Conference Champs and Playoff

[thochhausler]

Joel Klatt has the best argument that needs to be repeated. There needs to be a prerequisite to get into the CFP and that is to win your conference championship.

It doesn't make sense to allow a team into the CFP if they have already proved, without a doubt, not to be the best team in their own conference. We have the CFP to remove doubt across conferences.

I am not sure why Mr. Klatt's idea isn't getting more traction. He also brings up a good point that we may as well not even keep score with the system we have now (just send in your film at the end of the year and let the committee decide who is the best 4 teams).

Also, teams will still need to schedule a strong OOC schedule with his proposal so the committee can determine who the top 4 conference champions are. The only exception would be an independent team and they would still have to wind up in the top 4 to get in.

 

[78SweetRevenge]

You can't make it a requirement unless you include ALL conference champions

And, no, it would encourage every team to play weak non-conference games. There's no benefit to playing a strong team before conference play because it can hurt you.

If a conference title is a requirement then ND & BYU can't go--there's no exceptions to requirements.

There's year's where the second best team in a conference is more deserving than a conference winner. It was true with Penn State vs. Pac XII/Big XII last year and it was true with Bama vs. Pac XII/Big Ten this year.

 

[psu00]

Joel Klatt has the best argument that needs to be repeated. There needs to be a prerequisite to get into the CFP and that is to win your conference championship.

It doesn't make sense to allow a team into the CFP if they have already proved, without a doubt, not to be the best team in their own conference. We have the CFP to remove doubt across conferences.

I am not sure why Mr. Klatt's idea isn't getting more traction. He also brings up a good point that we may as well not even keep score with the system we have now (just send in your film at the end of the year and let the committee decide who is the best 4 teams).

Also, teams will still need to schedule a strong OOC schedule with his proposal so the committee can determine who the top 4 conference champions are. The only exception would be an independent team and they would still have to wind up in the top 4 to get in.

IMO best option is a 16 team playoff. Like March Madness, the P5 conference champions get the automatic bids. The other 11 are wild cards picked by the committee.

It would be very rare to have a team left out that had a legitimate claim/ opportunity to win a national title.

 

[nittanyjoe]

I have been of the mindset that a four team playoff is the right number of teams because you don’t want to take anything away from the regular season. I felt this way because I could not imagine the Committee devaluing conference champions.

Now that the committee has gone with none conference champions the past two years, it seems to me we do need an 8 team playoff.

 

[wilbury]

Joel Klatt has the best argument that needs to be repeated. There needs to be a prerequisite to get into the CFP and that is to win your conference championship.

It doesn't make sense to allow a team into the CFP if they have already proved, without a doubt, not to be the best team in their own conference. We have the CFP to remove doubt across conferences.

I am not sure why Mr. Klatt's idea isn't getting more traction. He also brings up a good point that we may as well not even keep score with the system we have now (just send in your film at the end of the year and let the committee decide who is the best 4 teams).

Also, teams will still need to schedule a strong OOC schedule with his proposal so the committee can determine who the top 4 conference champions are. The only exception would be an independent team and they would still have to wind up in the top 4 to get in.

Except for the fact that, with unbalanced conferences, the best team won't always win the championship.

 

[RLCookie]

Make the conference championships the first round of the playoff. Along with the conference championships the next two highest ranked teams play. This covers the non conference teams like BYU and ND. You now have a 12 team playoff.

After round 1 the committee would rank the 6 winners. The top two teams would receive a bye in round 2. Round two would be played the following weekend. The results would get us down to the final 4.

This system adds 3 games to the current system and one additional weekend for 4 teams. The 8 eliminated teams are paired up and play the New Year’s Day bowl games.

 

[Pennoyer]

Why not an 8 team playoff.

5 conference champions, 2 at large. If a group of 5 team is in final top 12, they get the 8th seed; if not, another at large.

First round at home of higher ranked team one week after conference championships. Winners advance as now.

4 losers get a bowl game Jan 1.

 

[thochhausler]

You can't make it a requirement unless you include ALL conference champions

And, no, it would encourage every team to play weak non-conference games. There's no benefit to playing a strong team before conference play because it can hurt you.

