OT: Here is an excellent take on spike in school shootings from Malcolm Gladwell

[ericstratton-rushchairman]

This is an article from National Review using excerpts from a Gladwell article from a few years ago. Basic premise is with each successive shooting the "social threshold" lowers for the next individual. He points to Columbine as the major pivot point. Deeply interesting and disturbing at the same time.

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/why-do-mass-shootings-happen-best-explanation/

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

This is an article from National Review using excerpts from a Gladwell article from a few years ago. Basic premise is with each successive shooting the "social threshold" lowers for the next individual. He points to Columbine as the major pivot point. Deeply interesting and disturbing at the same time.

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/why-do-mass-shootings-happen-best-explanation/

Read that before and he’s used the Stanford riot threshold study to explain other incidents of social phenomena. He’s a very smart man whose opinion I respect a lot - would love if he could offer some solutions.

 

[LeatherHelmets]

Thanks for sharing. Just spent the last 3 hours worrying about my daughter, who is a high school teacher. Her school was was on a "hard lockdown". It just ended, and it also occurred this past Friday. Very relieved that the result was "no credible threat", but they need to finds these copycats and make an example.

 

[LionDeNittany]

This is an article from National Review using excerpts from a Gladwell article from a few years ago. Basic premise is with each successive shooting the "social threshold" lowers for the next individual. He points to Columbine as the major pivot point. Deeply interesting and disturbing at the same time.

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/why-do-mass-shootings-happen-best-explanation/

What's interesting about Columbine and the Joker movie theater incident... is that you had oddball kids clad in black who kept to themselves.

Yet, in the same area when some oddball kids show up to a school, keep to themselves and are dressed in black, and someone phones security on them... it's racial profiling.

There's no way to win.

 

[Grant Green]

From Gladwell article:
"On February 2, 1996, in Moses Lake, Washington, a fourteen-year-old named Barry Loukaitis walked into Frontier Middle School dressed in a black duster and carrying two handguns, seventy-eight rounds of ammunition, and a hunting rifle. He killed two students and wounded a third before shooting his algebra teacher in the back."

Manuel Vela was my good friend's nephew and was the first (and only intended) victim. It's hard for me to believe that was essentially the first of a series of high profile school shootings.

However, there is a long list of school shootings throughout US history. Big difference is that now the goal is mass casualties and a 24-7 news cycle to talk about it.

 

[Nitt1300]

Many of you are probably not old enough to really remember the tower shooting at the University Of Texas in 1966. It was a HUGE shock at the time, and it would probably be just another three day news story today.

 

[step.eng69]

Many of you are probably not old enough to really remember the tower shooting at the University Of Texas in 1966. It was a HUGE shock at the time, and it would probably be just another three day news story today.

Old enough? Yep & I remember

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

What's interesting about Columbine and the Joker movie theater incident... is that you had oddball kids clad in black who kept to themselves.

Yet, in the same area when some oddball kids show up to a school, keep to themselves and are dressed in black, and someone phones security on them... it's racial profiling.

There's no way to win.

Dressing in all black says much more about other things than it does race IMO (musical tastes, etc.)

 

[Ian]

After 9/11, we respond with strict travel restrictions for all. The traveler had to deal with the inconvenience. Metal detectors, pat downs, etc...

Unfortunately, we need to do the same thing at schools. One entrance and it’s guarded by trained security with metal detectors and dogs. Pretty simple solution. Drug trafficking will also be reduced at the schools.

It’s sad on so many fronts but the tragedies and suffering has to stop. Gun control isn’t the answer. Build fences around our schools. Exit doors are not entrance doors like at most hotels.

Another idea would be to have police stationed at schools full time. That’s their “beat”.

It is what it is and it’s a terrible thing but we have to do a bettter job of securing our schools.

 

[Grant Green]

Gun control isn’t the answer. B.

