Sounds like Notre Dame may be pursuing Ohio State's Hartline for their OC job

[Online Persona]

Ohio St rivals already out there denying Hartline would have interest but you know how that goes. Interesting development as Hartline would probably have a few WRs follow him if he did leave and they would almost certainly start immediately at Notre Dame.

 

[GregInPitt]

Why would anyone leave oh-high-ya to go to the Domers..... Hartline should turn it down and then interview for the head coaching job when it opens up after this season.

 

[bison13]

Why would anyone leave oh-high-ya to go to the Domers..... Hartline should turn it down and then interview for the head coaching job when it opens up after this season.

I don’t think it’ll be open this year but if he becomes the offensive coordinator he can slide right into it if/when it opens up next year.

 

[Online Persona]

I don’t think it’ll be open this year but if he becomes the offensive coordinator he can slide right into it if/when it opens up next year.

Maybe but it is possible that if he's successful as Notre Dame's OC that he saves his buddy's HC job there.

 

[HazletonLion]

Hartline is above that position at ND. He could be a HC at Nebraska , or GT.
He is probably on par with Freeman as a HC at ND, depends if you're a fan of offensive or defensive building blocks to a program.

 

[LandoComando]

Maybe but it is possible that if he's successful as Notre Dame's OC that he saves his buddy's HC job there.

I don't see any logic for Hartline to go to ND. It's a lateral move at best. ND would need to throw a ton of cash at him and Ohio State would need to refuse to match it. Seems unlikely. Hartline's next move will be a HC somewhere. Just like Manny Diaz isn't leaving Penn State unless it's a HC position unless someone overpays.

 

[CbusLion10]

I don't see any logic for Hartline to go to ND. It's a lateral move at best. ND would need to throw a ton of cash at him and Ohio State would need to refuse to match it. Seems unlikely. Hartline's next move will be a HC somewhere. Just like Manny Diaz isn't leaving Penn State unless it's a HC position unless someone overpays.

OSU WR coach to ND OC is not a lateral move at best.

 

[CJFisJoePaII]

OSU WR coach to ND OC is not a lateral move at best.

Don't talk facts and reality with Mr. Always Wrong - he has no need for those things when discussing topics. Ignoring him is the best policy.

 

[Online Persona]

Often when there is smoke like this, there are at least discussions behind the scenes. Now I get that they don't want it to be a distraction during the season but it must be pretty serious if Ohio St rivals has had to make a statement on the topic.

 

[LandoComando]

OSU WR coach to ND OC is not a lateral move at best.

He's the passing game coordinator

 

[rrdd2021]

He's the passing game coordinator

Just read that he was given a huge raise with this promotion to $950,000 yearly. He's eventually going to leave OSU for a promotion somewhere but just don't see ND as that place.

And keep in mind, OSU is his alma mater and he loves the place. Plus, he made a ton of money in the NFL and read that he invested wisely so money is not as important to him as the job and title - which is not ND. He's not a former OSU player - like James Lauranitus - who's close to Marcus Freeman.

 

[LandoComando]

Just read that he was given a huge raise with this promotion to $950,000 yearly. He's eventually going to leave OSU for a promotion somewhere but just see ND as that place.

And keep in mind, OSU is his alma mater and he loves the place. Plus, he made a ton of money in the NFL and read that he invested wisely so money is not as important to him as the job and title - which is not ND. He's not a former OSU player - like James Lauranitus - who's close to Marcus Freeman.

Correct--Ohio State comes up with all kind of weird job titles to give guys promotions and try to keep them as long as possible. He will eventually leave but if he goes to ND under Freeman he's an idiot.

 

[Online Persona]

So the same posters that always bash PSU and always talk up Ohio St also do not want Hartline to take a promotion to OC at Notre Dame that may lead to a HC job if he's successful? Gotcha.

 

[lowhandicapper]

It will be interesting to see where ND goes from here. It is apparent they are taking the approach of hiring likable recruiter types that have limited real coaching experience. I guess they are thinking bring in the Jimmy's & Joe's and the coaches will learn the X's & O's.
I have a feeling Wisconsin will go this route with Leonard as well. Its a philosophy to keep an eye on.

