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So, Faye Dunaway (not WB) announces LLL...

N&B4PSU

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...not Warren Beatty. And she looked at the card and got it wrong. [btw, cut to Faye to the right of the stage a minute later before the mistake is out... she looks like she's sick.]

I've been told i am the only person in the world who thinks this was all staged... and I agree that there is good reason to presume the Award folks have no interest in appearing like roobs.

But re-watching it all, it sure seemed straged to me. [i just played "follow the cards"... they had to switch the card the lead was holding with a card handed to another in the background]

So, normal folks, how say ye?
 
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...not Warren Beatty. And she looked at the card and got it wrong. [btw, cut to Faye to the right of the stage a minute later before the mistake is out... she looks like she's sick.]

I've been told i am the only person in the world who thinks this was all staged... and I agree that there is good reason to presume the Award folks have no interest in appearing like roobs.

But re-watching it all, it sure seemed straged to me. [i just played "follow the cards"... they had to switch the card the lead was holding with a card handed to another in the background]

So, normal folks, how say ye?

No idea - but DiCaprio handed Emma Stone her envelope and card when she won and she says she never let go of it. If true, how does Beatty get her card? Weird. Can't imagine a show as stuffy as the Oscars would purposely stage something like this.

Update: Freeze frame clearly shows Beatty holding card for Beat Supporting Actress...

 
No idea - but DiCaprio handed Emma Stone her envelope and card when she won and she says she never let go of it. If true, how does Beatty get her card? Weird. Can't imagine a show as stuffy as the Oscars would purposely stage something like this.
I keep looking at a still of Faye Dunaway while the speeches were still going and she looks absolutely sick... like she knows it's all a hoax.

Again, just watch the merry-go-round with the red cards. At this point, the only thing that makes any sense is they printed 2 emma stone cards.

i'd need someone to tell me whether in past oscars a bunch of people get handed winning red cards.. i really don't recall as it was never an issue. but the academy folks sure seemed to know who to go to for the "correct" version.
 
I keep looking at a still of Faye Dunaway while the speeches were still going and she looks absolutely sick... like she knows it's all a hoax.

Again, just watch the merry-go-round with the red cards. At this point, the only thing that makes any sense is they printed 2 emma stone cards.

i'd need someone to tell me whether in past oscars a bunch of people get handed winning red cards.. i really don't recall as it was never an issue. but the academy folks sure seemed to know who to go to for the "correct" version.

You think this was staged? If so, who was in on it? Everyone? Why would Emma Stone make a point to say that her card never left her hand? Why dupe the entire cast and crew of La La Land? Beatty and Dinaway (who both look like idiots now)? Don't buy it. I think there were two cards but by accident. Honestly thought Beatty and Dunaway looked so lost and nearly incoherent that this was all on them. I mean - they even flashed the La La Land winning graphic. Certainly more of a statement to give Moonlight the award outright than to play this kind of Miss Universe stunt.

 
You think this was staged? If so, who was in on it? Everyone? Why would Emma Stone make a point to say that her card never left her hand? Why dupe the entire cast and crew of La La Land? Beatty and Dinaway (who both look like idiots now)? Don't buy it. I think there were two cards but by accident. Honestly thought Beatty and Dunaway looked so lost and nearly incoherent that this was all on them. I mean - they even flashed the La La Land winning graphic. Certainly more of a statement to give Moonlight the award outright than to play this kind of Miss Universe stunt.

I think you're right.... but there was such a merry-go-round in the background with the cards that couldn't be ignored. [and why did it take so long for the producers to get involved? as soon as it was announced poeple knew it was wrong... why the delay?] Faye looked quite comfortable and confident when she announced LLL yet later before the correction looked dreadful. It might be she realized she'd screwed it up.

But what the hell... we got us 2 AA winners! $$ people should have a field day and they'll be talking about this mess for a long time.

We will probably see some folks fired and a much younger couple present it next year.
 
I think you're right.... but there was such a merry-go-round in the background with the cards that couldn't be ignored. [and why did it take so long for the producers to get involved? as soon as it was announced poeple knew it was wrong... why the delay?] Faye looked quite comfortable and confident when she announced LLL yet later before the correction looked dreadful. It might be she realized she'd screwed it up.

But what the hell... we got us 2 AA winners! $$ people should have a field day and they'll be talking about this mess for a long time.

