New MSU head coach found!?

[pandaczar12]

a) the original argument was Pitt has a better chance at making the NY6 than MSU
b) you moved the goal posts to CFP
c) I have no idea why you think the fact that MSU made the CFP in 2015 or any of their other past accomplishments has anything to do with their future prospects
d) You're terrible at math and probabilities

a) Not true, see post #19 and #25... before you decided to offer you unsolicited opinion. Regardless, you removed Pitt from your argument... how can you even make this response with a straight face?
b) Textbook projection on your part, but I already addressed this in a)
c) I have no idea why you think that recent past results have no bearing on future results. Recruiting is the lifeblood of CFB, MSU clearly has more to sell to recruits than Pitt. I can't believe I have to explain this. How can you even say that Pitt has an easier path to the NY6 without considering recent past history? That argument assumes that teams will achieve in the future similar to how they have recently. Relying on this argument proves my point.
d) Says the guy who provides no numbers, just an emotional opinion that completely ignores recent history. It's clear that MSU not only has more access to the NY6, they also have outperformed Pitt recently (this of course doesn't even address the CFP). I'll wait for your numbers that show otherwise.

 

[cjrugger]

a) Not true, see post #19 and #25... before you decided to offer you unsolicited opinion. Regardless, you removed Pitt from your argument... how can you even make this response with a straight face?
b) Textbook projection on your part, but I already addressed this in a)
c) I have no idea why you think that recent past results have no bearing on future results. Recruiting is the lifeblood of CFB, MSU clearly has more to sell to recruits than Pitt. I can't believe I have to explain this. How can you even say that Pitt has an easier path to the NY6 without considering recent past history? That argument assumes that teams will achieve in the future similar to how they have recently. Relying on this argument proves my point.
d) Says the guy who provides no numbers, just an emotional opinion that completely ignores recent history. It's clear that MSU not only has more access to the NY6, they also have outperformed Pitt recently (this of course doesn't even address the CFP). I'll wait for your numbers that show otherwise.

a) post #19 doesn't say anything about the CFP. Post #20 is about the path to the NY6, which you then responded to and tried to make it about the CFP in #25. It's a message board, no one 'solicits' opinions dummy
b) 2015 was a long time ago and D'Antonio is no longer the coach.

247 Composite Recruting Rankings
2020
#43- MSU
#44- Pitt
I guess all these high school players aren't as smart as you and can't see what a great opportunity it is to play at MSU. Or are you saying the guy selling it at Pitt is better than the guy who was selling it at MSU?

c) The B1G has sent 2.6 teams per year to the NY6. So MSU does not have a 1 in 7 chance in making it. They have a .6 in 12 chance of making it. You're leaving out the chance that a 2nd west team makes the NY6. The ACC has sent 1.8 teams per year to the NY6. In 5 of the 6 years of the NY6, the Coastal champ (no matter how much they suck) has played in the NY6. So rerun your calculations and get back to us.

 

[cop113]

keep living in the past when PSU was sanctioned and UM had RichRod/Hoke if you want.
Pitt's path to NY6 is easier than MSU's (as long as Clemson gets a bye to the CFP).

Pitt loses four to five games every year in a weak conference and is never ranked in the top 25. How does that get you to a NY6???

 

[WDLion]

Pitt loses four to five games every year in a weak conference and is never ranked in the top 25. How does that get you to a NY6???

Pitts path is easier when you consider the teams each team needs to beat to get there.

 

[ClarkstonMark]

Pitt loses four to five games every year in a weak conference and is never ranked in the top 25. How does that get you to a NY6???

they can be 6-7 as long as they win coastal and get trounced by Clemson and they will still be in NY6.
It's not that difficult to understand.

 

[cjrugger]

Pitt loses four to five games every year in a weak conference and is never ranked in the top 25. How does that get you to a NY6???

ask UVA

 

[pandaczar12]

a) post #19 doesn't say anything about the CFP. Post #20 is about the path to the NY6, which you then responded to and tried to make it about the CFP in #25. It's a message board, no one 'solicits' opinions dummy
b) 2015 was a long time ago and D'Antonio is no longer the coach.