 

[LandoComando]

So the same posters that always bash PSU and always talk up Ohio St also do not want Hartline to take a promotion to OC at Notre Dame that may lead to a HC job if he's successful? Gotcha.

When do I "bash" Penn State? I criticize the fans
Again, it's not a promotion--he's their passing game coordinator. Going from Ohio State to Notre Dame is not a promotion. Just like if Manny Diaz left to be the DC at Notre Dame I'd say the same.

 

[lazydave841]

Almost everybody at OSU has something attached to their actual job title. Most schools, this is simply about money. Down the line, it's an extra title on a resume. Right now, it's paying enough money to keep guys like Hartline at OSU vs leaving for OC jobs and eventually HC jobs.

In the scheme of things, Hartline has a great thing going, but is a relatively young coach. He's known for being an excellent recruiter, but he's been at 1 school his entire coaching career. One that's been top 5 his entire stay. He's a perfect fit for OSU in their world: young guy with NFL pedigree that can be hands on in his teaching, recruiting to a school that is drawing very well regardless of who is there.

Can he do that elsewhere yet? Some people are making offers.

Ryan Day Plans to Continue Running Ohio State’s Offense Even with Promotions of Tony Alford and Brian Hartline

Even though Ohio State now has an offensive coordinator, passing game coordinator and run game coordinator, Ryan Day will continue to call the Buckeyes’ offensive plays.

www.elevenwarriors.com

 

[lazydave841]

Again, it's not a promotion--he's their passing game coordinator. Going from Ohio State to Notre Dame is not a promotion.

You think being passing game coordinator is the same as offensive coordinator?

 

[LandoComando]

You think being passing game coordinator is the same as offensive coordinator?

Review the titles for Ohio State's coaches. Leaving Ohio State making nearly 1M a year to be an OC at ND is not an upgrade for him at all. There's literally no difference for his resume or chances of becoming a HC.

 

[PSUWrestlingFanSince2011]

Review the titles for Ohio State's coaches. Leaving Ohio State making nearly 1M a year to be an OC at ND is not an upgrade for him at all. There's literally no difference for his resume or chances of becoming a HC.

I disagree, I think his chances go down to become a HC if he leaves for ND.

 

[LandoComando]

I disagree, I think his chances go down to become a HC if he leaves for ND.

He doesn't have to leave Ohio State to be a HC--at all

 

[lazydave841]

He doesn't have to leave Ohio State to be a HC--at all

You think some AD is going to hire him as HC merely by staying at OSU without ever "leaving the royal hunting grounds" and showing his abilities outside of the machine and having ever been over an offense?

 

[CJFisJoePaII]

You think some AD is going to hire him as HC merely by staying at OSU without ever "leaving the royal hunting grounds" and showing his abilities outside of the machine and having ever been over an offense?

Again, my suggestion is that you ignore moron boy, he not only thinks, but says a plethora of idiotic, stupid stuff.

 

[LandoComando]

You think some AD is going to hire him as HC merely by staying at OSU without ever "leaving the royal hunting grounds" and showing his abilities outside of the machine and having ever been over an offense?

Yes, are you pretending we haven't seen assistants get HC jobs?
And, again, passing game coordinator will be good enough for him because he's highly thought of. Everyone is different

 

[LandoComando]

Again, my suggestion is that you ignore moron boy, he not only thinks, but says a plethora of idiotic, stupid stuff.

You're obsession with me is adorable. The best is when someone claims to ignore someone but can't stop talking about them.

 

[lazydave841]

Yes, are you pretending we haven't seen assistants get HC jobs?
And, again, passing game coordinator will be good enough for him because he's highly thought of. Everyone is different

PGC isn't OC. I can think of Dabo. And his HC gig was an internal rise. Unless Day bolts for the NFL, I don't see that job coming open soon.

If everything you say is true, shouldn't ND overpay to get him to be OC? Then he's right there for elevating to HC when you cut loose Freeman.

 

[LandoComando]

PGC isn't OC. I can think of Dabo. And his HC gig was an internal rise. Unless Day bolts for the NFL, I don't see that job coming open soon.

If everything you say is true, shouldn't ND overpay to get him to be OC? Then he's right there for elevating to HC when you cut loose Freeman.

