

Jimmy can also make middling teams good (see Vandy) and a achieved it through different means…recruiting. What is clear is that he can’t go from good to elite, not even close. He would need top 3 recruiting classes as he loses every time when he can’t “out talent” his opponent, and often when he has better players.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MacNit07
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT