Cael vs Gable, first 27 finalists...

[21Guns]

Sanderson: 16 wins, 11 losses
Gable: as follows...
1977 Mouriam, lost, 0-1
Campbell, won 1-1
1978 Lewis, lost 1-2
Kinseth, lost, 1-3
1979 Lewis, won 2-3
Trizino, lost, 2-4
Kinseth won, 3-4
DeAnna, lost, 3-5
Palmer, lost 3-6
1980 Glenn, lost, 3-7
Lewis, won, 4-7
Banach, won, 5-7
1981: Zalesky, lost, 5-8
Trizzino, lost, 5-9
DeAnna, lost, 5-10
Banach, won, 6-10
Banach, won, 7-10
1982: Davis, won, 8-10
L Zalesky, lost, 8-11
J. Zelesky won, 9-11
E Banach, lost, 9-12
Bush, won, 10-12
1983: Davis won, 11-12
J Zalesky, won, 12-12
Goldman, lost, 12-13
E Banach, won, 13-13
L Banach, won, 14-13.


So this little exercise kills three myths right away.

Myth 1: PSU does not do as well in the finals as they do in general
Myth 2: Gable's final record is better than Cael's, in fact it is worse THROUGH 27 FINALS(yes, we don't know what the future holds and Gable won so many more in his next decade plus, but FOR NOW, these are the facts). Cael 16-11, Gable 14-13.
Myth 3: Dominant teams should be dominate in the finals in order to prove their greatness.

There. Done.

 

[royboy]

If I read that right, within a 5 year span from 1979 thru 1983, Iowa had 5 finalists on 4 occasions. Mighty impressive.

 

[21Guns]

If I read that right, within a 5 year span from 1979 thru 1983, Iowa had 5 finalists on 4 occasions. Mighty impressive.

Absolutely. This post is not about how many finalists in how many years, this post is about the first 27 finalists, and what they're winning percentage was in the finals.

Yes, you are correct, Dan has it over on Cael, as far as quickest to get 5 finalists in, on 4 seperate occasions. I'm not debating that Cael>Gable, I'm debunking those three myths that some have put forward, about how Gable did better than Cael in the finals, and about how you need to have a higher win percentage on Saturday night, or somehow you are not maximizing your success.

 

[21Guns]

Yes, it did take Dan one less year, to produce 27 finalists, so you have that argument also, but AGAIN, that's not the point of the exercise here.

 

[ZepGraffiti]

Actually Cael was 13-14 with his first 27 finalists & currently sits at 18-15 overall.
Myth might be that PSU was his first gig.

 

[WildTurk]

Does ISU not count now?

 

[21Guns]

No, in fact it does not count. PENN STATE Cael Sanderson compared to IOWA Dan Gable. That's the discussion on the table. Two circle jerk attackers are not in play.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

Sanderson: 16 wins, 11 losses
Gable: as follows...
1977 Mouriam, lost, 0-1
Campbell, won 1-1
1978 Lewis, lost 1-2
Kinseth, lost, 1-3
1979 Lewis, won 2-3
Trizino, lost, 2-4
Kinseth won, 3-4
DeAnna, lost, 3-5
Palmer, lost 3-6
1980 Glenn, lost, 3-7
Lewis, won, 4-7
Banach, won, 5-7
1981: Zalesky, lost, 5-8
Trizzino, lost, 5-9
DeAnna, lost, 5-10
Banach, won, 6-10
Banach, won, 7-10
1982: Davis, won, 8-10
L Zalesky, lost, 8-11
J. Zelesky won, 9-11
E Banach, lost, 9-12
Bush, won, 10-12
1983: Davis won, 11-12
J Zalesky, won, 12-12
Goldman, lost, 12-13
E Banach, won, 13-13
L Banach, won, 14-13.


So this little exercise kills three myths right away.

Myth 1: PSU does not do as well in the finals as they do in general
Myth 2: Gable's final record is better than Cael's, in fact it is worse THROUGH 27 FINALS(yes, we don't know what the future holds and Gable won so many more in his next decade plus, but FOR NOW, these are the facts). Cael 16-11, Gable 14-13.
Myth 3: Dominant teams should be dominate in the finals in order to prove their greatness.