I don't know why you keep saying PGC isn't an OC. That doesn't alter anything here. Nor have I said he's an OC.

I think they should cut Freeman before they do anything else. Hiring him was an epic mistake. Hartline leaving a great, stable situation for Notre Dame could be a career killer (well, "delayer") because there's no guarantee things go well. Is it worth the risk for him? Only he can answer that. I wouldn't bite. I just don't see the appeal right now.

I also haven't seen that Tommy Rees was fired so I'm not entirely sure why we're even assuming Freeman has the balls to pull off that move.

 

[lazydave841]

don't know why you keep saying PGC isn't an OC. That doesn't alter anything here. Nor have I said he's an OC.

It alters everything. PGC will open doors to a OC job. I don't believe it will open the door to HC unless Day leaves.

It's a lateral move at best

OSU WR coach to ND OC is not a lateral move at best.

He's the passing game coordinator

You equate them the same when they clearly are not. That comes across as you saying being a PGC is just as important as OC. Your words. I just replied.

 

[LandoComando]

It alters everything. PGC will open doors to a OC job. I don't believe it will open the door to HC unless Day leaves.

You equate them the same when they clearly are not. That comes across as you saying being a PGC is just as important as OC. Your words. I just replied.

It is a lateral move--Ohio State PGC to Notre Dame OC. Ohio State is a MUCH better program right now especially given Freeman/Day.

I equate Ohio State PGC to ND OC. Just like Venables DC Clemson or Smart DC Georgia>>>>> many HC jobs in FBS and that's why they stayed until they got the job they wanted.

 

[rrdd2021]

So the same posters that always bash PSU and always talk up Ohio St also do not want Hartline to take a promotion to OC at Notre Dame that may lead to a HC job if he's successful? Gotcha.

Your obsession with anything OSU - Fleming is close to being a sickness.......to the point where nobody can discuss them if it doesn't match up with your point of view. It comes off as childish jealousy

 

[Online Persona]

It alters everything. PGC will open doors to a OC job. I don't believe it will open the door to HC unless Day leaves.







You equate them the same when they clearly are not. That comes across as you saying being a PGC is just as important as OC. Your words. I just replied.

He knows they aren't the same but doesn't want Ohio St to lose Hartline

 

[Online Persona]

Your obsession with anything OSU - Fleming is close to being a sickness.......to the point where nobody can discuss them if it doesn't match up with your point of view. It comes off as childish jealousy

What does pretending to be a fan of a different school and posting there only to attack that school and promote Ohio St come off as?

 

[lowhandicapper]

This thread has gotten a little off the rails.
If Hartline were to leave as a position coach for a coordinator his path would most likely look more like Mike Yurcich, who basically did the same thing....Went from position coach to big time school coordinator. The problem Yurcich had was that his head coach, Tom Herman, could not sustain enough program success to continue his upward mobility or overall employment for that matter. So in such cases it must be understood that the coordinators success is very tied to the success of the head coach. Hartline takes a real risk going to Notre Dame under an inexperienced head coach however the upside is that if ND has one good year or one prolific offense he would absolutely be one of the top names for a prime head coaching job, whereas this would not be the case if stays as a potion coach at OSU...The path becomes more conservative and on a longer timeline in his current role. Its a risk/reward situation. A former letterman that played in the pro's who's considered a great recruiting as a position coach on a top 5 team is a pretty stable comfy position, the ND OC job is not. It's high pressure, better perform.

For God's sakes people leave kids like Julian Fleming alone. They didn't want to come here, there are probably colleges you considered and didn't go to as well. The Fleming hate is pathetic and is indictive of the person spewing it as opposed to the kid himself. I mean Penn State did so good by him that they only changed his position coach two times and his offensive coordinator during his recruitment. Penn State must have been flexing its stability to him at the time. It really paid off.