247 Composite Recruting Rankings
2020
#43- MSU
#44- Pitt
I guess all these high school players aren't as smart as you and can't see what a great opportunity it is to play at MSU. Or are you saying the guy selling it at Pitt is better than the guy who was selling it at MSU?

c) The B1G has sent 2.6 teams per year to the NY6. So MSU does not have a 1 in 7 chance in making it. They have a .6 in 12 chance of making it. You're leaving out the chance that a 2nd west team makes the NY6. The ACC has sent 1.8 teams per year to the NY6. In 5 of the 6 years of the NY6, the Coastal champ (no matter how much they suck) has played in the NY6. So rerun your calculations and get back to us.

a) Post #19 talks about MSU having a "much higher ceiling", AKA the CFP. Post #20 tries to go off topic from the CFP. Post #25 tries to get us back on track. For the record, all of these posts were before you got involved. Exactly, no one solicited your emotional outburst. Please keep them to yourself.

b) 1976 was a whole lot longer ago, and that was the last time Pitt was relevant. MSU has the new coach who will be around for a while, who knows how long Pitt puts up with 5 loss Narduzzi seasons?

So you think 2020 "Recruting" Rankings tell the entire story.... LOL! Who has the coach more likely to be around longer? Who has better facilities and more money? Who has more recent success? Who has more access to the NY6?

d) You're terrible at math and probabilities. Also, your assumptions are not based in reality. I don't think you have one number correct, so rerun your calculations and get back to us. Feel free to post your work so I can correct you.

 

[cjrugger]

a) Post #19 talks about MSU having a "much higher ceiling", AKA the CFP. Post #20 tries to go off topic from the CFP. Post #25 tries to get us back on track. For the record, all of these posts were before you got involved. Exactly, no one solicited your emotional outburst. Please keep them to yourself.

b) 1976 was a whole lot longer ago, and that was the last time Pitt was relevant. MSU has the new coach who will be around for a while, who knows how long Pitt puts up with 5 loss Narduzzi seasons?

So you think 2020 "Recruting" Rankings tell the entire story.... LOL! Who has the coach more likely to be around longer? Who has better facilities and more money? Who has more recent success? Who has more access to the NY6?

d) You're terrible at math and probabilities. Also, your assumptions are not based in reality. I don't think you have one number correct, so rerun your calculations and get back to us. Feel free to post your work so I can correct you.

You were the one who tried to move the goalposts to CFP after Clarkston said NY6. You were the one who brought up recruiting, not me. Coaches? Well let's see, the MSU coach said he wasn't going anywhere a week ago, and lied.The Pitt coach turned down the job. So I'd guess Narduzzi will be there longer. I corrected your math, sorry you didnt like the outcome.

You suck at this. You actually think opinions are solicited here? Who solicited yours?

 

[pandaczar12]

You were the one who tried to move the goalposts to CFP after Clarkston said NY6. You were the one who brought up recruiting, not me. Coaches? Well let's see, the MSU coach said he wasn't going anywhere a week ago, and lied.The Pitt coach turned down the job. So I'd guess Narduzzi will be there longer. I corrected your math, sorry you didnt like the outcome.

You suck at this. You actually think opinions are solicited here? Who solicited yours?

Can't you read? Just because I didn't explicitly say "CFP", doesn't mean that wasn't my intent when I discussed a higher ceiling. When he tried to move the goalposts, I clearly corrected him quickly. End of discussion. Regardless, you removed Pitt from your argument and haven't explained why. You also never responded to my pointing out that you can't say that Pitt has an easier path to the NY6 without considering recent past history. Because relying on that argument assumes that teams will achieve in the future similar to how they have recently. Which proves my point.

Link to the proof that Narduzzi turned down the job? (FYI... him saying he's not going anywhere is not proof)

If you are not willing to show your work, I can not correct you. If you are unwilling to back up your own point, I have no choice but to accept your concession.

I suck at this? You keep rambling on about my jab that no one asked for you to get involved... like it's important... rather than defend your own math. Think about that.