There. Done.

Many different ways to look at this. The other obvious way is to look at Championships won during their first 8 years at each program. Cael has won 6 in 8 years; Gable went 7 for 8 missing only in his first year (Gable won the Championship in 9 of his first 10 years with Iowa State winning his first year, 1977, and Iowa State ending his 9 title streak in 1987). However, Cael has produced 16 Individual Champions during his first 8 years, an average of 2 per year, which is pretty darn impressive. After 1987, Gable didn't win his next Championship until 1991, so he won the NCAA Championship 9 of his first 14 trips at Iowa, so Cael would need to win at least 3 of his next 6 Championships at PSU to match that feat. Given that PSU looks to be a prohibitive favorite the next couple years, Cael could realistically surpass Gable's first 14 years at Iowa at PSU as crazy as that sounds.

 

[21Guns]

Many different ways to look at this. The other obvious way is to look at Championships won during their first 8 years at each program. Cael has won 6 in 8 years; Gable went 7 for 8 missing only in his first year (Gable won the Championship in 9 of his first 10 years with Iowa State winning his first year, 1977, and Iowa State ending his 9 title streak in 1987). However, Cael has produced 16 Individual Champions during his first 8 years, an average of 2 per year, which is pretty darn impressive. After 1987, Gable didn't win his next Championship until 1991, so he won the NCAA Championship 9 of his first 14 trips at Iowa, so Cael would need to win at least 3 of his next 6 Championships at PSU to match that feat. Given that PSU looks to be a prohibitive favorite the next couple years, Cael could realistically surpass Gable's first 14 years at Iowa at PSU as crazy as that sounds.

Another good solid post amigo. Five stars.

 

[Neo_Hawk]

It seems like the point of your "little exercise" was to create 3 myths that I don't think I have ever seen mentioned anywhere, find some favorable (random, 27???) stats to back up these fake myths and post them, only to find out that they really don't prove your point because they don't take in to account that Gable was a first time HC and CS was an experienced HC and on top of that, they actually prove that that Gable was quicker to win titles, both team and individual and his teams were more dominantly represented on the podium.

I am not sure why any PSU fan would want to try and compare CS to Gable at this point, it's not fair to CS and it's not needed. While I think my teams current coaches are great, you have the proof that yours is the greatest coach actively coaching right now, hands down. He is a great coach, great man, I am sure a great husband and father (does he have kids?) and a great representative of our sport. Your team is the reigning champ and prohibitive favorite next year (already). The only thing worth proving, you guys are already proving on the mat. To quote Inigo Montoya, You are using these stats, I do not think they mean what you think they mean.

While I appreciate you pumping up Gable stats, there is only one Dan Gable. But good news for you, there is only one Cael Sanderson and you don't need haphazardly done, poorly thought through statistics to justify his success, amigo.

 

[tikk10]

No, in fact it does not count. PENN STATE Cael Sanderson compared to IOWA Dan Gable. That's the discussion on the table. Two circle jerk attackers are not in play.

Maybe you should've dropped an asterisk or something because it wasn't clear you set the goal posts where you did. (I mean, was ISU not a D1 school while Cael coached there?) Or why you chose to slur the two people who pointed out the obvious flaw in your presentation.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

It seems like the point of your "little exercise" was to create 3 myths that I don't think I have ever seen mentioned anywhere, find some favorable (random, 27???) stats to back up these fake myths and post them, only to find out that they really don't prove your point because they don't take in to account that Gable was a first time HC and CS was an experienced HC and on top of that, they actually prove that that Gable was quicker to win titles, both team and individual and his teams were more dominantly represented on the podium.

I am not sure why any PSU fan would want to try and compare CS to Gable at this point, it's not fair to CS and it's not needed. While I think my teams current coaches are great, you have the proof that yours is the greatest coach actively coaching right now, hands down. He is a great coach, great man, I am sure a great husband and father (does he have kids?) and a great representative of our sport. Your team is the reigning champ and prohibitive favorite next year (already). The only thing worth proving, you guys are already proving on the mat. To quote Inigo Montoya, You are using these stats, I do not think they mean what you think they mean.