 

[Online Persona]

This thread has gotten a little off the rails.
If Hartline were to leave as a position coach for a coordinator his path would most likely look more like Mike Yurcich, who basically did the same thing....Went from position coach to big time school coordinator. The problem Yurcich had was that his head coach, Tom Herman, could not sustain enough program success to continue his upward mobility or overall employment for that matter. So in such cases it must be understood that the coordinators success is very tied to the success of the head coach. Hartline takes a real risk going to Notre Dame under an inexperienced head coach however the upside is that if ND has one good year or one prolific offense he would absolutely be one of the top names for a prime head coaching job, whereas this would not be the case if stays as a potion coach at OSU...The path becomes more conservative and on a longer timeline in his current role. Its a risk/reward situation. A former letterman that played in the pro's who's considered a great recruiting as a position coach on a top 5 team is a pretty stable comfy position, the ND OC job is not. It's high pressure, better perform.

For God's sakes people leave kids like Julian Fleming alone. They didn't want to come here, there are probably colleges you considered and didn't go to as well. The Fleming hate is pathetic and is indictive of the person spewing it as opposed to the kid himself. I mean Penn State did so good by him that they only changed his position coach two times and his offensive coordinator during his recruitment. Penn State must have been flexing its stability to him at the time. It really paid off.

First several paragraphs correct. If Hartline doesn't believe he's ready to run an offense then he shouldn't take the Notre Dame job. It's hard to imagine a better OC job with a higher probability of success coming available. They are having one aberration year in an otherwise long history of prolific offenses and the biggest piece that they are missing is good receivers. Enter Hartline and some top 10 WR prospects who mostly sit the bench at Ohio St plus some top recruits and you have an instant formula for success which likely leads to HC opportunities.

As far as Fleming goes, if you notice it keeps getting brought up again and again by those who only attack PSU and defend Ohio St to the extent they are willing to make such outlandish statements as a made up passing coordinator title being equivalent to OC. You are misinterpreting this topic. I feel sorry for Fleming, he's too good to have never gotten a real opportunity in 3 years. He was the #7 overall recruit at any position and has mostly rode the pine. Any other school such as Notre Dame and this kid would be projected as a 1st or 2nd rounder already. That's not hate. It's feeling sorry for him. He just doesn't have the opportunity that he deserves. He's Jameson Williams all over again will likely have to go the transfer path to get his shot to be WR1 and a high draft pick.

 

[marshall23]

First several paragraphs correct. If Hartline doesn't believe he's ready to run an offense then he shouldn't take the Notre Dame job. It's hard to imagine a better OC job with a higher probability of success coming available. They are having one aberration year in an otherwise long history of prolific offenses and the biggest piece that they are missing is good receivers. Enter Hartline and some top 10 WR prospects who mostly sit the bench at Ohio St plus some top recruits and you have an instant formula for success which likely leads to HC opportunities.

As far as Fleming goes, if you notice it keeps getting brought up again and again by those who only attack PSU and defend Ohio St to the extent they are willing to make such outlandish statements as a made up passing coordinator title being equivalent to OC. You are misinterpreting this topic. I feel sorry for Fleming, he's too good to have never gotten a real opportunity in 3 years. He was the #7 overall recruit at any position and has mostly rode the pine. Any other school such as Notre Dame and this kid would be projected as a 1st or 2nd rounder already. That's not hate. It's feeling sorry for him. He just doesn't have the opportunity that he deserves. He's Jameson Williams all over again will likely have to go the transfer path to get his shot to be WR1 and a high draft pick.

Your argument citing someone's recruiting ranking as evidence that success is inevitable is juvenile. The list of top ranked failures has been cited and you continue with your fanboy nonsense.
These are athletes .....not computer components.
No one brings up Julian Fleming except in response to you. We get it, you feel sorry for him.
Get over it.....Julian is doing just fine. Now please go away or get another soapbox.
Start a sobbing obsession for Justin Shorter.

 

[lowhandicapper]

As far as Fleming goes, if you notice it keeps getting brought up again and again by those who only attack PSU and defend Ohio St to the extent they are willing to make such outlandish statements as a made up passing coordinator title being equivalent to OC. You are misinterpreting this topic. I feel sorry for Fleming, he's too good to have never gotten a real opportunity in 3 years. He was the #7 overall recruit at any position and has mostly rode the pine. Any other school such as Notre Dame and this kid would be projected as a 1st or 2nd rounder already. That's not hate. It's feeling sorry for him. He just doesn't have the opportunity that he deserves. He's Jameson Williams all over again will likely have to go the transfer path to get his shot to be WR1 and a high draft pick.

