The Narrative, is, indeed, finally changing...

[21Guns]

Long talk with a few folks from Tempe Az, on Sunday, they were at the sports bar watching the games early9 am pacific, including PSU game, and talked with a bunch of people) regarding Joe...everyone now agreed that it's more commonly accepted now, that Joe did not know anything, did his part as far as what he even knew to do, and the nation engaged in a witch hunt afterward.

These are people who follow Pac 12 football, exclusively, from all the major markets, Seattle, LA, San Francisco, and Phoenix.

 

[fairgambit]

Long talk with a few folks from Tempe Az, on Sunday, they were at the sports bar watching the games early9 am pacific, including PSU game, and talked with a bunch of people) regarding Joe...everyone now agreed that it's more commonly accepted now, that Joe did not know anything, did his part as far as what he even knew to do, and the nation engaged in a witch hunt afterward.

These are people who follow Pac 12 football, exclusively, from all the major markets, Seattle, LA, San Francisco, and Phoenix.

First hand reports like this are encouraging, but I don't know if they represent a change in the narrative, or just isolated incidents. Certainly we also hear stories of people being heckled for wearing Penn State gear. Still, every positive report represents progress, so I'll say I'm optimistic.

 

[JR4PSU]

Good to hear.

Time will allow people's heads to clear and think about this without emotion. When they do that Joe will come out on the better side of the discussion.

 

[PSU-Knocker]

Good to hear.

Time will allow people's heads to clear and think about this without emotion. When they do that Joe will come out on the better side of the discussion.

Roger that!

 

[Judge Smails]

Long talk with a few folks from Tempe Az, on Sunday, they were at the sports bar watching the games early9 am pacific, including PSU game, and talked with a bunch of people) regarding Joe...everyone now agreed that it's more commonly accepted now, that Joe did not know anything, did his part as far as what he even knew to do, and the nation engaged in a witch hunt afterward.

These are people who follow Pac 12 football, exclusively, from all the major markets, Seattle, LA, San Francisco, and Phoenix.

But how much can they bench?

 

[PhillyPhan21]

To your point 21guns, I have often thought about what effect this message board might be having on non-PSU fans who stop by and lurk. Is this board having an effect?

IMO, we need to start an aggressive guerilla marketing campaign of what we all collectively know by reaching out to friends family, acquaintances, and even media. Invite them to the board, point out Ray's blog, etc.

PSU has been shafted by the sensationalistic national sports media and corrupt PA media BUT we can all do our own little part to spread the word and eventually there will be a tipping point. It's possible that when the court cases break we can have a public that is receptive to the real story.

No. In fact, its probably doing just the opposite, with all the Sandusky is innocent Ziggy cheerleading posts. As a PSU fan every time someone posts to update on Ziggy's latest escapade's I cringe and smack my forehead.

 

[PhillyPhan21]

IMO, by and large Ziggy gets put in his place when he comes out with the Jerry crap.

He's got a LOT of support on this board.

 

[bamasota]

To your point 21guns, I have often thought about what effect this message board might be having on non-PSU fans who stop by and lurk. Is this board having an effect?

IMO, we need to start an aggressive guerilla marketing campaign of what we all collectively know by reaching out to friends family, acquaintances, and even media. Invite them to the board, point out Ray's blog, etc.

PSU has been shafted by the sensationalistic national sports media and corrupt PA media BUT we can all do our own little part to spread the word and eventually there will be a tipping point. It's possible that when the court cases break we can have a public that is receptive to the real story.

One thing you might try is going over the the soundoff board and posting some of Ray's material. I'm sure you will receive a great deal of feedback coming from a nationwide audience.

 

[LionwiththeDevil]

Long talk with a few folks from Tempe Az, on Sunday, they were at the sports bar watching the games early9 am pacific, including PSU game, and talked with a bunch of people) regarding Joe...everyone now agreed that it's more commonly accepted now, that Joe did not know anything, did his part as far as what he even knew to do, and the nation engaged in a witch hunt afterward.

These are people who follow Pac 12 football, exclusively, from all the major markets, Seattle, LA, San Francisco, and Phoenix.

It's sports, and it really comes down to whether you like PSU and/or Joe, or not. If you did, the narrative didn't fit and you did your own research. If you were jealous of the way PSU ran things and the success Joe had, then the newspaper headlines justified your negatives feeling about PSU/Joe.