While I appreciate you pumping up Gable stats, there is only one Dan Gable. But good news for you, there is only one Cael Sanderson and you don't need haphazardly done, poorly thought through statistics to justify his success, amigo.

This is a somewhat slanted view as Gable, after spending his first several seasons as a Lead Assistant, inherited an Iowa team in 1977 from Gary Kurdelmeier which had just won the NCAA Tournament in 1975 and 1976 - Cael inherited the ISU HC position from Bobby Douglas after 3 years as an Assistant, but ISU was not coming off of back-to-back National Championships. Cael's career since moving to PSU is very comparable to Gable's first 8 years at Iowa. How you say that this is not a "fair comparison" is complete nonsense imho.

 

[Neo_Hawk]

This is a somewhat slanted view as Gable, after spending his first several seasons as a Lead Assistant, inherited an Iowa team in 1977 from Gary Kurdelmeier which had just won the NCAA Tournament in 1975 and 1976 - Cael inherited the ISU HC position from Bobby Douglas after 3 years as an Assistant, but ISU was not coming off of back-to-back National Championships. Cael's career since moving to PSU is very comparable to Gable's first 8 years at Iowa. How you say that this is not a "fair comparison" is complete nonsense imho.

You too are being a little loose with actual facts, and in this case, quotes. First off, when you are claiming to quote someone, and you use quotation marks ("__") that means you are actually quoting word for word what is placed in the quotation marks. No where did I use the words "fair comparison".

In addition to that, my reference using the words "not fair" (correctly done quotation) was aimed at being "not fair" (see how that works) to your coach, who is still active, and comparing him to arguably the greatest college coach ever. CS is his own man and doing his own thing and doing it quite well, why try and manufacture some stat somewhere to prove he is better than anyone. Let his work speak for itself and when it's all said and done, then make these type of comparisons, OR use actual recognizable stats to make the comparison, not some micro stats to find one way in which the current best coach is better than the retired best coach. It's just a silly way to argue your point. And it's silly for you to take a statement that anyone can read and understand and make it sound like it was something else entirely. You knew what I was saying but chose to make something up, not sure why. Is this another example of creating a fake myth just so you have a reason to post something? Twice in one thread, nice.

 

[21Guns]

Maybe you should've dropped an asterisk or something because it wasn't clear you set the goal posts where you did. (I mean, was ISU not a D1 school while Cael coached there?) Or why you chose to slur the two people who pointed out the obvious flaw in your presentation.

The two people who pointed out the "obvious flaw" have "slurred" me for their entire existence on this board. If you need, I will provide you the proof in the posts, that's up to you. You wish to join them in their attacks, that's also up to you.

There is no flaw in my presentation: My point is, that Cael, at Penn State, has done quite well in finals matches, and in fact, better than Dan Gable did in his first 27 title matches. You cannot argue that, but feel free to join them in their attacks. Again on you.

 

[21Guns]

It seems like the point of your "little exercise" was to create 3 myths that I don't think I have ever seen mentioned anywhere, find some favorable (random, 27???) stats to back up these fake myths and post them, only to find out that they really don't prove your point because they don't take in to account that Gable was a first time HC and CS was an experienced HC and on top of that, they actually prove that that Gable was quicker to win titles, both team and individual and his teams were more dominantly represented on the podium.

I am not sure why any PSU fan would want to try and compare CS to Gable at this point, it's not fair to CS and it's not needed. While I think my teams current coaches are great, you have the proof that yours is the greatest coach actively coaching right now, hands down. He is a great coach, great man, I am sure a great husband and father (does he have kids?) and a great representative of our sport. Your team is the reigning champ and prohibitive favorite next year (already). The only thing worth proving, you guys are already proving on the mat. To quote Inigo Montoya, You are using these stats, I do not think they mean what you think they mean.

