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Freiermuth now officially a starter

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tboyer

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Sep 25, 2002
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Depth chart is out and he's co-starter with Holland and Dalton. Pretty incredible for 4th game of the freshman season.

To me Freiermuth's ascent is one of the most positive developments so far this year. If he proves to be a reliable pass catcher, there's nothing that can help the offense more than a versatile TE.

You can line him up and the defense really doesn't know if it's a run or pass. They don't know if he's going to double team a DE or lead a sweep or pull or just sneak out into the flat and take a dump pass or take off and split the safeties 20 yards downfield.

It's bread and butter stuff, nothing that hasn't been in the playbook for 30 years, but you add it to what PSU can already do offensively and it can make a huge difference, especially on third down.

If things work out, Freiermuth will not get a lot of attention from defenses until he catches a bunch of passes, then he will get attention and that will create all kinds of opportunities for JJ.

I'm also just excited to see a young player show so much so soon. He could turn out to be really, really good.
 
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I like it. He has "the look." He just looks like a big time TE already. Excited to watch him develop.
 
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Wonder if this means Kuntz will be redshirted? Might not matter if both end up as good as advertised...they’re probably done after 3 years anyway.
 
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brings up the question as to most valuable true freshmen? Still have to think that its Parsons....but that could change in the next year or two. I like the looks of Shorter, Dotson, Oweh, Slade, Mustipher, Luketa....could be a special class.
 
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The best thing about 87 and Rahne running this offense is that he's using an H-back in a FB role for us this year. I think this has been one of the keys to us being able to run the ball this year opposed to the last two years. One is that 87 can block, and two is that we are running two TE sets where 87 is basically a FB, reading the play and throwing blocks to clear out lanes for Sanders.

He cleared out the guy to spring Miles for the game winning TD against App State in OT. He is a big reason we've been running the ball so well this year.
 
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Friermuth appears to be most similar to Jesse James as a true freshman TE in terms of being able to play the position.
 
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Custerdome said:
Don't see a "backup" linebacker who never plays the first series and then plays most of the rest of the game either, but hey.
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I know that CJF is a guy who will play the best guy at every position, but at the same time I think he's being a little loyal to the 5th year senior with the platitude of "starter" so far this year. I also think this is more about managing the locker room and leadership on this team. You don't want to lose the leadership of that 5th year senior, either. And he IS a leader on this team. It's a balancing act and I think he's doing a great job. He is allowing a guy to keep some pride in still being a "starter" but I think the writing is on the wall here. Illinois might be the last game he starts.
 
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Player2BNamedL8r said:
Wonder if this means Kuntz will be redshirted? Might not matter if both end up as good as advertised...they’re probably done after 3 years anyway.
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The buzz is that Kuntz will benefit from a year to put on weight and get stronger. But he looked awesome catching that pass.

The way football is going, the TE position is kind of splitting in two with some TEs becoming more like wideouts. Kuntz looks like a good candidate for the wideout/Gesicki TE whereas Freiermuth is more like the conventional TE playing a lot more at the LOS but still capable of hurting people downfield. You need both. PSU could be really sitting pretty at this position for a couple of years.
 
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Obliviax said:
brings up the question as to most valuable true freshmen? Still have to think that its Parsons....but that could change in the next year or two. I like the looks of Shorter, Dotson, Oweh, Slade, Mustipher, Luketa....could be a special class.
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To me it's good sign that we don't have any idea about the answer to the question. It's a large number of players who could end up being the freshman MVP -- and it will depend as much on the team's needs as anything. Dotson, Shorter, Oweh may all redshirt just because there is better depth at their positions than there is for Mustipher and Luketa and Freiermuth.

Have to say though I was really surprised to see Oweh looking so strong out there. He has that why-bother-redshirt look to him -- this is not someone who will be playing college football for 5 years. If it is safe to play him in terms of skill level and ability to avoid injuries, they could really use him in the B1G season, at least in passing downs.
 
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jrd23psu said:
The best thing about 87 and Rahne running this offense is that he's using an H-back in a FB role for us this year. I think this has been one of the keys to us being able to run the ball this year opposed to the last two years. One is that 87 can block, and two is that we are running two TE sets where 87 is basically a FB, reading the play and throwing blocks to clear out lanes for Sanders.

He cleared out the guy to spring Miles for the game winning TD against App State in OT. He is a big reason we've been running the ball so well this year.
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Maybe they should recruit a fb.
 
He doesn't look like a TR FR. The kid looks like he's gonna be special. I think it speaks volumes that he's already a starter in game 4. Obviously CJF believes in him in order to put him with/ahead of guys with a lot more time/experience in the program.
 
83wuzme said:
Friermuth appears to be most similar to Jesse James as a true freshman TE in terms of being able to play the position.
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If remains healthy, I’ll take the over on the Fr.. Thought he looked terrific.
 