If a conference title is a requirement then ND & BYU can't go--there's no exceptions to requirements.

There's year's where the second best team in a conference is more deserving than a conference winner. It was true with Penn State vs. Pac XII/Big XII last year and it was true with Bama vs. Pac XII/Big Ten this year.

I don't understand your argument. Last year, Penn State was the best team in a conference. This year, nobody knows if Bama is better than the PacXII/Big Ten. But, we do know that Bama already had their chance to prove they were the best team in the SEC and didn't do so. Hence, Bama should not have been invited to get a second chance. Ohio State and USC won their game when it most mattered...at the end of the season in their championship game.

 

[wilbury]

I don't understand your argument. Last year, Penn State was the best team in a conference. This year, nobody knows if Bama is better than the PacXII/Big Ten. But, we do know that Bama already had their chance to prove they were the best team in the SEC and didn't do so. Hence, Bama should not have been invited to get a second chance. Ohio State and USC won their game when it most mattered...at the end of the season in their championship game.

I don't think that Georgia is the best team in the SEC this year and I'm not sure Penn State was the best team in the Big Ten last year.

It's fine to make the conference championship a requirement. It just requires a complete realignment of divisions or maybe even getting rid of divisions in the conferences.

Regardless, 4 teams is fine. We don't need any more.

 

[ClarkstonMark]

Joel Klatt has the best argument that needs to be repeated. There needs to be a prerequisite to get into the CFP and that is to win your conference championship.

It doesn't make sense to allow a team into the CFP if they have already proved, without a doubt, not to be the best team in their own conference. We have the CFP to remove doubt across conferences.

I am not sure why Mr. Klatt's idea isn't getting more traction. He also brings up a good point that we may as well not even keep score with the system we have now (just send in your film at the end of the year and let the committee decide who is the best 4 teams).

Also, teams will still need to schedule a strong OOC schedule with his proposal so the committee can determine who the top 4 conference champions are. The only exception would be an independent team and they would still have to wind up in the top 4 to get in.

dumb argument .... sometimes 2 of the best teams in the nation actually play in the same conference, like this year

 

[Marylovesthelions]

Make the conference championships the first round of the playoff. Along with the conference championships the next two highest ranked teams play. This covers the non conference teams like BYU and ND. You now have a 12 team playoff.

After round 1 the committee would rank the 6 winners. The top two teams would receive a bye in round 2. Round two would be played the following weekend. The results would get us down to the final 4.

This system adds 3 games to the current system and one additional weekend for 4 teams. The 8 eliminated teams are paired up and play the New Year’s Day bowl games.

Are not in a conference, never in playoff. Conference championship determines a six team playoff. Bottom four play each other to create a final four. They will always find a way to screw PSU until it is no longer possible. Instant replay proved that in the B1G. Screw te B1G and the NCAA.

 

[Marylovesthelions]

dumb argument .... sometimes 2 of the best teams in the nation actually play in the same conference, like this year

So two American leagurpe east teams should play in the World Series if they are the two best? Your thinking is stinking.

 

[Art]

You can't make it a requirement unless you include ALL conference champions

And, no, it would encourage every team to play weak non-conference games. There's no benefit to playing a strong team before conference play because it can hurt you.

If a conference title is a requirement then ND & BYU can't go--there's no exceptions to requirements.

There's year's where the second best team in a conference is more deserving than a conference winner. It was true with Penn State vs. Pac XII/Big XII last year and it was true with Bama vs. Pac XII/Big Ten this year.

Sure you can. The Power 5 make the rules about who gets into the playoff just like they do now.

 

[Art]

dumb argument .... sometimes 2 of the best teams in the nation actually play in the same conference, like this year

Maybe, so then we get a do-over of the conference championship, with maybe a different result. Think we've seen that movie once before.

 

[Marylovesthelions]

If champs are overlooked, stop the money making bullspit of playoffs. No other sport at any level bars champs of the biggest leagues from te playoffs. The present is just another way for the sports machine to control the sport results off the field. I do not understand how any PSU fan can support this system given how mahy times the decision makers have royally screwed the Lions.