 

[cjrugger]

Can't you read? Just because I didn't explicitly say "CFP", doesn't mean that wasn't my intent when I discussed a higher ceiling. When he tried to move the goalposts, I clearly corrected him quickly. End of discussion. Regardless, you removed Pitt from your argument and haven't explained why. You also never responded to my pointing out that you can't say that Pitt has an easier path to the NY6 without considering recent past history. Because relying on that argument assumes that teams will achieve in the future similar to how they have recently. Which proves my point.

Link to the proof that Narduzzi turned down the job? (FYI... him saying he's not going anywhere is not proof)

If you are not willing to show your work, I can not correct you. If you are unwilling to back up your own point, I have no choice but to accept your concession.

I suck at this? You keep rambling on about my jab that no one asked for you to get involved... like it's important... rather than defend your own math. Think about that.

You're such a disingenuous loser. On a board full of crap, your bolded work above is really elite level bullsh!t. Impressive work. Take care

 

[pandaczar12]

You're such a disingenuous loser. On a board full of crap, your bolded work above is really elite level bullsh!t. Impressive work. Take care

So you are claiming to know my intent better than I do... and you have the nerve to call me disingenuous? I clearly said "a higher ceiling", and I quickly corrected the other poster when he tried to move the goal posts. I also repeatedly kept putting the goal posts back to CFP throughout the entire thread. Those facts just don't fit your agenda.

I know why you won't provide a link backing up your "Narduzzi turned them down" argument... because you can't. I will help you out and provide the board discussion on his announcement that nobody believed... with the exception of you and every Pitt fan.

https://bwi.forums.rivals.com/threa...ling-tommy-stevens-tweet.259889/#post-4665085

All you post are childish insults and irrelevant gibberish, as an attempt to distract from the fact that you don't want to defend your own math. If you decide you want to grow up and learn something, I will be here to correct your work.

 

[diontechristmas]

they can be 6-7 as long as they win coastal and get trounced by Clemson and they will still be in NY6.
It's not that difficult to understand.

I believe there is a clause that the team must be ranked in the top 25 in this scenario to get the ny6 bid. Virginia qualified this year by the skin of their teeth.

 

[Art]

I believe there is a clause that the team must be ranked in the top 25 in this scenario to get the ny6 bid. Virginia qualified this year by the skin of their teeth.

Nope, no such "clause."

 

[RGWhirly]

I hope MSU becomes a 2-10 team year in year out with one of their only wins being beating their big brother quite often.

 

[NewEra 2014]

One of MTs potential recruiting advantages, that he is loyal to his program, is out the window after just one year as a head coach. Nice move.

It would have been one thing if he left Colorado for Wisky, his alma mater. But for him to leave for the MSU job after only one year? He will have a tough time living that one down on the recruiting trail.

 

[anon_is9z1n0h3zblb]

One of MTs potential recruiting advantages, that he is loyal to his program, is out the window after just one year as a head coach. Nice move.

It would have been one thing if he left Colorado for Wisky, his alma mater. But for him to leave for the MSU job after only one year? He will have a tough time living that one down on the recruiting trail.

From an article published today in the Athletic. I'd post s link but it's behind a pay wall. From Andy Staples.

Lesson 4: Don’t bash players looking to transfer when you’ve always looked for other jobs.
Tucker should have known this already, but hopefully this episode has taught him that he lives in the largest glass house in that particular neighborhood. (And he can afford to put a big ol’ addition on that glass house with his new paychecks.) Tucker secured the bag, and that’s great. We all should hope to do the same. But don’t begrudge someone else the opportunity to look elsewhere for a better opportunity when you’ve made a career out of it.

A little more self-awareness might help Tucker in his new job. If I’m Ohio State’s Ryan Day, Michigan’s Jim Harbaugh or Penn State’s James Franklin, I’m pointing out Tucker’s recent about-face to every recruit who is considering my school and Michigan State. Tucker is going to have to work even harder to build trust now, and owning his previous terrible takes would be a great way to start.

 

[Tom McAndrew]

 

[LionJim]

View embedded media

Yeah, I read that earlier. Not a good look.

