Rule change wishlist for 2025/6

[GogglesPaizano]

Ok, two weeks of downtime, so I will try not to not you with this old and tired topic, but I have only 2 that are timely and relevant.

1). Wrestling from one or both knees in neutral gets a 5 count then a stall warning. It's away too defensive, slows the action, and is plain boring. It's got to go. PS can someone at least try an outside sweep single against the post leg? Low risk, of a reattack, and it might just be the solution to this torturous technique. PSS - yes this means you Drake and Angelo!!!

2). We do NOT need a step out point in Folk, but we absolutely need to enforce fleeing the mat. My #1 example is near the boundary in neutral where one wrestler has a leg. Whether standing or on the mat every single dual you see multiple examples where the defensive wrestler gives it everything he's got to flee or pull both wrestlers out. A near takedown turns into a restart. It's criminal and drives me friggin nuts, not to mention how blatantly it's used all the time. You should never be able to use the out of bounds as a means to a restart when on the verge of giving up points.

 

[Folkstylefan]

Couldn’t agree more with #1, hate watching those wrestling on their knees. It’s stalling and should be called so. #2 we definitely do NOT want a push out rule. Don’t need to go back to the 80’s and watch such s boring product again. Which is what we would get. As far as stalling, it just needs to be called, but you cannot tell a wrestler, not to try to get away from a single leg, standing or otherwise. Yes there are definitely some egregious fleeing the mat, but when there’s no place but out of bounds to shed the single it is what it is. Call stalling for edge wrestling, before that happens.

 

[IANit]

Couldn’t agree more with #1, hate watching those wrestling on their knees. It’s stalling and should be called so. #2 we definitely do NOT want a push out rule. Don’t need to go back to the 80’s and watch such s boring product again. Which is what we would get. As far as stalling, it just needs to be called, but you cannot tell a wrestler, not to try to get away from a single leg, standing or otherwise. Yes there are definitely some egregious fleeing the mat, but when there’s no place but out of bounds to shed the single it is what it is. Call stalling for edge wrestling, before that happens.

Seems like #1 is a big Iowa thing. Angelo did it a lot tonight. Have seen Ayala do it. Definitely needs to go.

 

[west2east]

Didn't Nico wrestle on one knee a bunch ?

 

[SJP80]

Didn't Nico wrestle on one knee a bunch ?

Sometimes. Didn't like it then either.

 

[7brwnpsu]

Didn't Nico wrestle on one knee a bunch ?

No, he was just short. You must have been sitting in the upper deck at Nationals.

 

[El-Jefe]

Didn't Nico wrestle on one knee a bunch ?

Nico did not drop to a knee from space to avoid action. He occasionally took the action down to knees while in a tie, and wrestled thru the position. Also, BTW, Nico scored a lot.

Really, you don't need to be the message board police. Blatant obfuscation like this, and like the difference between Kasak and Ferrari (celebrating vs celebrating at the other bench), comes across as carrying water for Iowa. Likely because, well, it is.

 

[wrestleknownothing]

I would like to see the grasping of the ankle count become cumulative. Grab it once for a three count, let go, grab it again, and the count starts at four. No more than 5 total seconds on the ankle.

Same for the knee. If a wrestler goes to a knee without being in a tie, the count begins, and is cumulative.

 

[Nitlion1986]

Didn't Nico wrestle on one knee a bunch ?

Not that I recall. However, I am getting old and too much information available in my head to recall with any reliability.

 

[Reslo]

Nico did not drop to a knee from space to avoid action. He occasionally took the action down to knees while in a tie, and wrestled thru the position. Also, BTW, Nico scored a lot.

Really, you don't need to be the message board police. Blatant obfuscation like this, and like the difference between Kasak and Ferrari (celebrating vs celebrating at the other bench), comes across as carrying water for Iowa. Likely because, well, it is.

Don't let this distract you from the fact that Corby had to wade through about 100 PSU wrestlers to find an example from 13 years ago. Quite a gotcha moment. The message board is in shambles.