We will probably see some folks fired and a much younger couple present it next year.

The producers don't know (at least in past years they haven't), so it would have taken a while for them to become aware. Supposedly the only people that know are the auditors,
They are real careful to limit the number of people who know because there's a lot of money bet on the Oscars.
 
The producers don't know (at least in past years they haven't), so it would have taken a while for them to become aware.
can't agree. At that level there are contingency plans to address this kind of problem and it was known immediately by someone capable of putting the contingency plan into operation... and it did not happen until after all the important acceptance speeches were made.

sure, it was probably just a snafu, but there's an awful lot that makes zero sense. well, incompentency comes to mind... and heads will roll.
 
I think there were two cards but by accident.

I'd bet money this is exactly what happened. In any event, the Academy looks like a bunch of bumblers, and Trump is (quite rightfully) gonna have a frickin' field day with this. LOL...
 
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actually, UL is correct... the "producers" would not know... but the contingency people are in place to know within
If that was the case, wouldn't Beatty have announced Viola Davis' name instead of Emma Stone's name?
Thought you had a winner here, but the FF shows actress in a leading role... although I was surprised it doesn't say BEST actress... i presume that's standard, though.
 
can't agree. At that level there are contingency plans to address this kind of problem and it was known immediately by someone capable of putting the contingency plan into operation... and it did not happen until after all the important acceptance speeches were made.

sure, it was probably just a snafu, but there's an awful lot that makes zero sense. well, incompentency comes to mind... and heads will roll.

Heads will roll, starting with these guys.

Meet the only two people in the world who already know all the Oscar winners

Oops - not so fast.

Cullinan: It doesn’t come up for tender. As long as our relationship is good and strong and we do a good job, which we always do, the academy has been pleased I think with how we’ve been involved. It’s such a long term relationship that we know intricately how everything works, the timing of it, the process that we use, and they have absolute trust in us and what we do.
 
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Heads will roll, starting with these guys.

Meet the only two people in the world who already know all the Oscar winners

Oops - not so fast.

Cullinan: It doesn’t come up for tender. As long as our relationship is good and strong and we do a good job, which we always do, the academy has been pleased I think with how we’ve been involved. It’s such a long term relationship that we know intricately how everything works, the timing of it, the process that we use, and they have absolute trust in us and what we do.
Seriously, you almost have to presume that one of them handed WB the wrong card (how in the F does that even happen?) and 2, that upon hearing the wrong name that it took several minutes to get people in place to fix the problem.

Contingency plans are in place to handle this exact mistake and anyone who has been involved in CP at this level knows it does not take minutes to scramble and resolve. Everyone at a certain level is watching and on high alert for a mistake -- their worst nightmare.

It does not take that much time to fix (i had hoped to get an exact fix on the time but the TV would not play along... must be in on the conspiracy lol). so yeah, heads will roll... but a lot of people are going to ask how this could possibly have happened and it will fuel CT's galore.
 
I think you see Beatty's confusion when he opens up the envelope and sees "Emma Stone" in big letters with "La La Land" underneath. You can even see him go back to the envelope and see if there's anything else in there, and then turn to Dunaway who quickly glances at the card, sees "La La Land" and says it.
 
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it just bothers me that they seem to know who to go to to get the "winning" card, How?? There were other people standing there with red cards... but they go straight to the guy (can't remember his name) and pretty much snatch the card from him... then the cameras fade away so we no longer have a close up of what is happening on stage. then they zoom back in and cards are exchanged and voila... new winner.

the PI in me has issues (looks like 3 card monty)... the rational mind (as it were) is perplexed. gonna sleep ok either way... lol.
 
can't agree. At that level there are contingency plans to address this kind of problem and it was known immediately by someone capable of putting the contingency plan into operation... and it did not happen until after all the important acceptance speeches were made.

sure, it was probably just a snafu, but there's an awful lot that makes zero sense. well, incompentency comes to mind... and heads will roll.
It used to be the presenter(s) would say, "And the envelope, please." And a Price Waterhouse cat would give them the envelope. They did not bring the envelope out with them.
 
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...not Warren Beatty. And she looked at the card and got it wrong. [btw, cut to Faye to the right of the stage a minute later before the mistake is out... she looks like she's sick.]