Complex problems typically result from numerous conditions and require a multi-pronged solution. More security at schools is certainly one of them, as is addressing mental health services. To eliminate one of the main conditions as a possible cause is foolish and stinks of partisan politics.

And don't be short-sighted. We do not just have a school shooting problem, we have a mass shooting problem. Addressing only schools isn't addressing the problem as a whole.

 

[Cosmos]

This is an article from National Review using excerpts from a Gladwell article from a few years ago. Basic premise is with each successive shooting the "social threshold" lowers for the next individual. He points to Columbine as the major pivot point. Deeply interesting and disturbing at the same time.

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/why-do-mass-shootings-happen-best-explanation/

Thanks for posting.

 

[Aardvark86]

Complex problems typically result from numerous conditions and require a multi-pronged solution. More security at schools is certainly one of them, as is addressing mental health services. To eliminate one of the main conditions as a possible cause is foolish and stinks of partisan politics.

And don't be short-sighted. We do not just have a school shooting problem, we have a mass shooting problem. Addressing only schools isn't addressing the problem as a whole.

You are right that mental illness is a frequent root cause issue. But we don’t have the courage to deal with it as a public health issue rather than a civil liberties issue.

 

[Cosmos]

Complex problems typically result from numerous conditions and require a multi-pronged solution. More security at schools is certainly one of them, as is addressing mental health services. To eliminate one of the main conditions as a possible cause is foolish and stinks of partisan politics.

And don't be short-sighted. We do not just have a school shooting problem, we have a mass shooting problem. Addressing only schools isn't addressing the problem as a whole.

Interesting posit. I would take it a step further, however. We just don't have a mass shooting problem. We have a trust problem. At the risk of divulging my age I remember when we slept with the doors unlocked and the windows open. But then we stopped trusting. And somewhere along the way it became a problem, and then it morphed into a complex problem. In my simple way of thinking there must be consequences for bad behavior. And the punishment should get equal (or more) coverage than the crime itself. The stockade served as a deterrent. The guillotine did too for those watching, I suppose. But of this much I am sure. The media coverage gives shooters notoriety and it's doing us no favors.

 

[RandyL]

As bizarre as it sounds, the day may come when we consider holding parents criminally responsible for their childrens behavior under certain circumstances.

 

[Locolion]

This is an article from National Review using excerpts from a Gladwell article from a few years ago. Basic premise is with each successive shooting the "social threshold" lowers for the next individual. He points to Columbine as the major pivot point. Deeply interesting and disturbing at the same time.

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/why-do-mass-shootings-happen-best-explanation/

The “cure”, my friends, is to stop media coverage of these events. Just announce that they are occuring at XYZ school, but provide no “glory” coverage of the shooters.

 

[pandaczar12]

The “cure”, my friends, is to stop media coverage of these events. Just announce that they are occuring at XYZ school, but provide no “glory” coverage of the shooters.

I've been saying this for years... stop printing their names. They want the notoriety.

 

[todd brewster]

Good suggestions and here are two more.

Get those idiots in Hollywood to stop preening and take a stand against violence on TV, in Movies and especially on video games. We can't take away 1st Amendment rights, but we can boycott like we did Weinstein, DeNiro, Spacey and others who made alleged sexual assaults.

The other trend are the pharmacy companies that give out drugs like candy to our kids. There is a definite link among prescription drugs and mass shooters.

 

[Mister Magoo]

Good suggestions and here are two more.

Get those idiots in Hollywood to stop preening and take a stand against violence on TV, in Movies and especially on video games. We can't take away 1st Amendment rights, but we can boycott like we did Weinstein, DeNiro, Spacey and others who made alleged sexual assaults.

The other trend are the pharmacy companies that give out drugs like candy to our kids. There is a definite link among prescription drugs and mass shooters.

Kids are over-medicated for sure. Don't ya think violent video games factors in too? I don't believe kids
are inherently more evil than we were. They have access to many more things than we did.