 

[SJP80]

Don't let this distract you from the fact that Corby had to wade through about 100 PSU wrestlers to find an example from 13 years ago. Quite a gotcha moment. The message board is in shambles.

And finding one PSU guy doesn't make it a bad idea. He would be more honest if the initial response was "I love the idea, or I hate the idea" instead of inferring a Iowa bias and throwing out the "beloved PSU guy wrestled that way"

 

[El-Jefe]

Seems like #1 is a big Iowa thing. Angelo did it a lot tonight. Have seen Ayala do it. Definitely needs to go.

Not really fair to pin this on Brands. Can't say offhand about Ayala, but the Ferraris did this long before arriving in Iowa City. AJ didn't learn it from Smith either.

Besides, we've had a lot of PA kids do this over the years -- Cole Matthews and Mason Beckman immediately come to mind. In last year's state finals, Curtis Nelson immediately went to knees against Landon Sidun -- though in fairness, Nelson did it while in range and did quickly attack from knees, it was just an unorthodox way of changing levels for an attack. (Actually, we'd all have a lot less issue with it if everyone did it like Nelson.)

 

[El-Jefe]

And finding one PSU guy doesn't make it a bad idea. He would be more honest if the initial response was "I love the idea, or I hate the idea" instead of inferring a Iowa bias and throwing out the "beloved PSU guy wrestled that way"

He was being completely honest.

His take was essentially: you guys need to sit this out because I found one example from 10+ years ago, that may not be entirely applicable.

Or, shorter version: shut up because reasons.

 

[LorenzoFan]

Being called for stalling while grasping the ankles or legs at times is a crock! I hate it when the top guy is trying to pull the bottom guy back in bounds and the top guy by rule is getting the count.

 

[ac98]

I agree on the 1 knee. I think the 5 count is too long and too easy to game. It would say that anytime a wrestler is disengaged from another wrestler in neutral and doesn’t stand back up immediately it’s stalling.

 

[Folkstylefan]

Yes I have seen many PA kids do this and think it should be called stalling. Corby is Iowa biased like pyles and JD. If you don’t realize that your blind.

 

[west2east]

Nico did not drop to a knee from space to avoid action. He occasionally took the action down to knees while in a tie, and wrestled thru the position. Also, BTW, Nico scored a lot.

Really, you don't need to be the message board police. Blatant obfuscation like this, and like the difference between Kasak and Ferrari (celebrating vs celebrating at the other bench), comes across as carrying water for Iowa. Likely because, well, it is.

Just making sure everyone remembers the past 🤷

 

[west2east]

Don't let this distract you from the fact that Corby had to wade through about 100 PSU wrestlers to find an example from 13 years ago. Quite a gotcha moment. The message board is in shambles.

100 lol he actually came to my mind immediately. Not a gotcha moment at all I just don't remember seeing threads about it then 🤷

 

[west2east]

Yes I have seen many PA kids do this and think it should be called stalling. Corby is Iowa biased like pyles and JD. If you don’t realize that your blind.

Just pointing out some facts on the being on one knee thing. I could care a less who hates Iowa but don't let that hate make you blind( I know what thats like for 24 hours with the lights on my eyes from that damn mat cleaner scam machine) and forget about what's happened in the past

 

[dicemen99]

Just pointing out some facts on the being on one knee thing. I could care a less who hates Iowa but don't let that hate make you blind( I know what thats like for 24 hours with the lights on my eyes from that damn mat cleaner scam machine) and forget about what's happened in the past

Thank you for your service.

 

[Nitlion1986]

Even if Nico occasionally hit a knee it is a bit different that Ferrari. First Nico was always boring in, pulling, tugging and twisting. If Nico was dropping to a knee he was using it to pull down.
Ferrari is backing up. If on his feet Ferrari is retreating towards the edge but usually he is on his knees retreating. He does fire off shots if u r dumb enough to just bore straight in.

 

[El-Jefe]

Yes I have seen many PA kids do this and think it should be called stalling. Corby is Iowa biased like pyles and JD. If you don’t realize that your blind.

Nobody is Iowa biased like Pyles.