 

[AWS1022]

You can't make it a requirement unless you include ALL conference champions

And, no, it would encourage every team to play weak non-conference games. There's no benefit to playing a strong team before conference play because it can hurt you.

If a conference title is a requirement then ND & BYU can't go--there's no exceptions to requirements.

There's year's where the second best team in a conference is more deserving than a conference winner. It was true with Penn State vs. Pac XII/Big XII last year and it was true with Bama vs. Pac XII/Big Ten this year.

The second best team is not more deserving because they're second best.

 

[AWS1022]

If champs are overlooked, stop the money making bullspit of playoffs. No other sport at any level bars champs of the biggest leagues from te playoffs. The present is just another way for the sports machine to control the sport results off the field. I do not understand how any PSU fan can support this system given how mahy times the decision makers have royally screwed the Lions.

And how many times do the usual suspects get the benefit of the doubt (Bama, OSU, GA, Oklahoma, USC, Auburn)? Any Penn State fan thinking the "best" teams should go instead of conference champions better get used to seeing two or three SEC programs in the playoffs every year.

 

[Nitt1300]

I think 8 is the right number- 5 conference champs and the three highest ranked teams after that.

By season's end there is typically not much difference between the top 4-5 teams, and teams ranked much lower than that you generally see a significant fall off in quality. Eight is enough.

 

[AWS1022]

I think 8 is the right number- 5 conference champs and the three highest ranked teams after that.

By season's end there is typically not much difference between the top 4-5 teams, and teams ranked much lower than that you generally see a significant fall off in quality. Eight is enough.

And they could do 8 without getting rid of their prescious bowl games. Just add the first round of playoffs after the championship games with the higher seeded teams hosting. Then take the usual break and have basically the same system they have now.

 

[78SweetRevenge]

I don't understand your argument. Last year, Penn State was the best team in a conference. This year, nobody knows if Bama is better than the PacXII/Big Ten. But, we do know that Bama already had their chance to prove they were the best team in the SEC and didn't do so. Hence, Bama should not have been invited to get a second chance. Ohio State and USC won their game when it most mattered...at the end of the season in their championship game.

Why does a team have to be the best in the SEC to be better than the Big Ten, Big XII, Pac XII or ACC champ? In some years you'll have two of the best teams in one conference. This is why a four team playoff is beyond stupid

 

[78SweetRevenge]

So two American leagurpe east teams should play in the World Series if they are the two best? Your thinking is stinking.

The should both make the playoffs--which they do

 

[78SweetRevenge]

Sure you can. The Power 5 make the rules about who gets into the playoff just like they do now.

Then FBS needs split into 2 levels--until that happens it's not a real playoff. Anyone that truly believes this systems provides us with a real champion is delusional. It's no better than the MNCs of the BCS

 

[78SweetRevenge]

The second best team is not more deserving because they're second best.

Wrong...simply dead wrong. Ohio State, because of the schedule they played, was more deserving than us last year based on the system that we have. Stop ignoring Oklahoma, Michigan & Pitt. The committee didn't. Rightfully so

 

[RLCookie]

So ND isn’t eligible for a NC? I’m don’t like ND but you can’t eliminate their ability to win it. I know you can try and force them to join a conference. Picking two at large helps to when you have extremely competitive divisions like the Big Ten East or the SEC West.

Are not in a conference, never in playoff. Conference championship determines a six team playoff. Bottom four play each other to create a final four. They will always find a way to screw PSU until it is no longer possible. Instant replay proved that in the B1G. Screw te B1G and the NCAA.

 

[Art]

Then FBS needs split into 2 levels--until that happens it's not a real playoff. Anyone that truly believes this systems provides us with a real champion is delusional. It's no better than the MNCs of the BCS

Really don't give a shit about the A5. P5 should declare them and gone. Does anyone really care the UCF isn't in the playoff this year?