 

[interrobang]

My son's school was on lockdown last week because someone nearby called 911 on a guy cleaning his BB gun.

The threshold is most certainly lower.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Kids are over-medicated for sure. Don't ya think violent video games factors in too? I don't believe kids
are inherently more evil than we were. They have access to many more things than we did.

Except violent video games and movies are available all over the world. Kids in Japan, Korea, and Europe play as much or more than Americans. There is something there much harder to get, but no one in America wants to talk about that. It's like trying to eliminate the opioid crisis without addressing the drugs.

 

[Player2BNamedL8r]

Read that before and he’s used the Stanford riot threshold study to explain other incidents of social phenomena. He’s a very smart man whose opinion I respect a lot - would love if he could offer some solutions.

One of the most fascinating books I’ve ever read was Outliers by Mr. Gladwell. A must read for anyone looking for an interesting take on how people obtain high levels of success.

 

[Psychedelic_MackDaddy]

This is an article from National Review using excerpts from a Gladwell article from a few years ago. Basic premise is with each successive shooting the "social threshold" lowers for the next individual. He points to Columbine as the major pivot point. Deeply interesting and disturbing at the same time.

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/why-do-mass-shootings-happen-best-explanation/

Why does this keep happening?

I'll tell you why. We are apes - me, you, your neighbor, etc.

Why does war keep happening?

'll tell you why. We are apes - me, you, your neighbor, etc.

Why does genocide keep happening?

'll tell you why. We are apes - me, you, your neighbor, etc.

Why does murder and rape keep happening?

'll tell you why. We are apes - me, you, your neighbor, etc.

 

[Cletus11]

Wasn’t there a shooter on the Hub lawn back in the mid 90’s. Had a hunting rifle and took a shot or two from the bushes. rOTC guy was walking by when it happened and wrestled the gun from him before anybody got hit with a bullet. Anybody else remember that

 

[ericstratton-rushchairman]

One of the most fascinating books I’ve ever read was Outliers by Mr. Gladwell. A must read for anyone looking for an interesting take on how people obtain high levels of success.

His other books are great as well. In fact, his book "What the Dog Saw" is a collection of a bunch of his articles for The New Yorker. Just great stuff

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Wasn’t there a shooter on the Hub lawn back in the mid 90’s. Had a hunting rifle and took a shot or two from the bushes. rOTC guy was walking by when it happened and wrestled the gun from him before anybody got hit with a bullet. Anybody else remember that

I was in class in the building across from the HUB - Boucke.

 

[mn78psu83]

Wasn’t there a shooter on the Hub lawn back in the mid 90’s. Had a hunting rifle and took a shot or two from the bushes. rOTC guy was walking by when it happened and wrestled the gun from him before anybody got hit with a bullet. Anybody else remember that

Yes. I was on campus at the time. The shooter was a woman, Jillian Robbins. She killed one student and wounded another. She used a 7mm Mauser. Brendon Malovrh (sp?) was the student who tackled her from behind.

 

[PeetzPoolBoy]

Why does this keep happening?

I'll tell you why. We are apes - me, you, your neighbor, etc.

Why does war keep happening?

'll tell you why. We are apes - me, you, your neighbor, etc.

Why does genocide keep happening?

'll tell you why. We are apes - me, you, your neighbor, etc.

Why does murder and rape keep happening?

'll tell you why. We are apes - me, you, your neighbor, etc.

When was your last date with a breathing female?

 

[Obliviax]

Why does this keep happening?

I'll tell you why. We are apes - me, you, your neighbor, etc.

Why does war keep happening?

'll tell you why. We are apes - me, you, your neighbor, etc.

Why does genocide keep happening?

'll tell you why. We are apes - me, you, your neighbor, etc.

Why does murder and rape keep happening?

'll tell you why. We are apes - me, you, your neighbor, etc.

has there been a shooting at a catholic school?