 

[marshall23]

I'm just curious what everyone would do if they got a job offer that doubled their salary and benefits and did the same for their loyal associates that they can bring with them?Is there a graceful way exiting given the circumstances? Because the timing is bad do you say no? I understand both sides. I don't know anything about Tucker, but I'm not sure how we all would handle it, if the decision was ours to make. Bill O'Brien lied to a lot of kids too.

 

[Art]

I'm just curious what everyone would do if they got a job offer that doubled their salary and benefits and did the same for their loyal associates that they can bring with them?Is there a graceful way exiting given the circumstances? Because the timing is bad do you say no? I understand both sides. I don't know anything about Tucker, but I'm not sure how we all would handle it, if the decision was ours to make. Bill O'Brien lied to a lot of kids too.

Can't really blame him. Also can't blame the competition for using the look against him.

 

[LemonEars]

Pretty simple what happened here. Narduzzi went to pitt to audition for the MSU job. Narduzzi failed his audition.

 

[marshall23]

Pretty simple what happened here. Narduzzi went to pitt to audition for the MSU job. Narduzzi failed his audition.

As I posted earlier.....I happened to be listening to XM and they had some guy named Hondo, who covers MSU Football. One thing he was adamant about was that MSU would not give the job to a Dantonio associate. He was clear they wanted to "move on" from that era. I doubt that MSU ever had a conversation with El Douche, if his agent made contact he was respectfully rebuffed. It was easy for El Douche to say he was staying put, since there was never any discussion otherwise.

 

[LemonEars]

MSU saying "they want to move on from the Dantonio era" is a backhanded way of saying that those associated with the Dantonio era aren't worthy of consideration.

 

[BobPSU92]

MSU saying "they want to move on from the Dantonio era" is a backhanded way of saying that those associated with the Dantonio era aren't worthy of consideration.

Maybe, just maybe, someone at msu has some sense that they need to change their ways after myriad scandals and cover-ups and the fact that they lost their first choice due to their CAMPUS. CULTURE. .

 

[Roswell-Blue]

I'm just curious what everyone would do if they got a job offer that doubled their salary and benefits and did the same for their loyal associates that they can bring with them?Is there a graceful way exiting given the circumstances? Because the timing is bad do you say no? I understand both sides. I don't know anything about Tucker, but I'm not sure how we all would handle it, if the decision was ours to make. Bill O'Brien lied to a lot of kids too.

Looks like Mel Tucker's critics wants him to be "that guy". That guy being the one who doesn't jump to leave when you double his and his staff's salary and benefits. Seems we always want someone else to be that guy, but not us. If we're honest most of Tucker's critics would do just what he did - run to the big money. It feels like hypocrisy to me. The idea that honor and truth i.e. "I gave my word" can compete against the powerful and operative world view of "always more" is a losing proposition.

 

[LemonEars]

Maybe, just maybe, someone at msu has some sense that they need to change their ways after myriad scandals and cover-ups and the fact that they lost their first choice due to their CAMPUS. CULTURE. .

Good point. Maybe the people in the MSU athletic department recognized that Narduzzi knew about the scandals and did nothing to stop them. Thus, Narduzzi was tainted and not eligible for the head coaching job.

 

[ram2020]

Looks like Mel Tucker's critics wants him to be "that guy". That guy being the one who doesn't jump to leave when you double his and his staff's salary and benefits. Seems we always want someone else to be that guy, but not us. If we're honest most of Tucker's critics would do just what he did - run to the big money. It feels like hypocrisy to me. The idea that honor and truth i.e. "I gave my word" can compete against the powerful and operative world view of "always more" is a losing proposition.