 

[nittnee]

Why does a team have to be the best in the SEC to be better than the Big Ten, Big XII, Pac XII or ACC champ? In some years you'll have two of the best teams in one conference. This is why a four team playoff is beyond stupid

Who cares? You want in, win your conference. Every other league in every other sport has pre-determined criteria to get into a championship playoff process.

Agree on needing at least eight teams and it is inevitable that it will happen at some point. Why the NCAA continues to do this drip, drip, drip approach is beyond me (and stupid).

 

[78SweetRevenge]

So ND isn’t eligible for a NC? I’m don’t like ND but you can’t eliminate their ability to win it. I know you can try and force them to join a conference. Picking two at large helps to when you have extremely competitive divisions like the Big Ten East or the SEC West.

Right--and the Big Ten East and the SEC West are the exact reasons why 2 teams from one conference should absolutely be considered. Same with the ACC Atlantic at times when FSU & Clemson were clearly top 5-7 teams

 

[Art]

Who cares? You want in, win your conference. Every other league in every other sport has pre-determined criteria to get into a championship playoff process.

Agree on needing at least eight teams and it is inevitable that it will happen at some point. Why the NCAA continues to do this drip, drip, drip approach is beyond me (and stupid).

Just one little correction: the NCAA isn't doing anything wrt playoff and never will. It's the Power 5 conferences.

 

[78SweetRevenge]

Really don't give a shit about the A5. P5 should declare them and gone. Does anyone really care the UCF isn't in the playoff this year?

I'm sure UCF cares--and the G5 teams. No one that truly matters.
Every other sport is inclusive including football at the lower levels. There's absolutely no reason that they can't expand to at least 16 teams. Absolutely none.

 

[Art]

I'm sure UCF cares--and the G5 teams. No one that truly matters.
Every other sport is inclusive including football at the lower levels. There's absolutely no reason that they can't expand to at least 16 teams. Absolutely none.

Right, no one that really matters. And no other sport, besides basketball, matters. Basketball holds its three-ring circus because CBS pays a lot of money for it. Until some broadcaster starts clamoring for more content and puts money on the table, it ain't happening. And it ain't happening any time soon.

 

[roswelllion]

Why not an 8 team playoff.

5 conference champions, 2 at large. If a group of 5 team is in final top 12, they get the 8th seed; if not, another at large.

First round at home of higher ranked team one week after conference championships. Winners advance as now.

4 losers get a bowl game Jan 1.

I’d keep 4. Protects excitement of regular season. Expanding to discourages OOC strong games. Just looking at this the extra 4 would be USC, tOSU UCF and Auburn. If losers in championship games are out what does that say if they had been undefeated. Adding 4 adds 2 conference champions almost assures 2 SEC likely a power 5. So you have ND and all conference runner ups plus SEC 3rd place fighting for one spot.

 

[KnightSlayer]

Wrong...simply dead wrong. Ohio State, because of the schedule they played, was more deserving than us last year based on the system that we have. Stop ignoring Oklahoma, Michigan & Pitt. The committee didn't. Rightfully so

Bullshit. We beat them head to head and won the conference. That should always trump the looks test.

 

[78SweetRevenge]

Bullshit. We beat them head to head and won the conference. That should always trump the looks test.

What looks test? Ohio State and Penn State did not have the same record nor did we play the same schedule. We won by 3 at home. Ranking have NEVER been about H2H. We see teams ranked ahead of teams they beat all the time. Us beating Ohio State by 3 at home doesn't mean we're better. See what Georgia did to Auburn the second time they played. An 11-1 Ohio State with their only loss being to a top 5 Penn State team will always get in over an 11-2 Penn State team with a bad loss at Pitt and a blowout loss against Michigan...especially when Ohio State beat Oklahoma on the road. Switch Penn State and Ohio State and Penn State gets in. It is about the resume. Ohio State was significantly ahead of us last year hence the tiebreakers were never activated. I don't understand why people still don't grasp this. If we beat Pitt we're in at 12-1. Washington would have probably been left out. Washington should have been left out anyway. That's where the outrage should be.