 

[LionDeNittany]

Dressing in all black says much more about other things than it does race IMO (musical tastes, etc.)

That's the point. Some kids were dressed in black. They show up AT A SCHOOL, keep to themselves and do not even say their name when asked.

Someone who knows about Columbine and the movie theater incident phones security/police, and they are accused of racial profiling.

How can the police ever get ahead of these things?

LdN

 

[LionDeNittany]

Wasn’t there a shooter on the Hub lawn back in the mid 90’s. Had a hunting rifle and took a shot or two from the bushes. rOTC guy was walking by when it happened and wrestled the gun from him before anybody got hit with a bullet. Anybody else remember that

Well, one it was a woman. Two a student was killed and one or two more were injured. Other than that... well you got the location and date correct.

In the end a sort of smallish incident but that was because of the brave man.

This is also why when there was a shooter at VT, PSU alum were so involved in helping.

LdN

 

[Psychedelic_MackDaddy]

That's the point. Some kids were dressed in black. They show up AT A SCHOOL, keep to themselves and do not even say their name when asked.

Someone who knows about Columbine and the movie theater incident phones security/police, and they are accused of racial profiling.

How can the police ever get ahead of these things?

LdN

It's called GOTH.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

That's the point. Some kids were dressed in black. They show up AT A SCHOOL, keep to themselves and do not even say their name when asked.

Someone who knows about Columbine and the movie theater incident phones security/police, and they are accused of racial profiling.

How can the police ever get ahead of these things?

LdN

For the police, they're just doing their job when they respond. The other stuff, I have no idea - it's difficult.

 

[LionDeNittany]

For the police, they're just doing their job when they respond. The other stuff, I have no idea - it's difficult.

Yes good point. And I agree. It is difficult. That's the problem with freedom.

LdN

 

[TheBumble]

Many of you are probably not old enough to really remember the tower shooting at the University Of Texas in 1966. It was a HUGE shock at the time, and it would probably be just another three day news story today.

There was an episode of Independent Lens on PBS about this event that was very good. I didn't know the whole story until watching it. The first person shot was a pregnant woman. She laid bleeding to death in the middle of the south mall until a couple students ran out there and carried her to safety. I was so inspired watching the video of young people risking their lives to save a complete stranger. They could have stayed hidden behind buildings like everyone else and nobody would have criticized them. It makes you wonder how you would react in a situation like that.

 

[Waltwam]

When was your last date with a breathing female?

Recently. She was an ape!

 

[rudedude]

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-philip-zimbardo/post_3387_b_1543693.html

Psychology professor who conducted the infamous Stanford Prison experiment.

 

[psuro]

You guys are missing the obvious solution to school shootings.

 

[pandaczar12]

You guys are missing the obvious solution to school shootings.

I'd love to hear it, as long as it doesn't involve magically making all guns (legal and illegal) disappear from the face of the planet... which is impossible and doesn't address the root cause of the problem, and would only turn school shootings in to school bombings, stabbings, vehicle attacks, etc.

 

[psuro]

I'd love to hear it, as long as it doesn't involve magically making all guns (legal and illegal) disappear from the face of the planet... which is impossible and doesn't address the root cause of the problem, and would only turn school shootings in to school bombings, stabbings, vehicle attacks, etc.

Observational analysis of the situation will tell you who is doing the shooting. That will help you in identifying the solution.

 

[Cletus11]

Well, one it was a woman. Two a student was killed and one or two more were injured. Other than that... well you got the location and date correct.

In the end a sort of smallish incident but that was because of the brave man.

This is also why when there was a shooter at VT, PSU alum were so involved in helping.

LdN

You obviously missed the point of the post, the point is if you asked probably 95% of PSU alums they would have no clue that PSU had a school shooting (and according to you, someone died). And this happened in the mid 90's so not like 50 years ago or something. If the same incident happened today, it would be all over the 24 hour news cycle for day's, etc....showing the major difference between today and as short as 20 years ago.