FC: McElroy and Zarzour

[Pennoyer]

Not sure if anyone heard them this morning but some they had a really interesting take re PSU

1. Said of all teams to feel for, PSU was definitely it this year. Every bit as good or better than teams in CFB playoffs.
2. PSU needed some luck and just didn't get it at OSU and MSU. Said both Ala and GA got the luck they needed. Basically said teams need luck to get to Cfb and PSU just never got it this year.
3. Both would rank Penn State #3, though both thought they would beat GA. McElroy felt they would give Ala a real fight.
4. Talked about losing by 1 at OSU and by 3 in a fluky "9 hour weather delay". McElroy properly noted that weather delays kills visiting teams
5. Broke down our players, especially O, who can match up with any defense
6. Trace is WAY underrated.

Just some perspective. The "luck" thing is interesting especially from a non PSU fan perspective. We really didn't get lucky when we needed it to happen. Anyway these guys were super high on Penn State

 

[Chris92]

I heard that as well this morning. Although, McElroy never specifically used the phrase, he was all but saying PSU passed the "eye test" for him after doing our game.

 

[Obliviax]

Not sure if anyone heard them this morning but some they had a really interesting take re PSU

1. Said of all teams to feel for, PSU was definitely it this year. Every bit as good or better than teams in CFB playoffs.
2. PSU needed some luck and just didn't get it at OSU and MSU. Said both Ala and GA got the luck they needed. Basically said teams need luck to get to Cfb and PSU just never got it this year.
3. Both would rank Penn State #3, though both thought they would beat GA. McElroy felt they would give Ala a real fight.
4. Talked about losing by 1 at OSU and by 3 in a fluky "9 hour weather delay". McElroy properly noted that weather delays kills visiting teams
5. Broke down our players, especially O, who can match up with any defense
6. Trace is WAY underrated.

Just some perspective. The "luck" thing is interesting especially from a non PSU fan perspective. We really didn't get lucky when we needed it to happen. Anyway these guys were super high on Penn State

Thanks...totally agree on "luck".

 

[NewEra 2014]

Although we arguably did have some "luck" to win the Iowa game at the end, it really did come down to a couple of plays here or there against MSU and OSU, and we would have been in the playoff.

All in all, it was one of the better seasons I can ever remember as a Penn State fan, going back to late 1970's. At least in the top 20% or so of all seasons. I'm already looking forward to next fall.

 

[JWB389]

Not sure if anyone heard them this morning but some they had a really interesting take re PSU

1. Said of all teams to feel for, PSU was definitely it this year. Every bit as good or better than teams in CFB playoffs.
2. PSU needed some luck and just didn't get it at OSU and MSU. Said both Ala and GA got the luck they needed. Basically said teams need luck to get to Cfb and PSU just never got it this year.
3. Both would rank Penn State #3, though both thought they would beat GA. McElroy felt they would give Ala a real fight.
4. Talked about losing by 1 at OSU and by 3 in a fluky "9 hour weather delay". McElroy properly noted that weather delays kills visiting teams
5. Broke down our players, especially O, who can match up with any defense
6. Trace is WAY underrated.

Just some perspective. The "luck" thing is interesting especially from a non PSU fan perspective. We really didn't get lucky when we needed it to happen. Anyway these guys were super high on Penn State

I heard it as well. Just about choked on my coffee. It's easy for them to say it now. The season's over. They didn't have the guts to say it earlier.

There was an SEC homer on Tuesday night in place of Mark Packer. I was ready to punch the radio. Maybe the first team was trying to balance him out.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

Not sure if anyone heard them this morning but some they had a really interesting take re PSU

1. Said of all teams to feel for, PSU was definitely it this year. Every bit as good or better than teams in CFB playoffs.
2. PSU needed some luck and just didn't get it at OSU and MSU. Said both Ala and GA got the luck they needed. Basically said teams need luck to get to Cfb and PSU just never got it this year.
3. Both would rank Penn State #3, though both thought they would beat GA. McElroy felt they would give Ala a real fight.
4. Talked about losing by 1 at OSU and by 3 in a fluky "9 hour weather delay". McElroy properly noted that weather delays kills visiting teams
5. Broke down our players, especially O, who can match up with any defense
6. Trace is WAY underrated.

Just some perspective. The "luck" thing is interesting especially from a non PSU fan perspective. We really didn't get lucky when we needed it to happen. Anyway these guys were super high on Penn State

McElroy's tune has completely changed in the matter or months with regards to PSU.

 

[Nittanygrad93]

I agree regarding luck for MSU. The weather was particularly BAD luck. It would have been nice to have some luck against tOSU, but with the leads PSU had we should have been able to come out with the win without the benefit of luck.