I've been told i am the only person in the world who thinks this was all staged... and I agree that there is good reason to presume the Award folks have no interest in appearing like roobs.

But re-watching it all, it sure seemed straged to me. [i just played "follow the cards"... they had to switch the card the lead was holding with a card handed to another in the background]

So, normal folks, how say ye?

Could the problem be that Beatty and Dunaway have a combined age of 155 years and each have enough botulinum toxin in their systems to float a battleship?
 
Could the problem be that Beatty and Dunaway have a combined age of 155 years and each have enough botulinum toxin in their systems to float a battleship?
No. They were given the wrong envelope. It had nothing to do with their age. In fact, it was people much younger than them that screwed up. Stupid asses about your age , most likely. So stfu with the age thing.
 
No. They were given the wrong envelope. It had nothing to do with their age. In fact, it was people much younger than them that screwed up. Stupid asses about your age , most likely. So stfu with the age thing.

I apologize. I admit to a terrible habit of poking fun at people who try hard at being someone else. We are undeserving as a nation.
 
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I apologize. I admit to a terrible habit of poking fun at people who try hard at being someone else. We are undeserving as a nation.
You made fun of them for being elderly, implying incompetence (not incontinence, so don't try). The fault was with the younger professionals who couldn't manage the simple task of giving the proper, and final, envelope to the presenters. What they inject themselves with for cosmetics is not pertinent (if a 70 year old man dyes his brown hair orange/blonde and has a fake tan, does that render him incompetent or just make him look silly or both). Maybe a few injections would improve the performance of the youthful Price Waterhouse incompetents.
 
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it just bothers me that they seem to know who to go to to get the "winning" card, How?? There were other people standing there with red cards... but they go straight to the guy (can't remember his name) and pretty much snatch the card from him... then the cameras fade away so we no longer have a close up of what is happening on stage. then they zoom back in and cards are exchanged and voila... new winner.

the PI in me has issues (looks like 3 card monty)... the rational mind (as it were) is perplexed. gonna sleep ok either way... lol.
I believe the other envelopes are those that individual winners had from their awards earlier in the show. They knew who to go to because they knew who they handed that particular envelope off to... a producer who hadn't won an award earlier in the evening.
 
The only problem I had with this ... is that on the bottom of the card it actually shows what the award is for. Meaning at the bottom of the card that Beatty & Dunaway has ... which shows Emma Stone, La La Land, it says on there "Best Actress" and not "Best Picture." Not sure why that wouldn't have been noticed and either of the two say I think we got the wrong card.
 
The only problem I had with this ... is that on the bottom of the card it actually shows what the award is for. Meaning at the bottom of the card that Beatty & Dunaway has ... which shows Emma Stone, La La Land, it says on there "Best Actress" and not "Best Picture." Not sure why that wouldn't have been noticed and either of the two say I think we got the wrong card.
I get the impression Warren realized it was wrong, but for some reason, instead of saying it was wrong, he showed it to Faye (maybe to confirm what he was looking at). She glanced at it, not thinking there was an error, but that Warren was drawing out the suspense, and her eyes went right to La La Land on the card, expecting to see that, and said it before Warren could stop her.

No one goes into this situation expecting to have the wrong card, so I kind of understand. In an ideal world, Warren would have said something to the show producers from the stage, or maybe told Faye he thought they had the wrong card before showing it to her. He kind of froze, not sure what to do on live TV in the biggest industry event of the year, handing out the biggest prize.
 
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I believe the other envelopes are those that individual winners had from their awards earlier in the show. They knew who to go to because they knew who they handed that particular envelope off to... a producer who hadn't won an award earlier in the evening.
Might be mistaken, but I'm pretty sure that was Justin Hurwitz (not Jordan Horowitz whose card they already had) who DID win an award earlier... so in theory, he is holding his winning card. What is gained by going after it?

btw, as soon as that happens, the cameras peel back and we (tv audience) have no view of events until they restore order.. then the cameras move back in.

as to why it would be staged: you got 2 winners. your big traditional hollywood number AND your big diversity pick (which is going to make more money... as will LLL). Everybody made nice nice. people will talk about this for a while instead of just talking about what people wore. I have no idea if organized gambling could have benefitted.

but one thing remains unresolved: pwc is responsbile for 24 envelopes. No, TWO people are actually responsible. No flunkies. 2 people whose sole job is to get 24 cards correct. and the most important one of all... they fail. And the moment of failure there is a contingency plan designed to minimize that failure... and it took nearly 7 minutes to execute.

could it 'just be a mistake'? of course. but there are a lot of unanswered questions... for me, why did they go straight to Hurwitz and take his card?
 
