I was listening to the Keystone Network's 5 year Sanction anniversary podcasts. It got me thinking, while we were down it must of meant some program benefited and have been up. Who do you guys think benefited the most while were down? Ones that I think the most were Rutgers and Mich State because they have fallen back to earth while we had a great season last year.
Program(s) that benefited most while we were down?
- Thread starter ejb25
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Michigan State for sure, probably more than any other school. I think Ohio State benefited. We're now going head to head with them on many recruits.
Michigan State is the only school that did. Rutgers was still horrible and couldn't even beat us while sanctioned. Maryland was average as they always are. Pitt is can't even win 8 games. Literally other than MSU ... no one lol
If the rumors that Meyer was set to take over from Joe in 2012 are true, tOSU was the big beneficiary.. If not, they still were able to pick up some recruits that we might have signed.
I don't think any school directly benefitted to their net gain and PSU's net loss in those head to head comparisons .
MSU had lost 8/10 games to PSU leading into sanctions but they dropped off the schedule from 2012-2013. A depleted PSU team didn't pose much threat to D'Antonio's '14 and '15 teams but at that point, I think MSU was built a lot more on Michigan's ineptitude as anything PSU endured.
There were some significant recruiting losses that sanctions played a big role in. The big names that pop up are Peppers and WIlkens....and then guys like Boyd and Johnson that ended up at Pitt. I suppose we could say Pitt should have benefitted more with a few players ending up there from the sanctions but it didn't exactly translate on the field for them or give them any net gain in recruiting over PSU.
MSU had lost 8/10 games to PSU leading into sanctions but they dropped off the schedule from 2012-2013. A depleted PSU team didn't pose much threat to D'Antonio's '14 and '15 teams but at that point, I think MSU was built a lot more on Michigan's ineptitude as anything PSU endured.
There were some significant recruiting losses that sanctions played a big role in. The big names that pop up are Peppers and WIlkens....and then guys like Boyd and Johnson that ended up at Pitt. I suppose we could say Pitt should have benefitted more with a few players ending up there from the sanctions but it didn't exactly translate on the field for them or give them any net gain in recruiting over PSU.
Yeah. Most argued that last year was going to be the worst of the sanctions, so I guess last year Rutgres should have benifitted the most.
How'd, that work out for them? Yeah, zero points against the BIG East best three teams. So without the sanctions, Michigan hangs a hundred on them?
They do have an excuse though....we had sanctions, they had a Flood.
Virginia, Maryland, Temple and Pitt all won games they wouldn't have won if PSU had been at full strength. I don't know that it would have made much of a difference in any particular program. The rise and fall of programs is over a large number of years.
You could argue that the relative decline of Penn State in Paterno's last 20 years allowed the rise of Rutgers under Schiano because Rutgers was able to beat out PSU for quite a few NJ and Pa. recruits. A lot of talented Pa. players spurned Paterno to play for Maryland, VA and Va Tech or went further south to Fla.
But I don't see any lasting effects. Just about everything Schiano built in credibility for the Rutgers program is gone. Maryland is doing well now, but going forward Penn State is going to generally beat Maryland for Delmarva and Balt-Wash metro area players.
U.Va. is down, Va. Tech is in transition and UNC is not a power. So it's been a good time for Franklin to re-establish ties in Va. and the Carolinas which used to be almost like home territory for PSU.
You could argue that the relative decline of Penn State in Paterno's last 20 years allowed the rise of Rutgers under Schiano because Rutgers was able to beat out PSU for quite a few NJ and Pa. recruits. A lot of talented Pa. players spurned Paterno to play for Maryland, VA and Va Tech or went further south to Fla.
But I don't see any lasting effects. Just about everything Schiano built in credibility for the Rutgers program is gone. Maryland is doing well now, but going forward Penn State is going to generally beat Maryland for Delmarva and Balt-Wash metro area players.
U.Va. is down, Va. Tech is in transition and UNC is not a power. So it's been a good time for Franklin to re-establish ties in Va. and the Carolinas which used to be almost like home territory for PSU.
With just a handful of exceptions (KJ Carter), Paterno almost never beat Ohio State for recruits. PSU got some great players out of Ohio like Enis but they were people OSU had passed on.
This year is the first time I remember PSU potentially landing multiple players OSU wanted (Luketa and -- we hope -- Hawkins and Scruggs). Franklin still has a long way to go before anybody can talk about recruiting parity with tOSU or Michigan though.
Agree 100%. Since the NCAA has admitted they were wrong and restored all vacated wins, they still need to vacate the losses they caused by the unjust sanctions.
It's amazing that PSU was still feeling the effects from sanctions, had a ton of key injuries, were installing a new offensive system, and playing on the road... they still should have beat Pitt, but pissed away multiple chances. It's truly unbelievable how the stars had to align for Pitt to luck out that win. That won't happen this year. #8of10
I'd say the PSU BOT benefited the most.
Pitt and Maryland should have benefited greatly, but they completely whiffed on the opportunity.
Michigan State had the perfect storm of a down Michigan and PSU. Back to reality for them now.
However, I agree with the earlier poster that the program that benefited the greatest has been OSU. This is especially true If Meyer really was going to succeed Paterno.
Michigan State had the perfect storm of a down Michigan and PSU. Back to reality for them now.
However, I agree with the earlier poster that the program that benefited the greatest has been OSU. This is especially true If Meyer really was going to succeed Paterno.