 

[AWS1022]

Wrong...simply dead wrong. Ohio State, because of the schedule they played, was more deserving than us last year based on the system that we have. Stop ignoring Oklahoma, Michigan & Pitt. The committee didn't. Rightfully so

That's very subjective of you. Sorry, you're never going to convince me OSU deserved to get in over us last year as much as you spout off about resume. OSU had their chance to win the conference and they didn't just like we had our chance this year and didn't.

 

[wilbury]

And how many times do the usual suspects get the benefit of the doubt (Bama, OSU, GA, Oklahoma, USC, Auburn)? Any Penn State fan thinking the "best" teams should go instead of conference champions better get used to seeing two or three SEC programs in the playoffs every year.

OK, so lets put in teams that aren't the best just so we can get every conference in there.

You just can't take the conference champion the way things are set up now. If we change the rules, what follows is major changes to the conference divisions and scheduling. You might not like what you get.

 

[AWS1022]

OK, so lets put in teams that aren't the best just so we can get every conference in there.

You just can't take the conference champion the way things are set up now. If we change the rules, what follows is major changes to the conference divisions and scheduling. You might not like what you get.

Teams that aren't the best based on what? A group of guys' opinions? There's no way to truly tell who the best are without playing on the field....so at best it's an exercise in mental masturbation. Ga looked so good because they played in a crap division in an average conference....so what evidence is there that they are one of the best teams? Same with Bama and Auburn. There were years when the Big was down and it made OSU look like world beaters. So to say certain teams are the best teams is pretty much a guess. If they're only going to take 4 teams, then it should be all conference champions because at least they proved something.

 

[78SweetRevenge]

Teams that aren't the best based on what? A group of guys' opinions? There's no way to truly tell who the best are without playing on the field....so at best it's an exercise in mental masturbation. Ga looked so good because they played in a crap division in an average conference....so what evidence is there that they are one of the best teams? Same with Bama and Auburn. There were years when the Big was down and it made OSU look like world beaters. So to say certain teams are the best teams is pretty much a guess. If they're only going to take 4 teams, then it should be all conference champions because at least they proved something.

It doesn't prove anything. Nothing. A four playoff is idiotic and becomes more idiotic when winning a conference title is required since they aren't all equal

 

[psu00]

I think the bottom line is that people will never agree on the best 4 teams with 5 conferences (especially when the committee is now willing to take more than 1 team in a conference).

IMO they need an 8 (likely 16) team playoff. The conference champs get automatic bids like March madness- (whether that team is the best in the conference or not). Let the committee fill in the rest.

 

[KnightSlayer]

What looks test? Ohio State and Penn State did not have the same record nor did we play the same schedule. We won by 3 at home. Ranking have NEVER been about H2H. We see teams ranked ahead of teams they beat all the time. Us beating Ohio State by 3 at home doesn't mean we're better. See what Georgia did to Auburn the second time they played. An 11-1 Ohio State with their only loss being to a top 5 Penn State team will always get in over an 11-2 Penn State team with a bad loss at Pitt and a blowout loss against Michigan...especially when Ohio State beat Oklahoma on the road. Switch Penn State and Ohio State and Penn State gets in. It is about the resume. Ohio State was significantly ahead of us last year hence the tiebreakers were never activated. I don't understand why people still don't grasp this. If we beat Pitt we're in at 12-1. Washington would have probably been left out. Washington should have been left out anyway. That's where the outrage should be.

That is strictly your opinion with which I completely disagree. There have been plenty of championship games where the winner would lose if the teams played again. Same with teams who win against a team in the regular season but then lose to that team in the playoffs. Too bad. We beat Ohio State head to head and we won our conference championship. In a playoff seeding scenario, the one extra loss is irrelevant. Penn State should have been in ahead of Ohio State, IMO. Splitting hairs over a 2nd or 3rd. place conference team against a conference champ with one extra loss is bullshit. The best team/SOS argument is subjective and filled with bias. With 120+ teams and only 4 playoff spots, if you can't win one of the major conference, then you don't deserve a shot. If you want to give the best team not to win one of the 5 major conferences a chance in the playoffs, then make it 8 teams.

 

[PearlSUJam]