 

[PSUFBFAN]

McElroy's tune has completely changed in the matter or months with regards to PSU.

I haven't heard him on his radio show very much throughout the year, but he was really negative about PSU last year.

He was very fair to PSU during his Fiesta Bowl broadcast, but I just chalked that up to the fact he knew his audience would be a very heavy pro-PSU audience. Perhaps he is truly convinced that we are one of the better teams in the country.

 

[Bob78]

Thanks...totally agree on "luck".

Great to hear the recognition on the national media level.

I think we had a bit of luck in that Iowa scored with as much time left as they did, allowing Trace to work his magic through the final play. Not luck in the sense that other teams lost when we needed them to, but Iowa scoring with >1 minute to play vs. on the last play as seems to happen too often.... well, we needed that and we took advantage.

If Luck = Preparation + Opportunity, as coaches love to say, we need to make more of our own luck more often than we did this season. Not a lot more, as we were well prepared all season, imo, but in the biggest moments. Like we did at Iowa.

11-2 is outstanding, and will be tough to match next season given what we need to replace. But our confidence level is sky-high, the coaches keep getting batter at what they do, the talent is abundant.... 10-2 regular season is the low end of the bar for '18.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

Great to hear the recognition on the national media level.

I think we had a bit of luck in that Iowa scored with as much time left as they did, allowing Trace to work his magic through the final play. Not luck in the sense that other teams lost when we needed them to, but Iowa scoring with >1 minute to play vs. on the last play as seems to happen too often.... well, we needed that and we took advantage.

If Luck = Preparation + Opportunity, as coaches love to say, we need to make more of our own luck more often than we did this season. Not a lot more, as we were well prepared all season, imo, but in the biggest moments. Like we did at Iowa.

11-2 is outstanding, and will be tough to match next season given what we need to replace. But our confidence level is sky-high, the coaches keep getting batter at what they do, the talent is abundant.... 10-2 regular season is the low end of the bar for '18.

Timing, timing, timing....it's kind of funny that PSU is finally starting to take off and now the BT East may be the toughest division in all of college football. Then we have Iowa and UW as cross over games next year....it's a brutal schedule even with most of the tough games at home. BRUTAL.

 

[Obliviax]

Great to hear the recognition on the national media level.

I think we had a bit of luck in that Iowa scored with as much time left as they did, allowing Trace to work his magic through the final play. Not luck in the sense that other teams lost when we needed them to, but Iowa scoring with >1 minute to play vs. on the last play as seems to happen too often.... well, we needed that and we took advantage.

If Luck = Preparation + Opportunity, as coaches love to say, we need to make more of our own luck more often than we did this season. Not a lot more, as we were well prepared all season, imo, but in the biggest moments. Like we did at Iowa.

11-2 is outstanding, and will be tough to match next season given what we need to replace. But our confidence level is sky-high, the coaches keep getting batter at what they do, the talent is abundant.... 10-2 regular season is the low end of the bar for '18.

Agree but just think how close we get with regards to tOSU's blocked punt and Sparty's rain delay.

 

[Cletus11]

I didn't think Iowa was luck. PSU dominated that game and just gave up a few big plays. And then drove the ball the length of the field in the final two minutes for a score.

You could say the exact opposite happened in the PSU-OSU game. OSU was moving the ball all day, just making dumb mistakes to cost them possessions.

MSU was bad luck. Massive rain delay. Away game after the OSU away game that ended late. Several plays to be made that typically PSU makes but doesn't. The 50/50 late hit on Allen. PSU caught zero breaks in that game and MSU had all the luck.

 

[10 Years After]

Timing, timing, timing....it's kind of funny that PSU is finally starting to take off and now the BT East may be the toughest division in all of college football. Then we have Iowa and UW as cross over games next year....it's a brutal schedule even with most of the tough games at home. BRUTAL.

Yes but if they do make it through that schedule then they will make the final four.

 

[rudedude]

IMO those two are shills for the corporate game of keeping the status quo for college football, especially reinforcing that the current opinion based system is superior to actually winning on the field. I was incredulous to hear McElroy say the NFL system of determining playoff teams is a dinosaur vs the current college playoff beauty contest. They both emote how an 8 team playoff dilutes the regular season. What a bunch of jamokes. I often have to turn off their silliness.

 

[Bob78]

I didn't think Iowa was luck. PSU dominated that game and just gave up a few big plays. And then drove the ball the length of the field in the final two minutes for a score.

You could say the exact opposite happened in the PSU-OSU game. OSU was moving the ball all day, just making dumb mistakes to cost them possessions.

MSU was bad luck. Massive rain delay. Away game after the OSU away game that ended late. Several plays to be made that typically PSU makes but doesn't. The 50/50 late hit on Allen. PSU caught zero breaks in that game and MSU had all the luck.