Eh, I'd disagree with that. Supposedly (may be urban legend) tOSU made a big goof in recruiting Enis. We always were good getting kids out of the Youngstown area. And as I recall, Hartings* was a guy tOSU wanted (I think they thought he'd come along with Hoying). And Fox--they just took him for granted as a legacy. And I'll bet they wanted Blackledge....
*Just found out that Hartings is now in Columbus as head coach at Worthington Christian HS (I had a couple of kids on my soccer team back in the day who went there).
Without a question it was MSU. Pitt thought it would but it never materialized.
Maybe second was ND.
It was, INMO, the biggest reason for all the negative recruiting that was going on by MSU, Pitt and ND.
They were terrified of what could happen at PSU once the ship was righted...with good reason.
Illinois tried the hardest but failed miserably
I think in the anonymous coaches comment thread, one of the coaches identified Illinois as the program most likely to get "left behind" in the BIG.Illinois tried the hardest but failed miserably
Considering we have Rutgres.....man, Illinois must really suck.
I think MSU, Pitt and Rutgres were the biggest beneficiaries of Emmert's folly. MSU and Pitt pretty much owned the top talent in the WPIAL from 2011 through 2014, with UM getting a few as well. WVU likely benefitted also from the WPIAL trickle-down.
Similarly, the sanctions created a recruiting void for the top players in NJ that Rutgres was somewhat able to initially fill. In both 2011 and 2012 the B1G powerhouse got the top in-state recruit and almost half of the in-state top 10. Plus Rutgres got 2 (!) top 10 recruits out of PA in 2012, one a PSU decommit. NO WAY that happens without the scandal. With normality returning, they've had exactly one commitment from a top 10 in-state recruit across the last 4 classes.
Dishonorable mention to ND for Fuller. Also because ND.
In hindsight, tOSU doesn't make the list since none of the flippin' four amounted to anything beyond scout team-fodder and Spence couldn't lay off the molly.
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anon_xdc8rmuek44eq
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Yup - after a year at Kiski Prep OSU was threatening to keep Enis in Ohio - too bad they spelled his name Ennis in some correspondence.
Absolutely agree Temple and Pitt benefitted but it will be completely temporary. Neither raised their profile that much, although, Temple's profile was so low they couldn't help but raise it.
Actually, the person who benefitted the most was Matt Rhule. As far as I'm concerned it couldn't have happened to a better guy.....at least he was one of our own and not disrespectful of the situation. Temple now looks like a good job for coaches looking for an interim stop to a bigger coaching gig. They may have replaced Pitt in that role--especially after Narduzzi gets fired.
Michigan State was also the other big winner, beating us out for some crucial recruits. There is some real bad blood there on our side regarding MSU. It's been rumored that MSU was the nastiest in terms of negative recruiting. D'Antonio, isn't as pristine a guy as many think neither are the members of his regime.
OSU also definitely benefitted as did Michigan. Rutgers didn't get squat which drives their fans absolutely crazy
OSU passed on Blackledge and Kijana? Man, OSU had damn lousy recruiters and talent evaluators back then.
I suggest you read the posts you're reacting to a little more slowly, and then respond.
maybe not a large quantity of recruits, but some damn good quality recruits in the early 90's while Cooper was there:
Along with KJ Carter
Enis - OSU didnt pass on him
Jeff Hartings
OJ McDuffie
Joe Jerevicius
It's a very small number.
McDuffie was 1980s.
Enis -- OSU did recruit him but very late in the process, after Enis was already a strong lean for PSU.
Jurevicius - yes PSU won there -- Cooper said JJ wouldn't "give him the time of day."
PSU also beat Cooper for a high rated DT named Mike Buzin -- who was son of a former PSU player, so legacy ties there.
But that is about it. As soon as Cooper got that program rolling, Paterno wasn't signing people Ohio State wanted. Same under Tressel. I don't recall Paterno beating Tressel for someone Tress really wanted. Maybe Derek Fox, but again that may have been a situation where there wasn't really room for Fox at tOSU.
i believe for the entire decade of 2000-2009 (when I started paying attention to recruiting via the media), the only kid from Ohio who we landed, that had an OSU offer was MZjr
As would be expected. Most programs stayed in state with most of their recruits in those days. But PSU always had a half dozen to a dozen Ohio kids....
Thank you. And it's not surprising, Ohio State was a top 5 team for most of the 2000s and 2010s; PSU was not anywhere near OSU's level.
My only original point was that PSU might be getting a couple of guys out Ohio this year that Ohio State really wants, which is very unusual.
It's just another sign of upgraded recruiting. If PSU is going to approach talent parity with Ohio State and Michigan, PSU needs to get some top players from Ohio just like Ohio State and UM get some top players from New Jersey and Pa.
I'm not completely convinced by this argument. It's not like tOSU was getting a ton of players out of PA in those days either. One or two.
And I'll throw out another name from that era.
Gerald Cadogan. First team All Ohio from Portsmouth, finalist for Wendy's HS Heisman. I expect tOSU wanted him.... He ended up a first team All Big Ten.
he did not have an OSU offer. he was a mid level 3 star prospect. very good college player, but was not recruited by OSU
I cant read the article (only the first line as im not a member), but Im fairly certain (99%) Nate did not have an OSU offer either.
FWIW
when I say "recruited" i mean an actual offer.
not attending a camp or getting letters
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