I'm sorry this part is fantasyland. If a player cannot beat out his competition in college, he will not, I repeat will not be in line to be a top draft pick, no matter what school he attends. Sometimes people get so caught up in the rankings and measurables that they forget that its the actual performance that matters. See Justin Shorter or Irv Charles. Secondly, Fleming has not been able to stay health enough to secure his desired role. Durability is a huge part of being a good and reliable football player. Huge.
What happens with a lot of these top WR types is they go to 7 on 7 camps and dominate against defense that doesn't exist, isn't even allowed to hit you and has no playing continuity together unlike say a real team that the back seven work and practice together every day and are coordinated by a real defensive coordinator, its a huge difference. Not to mention they play against extremely inferior cornerback talent during their high school seasons. So it is truly hard to evaluate how good they be because contrary to popular opinion playing wide receiver is a lot more than a 40 and a vertical.
You shouldn't feel sorry for Fleming, he made a choice to compete against the best and see if he is good enough, it's literally how Alabama recruits....Come play for us and you will compete against the best every single day. I can assure you if Fleming is the #3 at OSU he would not be a Heisman frontrunner had he gone to Oklahoma State, it just doesn't work that way. I'm sure you feel bad for Robert Foster too who would have been a day one starter at Pitt but chose Alabama, where he was sparingly used over his career.

 

[cvilleelkscoach]

You think being passing game coordinator is the same as offensive coordinator?

Let's not forget, Mike Yurcich was the passing game coordinator at OSU and left there to take the OC job at Texas.

 

[Online Persona]

I'm sorry this part is fantasyland. If a player cannot beat out his competition in college, he will not, I repeat will not be in line to be a top draft pick, no matter what school he attends. Sometimes people get so caught up in the rankings and measurables that they forget that its the actual performance that matters. See Justin Shorter or Irv Charles. Secondly, Fleming has not been able to stay health enough to secure his desired role. Durability is a huge part of being a good and reliable football player. Huge.
What happens with a lot of these top WR types is they go to 7 on 7 camps and dominate against defense that doesn't exist, isn't even allowed to hit you and has no playing continuity together unlike say a real team that the back seven work and practice together every day and are coordinated by a real defensive coordinator, its a huge difference. Not to mention they play against extremely inferior cornerback talent during their high school seasons. So it is truly hard to evaluate how good they be because contrary to popular opinion playing wide receiver is a lot more than a 40 and a vertical.
You shouldn't feel sorry for Fleming, he made a choice to compete against the best and see if he is good enough, it's literally how Alabama recruits....Come play for us and you will compete against the best every single day. I can assure you if Fleming is the #3 at OSU he would not be a Heisman frontrunner had he gone to Oklahoma State, it just doesn't work that way. I'm sure you feel bad for Robert Foster too who would have been a day one starter at Pitt but chose Alabama, where he was sparingly used over his career.

1) Look back at the Fleming thread and you will see a clear pattern of Ohio St supporters (some openly, some pretending to be psu fans) each of the last 2 weeks bringing the topic back up after everyone had let it go to beat their chests about Fleming catching a few balls as their 3rd or 4th wr option. They are bringing the topic back up and I responded to them.

2) How can you say "If a player cannot beat out his competition in college, he will not, I repeat will not be in line to be a top draft pick, no matter what school he attends."?

Jameson Williams could not beat out the starting WRs at Ohio St a couple of years ago, transferred to Alabama, won a national title, was selected as 1st string all American OVER the very same WRs at Ohio St that he couldn't beat out, and was selected as the 12th overall draft pick.

Joe Burrow rode the pine at Ohio St, transferred to LSU, won a national title, was the Heisman winner, and the #1 overall pick in the NFL draft.

Those are just 2 very recent examples of talent buried in the depth chart at Ohio St that not only did what you claimed cannot be done but actually did it at a much higher level of success than you said could not be done.

 

[lowhandicapper]

1) Look back at the Fleming thread and you will see a clear pattern of Ohio St supporters (some openly, some pretending to be psu fans) each of the last 2 weeks bringing the topic back up after everyone had let it go to beat their chests about Fleming catching a few balls as their 3rd or 4th wr option. They are bringing the topic back up and I responded to them.