 

[wslee1]

Long talk with a few folks from Tempe Az, on Sunday, they were at the sports bar watching the games early9 am pacific, including PSU game, and talked with a bunch of people) regarding Joe...everyone now agreed that it's more commonly accepted now, that Joe did not know anything, did his part as far as what he even knew to do, and the nation engaged in a witch hunt afterward.

These are people who follow Pac 12 football, exclusively, from all the major markets, Seattle, LA, San Francisco, and Phoenix.

I do believe you are right. That's why some of the TV commentators are beginning to talk about him so freely as well. I've learned thorough some of my business dealings, 20% of the people will always love you no matter what and be in your camp, 20% of the people will not like you no matter what you do. That leaves the 60% in the middle that can sway either way, with some that just don't care one way or the other. Hopefully that 60% is starting to come back around to know that Joe was not involved but was innocently crucified.

 

[joeparules]

It's sports, and it really comes down to whether you like PSU and/or Joe, or not. If you did, the narrative didn't fit and you did your own research. If you were jealous of the way PSU ran things and the success Joe had, then the newspaper headlines justified your negatives feeling about PSU/Joe.

Agree 100%. I know people who have never liked PSU/JVP because of the success with honor and no matter how many facts/truth you throw at them they (want to) believe the program and Joe were always crooked. As for the "60% in the middle" I believe (hope) I have been able to educate a few of them with the facts and they have changed their opinion on the issue. Just a few more million to educate!

 

[nits74]

He's got a LOT of support on this board.

Not really. There are only a few that take everything he says as gospel, and others that view his comments with some discretion. And then there are others that discount all that he says. Point is that category one is a small minority.

 

[PhillyPhan21]

Not really. There are only a few that take everything he says as gospel, and others that view his comments with some discretion. And then there are others that discount all that he says. Point is that category one is a small minority.

True, but they are a very vocal minority. VERY VOCAL.

 

[cop113]

First hand reports like this are encouraging, but I don't know if they represent a change in the narrative, or just isolated incidents. Certainly we also hear stories of people being heckled for wearing Penn State gear. Still, every positive report represents progress, so I'll say I'm optimistic.

I sure haven't seen or heard of people getting heckled for wearing Penn State gear. In fact I see more people than ever who are wearing Penn State gear and are proud Penn State fans!

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

To your point 21guns, I have often thought about what effect this message board might be having on non-PSU fans who stop by and lurk. Is this board having an effect?

IMO, we need to start an aggressive guerilla marketing campaign of what we all collectively know by reaching out to friends family, acquaintances, and even media. Invite them to the board, point out Ray's blog, etc.

PSU has been shafted by the sensationalistic national sports media and corrupt PA media BUT we can all do our own little part to spread the word and eventually there will be a tipping point. It's possible that when the court cases break we can have a public that is receptive to the real story.

This board generally has a detrimental affect toward the overall cause if you're talking about outsiders.

People here tend to fly off the handle and are wholly unable put one iota of objectivity in any discussion that's Paterno or scandal related. Everything the university does is seen through the Paterno lens. This board perpetrates the "cult" mentality to all of those who see it.

With all of this said.....no one should give a damn what others think. We all know what Joe stood for, and what he/his family meant for Penn State, State College, Centre County, Pennsylvania, etc.

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

He's got a LOT of support on this board.

I wouldn't qualify it as a lot. There is a core group of mental midgets who listen to and care about what Zieglar says. Mt. Nittany and todd brewster (the real one; not the imposter posting recently) all come to mind. The total number is less than 10.

Even for as much as a looney bin as this place can be, the number in the Zieglar Club is few.....the trouble is, they're a vocal few.

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

Long talk with a few folks from Tempe Az, on Sunday, they were at the sports bar watching the games early9 am pacific, including PSU game, and talked with a bunch of people) regarding Joe...everyone now agreed that it's more commonly accepted now, that Joe did not know anything, did his part as far as what he even knew to do, and the nation engaged in a witch hunt afterward.

These are people who follow Pac 12 football, exclusively, from all the major markets, Seattle, LA, San Francisco, and Phoenix.

Sorry to bombard this thread Bushwood-style with multiple posts in a row. Chalk another dumb thread up to our most heard from troll.

