Massachusettes considering banning youth tackle football
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Kids where I live play tackle in 2nd grade. They can barely hold up the helmet. Not sure when tackle is appropriate, but I know it’s not 2nd grade.
I started in 4th grade myself. My opinion is based on being a former FCS player and high school assistant. My son is only 5 so we haven’t crossed that bridge yet, but holding him out of tackle until at least 5th grade (if he wants to play of course).
I started in 4th grade myself. My opinion is based on being a former FCS player and high school assistant. My son is only 5 so we haven’t crossed that bridge yet, but holding him out of tackle until at least 5th grade (if he wants to play of course).
IMO, kids dont need to play tackle football until the 7th or 8th grade at the earliest, and then I would prefer via the school system as opposed to a 'youth' league.
Kids where I live play tackle in 2nd grade. They can barely hold up the helmet. Not sure when tackle is appropriate, but I know it’s not 2nd grade.
I started in 4th grade myself. My opinion is based on being a former FCS player and high school assistant. My son is only 5 so we haven’t crossed that bridge yet, but holding him out of tackle until at least 5th grade (if he wants to play of course).
I started in 4th grade myself. My opinion is based on being a former FCS player and high school assistant. My son is only 5 so we haven’t crossed that bridge yet, but holding him out of tackle until at least 5th grade (if he wants to play of course).
Kids in my area start playing tackle when they’re 7 and 8 years old...way too young. Then all the coaches do is keep handing the ball off to the best and/or strongest athlete to try and win....that happens all through youth football.
Lack of ability to obtain insurance coverage will probably kill youth football and someday HS football. Other sports like lacrosse, and soccer are having difficulty obtaining coverage at times. Even in the start up league, Steve Spurriers Orlando team has to practice half the month in Georgia to get Workmans comp because of the Florida laws on WC.
first, the photo in the article is kind of funny.
second, I hate that this should be "a law". I like freedom of choice. I recognize these kids probably don't have a choice but many are forced into playing football by their families.
Third, I've never understood youth football that young. I feel bad for the kids when I see them practicing. It seems common sense that flag football is as tough as it should get up until a certain age; perhaps 12 or so. I know I didn't start until jr high school (7th grade) at an organized level.
second, I hate that this should be "a law". I like freedom of choice. I recognize these kids probably don't have a choice but many are forced into playing football by their families.
Third, I've never understood youth football that young. I feel bad for the kids when I see them practicing. It seems common sense that flag football is as tough as it should get up until a certain age; perhaps 12 or so. I know I didn't start until jr high school (7th grade) at an organized level.
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anon_1eeb2b426hv3y
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I’m inclined to agree with all you guys who think the contact should be delayed. It just seems sensible, always has. But for at least 3 decades I’ve wrestled with the counter-point I’d learned (then—and the research results may have changed).
It’s that until kids are around 12-13, they’re not big or strong enough to really hurt each other given all the padding—and that pee-eee football is/was supposed to be among the most safe for that reason. Meanwhile, gymnastics and soccer were more dangerous due to injuries from falls, stress fractures on younger bones, etc.
If this is right, starting at 7th or 8th grade seems to be starting right when it becomes dangerous. Also shortens with window of lifetime playing experience for most players, which might be better for their brains. Of course, I don’t know the current research on concussions, etc for young boys playing football....
So my strong inclination is to agree, but I’m still puzzled which way is right.
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I've always felt that while dependent on the kid and every situation is different, that kids shouldn't start playing tackle until at least Jr. High 7th grade.
No reason 7 and 8 year olds should be playing tackle, they won't learn proper tackling tech that young anyway. Flag is the way to go early on.
No reason 7 and 8 year olds should be playing tackle, they won't learn proper tackling tech that young anyway. Flag is the way to go early on.
The above, big article on ESPN on how the insurance industry literally is walking away from football (and to a lesser extent any contact sports including lacrosse, soccer, etc..) due to liability reasons. Football will soon be priced out of the ability for organizations to have insurance such that I think literally within the next 10 years you will see a huge change in youth football to no contact and many high school and smaller college programs closing shop.
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anon_1eeb2b426hv3y
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would you mean flag with padding, or at least some sort of helmet and shoulder pads—maybe a la lacrosse gear? If so, that’d be great. But if we’re worried about head and neck injuries (in particular), I’d be more concerned about head to head collisions in tight quarters without helmets. And I might even prefer the contact if these kids falling all over themselves with heads and shoulders protected beyond their strength and size to harm.
Sounds bass-ackwards. But I’m torn on this and would defer to the science
My 6 year old grandson played Pop Warner last year. He wants to play. My son and his wife did not encourage it. The boys in the neighborhood are all at least 2 years older than he. When not playing organized football, they play tackle or rough-touch. The organized team has Schiff helments. I played little league beginning at 10 years old. My helmet was not much protection. In junior high and high school I played with a leather helmet.