2) How can you say "If a player cannot beat out his competition in college, he will not, I repeat will not be in line to be a top draft pick, no matter what school he attends."?

Jameson Williams could not beat out the starting WRs at Ohio St a couple of years ago, transferred to Alabama, won a national title, was selected as 1st string all American OVER the very same WRs at Ohio St that he couldn't beat out, and was selected as the 12th overall draft pick.

Joe Burrow rode the pine at Ohio St, transferred to LSU, won a national title, was the Heisman winner, and the #1 overall pick in the NFL draft.

Those are just 2 very recent examples of talent buried in the depth chart at Ohio St that not only did what you claimed cannot be done but actually did it at a much higher level of success than you said could not be done.

First off, your using exceptions as a standard. Which doesn't really work.
Second, those were lateral moves. Jameson sat behind Waddle & Smith just as he would have Olave & Wilson. Maybe he liked the scenery better in Tuscaloosa.
Third, for every Joe Burrow there are 25 Micah Bowens, Khari Fortt, Justin Shorter, Silas Redd types and many, many who you don't even know about. Who achieved no higher level of success than they had at a previous institution. In fact you could say even the success they did in fact have came due to maturity, which happens fast at the age of 20 and would have happened had they stayed.

I agree that it can happen but it's low percentage, like real low. The best example is actually right under your nose....Will Levis. But for every Will Levis there are dozens who just stay where they are developmentally no matter were they go. Let's talk about JT Daniels. 3rd school, same player but at least he found a school he can beat out the guy ahead of him. #1 QB out of high school can't beat out a preferred walk-on.
Honestly, I think it's great these kids can move around till they find the opportunity they like but by in large part the player doesn't change only the roster around them does.

 

[rrdd2021]

Your argument citing someone's recruiting ranking as evidence that success is inevitable is juvenile. The list of top ranked failures has been cited and you continue with your fanboy nonsense.
These are athletes .....not computer components.
No one brings up Julian Fleming except in response to you. We get it, you feel sorry for him.
Get over it.....Julian is doing just fine. Now please go away or get another soapbox.
Start a sobbing obsession for Justin Shorter.

Spot on and this Online Personna person absolutely refuses to acknowledge Fleming's injuries and surgery in his 2 years at OSU which he seems to feel wouldn't have happen at any other school. He's stuck in his own loop and refuses to look at other options especially any conversation about OSU which he clearly hates - that's his right and opinion but others have opinions also

As for my Hartline post, I posted information I read online - no opinions on my part. Yet Online starts accusing me of being a fan of another school ???? attacking PSU which I've never done. My school is Northwestern but I also have a brother-in-law who's an OSU grad - and huge fan - who I jaw with - good nature stuff - all the time.

 

[Online Persona]

First off, your using exceptions as a standard. Which doesn't really work.
Second, those were lateral moves. Jameson sat behind Waddle & Smith just as he would have Olave & Wilson. Maybe he liked the scenery better in Tuscaloosa.
Third, for every Joe Burrow there are 25 Micah Bowens, Khari Fortt, Justin Shorter, Silas Redd types and many, many who you don't even know about. Who achieved no higher level of success than they had at a previous institution. In fact you could say even the success they did in fact have came due to maturity, which happens fast at the age of 20 and would have happened had they stayed.

I agree that it can happen but it's low percentage, like real low. The best example is actually right under your nose....Will Levis. But for every Will Levis there are dozens who just stay where they are developmentally no matter were they go. Let's talk about JT Daniels. 3rd school, same player but at least he found a school he can beat out the guy ahead of him. #1 QB out of high school can't beat out a preferred walk-on.
Honestly, I think it's great these kids can move around till they find the opportunity they like but by in large part the player doesn't change only the roster around them does.

Agreed it isn't a high percentage overall and at most schools those transferring for an opportunity usually don't pan out.

But you have to admit that there is a very recent track record of exceptional success for backup/role players transferring from Ohio ST's offense to major programs where they actually get a shot and make the absolute most of it including natties, Heisman and 1st team AA, and early 1st round money.

If Hartline were to take the OC job and take just the second string WRs and QB at Ohio St with him to Notre Dame, they could be playoff bound and some of those guys would be high draft picks. Maybe that is what Fleming needs to showcase his talent?