But in Corby's case, whatever his biases are, this is about trolling us. Nothing more.

 

[KCLion]

Seems like #1 is a big Iowa thing. Angelo did it a lot tonight. Have seen Ayala do it. Definitely needs to go.

Ayala does it a lot too

 

[SetonHallPirate]

My suggestion comes from entirely out of left-field, but I think it would improve the product: A "no-saved-by-the-bell" rule.

If you've ever watched boxing, there's a rule that if a boxer is down and the period ends, the count continues, and only is stopped when it either reaches ten (ending the bout) or the boxer gets up. My suggestion is if nearfall is being held, counting, or imminent when the period ends, wrestling continues until the bottom man either clears the hold or the fall is called.

 

[nerfstate]

Cardenas is also a knee guy. Tries to bait guys into his double. RBY did that sometimes. Less so as he developed more attacks.

 

[WexfordWarrior]

Just pointing out some facts on the being on one knee thing. I could care a less who hates Iowa but don't let that hate make you blind( I know what thats like for 24 hours with the lights on my eyes from that damn mat cleaner scam machine) and forget about what's happened in the past

 

[Random4598375]

Ok, two weeks of downtime, so I will try not to not you with this old and tired topic, but I have only 2 that are timely and relevant.

1). Wrestling from one or both knees in neutral gets a 5 count then a stall warning. It's away too defensive, slows the action, and is plain boring. It's got to go. PS can someone at least try an outside sweep single against the post leg? Low risk, of a reattack, and it might just be the solution to this torturous technique. PSS - yes this means you Drake and Angelo!!!

2). We do NOT need a step out point in Folk, but we absolutely need to enforce fleeing the mat. My #1 example is near the boundary in neutral where one wrestler has a leg. Whether standing or on the mat every single dual you see multiple examples where the defensive wrestler gives it everything he's got to flee or pull both wrestlers out. A near takedown turns into a restart. It's criminal and drives me friggin nuts, not to mention how blatantly it's used all the time. You should never be able to use the out of bounds as a means to a restart when on the verge of giving up points.

No 5 count for wrestling from a knee. Just going to a knee for longer than reaction time while disengaged in neutral should be an automatic stall call.

 

[Random4598375]

Nico did not drop to a knee from space to avoid action. He occasionally took the action down to knees while in a tie, and wrestled thru the position. Also, BTW, Nico scored a lot.

Really, you don't need to be the message board police. Blatant obfuscation like this, and like the difference between Kasak and Ferrari (celebrating vs celebrating at the other bench), comes across as carrying water for Iowa. Likely because, well, it is.

Going to a knee while tied up is different than going to a knee while disengaged. Disengaged should be automatic stalling.

 

[Random4598375]

Just pointing out some facts on the being on one knee thing. I could care a less who hates Iowa but don't let that hate make you blind( I know what thats like for 24 hours with the lights on my eyes from that damn mat cleaner scam machine) and forget about what's happened in the past

Of course the rules should apply to everyone including Penn State.

 

[Ambrowns]

I still think if there is a 3 point takedown then we need a 3 point reversal. 2 points for reversal just doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. IMO, it discourages potential mat wrestling. 3 points for reversal makes it more worth the hassle.

 

[GogglesPaizano]

PS - of course there would be an exception to the rule, called the Anthony Robles exception, for obvious reasons.

I definitely dislike one knee in neutral position, but I am surprised there is not a lot of support for the fleeing the mat change. That one is so much more frequent and drives me nuts since in theory the rule is already in place, it's just the refs simply let it slide 95% of the time.

 

[Random4598375]

PS - of course there would be an exception to the rule, called the Anthony Robles exception, for inventory reasons.

I definitely dislike one knee in neutral position, but I am surprised there is not a lot of support for the fleeing the mat change. That one is so much more frequent and drives me nuts since in theory the rule is already in place, it's just the refs simply let it slide 95% of the time.