I am torn by the seeing my grandson’s love of playing. He will probably never a star but he loves the game. He draws plays. Then, I see the medical reports and the articles on former players. At the level he is playing, I do not believe there is anymore chance of concussions than in his playground play or riding his bike. Hopefully better protective head gear will be developed.
I am torn by the seeing my grandson’s love of playing. He will probably never a star but he loves the game. He draws plays. Then, I see the medical reports and the articles on former players. At the level he is playing, I do not believe there is anymore chance of concussions than in his playground play or riding his bike. Hopefully better protective head gear will be developed.
It's been my experience that youth tackle football is not for the kids. It's for the parents. I have long railed against it. I favor a ban.
Is Little League baseball or youth wrestling or youth soccer or basketball and hockey for the parents too. Your premise seems to be all inclusive with football and let’s the other sports off the hook.
i would say that is not correct. played youth football from the time of 8 years old and was by far and away my favorite thing to do as a kid. of course in every sport there are parents that push their kids to play sports to re-live their own glory. But football is not different than any other sport with respect to that.
Yeah I'd be good with similar headgear/protections as to what some high schools use for their summer 7on7 leagues (not really actual helmets though). I don't think shoulder pads/etc. are necessary, but headgear should be used.
Kids have played youth football for years. Obviously there are concerns but I still believe it is better than sitting in front of a video game drinking sugary carb filled drinks. When I was a kid we played tackle football all the time in the summer without pads or helmets and I don’t know anyone that I knew that is impaired. What’s next are we going to ban bikes and skateboards If a kid wants to play it should his choice in conjunction with his parents. Our society is becoming so pu***fied. I can tell you one thing there are a lot of good values that are learned from playing football that help you later in life. Where does it end. The concussion rate in youth girls soccer is high are we going to ban it?
From the land of deflated balls comes yet another softening of the sport.
I kid...I don’t have a problem with player safety at such a young age, but will add this - if they’re ever going to bring fundamentals of tackling back into the sport (also necessary to increase safety IMO), it would seem the earlier they could do so, the better.
I kid...I don’t have a problem with player safety at such a young age, but will add this - if they’re ever going to bring fundamentals of tackling back into the sport (also necessary to increase safety IMO), it would seem the earlier they could do so, the better.
Playing football without a helmet in the yard is not an issue. It’s also less about the few diagnosed concussions. It is the 1000’s of sub concussive hits a player takes over the course of a career.
I was never had a technical concussion, but saw stars and blacked out momentarily more times than I can count. In college, I saw stars at least 5-10 times every game. It’s the cumulative effect of all this, and starting the clock at 8 years old, that is an issue.
I confined my remarks to football because that is what this thread is about, but I feel the same way about all other youth sports. I have no doubt my vision of this is clouded by the era in which I grew up. In my early years there were no organized teams, except Little League Baseball, and we did not have a team near my home. As a result, we got a bunch of neighborhood kids together, without parents, and played baseball, basketball, or touch football, and enforced the rules ourselves. We were the umpires. We settled disputes. We stepped in when kids started to get rowdy. We did it all ourselves, and we learned life's lessons without a bunch of agenda driven adults telling us what to do. Perhaps it was just the luck of the draw, but of all the kids I can think of who played in that group, a dozen or so, I am not aware of a single one who went to prison, overdosed on drugs, or embarrassed their family in any other way.
Massachusetts (and the NFL) banned tackling Tom Brady many years ago.
Many of those youth sports are necessary to teach the skills needed to play the game at an older age. It’s tough to start playing baseball in high school and be good at it. I’ve seen tons of players start playing football in high school and excel at it. Also, most of the skills they need in football can be learned playing flag football.
I’ve coached both flag football and tackle football and for anyone to say that flag can teach you most of the skills you need in tackle is beyond asinine for anyone that has ever done it. Sorry. Additionally there is much more of a learning curve than you give the sport credit for. I would agree with your comment about baseball and football might not require as much of a learning curve as some sports but there is definitely a learning curve and technique and technical skills involved. Flag is great and fun for kids but teaches you very little about how to play 11 man tackle football.
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8 years old’s aren’t really learning much technique now are they. The kids mostly grab and bump and wrestle kids down.
Did you play in high school or college? Are you familiar with the feeling of getting your head bonked over and over. Little boys don’t really need to be subjected to that for some rudimentary technique work that will make no discernible difference in the future.