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Might be mistaken, but I'm pretty sure that was Justin Hurwitz (not Jordan Horowitz whose card they already had) who DID win an award earlier... so in theory, he is holding his winning card. What is gained by going after it?

btw, as soon as that happens, the cameras peel back and we (tv audience) have no view of events until they restore order.. then the cameras move back in.

as to why it would be staged: you got 2 winners. your big traditional hollywood number AND your big diversity pick (which is going to make more money... as will LLL). Everybody made nice nice. people will talk about this for a while instead of just talking about what people wore. I have no idea if organized gambling could have benefitted.

but one thing remains unresolved: pwc is responsbile for 24 envelopes. No, TWO people are actually responsible. No flunkies. 2 people whose sole job is to get 24 cards correct. and the most important one of all... they fail. And the moment of failure there is a contingency plan designed to minimize that failure... and it took nearly 7 minutes to execute.

could it 'just be a mistake'? of course. but there are a lot of unanswered questions... for me, why did they go straight to Hurwitz and take his card?
Actually, in reading further reports, it appears that Horowitz had the card. He is quoted as saying he hadn't looked at it, but they opened it in front of him and it says Emma Stone, La La Land. Then they opened up the correct envelope that said Moonlight, at which point he went up to the mic to announce the mistake.

Someone online has actually deconstructed from video stills and photos, the envelopes. On stage you can see one of the Oscar producers (the guy with the headset). One of the PWC reps also came out on stage with the producer, with the correct envelope. The other PWC rep came out separately from the other side of the stage, also with her envelope with the correct winner. So you had two envelopes with the correct winner brought out by the PWC reps, the wrong envelope that Warren had, and any envelopes brought on stage by winners from earlier awards.

There's been no explanation as to why it took as long as it did to correct the mistake. I imagine there was a lot of confusion and panic backstage. The PWC reps might have had to get together and confer before telling the Producers, and they were on opposite ends of the stage.

I can see the argument that they did it for publicity. However, what makes no sense is PWC is taking a big hit. They've had this gig for like 80 years and it's tons of publicity for them every year. Even if the Academy offered them a big payment to "screw it up," this event is a drop In the bucket to their overall revenues. They couldn't pay them enough for the reputation hit they're getting right now. And their reputation and the publicity around it is probably what makes their involvement worth it. So I don't think it was any conspiracy.
 
Actually, in reading further reports, it appears that Horowitz had the card. He is quoted as saying he hadn't looked at it, but they opened it in front of him and it says Emma Stone, La La Land. Then they opened up the correct envelope that said Moonlight, at which point he went up to the mic to announce the mistake.

Someone online has actually deconstructed from video stills and photos, the envelopes. On stage you can see one of the Oscar producers (the guy with the headset). One of the PWC reps also came out on stage with the producer, with the correct envelope. The other PWC rep came out separately from the other side of the stage, also with her envelope with the correct winner. So you had two envelopes with the correct winner brought out by the PWC reps, the wrong envelope that Warren had, and any envelopes brought on stage by winners from earlier awards.

There's been no explanation as to why it took as long as it did to correct the mistake. I imagine there was a lot of confusion and panic backstage. The PWC reps might have had to get together and confer before telling the Producers, and they were on opposite ends of the stage.

I can see the argument that they did it for publicity. However, what makes no sense is PWC is taking a big hit. They've had this gig for like 80 years and it's tons of publicity for them every year. Even if the Academy offered them a big payment to "screw it up," this event is a drop In the bucket to their overall revenues. They couldn't pay them enough for the reputation hit they're getting right now. And their reputation and the publicity around it is probably what makes their involvement worth it. So I don't think it was any conspiracy.

I think you did a nice job here and i thank you.

I still don't undersand why with all the red cards being held they had to grab Hurwitz' as well. What could possibly be in his card that could matter?

but i agree completely that PwC would not risk their reputation (although no matter how you cut it, if you can't get 24 cards right -- and the most important card of the night....)

but thanks!
 
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