While I appreciate you pumping up Gable stats, there is only one Dan Gable. But good news for you, there is only one Cael Sanderson and you don't need haphazardly done, poorly thought through statistics to justify his success, amigo.

Thanks amigo! I'll take your sarcasm as a complement.

27 is not random: 27 is the number of title matches SO FAR that Cael has coached in, at PENN STATE. Therefore, I ran the comparison of his first 27, to Dan's first 27.

No it is NOT an invented myth. I can pull up the threads, on this board, and many others, that criticized Cael for PSU's "poor performance" in finals matches. The threads are out there and that is fact.

 

[Neo_Hawk]

Thanks amigo! I'll take your sarcasm as a complement.

27 is not random: 27 is the number of title matches SO FAR that Cael has coached in, at PENN STATE. Therefore, I ran the comparison of his first 27, to Dan's first 27.

No it is NOT an invented myth. I can pull up the threads, on this board, and many others, that criticized Cael for PSU's "poor performance" in finals matches. The threads are out there and that is fact.

That would be great if you could pull them for me, I have never seen a single one, which it's possible I missed one, let alone multiple or many. I have also not heard "Myth 3: Dominant teams should be dominate in the finals in order to prove their greatness." I guess it's possible that someone would say this, but if they did, it's more of a statement than a myth. Dominant teams seem to be identified by their margin of victory over their competition and greatness seems to be a subjective term.

The stat's you used, in my opinion, do not prove greatness in any way. IMO you seem to be limiting your thoughts about what greatness is. Anyone that can't look at PSU's finals performance this past year and see that as greatness, but instead feels the need to prove it some other way are probably suffering from some sort of inferiority complex. That goes for PSU fans, Iowa fans, fosu fans and OKST fans.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

You too are being a little loose with actual facts, and in this case, quotes. First off, when you are claiming to quote someone, and you use quotation marks ("__") that means you are actually quoting word for word what is placed in the quotation marks. No where did I use the words "fair comparison".

In addition to that, my reference using the words "not fair" (correctly done quotation) was aimed at being "not fair" (see how that works) to your coach, who is still active, and comparing him to arguably the greatest college coach ever. CS is his own man and doing his own thing and doing it quite well, why try and manufacture some stat somewhere to prove he is better than anyone. Let his work speak for itself and when it's all said and done, then make these type of comparisons, OR use actual recognizable stats to make the comparison, not some micro stats to find one way in which the current best coach is better than the retired best coach. It's just a silly way to argue your point. And it's silly for you to take a statement that anyone can read and understand and make it sound like it was something else entirely. You knew what I was saying but chose to make something up, not sure why. Is this another example of creating a fake myth just so you have a reason to post something? Twice in one thread, nice.

Huh??? Your notion that it is some awful, egregious undertaking to compare Cael's first 8 years at PSU to Gable's first 8 years at Iowa is laughable! IOW, the only party who finds it so egregious is you (and like-minded Iowa whiners). Amusing how Squakeyes such as yourself jumped all over Cael in 2009 when he very publicly stated that he was going to PSU because moving to Pennsylvania would allow him to win NCAA Championships and build a Wrestling Dynasty.....and reach his coaching ambitions! But now that Cael is doing PRECISELY what he said, and predicted, he was going to do.....it is hearsay to bring up the topic or make comparisons to Gable??? Go figure, LMFAO!

 

[21Guns]

That would be great if you could pull them for me, I have never seen a single one, which it's possible I missed one, let alone multiple or many. I have also not heard "Myth 3: Dominant teams should be dominate in the finals in order to prove their greatness." I guess it's possible that someone would say this, but if they did, it's more of a statement than a myth. Dominant teams seem to be identified by their margin of victory over their competition and greatness seems to be a subjective term.

The stat's you used, in my opinion, do not prove greatness in any way. IMO you seem to be limiting your thoughts about what greatness is. Anyone that can't look at PSU's finals performance this past year and see that as greatness, but instead feels the need to prove it some other way are probably suffering from some sort of inferiority complex. That goes for PSU fans, Iowa fans, fosu fans and OKST fans.

TOP FLIGHT passive aggressive stuff, five stars!

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

TOP FLIGHT passive aggressive stuff, five stars!

This guy's notion that it is completely inappropriate and disgraceful to bring up comparisons of Cael's first 8 years at PSU to Gable's first 8 years at Iowa is comical. I think he's trying out for the lead part in his Elementary School drama club! Oh the humanity!!!!, they're comparing that awful Carl guy to the incomparable Dan Gable....

The most amusing part is that this is the same type of dork who jumped all over, and mockingly made fun of, "Carl" (or Bael take your choice) back in 2009 for publicly stating that he was going to PSU and Pennsylvania because it would give him unique advantages unavailable at ISU which would allow him to win NCAA Championships and build a Wrestling Dynasty....which were his coaching ambitions.

 

[Neo_Hawk]

Huh??? You're notion that it is some awful, egregious undertaking to compare Cael's first 8 years at PSU to Gable's first 8 years at Iowa is laughable! IOW, the only party who finds it so egregious is you (and like-minded Iowa whiners). Amusing how Squakeyes such as yourself jumped all over Cael in 2009 when he very publicly stated that he was going to PSU because moving to Pennsylvania would allow him to win NCAA Championships and build a Wrestling Dynasty.....and reach his coaching ambitions! But now that Cael is doing PRECISELY what he said, and predicted, he was going to do.....it is hearsay to bring up the topic or make comparisons to Gable??? Go figure, LMFAO!

Did I somewhere use the word "awful" or "egregious"? Do you have an actual quote of me jumping all over CS in 2009? Is the only way for have a disagreement to make things up? If you want to compare CS to Gable, that's fine, silly but fine. Do stats about finalists records tell you what you the whole story? I said it wasn't fair to him as a coach. unless in 2009 he said he was coming to PA to be better than Gable.

This is taking one stat and trying to make it prove your point. But you two keep patting each other on the back and tell each other how great you are, maybe you'll finally convince yourselves. Guys like you are an embarrassment to your entire fan base.

 

[Neo_Hawk]

TOP FLIGHT passive aggressive stuff, five stars!

Are you still going to post about the myths? You said "I can pull up the threads, on this board, and many others, that criticized Cael for PSU's "poor performance" in finals matches."

You offered, or are you like your buddy franklin that just makes stuff up so he can hear himself talk.

 

[tikk10]

The two people who pointed out the "obvious flaw" have "slurred" me for their entire existence on this board. If you need, I will provide you the proof in the posts, that's up to you. You wish to join them in their attacks, that's also up to you.

There is no flaw in my presentation: My point is, that Cael, at Penn State, has done quite well in finals matches, and in fact, better than Dan Gable did in his first 27 title matches. You cannot argue that, but feel free to join them in their attacks. Again on you.

My point is that you only qualified your premise after being called out for omitting it in the OP. You're comparing two coaches over an arbitrary span, you should explain why Cael gets a mulligan for his time at ISU under your statistical comparison. I'm not saying it's inappropriate to make the comparison as you did; I'm saying that the career record books won't handle it that way, so it would've been helpful to readers if you explained up front why ISU finalists are omitted from your analysis.

Also, disagreement is not an attack. As for whether people are giving you crap in other threads, look in the mirror because your tone is that of someone looking for a fight every minute of the waking day; acting surprised when you get them is disingenuous.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

Did I somewhere use the word "awful" or "egregious"? Do you have an actual quote of me jumping all over CS in 2009? Is the only way for have a disagreement to make things up? If you want to compare CS to Gable, that's fine, silly but fine. Do stats about finalists records tell you what you the whole story? I said it wasn't fair to him as a coach. unless in 2009 he said he was coming to PA to be better than Gable.

This is taking one stat and trying to make it prove your point. But you two keep patting each other on the back and tell each other how great you are, maybe you'll finally convince yourselves. Guys like you are an embarrassment to your entire fan base.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

Did I somewhere use the word "awful" or "egregious"? Do you have an actual quote of me jumping all over CS in 2009? Is the only way for have a disagreement to make things up? If you want to compare CS to Gable, that's fine, silly but fine. Do stats about finalists records tell you what you the whole story? I said it wasn't fair to him as a coach. unless in 2009 he said he was coming to PA to be better than Gable.

This is taking one stat and trying to make it prove your point. But you two keep patting each other on the back and tell each other how great you are, maybe you'll finally convince yourselves. Guys like you are an embarrassment to your entire fan base.

BTW whiner, how is it taking "one stat and trying to make it prove your point", when I specifically pointed out completely different stats than the OP??? Where did I say you used the words awful or egregious??? Again, the only person who thinks it is outrageous and inappropriate to compare Cael Sanderson's first 8 years at PSU to Gable's first 8 at Iowa is you, LMFAO!

 

[matter7172]

This is a somewhat slanted view as Gable, after spending his first several seasons as a Lead Assistant, inherited an Iowa team in 1977 from Gary Kurdelmeier which had just won the NCAA Tournament in 1975 and 1976 - Cael inherited the ISU HC position from Bobby Douglas after 3 years as an Assistant, but ISU was not coming off of back-to-back National Championships. Cael's career since moving to PSU is very comparable to Gable's first 8 years at Iowa. How you say that this is not a "fair comparison" is complete nonsense imho.

It is a pretty interesting comparison. Both Gable at Iowa and Sanderson at Penn State won titles in their second years. The big difference was that Gable inherited a team that was the two-time reigning champs and the repeat champs had just shattered the team scoring record. Cael inherited a team that had bottomed out - winning only two of their last 13 dual meets the season before he took over.

Given the starting points of the two coaches, I have to believe Carl's achievements in his first 8 years at Penn State are more impressive than Gable's first 8 at Iowa. Taking a team that went 2-9-2 over its last 13 duals to a championship in two years trumps taking a record-setting national championship team to a title in two years anyday imo.

Other than that, the records are pretty comparable. Given Cael's age and the state of program, Iowa fans better start preparing for the day when the last of their specious arguments against Cael's greatness as a coach (and a program BUILDER) topples like the rest of them. 23 is beginning to look a lot less unlikely of a target.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

It is a pretty interesting comparison. Both Gable at Iowa and Sanderson at Penn State won titles in their second years. The big difference was that Gable inherited a team that was the two-time reigning champs and the repeat champs had just shattered the team scoring record. Cael inherited a team that had bottomed out - winning only two of their last 13 dual meets the season before he took over.

Given the starting points of the two coaches, I have to believe Carl's achievements in his first 8 years at Penn State are more impressive than Gable's first 8 at Iowa. Taking a team that went 2-9-2 over its last 13 duals to a championship in two years trumps taking a record-setting national championship team to a title in two years anyday imo.

Other than that, the records are pretty comparable. Given Cael's age and the state of program, Iowa fans better start preparing for the day when the last of their specious arguments against Cael's greatness as a coach (and a program BUILDER) topples like the rest of them. 23 is beginning to look a lot less unlikely of a target.

Cael doesn't even need to get to 23 -- Gable coached for 21 years (1977 - 1997 using the year of the NCAA Championship Tournament) and won 15 NCAA Team Titles. Cael has 9 Titles to go to catch Gable.

 

[Neo_Hawk]

BTW whiner, how is it taking "one stat and trying to make it prove your point", when I specifically pointed out completely different stats than the OP??? Where did I say you used the words awful or egregious??? Again, the only person who thinks it is outrageous and inappropriate to compare Cael Sanderson's first 8 years at PSU to Gable's first 8 at Iowa is you, LMFAO!

The words outrageous and inappropriate (words you imply I am using) are not synonyms of unfair (word I actually used). Synonyms are.....well it doesn't matter, if you didn't know how quotation marks work you won't understand that either. Any 5th grader could win an argument with you with half their brain tied behind their back. You have a 3rd grade writing level and apparently even lower reading level.