The luck wrt Iowa was that they scored with enough time left for us to come back, nothing else.

The good luck we needed in the MSU game, besides not having the weather delay, was MSU to not make their FG to end the game. Teams who experience the good luck that the commentators were referring to, I believe, are the ones whose opponents miss those FGs, the game goes into OT, and the 'lucky' team pulls out a win. That's the kind of 'luck' that we needed to go 11-1 and win the east and win our way into the CFP. Imo.
Even really good teams, as we were this season, need some help from time to time. A big gust of wind as the ball was just off the foot of MSU's kicker would have been a nice thing, and I'd be ok with calling it a lucky break!

 

[ejb25]

While I do like a pro PSU argument and teams do need a little luck, it is hard to argue that Alabama just happens to be lucky every year.

 

[Obliviax]

The luck wrt Iowa was that they scored with enough time left for us to come back, nothing else.

The good luck we needed in the MSU game, besides not having the weather delay, was MSU to not make their FG to end the game. Teams who experience the good luck that the commentators were referring to, I believe, are the ones whose opponents miss those FGs, the game goes into OT, and the 'lucky' team pulls out a win. That's the kind of 'luck' that we needed to go 11-1 and win the east and win our way into the CFP. Imo.
Even really good teams, as we were this season, need some help from time to time. A big gust of wind as the ball was just off the foot of MSU's kicker would have been a nice thing, and I'd be ok with calling it a lucky break!

I always feel like, when a coach says "we gotta make a play" they are really talking about luck. PSU's blocked FG could not be anticipated, nor their blocked punt. Also true of passing teams from SD playing in a blizzard in Buffalo. Injuries are probably the biggest thing. tOSU has been really lucking on the O-line over the last several years.

 

[baircub1!]

Thanks...totally agree on "luck".

And to be fair..."luck" is also what got us into the Big 10 Championship game LY so works both ways...Michigan losing last two was a surprise to may...

 

[michnittlion]

I didn't think Iowa was luck. PSU dominated that game and just gave up a few big plays. And then drove the ball the length of the field in the final two minutes for a score.

You could say the exact opposite happened in the PSU-OSU game. OSU was moving the ball all day, just making dumb mistakes to cost them possessions.

MSU was bad luck. Massive rain delay. Away game after the OSU away game that ended late. Several plays to be made that typically PSU makes but doesn't. The 50/50 late hit on Allen. PSU caught zero breaks in that game and MSU had all the luck.

"50/50 late hit" on Allen? Huh? That was as clear a penalty as it gets. Saying anything otherwise is simply revisionist history.

We made our own bad "luck" against MSU. Gesicki seemingly running the wrong route (not running the out as McSorley expected him to be) and the intentional grounding that led to 3rd & 18. Thompkins dropping the ball on 4th & 3 2 plays later. MSU converting just about every single 3rd down they had.

It's a tough truth to admit given that a victory there and we might make the playoff. But that MSU loss was primarily on us. Not due to luck. We "earned" the loss.

 

[LionHoya]

The luck wrt Iowa was that they scored with enough time left for us to come back, nothing else.

The good luck we needed in the MSU game, besides not having the weather delay, was MSU to not make their FG to end the game. Teams who experience the good luck that the commentators were referring to, I believe, are the ones whose opponents miss those FGs, the game goes into OT, and the 'lucky' team pulls out a win. That's the kind of 'luck' that we needed to go 11-1 and win the east and win our way into the CFP. Imo.
Even really good teams, as we were this season, need some help from time to time. A big gust of wind as the ball was just off the foot of MSU's kicker would have been a nice thing, and I'd be ok with calling it a lucky break!

That's the kind of luck Clemson had last season. NCSt missed a short kick at the end of regulation to win the game. Clemson loses that one, and they likely don't make the playoffs.

 

[Art]

"50/50 late hit" on Allen? Huh? That was as clear a penalty as it gets. Saying anything otherwise is simply revisionist history.

We made our own bad "luck" against MSU. Gesicki seemingly running the wrong route (not running the out as McSorley expected him to be) and the intentional grounding that led to 3rd & 18. Thompkins dropping the ball on 4th & 3 2 plays later. MSU converting just about every single 3rd down they had.

It's a tough truth to admit given that a victory there and we might make the playoff. But that MSU loss was primarily on us. Not due to luck. We "earned" the loss.

Fvck you.

 

[Obliviax]

"50/50 late hit" on Allen? Huh? That was as clear a penalty as it gets. Saying anything otherwise is simply revisionist history.

We made our own bad "luck" against MSU. Gesicki seemingly running the wrong route (not running the out as McSorley expected him to be) and the intentional grounding that led to 3rd & 18. Thompkins dropping the ball on 4th & 3 2 plays later. MSU converting just about every single 3rd down they had.