Ranger Dan said:
Does this mean we should expect a three tight end set?
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I would love to see it sometime. You can do really fun things with it. How about a tight end bubble screen. Maybe three TEs and JJ out there at the same time.
 
spoog48 said:
Maybe they should recruit a fb.
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Why? Where would the FB play? You do know there is no FB position in this offense, right? Why would we recruit a position we don't even have?

We do have an H-Back position. And unless a FB is as tall as a TE and can run routes like a TE and catch like a TE he isn't playing H-Back.
 
tboyer said:
Have to say though I was really surprised to see Oweh looking so strong out there. He has that why-bother-redshirt look to him -- this is not someone who will be playing college football for 5 years. If it is safe to play him in terms of skill level and ability to avoid injuries, they could really use him in the B1G season, at least in passing downs.
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I agree. But we haven't seen him against the best OL's yet. If he's ready, play him. If not, redshirt him. Even if he's not a 5 year player, the redshirt will protect him in case of injury where he may wish he had that fifth season available.
 
MJG-90 said:
I agree. But we haven't seen him against the best OL's yet. If he's ready, play him. If not, redshirt him. Even if he's not a 5 year player, the redshirt will protect him in case of injury where he may wish he had that fifth season available.
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Wouldn’t the opposite be true? Not redshirting Oweh this season if he’s healthy protects the opportunity for him to redshirt down the road in case of injury. If you redshirt him this year, you lose the opportunity to redshirt him in, say, 2020 if he gets hurt.
 
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Raffycorn said:
Wouldn’t the opposite be true? Not redshirting Oweh this season if he’s healthy protects the opportunity for him to redshirt down the road in case of injury. If you redshirt him this year, you lose the opportunity to redshirt him in, say, 2020 if he gets hurt.
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Depends which game and what gets injured. Suppose he breaks a leg in game 6 of his fourth season and is out for the year. He can't get a redshirt because he played in half the games (isn't the limit one third?). Now maybe he wants to return for season 5 to prove he's healthy and improve his draft stock.

Also, remember my original statement was if he's ready now, play him and if not then redshirt him. Playing when he's not ready isn't going to be a good thing for anyone.
 
Raffycorn said:
Wouldn’t the opposite be true? Not redshirting Oweh this season if he’s healthy protects the opportunity for him to redshirt down the road in case of injury. If you redshirt him this year, you lose the opportunity to redshirt him in, say, 2020 if he gets hurt.
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It's an interesting question. Over the years we sometimes saw some blown out knees when freshmen were thrown into games before they were ready (Anybody remember Derek (Cameron) Wake's injury).

There probably is an argument to be made that it is safer not to play people until they've had a year of conditioning and practice against college players. The kind of collisions and vicious blocks you see at the Power 5 level is completely unlike what these guys see in high school.

But would the statistics bear that out? I suspect Franklin has already had his crack research staff look into it.
 
tboyer said:
It's an interesting question. Over the years we sometimes saw some blown out knees when freshmen were thrown into games before they were ready (Anybody remember Derek (Cameron) Wake's injury).

There probably is an argument to be made that it is safer not to play people until they've had a year of conditioning and practice against college players. The kind of collisions and vicious blocks you see at the Power 5 level is completely unlike what these guys see in high school.

But would the statistics bear that out? I suspect Franklin has already had his crack research staff look into it.
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Pretty sure Wake's injury was against Miami in 2001. He would have been a sophomore. And the injury had nothing to do with him playing before he was ready. He tried to leap over a blocker and his leg got caught.
 
Madsol said:
Pretty sure Wake's injury was against Miami in 2001. He would have been a sophomore. And the injury had nothing to do with him playing before he was ready. He tried to leap over a blocker and his leg got caught.
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It was versus Miami in 2001. It was the first PSU game that I ever attended. What a mix of emotions for me. That was the game Adam T led the team out onto the field after his spinal injury. We were all hyped up. Then 1 of the most talented teams in College Football History dismantled PSU and our starting QB Matt Senneca. Derek (not Cameron back then) Wake was lost for the season during the game with a really ugly injury. Then lastly after all hope was lost, Zack Mills took over and did a good job of leading the offense which led to the end of the dreadful Matt Senneca era.
 
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LionsandBear said:
It was versus Miami in 2001. It was the first PSU game that I ever attended. What a mix of emotions for me. That was the game Adam T led the team out onto the field after his spinal injury. We were all hyped up. Then 1 of the most talented teams in College Football History dismantled PSU and our starting QB Matt Senneca. Derek (not Cameron back then) Wake was lost for the season during the game with a really ugly injury. Then lastly after all hope was lost, Zack Mills took over and did a good job of leading the offense which led to the end of the dreadful Matt Senneca era.
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I posted this a little while ago but it really was amazing that that game was "only" 33-7, given the discrepancy in talent. It shows how much the game has changed, even in less than 20 years. If those two teams played today, in this style of football, Miami might have scored 100 points!
 
jrd23psu said:
Why? Where would the FB play? You do know there is no FB position in this offense, right? Why would we recruit a position we don't even have?

We do have an H-Back position. And unless a FB is as tall as a TE and can run routes like a TE and catch like a TE he isn't playing H-Back.
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The FB would play FB. The same position they use the H-Back. There is no set height for a TE. Some are 6'6 and some are 6'2. If the FB can catch, block and run a little then he can contribute. Do you think Zach Zwinak should have transferred? Was there a place for him in this offense? Didn't he lead the team in rushing? Do you think a James Conner could contribute? Any coach that could not find a way to use James Conner is not too bright.

The reality is this offense occasionally needs a fullback. This staff just calls them an H-back. It is flawed logic to line up a TE in the backfield if they are not a good blocker. Gesicki was really more of a WR. He did make one great block vs Wisconsin but for the most part he was not a good blocker. I would rather have a good FB over a 5th string TE or #5 RB in the future. It depends on the FB but if there is a player that can block, catch a little and run a little then I am all for it.

Will it make you happy if I call the FB an H-back? Let's recruit a legit Hback. You happy now?


stormingnorm said:
They did the same thing w Gesicki last year.

The results were not the same - for obvious reasons.
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stormingnorm said:
Yep.
So should Ohio State, Clemson, and Alabama. :rolleyes:
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Like you said, the results were not the same.
 
spoog48 said:
The FB would play FB. The same position they use the H-Back. There is no set height for a TE. Some are 6'6 and some are 6'2. If the FB can catch, block and run a little then he can contribute. Do you think Zach Zwinak should have transferred? Was there a place for him in this offense? Didn't he lead the team in rushing? Do you think a James Conner could contribute? Any coach that could not find a way to use James Conner is not too bright.

The reality is this offense occasionally needs a fullback. This staff just calls them an H-back. It is flawed logic to line up a TE in the backfield if they are not a good blocker. Gesicki was really more of a WR. He did make one great block vs Wisconsin but for the most part he was not a good blocker. I would rather have a good FB over a 5th string TE or #5 RB in the future. It depends on the FB but if there is a player that can block, catch a little and run a little then I am all for it.

Will it make you happy if I call the FB an H-back? Let's recruit a legit Hback. You happy now?







Like you said, the results were not the same.
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James Conner was an All-American halfback in college and has shown to be a capable halfback so far in the NFL. If a coach lined him up at fullback, they wouldn’t be making the best use out of him. Zwinak did a great job of stepping up in 2012 in difficult circumstances, but was basically a goal line back only by 2013, and O’Brien used two tight ends more than a tight end and Zwinak.
 
spoog48 said:
The FB would play FB. The same position they use the H-Back. There is no set height for a TE. Some are 6'6 and some are 6'2. If the FB can catch, block and run a little then he can contribute. Do you think Zach Zwinak should have transferred? Was there a place for him in this offense? Didn't he lead the team in rushing? Do you think a James Conner could contribute? Any coach that could not find a way to use James Conner is not too bright.

The reality is this offense occasionally needs a fullback. This staff just calls them an H-back. It is flawed logic to line up a TE in the backfield if they are not a good blocker. Gesicki was really more of a WR. He did make one great block vs Wisconsin but for the most part he was not a good blocker. I would rather have a good FB over a 5th string TE or #5 RB in the future. It depends on the FB but if there is a player that can block, catch a little and run a little then I am all for it.

Will it make you happy if I call the FB an H-back? Let's recruit a legit Hback. You happy now?







Like you said, the results were not the same.
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They aren't going to recruit a FB. Ever. It's not a position in this offense. You HAVE to be able to catch the ball as a TE in this offense. FBs aren't 6'2" either. They're about 5'11".

I don't know why people keep insisting this offense runs like a pro style offense. It isn't a pro style offense and it's never going to be one. It's a spread offense. It's an RPO. They do not go under center. There is no FB. People should stop complaining their apples doesn't taste like an orange. An apple is never going to taste like an orange.

If we want a FB this offense needs a new OC to install a pro style offense. Then we need to recruit a pro style QB because there isn't one on the roster nor are there any verbally committed to the program. All of them ran a spread offense/RPO in high school taking snaps exclusively in the shotgun. It would take a complete overall of the offense, personnel, and OC.

An H-Back is the closest thing we're going to get to a FB. It's not a FB, but what we've seen this year is that 87 can be used in a roll that can be similar. It's a lot tougher to find an H-Back that can do it all, though. Run routes, catch balls, and also block. These TE's are leaner than a FB and they don't block in high school. TEs are big pass catching WRs these days, so finding one who can block like 87 isn't easy. Gesicki never could. Incredible pass catcher, terrible blocker.

We're never going to have a FB. We're going to have to rely on finding kids like 87 who can block, an that's a tough find.
 
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Actually Bowers is still listed on the depth chart, so I'm not clear about whether he is injured or not. It's altogether possible, that he was passed on the depth chart by the other three, listed above him. 87 is coming on strong and so far I love what I see from him.
 
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