I don't think people take umbrage to these guys accepting new positions that double their salaries. I think the problem rests with telling kids that you are committed to being their coach for the foreseeable future, telling that to your current employer, espousing your commitment to fans and boosters on social media, then heading out of town like a fart in the wind. Many of these coaches are either totally naive and dumb at best, not expecting to get solicited by other schools or they are they are lying disingenuous scumbags. I don't respect either mindset. If you are being solicited by your dream employer, maybe stay off of social media a touch, maybe don't promise things to kids you can't keep(like B'OB telling hack and brenneman he would 100% see their careers through). I'm not half the fan of Matt Rhule as others on this board, but there is a guy who does it the right way. Tells his team he would be stupid not to listen to overtures from the NFL, he would expect them to do the same things in their careers, and that he will be straight up with them if an opportunity presents itself that he wants to explore. No hard feelings at Baylor when he left, none. It takes a special kind of as*hole to look a room full of players and recruits in the eye and tell them you are 100% committed to being their coach, then jumping on a plane to a new destination 3 hours later.

 

[PSUSignore]

I don't think people take umbrage to these guys accepting new positions that double their salaries. I think the problem rests with telling kids that you are committed to being their coach for the foreseeable future, telling that to your current employer, espousing your commitment to fans and boosters on social media, then heading out of town like a fart in the wind. Many of these coaches are either totally naive and dumb at best, not expecting to get solicited by other schools or they are they are lying disingenuous scumbags. I don't respect either mindset. If you are being solicited by your dream employer, maybe stay off of social media a touch, maybe don't promise things to kids you can't keep(like B'OB telling hack and brenneman he would 100% see their careers through). I'm not half the fan of Matt Rhule as others on this board, but there is a guy who does it the right way. Tells his team he would be stupid not to listen to overtures from the NFL, he would expect them to do the same things in their careers, and that he will be straight up with them if an opportunity presents itself that he wants to explore. No hard feelings at Baylor when he left, none. It takes a special kind of as*hole to look a room full of players and recruits in the eye and tell them you are 100% committed to being their coach, then jumping on a plane to a new destination 3 hours later.

What can they realistically do? When you have a current job, you do the duties of that job until the ink is dry on the next contract and it's a done deal. Part of his job is recruiting, fund raising, events, etc. He can't stop doing those things in case something with the new role falls through and given the public nature of his position can't stop doing them because then media reports of his job negotiation will go everywhere. Coaches are in a tough spot and they pretty much have to screw over someone in that scenario, and they sure aren't going to screw over the new employer on day 1.

 

[ram2020]

What can they realistically do? When you have a current job, you do the duties of that job until the ink is dry on the next contract and it's a done deal. Part of his job is recruiting, fund raising, events, etc. He can't stop doing those things in case something with the new role falls through and given the public nature of his position can't stop doing them because then media reports of his job negotiation will go everywhere. Coaches are in a tough spot and they pretty much have to screw over someone in that scenario, and they sure aren't going to screw over the new employer on day 1.

Fair points, let me see if there is a different way to go about this that is both reasonable to a prospective employer and your current employer. Mel gets contacted by MSU about their coaching vacancy. He walks into his AD's office and tells him his agent has been contacted and that Mel may have some interest in the position. The AD say's "okay, Mel, we want you to be here, we expect you to be here, but we understand the nature of high profile coaching in college football. Let's cancel our event tomorrow and I'd like you to either stay off of social media and not talk to the team until this position becomes "real" in your mind. I ask that you keep me informed over the next 24hours." Mel then interviews and comes back to his AD and says "I'd like to stay and you have my commitment, OR, I'll stay but my agent wants more money for me and my assistants OR I'm leaving, this is my dream job. " The AD can either say "F-off" or "We will begin negotiating immediately."

Instead of the above hypothetical, Mel meets with MSU, declines the job, announces his full commitment to CU, their community, boosters/fans and players, and then leaves once MSU takes another bite of the apple. Why not just cancel the event, why go onto social media and put out the rumors only to leave? It was poorly handled and I don't think it needed to be. Meet with the AD and your players, don't promise anything until you are sure, basically, be a reasonable adult. Nobody is saying he can't interview and that he doesn't have job duties, but there are definitely other ways to handle ie:

1. STAY off of social media
2. Be open and honest with your bosses
3. Don't make promise you won't keep even in the most unexpected scenarios
4. Give your employer the option to handle the PR and downplay the uncertainty of your employment as rumors swirl and you interview.

 

[mmp121]