It's a tough truth to admit given that a victory there and we might make the playoff. But that MSU loss was primarily on us. Not due to luck. We "earned" the loss.

Agreed.

And them scheduling and making that massive rainstorm, having a crappy visitor's locker room, convincing us to leave non-essential staff back in HV, deceiving us into ordering pizza and chicken, and then moving up the start time was incredibly crafty on their part.

 

[Madsol]

Agreed.

And them scheduling and making that massive rainstorm, having a crappy visitor's locker room, convincing us to leave non-essential staff back in HV, deceiving us into ordering pizza and chicken, and then moving up the start time was incredibly crafty on their part.

You'll regret agreeing with michnitt, not because he's wrong necessarily in this instance but because eventually he'll make an unmitigated ass of himself and your name will be linked to his. Good luck

 

[Option Bob]

Darrell Royal used to say, "You make your own luck." But I disagree. I might be all convoluted in my thinking here, but I define luck in football as "any event not a result of a team's direct action." I separate errors that are caused by good play from those that are made with no effort from the team benefiting from the "lucky" play.

For example, I don't consider it good luck to have a defensive player block a punt or FG; OTOH. I do consider in good luck to have the snap from center go over the punter's/kicker's heads. I also think a muffed punt is purely good luck, as well, since the kicking team is unable to make a play on the returner until he catches it.

Thus, in 2016, Penn State was not "lucky" when it blocked the Buckeye FG. But OSU was lucky when Penn State had both a muffed punt and a snap go over the punter's head.

Yes, Penn State has been the recipient of such good fortune through the years, often huge assists to undefeated seasons. There's likely a solid reason why some people claim, "It's better to be lucky than good."

 

[Obliviax]

Darrell Royal used to say, "You make your own luck." But I disagree. I might be all convoluted in my thinking here, but I define luck in football as "any event not a result of a team's direct action." I separate errors that are caused by good play from those that are made with no effort from the team benefiting from the "lucky" play.

For example, I don't consider it good luck to have a defensive player block a punt or FG; OTOH. I do consider in good luck to have the snap from center go over the punter's/kicker's heads. I also think a muffed punt is purely good luck, as well, since the kicking team is unable to make a play on the returner until he catches it.

Thus, in 2016, Penn State was not "lucky" when it blocked the Buckeye FG. But OSU was lucky when Penn State had both a muffed punt and a snap go over the punter's head.

Yes, Penn State has been the recipient of such good fortune through the years, often huge assists to undefeated seasons. There's likely a solid reason why some people claim, "It's better to be lucky than good."

I totally agree, Option Bob.

It would be great if your team can blow everyone out 35-3. But the NCAA's guidelines have made it so that several teams are competitive. As such, a weird bound, an injury or a bad call can change the outcome of a game. People and coaches can always say 'just play better', and that is an acceptable comment, but there are two teams on the field. You can't just tell them both to play better. I mean, neither OK or GA deserved to lose that game, but them's the rules.

I envision it like a weighted scale. if you put five lbs on one side and five on the other, it is balanced. Add a quarter onto one side and it is imbalanced. If you take that same scale, put 500 lbs on one and the other, it is balanced. Add that same quarter, and it is just as imbalanced. At some point, no matter the weight, that quarter makes the difference if both sides are balanced.

 

[michnittlion]

Darrell Royal used to say, "You make your own luck." But I disagree. I might be all convoluted in my thinking here, but I define luck in football as "any event not a result of a team's direct action." I separate errors that are caused by good play from those that are made with no effort from the team benefiting from the "lucky" play.

For example, I don't consider it good luck to have a defensive player block a punt or FG; OTOH. I do consider in good luck to have the snap from center go over the punter's/kicker's heads. I also think a muffed punt is purely good luck, as well, since the kicking team is unable to make a play on the returner until he catches it.

Thus, in 2016, Penn State was not "lucky" when it blocked the Buckeye FG. But OSU was lucky when Penn State had both a muffed punt and a snap go over the punter's head.

Yes, Penn State has been the recipient of such good fortune through the years, often huge assists to undefeated seasons. There's likely a solid reason why some people claim, "It's better to be lucky than good."

Generally agree.

Bit of a tangent, but I've read a couple articles where numbers-oriented folk have looked at things .......... defenses having more interceptions than other defenses is not luck. There is skill involved in it. Defenses causing more fumbles than other defenses is not luck. There is skill involved in it. But a defense actually recovering a fumble (once the fumble has occurred) is nearly all luck. Over time, every defense from Alabama to Akron and Pittsburgh looks alike in terms of fumble recovery percentage.