Your way to win a debate is to attribute an easily argued against false statement to someone and then talk about a bunch of things that have nothing to do with the original point. Also throw in a few "Squawkeyes" and We are (s) and hope some of the people on this board that actually graduated from Penn State jump to your defense. I will say that at least you know how to put an animated graphic on the message board, good for you. Keep up the good work.

 

[WildTurk]

Why is it that when someone doesn't agree or tries to add to the conversation its automatically an "attack"?

 

[Ihawkd9times]

Just curious, how many Olympic and world medalists came from Gable and Caels listed guys above?

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

The words outrageous and inappropriate (words you imply I am using) are not synonyms of unfair (word I actually used). Synonyms are.....well it doesn't matter, if you didn't know how quotation marks work you won't understand that either. Any 5th grader could win an argument with you with half their brain tied behind their back. You have a 3rd grade writing level and apparently even lower reading level.

Your way to win a debate is to attribute an easily argued against false statement to someone and then talk about a bunch of things that have nothing to do with the original point. Also throw in a few "Squawkeyes" and We are (s) and hope some of the people on this board that actually graduated from Penn State jump to your defense. I will say that at least you know how to put an animated graphic on the message board, good for you. Keep up the good work.

Huh??? Who knew that stating Cael has won 6 National Championships in his first 8 years at PSU versus Gable's 7 NCs in his first 8 years at Iowa (both facts, not "false statements") was all that whining gibberish and mouth diarrhea you spewed above....LMFAO.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

Why is it that when someone doesn't agree or tries to add to the conversation its automatically an "attack"?

"...tries to add to the conversation..." - good one, rotflmao.....

 

[WildTurk]

Are you laughing your arse or crying it off?

 

[21Guns]

My point is that you only qualified your premise after being called out for omitting it in the OP. You're comparing two coaches over an arbitrary span, you should explain why Cael gets a mulligan for his time at ISU under your statistical comparison. I'm not saying it's inappropriate to make the comparison as you did; I'm saying that the career record books won't handle it that way, so it would've been helpful to readers if you explained up front why ISU finalists are omitted from your analysis.

Also, disagreement is not an attack. As for whether people are giving you crap in other threads, look in the mirror because your tone is that of someone looking for a fight every minute of the waking day; acting surprised when you get them is disingenuous.

And you giving them is also disingenuous. So, you should look in the mirror also. And I don't need to explain my "tone" to you or anyone else, and you don't have the right to interpret my "tone". I don't need to explain why the sample only covers PSU: This is a PSU message board and it should not need explained why the post only covers PSU. Did I need to explain Gable taking over for a two time champion team in his first year? The only reason you even jumped in, was because of two leftover haters who tried to pile on with a lame nitpicking point, that doesn't hold water in the first place.

It might be "helpful" of you, to actually BE the impartial and fair poster you pretend to be, rather than to be another attacker in sheep's clothing. Fraud.

 

[21Guns]

Are you laughing your arse or crying it off?

How old are you? 10? You're pathetic, and your arguments are a joke, just like you are.

 

[WildTurk]

Now you are rolling on the floor laughing your ass off? Really? If i wrote a book with a bunch of punctuation marks in every one of my posts would that be a better contribution?

 

[21Guns]

Why is it that when someone doesn't agree or tries to add to the conversation its automatically an "attack"?

Same reason that when someone pretends to be just an Iowa fan, they jump on a Penn State board three seconds after Myles Martin beats Bo Nickal, and makes 3 posts.

 

[WildTurk]

How old are you? 10? You're pathetic, and your arguments are a joke, just like you are.

Hush

 

[21Guns]

Hush

Hush yourself.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

Are you laughing your arse or crying it off?

Every time I read the crap that you Iowa whiners wrote back in 2009 after Cael's public statements as to why he took the Head Coaching job at The Pennsylvania State University and what he intended to do to the wrestling world after he got there.

 

[WildTurk]

Same reason that when someone pretends to be just an Iowa fan, they jump on a Penn State board three seconds after Myles Martin beats Bo Nickal, and makes 3 posts.

You really need some new material. So stale