As far as the age thing I’m on the fence. My point is saying flag teaches you most of the skills to play tackle is just ridiculous.Further to say you can walk out on the field in 10th or 11th grade and excel for the most part is not in reality. There is a lot of technique and knowledge involved. Youtube some of Larry Johnson’s D-Line drills.
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As someone that has coached youth and HS ball, I agree that at he very youngest ages there is no real reason for tackle other than the kids have a ton of fun. In 10+ years in the youth leagues I saw maybe 1 concussion, 1 broken arm and the rest of the injuries were sprains and strains. I saw just as many injuries coaching girls softball.
If a kid wants to play in HS however, he really should be playing tackle by 5th, 6th or 7th grade IMO. At that level the risk if injury is very small and you are playing with kids that are likely as new to the game as you are. I hate it when some NFL player says that there is no reason to play before HS. To be an NFL player you have to be a gifted athlete that could excel in HS no matter what. 99% of kids are not that and if you walk out on a field for the first time as a 9th grader against kids that may be older and that have played the game before, then A) you likely will not have a great time and won't stick with it and B) you are at the level where real collisions occur and the risk of injury is much higher.
Flag is fine, but as a poster above said - it really is not football and doesn't teach you 80% of the skills involved.
The thing is that the Football has gotten the message that it needed to get safer and IMO it has become significantly safer. The sport provides soo many life lessons and enjoyment to players that I would hate for kids not to have the opportunity to play if they want to.
If a kid wants to play in HS however, he really should be playing tackle by 5th, 6th or 7th grade IMO. At that level the risk if injury is very small and you are playing with kids that are likely as new to the game as you are. I hate it when some NFL player says that there is no reason to play before HS. To be an NFL player you have to be a gifted athlete that could excel in HS no matter what. 99% of kids are not that and if you walk out on a field for the first time as a 9th grader against kids that may be older and that have played the game before, then A) you likely will not have a great time and won't stick with it and B) you are at the level where real collisions occur and the risk of injury is much higher.
Flag is fine, but as a poster above said - it really is not football and doesn't teach you 80% of the skills involved.
The thing is that the Football has gotten the message that it needed to get safer and IMO it has become significantly safer. The sport provides soo many life lessons and enjoyment to players that I would hate for kids not to have the opportunity to play if they want to.
Please enlighten me as to what skills outside of tackling do players actually need to be playing tackle football to learn.
My kid played from age 5 to 8 on a team that won ONE game through out that three year span. I yanked him from the league on a day it was pouring rain and no one was being rotated in and out. I asked the head coach why his kid was playing, all the coaches kids were playing and he had a bench full of kids that busted their ass all week in practice and couldn't get into the game. His answer was they were trying to make the playoffs.. One of the things that really pissed me off was watching the coaches run up the score.... For their ONE win Laughing.. By handing the ball off the the the only kid our team had with any speed .. Asking other coaches if they wanted to score again.
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Google different blocks and blocking techniques, d-line moves, gap responsibilities, etc. jeesh and wow.
Obviously,...because the most important goal of youth sports should be winning.
Youth coaching sucks pretty bad across the country and it’s a shame.
Again, why can’t those be taught without tackling? Blocking, blocking techniques, gap responsibilities all can be taught without tackling. In baseball, I can teach fielding ground balls, covering the outfield, relays, backups...all without live pitching.
Look if you haven’t done it I can’t explain it to you. Trustb
How in the hell do you drive block someone without hitting them? Blocking is contact not flag. I guess if you had the financial where with all to buy your flag kids a 5 man sled you could accomplish some of it. My point to you is football has a lot more technical skill and fundamentals to it than people realize. It is not merely running up and smashing someone. Go to a clinic with Coach Spencer or Limegrove sometime
In Flag football there is no contact - so no blocking and in fact after the ball is across the LOS players must basically stand still on offense. Some skills that they don't learn include:
* Tackling - obviously
* Blocking - not only the skill of actually making a block, but the proper angles, techniques and types of blocks
* Stance and starts - fundamentals
* Pad level - a key fundamental
* The rules (flag rules are completely different)
* Kicking game
etc.
Flag is a fun game, with some skills that are transferrable if you are a QB, Receiver or DB - other than that it does not prepare football players.
I never said anything about not blocking. Blocking is not tackling. Maybe the way many people play flag football is not that beneficial, but it could be if structured correctly. Do everything except at the end you’re pulling a flag instead of hitting someone. Still block, run plays, and everything else you do in tackle football except the actual tackling. It would still be beneficial, it would allow young kids to learn the game instead of just being afraid of getting hit the entire game, and would cut down on serious injuries.
But those rules could be changed to allow more learning aspects of the game and limit serious injuries. Of all the skills you listed, only one (tackling) actually requires someone to be playing tackle football to learn it.