I agree on you with the fleeing, too, but the kneeling definitely aggravates me more. When a wrestler with a single is pulling a guy back in by his foot and the guy is obviously fighting to go out of bounds, that should be called much more often. The more exciting counter to that that doesn't involve fleeing is the dive and roll to grab the other guy's ankle and get into a scramble position. Let's encourage that.

 

[Cowbell Man]

100 lol he actually came to my mind immediately. Not a gotcha moment at all I just don't remember seeing threads about it then 🤷

If wrestling from the knees was a new topic on this board your point would make sense, but it’s not. It’s one of those recurring ones that comes up because it’s a BS way to wrestle as a part of your offense and called out often.

In Ferrari’s case it’s exacerbated by a wrestler who likes to ride the rim if he’s not already on his knees and frankly….the rules do allow for his retreat to the edge be called as stalling. The rules were amended allow stalling for virtually anyone who refuses to wrestle toward the center. Naturally no one calls it quite like that but it would be cool if they would simply start dinging those…like Hidlay…who retreat immediately and use the edge as another defender. The rule is so easily written to call stalling on retreaters that a wrestler can just stand in the middle and wait for the opponent to come back….which of course happens rarely.

Jeez….some refs can’t even seem to call stalling on wrestlers that are not actually touching the opponent and have both feet out of bounds.

Ferrari on his knees is stalling. It’s not advancing. It’s just nothing. Ferrari retreating AND on his knees is ridiculous. Ferrari appears to me to be too talented for this. Would be great if evaporated.

 

[IANit]

Even if Nico occasionally hit a knee it is a bit different that Ferrari. First Nico was always boring in, pulling, tugging and twisting. If Nico was dropping to a knee he was using it to pull down.
Ferrari is backing up. If on his feet Ferrari is retreating towards the edge but usually he is on his knees retreating. He does fire off shots if u r dumb enough to just bore straight in.

My issue isn't with going to the knees period like when trying to score. It's going to one knee to prevent the opponent from having a shot at a takedown when you aren't pushing the pace yourself. It may not be against the rules, but it's against the spirit of the sport in my view.

 

[Callthestall]

Didn't Nico wrestle on one knee a bunch ?

He would on occasion but typically took action to his opponent. He looked to shoot more than counter. He had a couple of matches against Illinois Delgado that were very frustrating to watch. Delgado would either split to keep his ankle away or go over the top and grab ankles.
Speaking of grabbing ankles, refs should be quicker on stalemate calls in some positions.

 

[Sleepylion]

My suggestion comes from entirely out of left-field, but I think it would improve the product: A "no-saved-by-the-bell" rule.

If you've ever watched boxing, there's a rule that if a boxer is down and the period ends, the count continues, and only is stopped when it either reaches ten (ending the bout) or the boxer gets up. My suggestion is if nearfall is being held, counting, or imminent when the period ends, wrestling continues until the bottom man either clears the hold or the fall is called.

This match would have never ended...

 

[Roar More]

Another proposed rule change: three point reversal.

And if a wrestler starts on the bottom and somehow gets to his feet with the opponent's leg in the air as the only point of contact, that is an escape, not continued control and riding time for the one footed dancer.

 

[raslen007]

Not really fair to pin this on Brands. Can't say offhand about Ayala, but the Ferraris did this long before arriving in Iowa City. AJ didn't learn it from Smith either.

Besides, we've had a lot of PA kids do this over the years -- Cole Matthews and Mason Beckman immediately come to mind. In last year's state finals, Curtis Nelson immediately went to knees against Landon Sidun -- though in fairness, Nelson did it while in range and did quickly attack from knees, it was just an unorthodox way of changing levels for an attack. (Actually, we'd all have a lot less issue with it if everyone did it like Nelson.)

I believe one of the Peppleman boys (maybe Walter) use to do this Central Dauphin.

 

[raslen007]

I wouldn't mind seeing the tech fall amount go to 18.

 

[El-Jefe]

I believe one of the Peppleman boys (maybe Walter) use to do this Central Dauphin.

More than one of them, plus their teammate Kenny Courts.

But am hoping folks find more current examples.

Here's a prominent one in the very first few seconds of the first match: