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Hey you haters, meaningless bowl game my ass!

john4psu

Well-Known Member
Sep 7, 2003
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And Sean Clifford, ROSE BOWL OFFENSIVE PLAYER OF THE GAME!

- Won his SECOND MAJOR bowl game! Only the third PSU QB to accomplish that feat.

- Coach James Franklin is now 3-1 in MAJOR BOWL GAMES (having won the Fiesta, Cotton and Rose).

Suck it haters!
 
And Sean Clifford, ROSE BOWL OFFENSIVE PLAYER OF THE GAME!

- Won his SECOND MAJOR bowl game! Only the third PSU QB to accomplish that feat.

- Coach James Franklin is now 3-1 in MAJOR BOWL GAMES (having won the Fiesta, Cotton and Rose).

Suck it haters!

It was "meaningless" in the opinion of only one guy here...or maybe two at most.

For everyone else (to include players, coaches, and fans), it was a great win to cap off an excellent year and serve as a good springboard to next season.
 
It was "meaningless" in the opinion of only one guy here...or maybe two at most.

For everyone else (to include players, coaches, and fans), it was a great win to cap off an excellent year and serve as a good springboard to next season.
Since its the Rose Bowl, they were keeping score, and the Win counts on our record, it clearly is not a meaningless game. It was a great win - I’m never going to apologize for a PSU “W”! Utah wanted this win and played like it - and we went toe-to-toe with a physical team and beat them up - this will pay benefits, psyche and confidence-wise for PSU going into 2023. Let’s not diminish that last point - the OL and DL needed to stand up to a physical opponent and win, and now they know that they can!
 
And Sean Clifford, ROSE BOWL OFFENSIVE PLAYER OF THE GAME!

- Won his SECOND MAJOR bowl game! Only the third PSU QB to accomplish that feat.

- Coach James Franklin is now 3-1 in MAJOR BOWL GAMES (having won the Fiesta, Cotton and Rose).

Suck it haters!

While winning is better than losing, it's unclear to me exactly what meaning/consequence this game had. If the game was consequential, every NFL-bound player would have played. Take note that not a single player opted out for scUM, tOSU, UGA, TCU.

There may have been value to the month of bowl practice for younger players, but if we are being honest, PSU has not played a consequential game since Oct 29th when it was effectively removed from B1G East contention.
The Rose Bowl win might feel good, but it was not meaningful in any objective sense. After losing to tOSU, Franklin should have canned the "1-0" political stump speech and began considering - even slightly in private - how to go 1-0 in the next meaningful game on Labor Day weekend 2023. PSU's projection in 2023 would be better if QBs who will be on the roster in 2023 had throw a pass in a game that was not already decided.
If thinking that focusing on winning something is more important than a Super Super Sr QB beating rutgers and setting passing records, makes me a "hater," then so be it.
 
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While winning is better than losing, it's unclear to me exactly what meaning/consequence this game had. If the game was consequential, every NFL-bound player would have played. Take note that not a single player opted out for scUM, tOSU, UGA, TCU.

There may have been value to the month of bowl practice for younger players, but if we are being honest, PSU has not played a consequential game since Oct 29th when it was effectively removed from B1G East contention.
The Rose Bowl win might feel good, but it was not meaningful in any objective sense. After losing to tOSU, Franklin should have canned the "1-0" political stump speech and began considering - even slightly in private - how to go 1-0 in the next meaningful game on Labor Day weekend 2023. PSU's projection in 2023 would be better if QBs who will be on the roster in 2023 had throw a pass in a game that was not already decided.
If thinking that focusing on winning something is more important than a Super Super Sr QB beating rutgers and setting passing records, makes me a "hater," then so be it.
Don’t ever become a coach….of any sport.
 
You'd b
agree, dont think he ever played any team sports
FWIW...You'd both be wrong

Take note of the Giants-Eagles game this week.
It means something to the Eagles and Hurts will almost certainly play, even if his shoulder is not great.
It is meaningless to the Giants. They will sit many of their starters, even if 100% healthy.
 
You'd b

FWIW...You'd both be wrong

Take note of the Giants-Eagles game this week.
It means something to the Eagles and Hurts will almost certainly play, even if his shoulder is not great.
It is meaningless to the Giants. They will sit many of their starters, even if 100% healthy.
complete difference in professionals vs college kids
 
complete difference in professionals vs college kids
wait, college is different than the pros?

Obviously it is...but human motivation and actions are fairly universal. Meaningful vs meaningless games see very similar approaches.
And FTR, I never said that JF should have tanked 2022. I said he should have considered something other than "1-0" when 1-0 is nothing more than a foot note and the program could be better served with an eye on games that have actual meaning.
 
While winning is better than losing, it's unclear to me exactly what meaning/consequence this game had. If the game was consequential, every NFL-bound player would have played. Take note that not a single player opted out for scUM, tOSU, UGA, TCU.

There may have been value to the month of bowl practice for younger players, but if we are being honest, PSU has not played a consequential game since Oct 29th when it was effectively removed from B1G East contention.
The Rose Bowl win might feel good, but it was not meaningful in any objective sense. After losing to tOSU, Franklin should have canned the "1-0" political stump speech and began considering - even slightly in private - how to go 1-0 in the next meaningful game on Labor Day weekend 2023. PSU's projection in 2023 would be better if QBs who will be on the roster in 2023 had throw a pass in a game that was not already decided.
If thinking that focusing on winning something is more important than a Super Super Sr QB beating rutgers and setting passing records, makes me a "hater," then so be it.
If you watched that game last night and didn’t see how much it meant to the players and coaches then you are ignorant in any objective sense.
 
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wait, college is different than the pros?

Obviously it is...but human motivation and actions are fairly universal. Meaningful vs meaningless games see very similar approaches.
And FTR, I never said that JF should have tanked 2022. I said he should have considered something other than "1-0" when 1-0 is nothing more than a foot note and the program could be better served with an eye on games that have actual meaning.
coaches decisions vs player decisions. very different situations.
 
You'd b

FWIW...You'd both be wrong

Take note of the Giants-Eagles game this week.
It means something to the Eagles and Hurts will almost certainly play, even if his shoulder is not great.
It is meaningless to the Giants. They will sit many of their starters, even if 100% healthy.
That's not a good comparison, since the Giants have to stay healthy for the playoffs, while the Rose Bowl was Penn State's last game of the year.
 
That's not a good comparison, since the Giants have to stay healthy for the playoffs, while the Rose Bowl was Penn State's last game of the year.
So you're saying that Giants are prioritizing meaningful games in the future over meaningless games now...hmmm
 
If you watched that game last night and didn’t see how much it meant to the players and coaches then you are ignorant in any objective sense.
As I said, It felt good, but winning or losing a non-playoff bowl game has no objective meaning. It's an exhibition game.
 
So you're saying that Giants are prioritizing meaningful games in the future over meaningless games now...hmmm
You're really missing the point. When you're going to the playoffs, then a regular season game against the Eagles, who are clearly a superior team, is meaningless or close to it. Can't compare that to Penn State's final game of the year in which they get to prove something by beating a top 10 team. Prior to yesterday, which victory could they brag about?
 
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As I said, It felt good, but winning or losing a non-playoff bowl game has no objective meaning. It's an exhibition game.
Watch the video that was taken on the field after the game and then say it was a meaningless scrimmage. For now and forever this team will be recognized as the 2023 Rose Bowl champions….that’s not a meaningless scrimmage.
 
Watch the video that was taken on the field after the game and then say it was a meaningless scrimmage. For now and forever this team will be recognized as the 2023 Rose Bowl champions….that’s not a meaningless scrimmage.
I get it - subjectively people feel really good about winning the rose bowl. But in the annals of CFB history for the 2022, there was no objective purpose to the game, just ask all the opt outs. They ranked working on shaving 1/10 of 1 second off their combine 40 time over the "Grandaddy" of all bowl games.
I know we're not gonna see eye to eye on this. Some of us are judging bowl games based on what they used to mean, and some of us are a bit jaded based on the current reality of CFB and it's migration toward minor league professional status that will likely kill it.
I've said my piece and we don't need to litigate anymore. We won't agree and that's okay. On to more important things....
 
I get it - subjectively people feel really good about winning the rose bowl. But in the annals of CFB history for the 2022, there was no objective purpose to the game, just ask all the opt outs. They ranked working on shaving 1/10 of 1 second off their combine 40 time over the "Grandaddy" of all bowl games.
I know we're not gonna see eye to eye on this. Some of us are judging bowl games based on what they used to mean, and some of us are a bit jaded based on the current reality of CFB and it's migration toward minor league professional status that will likely kill it.
I've said my piece and we don't need to litigate anymore. We won't agree and that's okay. On to more important things....
The fact that some players place their pro careers above a bowl game is understandable. But that doesn't render the bowl game meaningless. It's possible for one thing to be important and for another to be more important . As for history, the result of the game and its impact on the rankings will be part of the permanent record.
 
I get it - subjectively people feel really good about winning the rose bowl. But in the annals of CFB history for the 2022, there was no objective purpose to the game, just ask all the opt outs. They ranked working on shaving 1/10 of 1 second off their combine 40 time over the "Grandaddy" of all bowl games.
I know we're not gonna see eye to eye on this. Some of us are judging bowl games based on what they used to mean, and some of us are a bit jaded based on the current reality of CFB and it's migration toward minor league professional status that will likely kill it.
I've said my piece and we don't need to litigate anymore. We won't agree and that's okay. On to more important things....
Unlike some other bowl games, the opt outs in this game were mainly due to injury, not trying to shave 1/10 of 1 second off their 40 time. If it wasn’t for them being injured, I would say all of the players would have played. The healthy ones who are going pro played in the game.
 
I get it - subjectively people feel really good about winning the rose bowl. But in the annals of CFB history for the 2022, there was no objective purpose to the game, just ask all the opt outs. They ranked working on shaving 1/10 of 1 second off their combine 40 time over the "Grandaddy" of all bowl games.
I know we're not gonna see eye to eye on this. Some of us are judging bowl games based on what they used to mean, and some of us are a bit jaded based on the current reality of CFB and it's migration toward minor league professional status that will likely kill it.
I've said my piece and we don't need to litigate anymore. We won't agree and that's okay. On to more important things....
ok then if you really think about it there is no objective purpose to ANY college football game, not the first game of the season and not the national championship game, it is all meaningless in the grand scheme of things
 
wait, college is different than the pros?

Obviously it is...but human motivation and actions are fairly universal. Meaningful vs meaningless games see very similar approaches.
And FTR, I never said that JF should have tanked 2022. I said he should have considered something other than "1-0" when 1-0 is nothing more than a foot note and the program could be better served with an eye on games that have actual meaning.

Walking out of Beaver Stadium after OSU I thought for sure we'd see more play from Allar. That wasn't in the cards. I'm thrilled for Sean and the team...but at some point early next Fall #15 will learn a few "rookie" lessons in the heat of battle that we collectively will wish he would've learned this year against Minnesota, Maryland, Mich State and Rutgers.
 
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Unlike some other bowl games, the opt outs in this game were mainly due to injury, not trying to shave 1/10 of 1 second off their 40 time. If it wasn’t for them being injured, I would say all of the players would have played. The healthy ones who are going pro played in the game.
Big difference between the Rose Bowl with a record of 11-2 plus a top 10 ranking and last years squad at 7-6. I don't like the healthy opt outs, and I'm really glad everyone that was able to played.
 
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People are pretending it has meaning because we won--let's be real
Had we lost there would have been an infinite number of excuses
 
People are pretending it has meaning because we won--let's be real
Had we lost there would have been an infinite number of excuses
I've been on this board more than 20 years, during which time we have lost several bowl games. I can't recall people ever excusing it by demeaning the importance of the games themselves.
 
I've been on this board more than 20 years, during which time we have lost several bowl games. I can't recall people ever excusing it by demeaning the importance of the games themselves.
In the past 20 years bowls have increasingly become less meaningful. The only people that would have used the bowl as meaningful had we lost are those that want Franklin gone. Everyone else would have had an excuse.
 
Walking out of Beaver Stadium after OSU I thought for sure we'd see more play from Allar. That wasn't in the cards. I'm thrilled for Sean and the team...but at some point early next Fall #15 will learn a few "rookie" lessons in the heat of battle that we collectively will wish he would've learned this year against Minnesota, Maryland, Mich State and Rutgers.
11 wins and top 10 finishes are promised to no one. You want to have your cake and eat it too. Allar needs to earn his bones or get shit on like the loyal fans did to Cliff. Creating excuses a year in advance is nonsense. He played enough and saw enough to step up. He's got an experienced line and a quality running game to provide him with training wheels. Things Cliff didn't have.
 
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In a way you are correct about having both. Drew saw meaningful minutes at Michigan. Otherwise he has a lot to see and learn, and he will be doing it whilst his compadres Allen and Singleton have progressed much more than he did this year based on game stats alone...only the coaches see practice and I do trust their judgement.

In one thread people were talking about how Nick has matured out of running the play call onto taking the hole that develops as plays evolove. The middling success for #10 in the middle of our schedule may be that learning curve.

Frankly Drew was shockingly awful in The Blue White game last year. It appears that he must've improved enough to pass Veilleaux but not even approach Sean. I doubt that Drew could've lead us to a Rose Bowl win anymore than their back up could for the Utes. Bigger stage, better team, and their guy had significant game action.

The hype of many young qbs isn't always realized immediately. Look at all the 5 star transfer guys. I fear that expectations may outweigh his ability based on his youth...nothing more. His potential is high, but so was Blackledge and Kerry Collins. There are bumps in the road, especially at qb, .just like Sean had.

I'm not at all a Clifford hater, but as we move ahead it is very fair to say that our qb spot is completely unproven across the board. Maybe this is the new portal way too?

I'm excited for next year, but the NC expectations may be more likely in 2 years. Like Ernest and Julio Gallo said, " we will sell no wine before its' time."

We'll see.
 
And Sean Clifford, ROSE BOWL OFFENSIVE PLAYER OF THE GAME!

- Won his SECOND MAJOR bowl game! Only the third PSU QB to accomplish that feat.

- Coach James Franklin is now 3-1 in MAJOR BOWL GAMES (having won the Fiesta, Cotton and Rose).

Suck it haters!
Be real. All bowl games are exhibition games, unless you are playing for the championship. They are not completely meaningless but close. Extra practice time is what is meaningful.

It doesn’t seem like a big win in the Rose unless you beat USC. I was at the 94 ducks game. They were hopelessly out matched. Our first year in big 10 and we should have got a shot at Nebraska for the title. I feel that rose bowl was completely meaningless.
 
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Be real. All bowl games are exhibition games, unless you are playing for the championship. They are not completely meaningless but close. Extra practice time is what is meaningful.

It doesn’t seem like a big win in the Rose unless you beat USC. I was at the 94 ducks game. They were hopelessly out matched. Our first year in big 10 and we should have got a shot at Nebraska for the title. I feel that rose bowl was completely meaningless.
I'm not sure I follow you. Are non-championship bowl games inherently meaningless, as you appear to say in the first paragraph? Or are they only meaningless when the matchup is not competitive? I would agree with the latter point, but definitely not the former.
 
Be real. All bowl games are exhibition games, unless you are playing for the championship. They are not completely meaningless but close. Extra practice time is what is meaningful.

It doesn’t seem like a big win in the Rose unless you beat USC. I was at the 94 ducks game. They were hopelessly out matched. Our first year in big 10 and we should have got a shot at Nebraska for the title. I feel that rose bowl was completely meaningless.
The lower level bowls have become watered down. There's too many of them and they should be reserved for the small conference teams or teams who managed a good season, but typically struggle. Oklahoma playing in a bowl at 6-6 was absurd aside from the extra practice time.

Once you get into the bigger bowls, I feel it means more to the teams with 8+ wins and trying to end their season on a positive note. Or in the case of Tulane, take down one of the traditional powers.

The big bowls (Rose, Fiesta, Orange, and Sugar) all have a ton of meaning. They're typically played by conference champs or runner ups. And a top 10 ranking and team prestige is on the line.
 
The lower level bowls have become watered down. There's too many of them and they should be reserved for the small conference teams or teams who managed a good season, but typically struggle. Oklahoma playing in a bowl at 6-6 was absurd aside from the extra practice time.

Once you get into the bigger bowls, I feel it means more to the teams with 8+ wins and trying to end their season on a positive note. Or in the case of Tulane, take down one of the traditional powers.

The big bowls (Rose, Fiesta, Orange, and Sugar) all have a ton of meaning. They're typically played by conference champs or runner ups. And a top 10 ranking and team prestige is on the line.
We were a conference champ or runner up? Why do kids consistently opt out of them but not playoff games?

Pretending these games matter is archaic. It truly is.
 
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