It's been my experience that the entire Sandusky Scandal, including the firing of JoePa and charges against C/S/S, hasn't changed opinions on Penn State at all in the grand scheme of things.

Here me out:

Those out there that always hated PSU are the most vocal, and hate us even more. We lost nothing here.

Those out there that always liked PSU aren't as vocal, but are still there, and still like us.

The rest, the overwhelming vast majority, just don't give a shit.

 

[PhillyPhan21]

This board generally has a detrimental affect toward the overall cause if you're talking about outsiders.

People here tend to fly off the handle and are wholly unable put one iota of objectivity in any discussion that's Paterno or scandal related. Everything the university does is seen through the Paterno lens. This board perpetrates the "cult" mentality to all of those who see it.

With all of this said.....no one should give a damn what others think. We all know what Joe stood for, and what he/his family meant for Penn State, State College, Centre County, Pennsylvania, etc.

I've seen threads on here whining about a mass conspiracy anytime a store doesn't have PSU apparel. A lot of butt hurt on this forum for sure

 

[kgilbert78]

I sure haven't seen or heard of people getting heckled for wearing Penn State gear. In fact I see more people than ever who are wearing Penn State gear and are proud Penn State fans!

Obviously, you don't live where I do. But it's getting better here. At work, it's ok to wear your team's colors on Fridays--I have started to do that again without problems. But that wasn't the case 4 years ago.

 

[PSUnormal]

No. In fact, its probably doing just the opposite, with all the Sandusky is innocent Ziggy cheerleading posts. As a PSU fan every time someone posts to update on Ziggy's latest escapade's I cringe and smack my forehead.

Very true. Can't believe I agree with you. The cause is hurt every time that quack opens his mouth.

 

[jj410]

Sorry to bombard this thread Bushwood-style with multiple posts in a row. Chalk another dumb thread up to our most heard from troll.

It's been my experience that the entire Sandusky Scandal, including the firing of JoePa and charges against C/S/S, hasn't changed opinions on Penn State at all in the grand scheme of things.

Here me out:

Those out there that always hated PSU are the most vocal, and hate us even more. We lost nothing here.

Those out there that always liked PSU aren't as vocal, but are still there, and still like us.

The rest, the overwhelming vast majority, just don't give a shit.

Absolutely true.
Some rabid loud fans of close rival college teams just looking for an excuse.
Others are fair-minded or don't even think about it.
(Meanwhile Ziggy tries to stir up the PSU counterparts of those rival fans.)

 

[21Guns]

But how much can they bench?

One of them is a pro power lifter and can bench press more weight than some small nations. He is an old friend. Many of the others however, are either business owners, regular blue collar guys, a few mechanics and a couple of guys still in the music business, not major bench press specimens, haha. I do, however bench 310, I am damn proud of that considering my age and some of my former health neglections regarding beer consumption etc...Nothing but love for ya smails, rock on.

 

[tboyer]

Long talk with a few folks from Tempe Az, on Sunday, they were at the sports bar watching the games early9 am pacific, including PSU game, and talked with a bunch of people) regarding Joe...everyone now agreed that it's more commonly accepted now, that Joe did not know anything, did his part as far as what he even knew to do, and the nation engaged in a witch hunt afterward.

These are people who follow Pac 12 football, exclusively, from all the major markets, Seattle, LA, San Francisco, and Phoenix.

People who have always hated Penn State (i.e. a lot of fans in the Big Ten unfortunately) are going to continue to believe Paterno and Sandusky were molesting boys together -- because that's what they want to believe, they want to continue the hate. Heck, we saw it from Northwestern fans last week. Facts mean nothing to them. It's like the crazy Republicans running for president who choose to believe men and dinosaurs lived together.

They're smart enough to know what the facts are but they choose to believe what they want to believe to hate Penn State and Paterno -- and really it dates back to 1990 -- Northwestern was one of the schools that very much did not want the Big Ten to invite PSU.

However, people from other parts of the country who respected PSU from a distance have no desire to believe the wrong narrative -- so they're open to what the actual facts say and what they don't say.

 

[21Guns]

These are people who follow Pac 12 football, as I said. Yes, Joe has some supporters on the west coast, however, the west is a very neutral part of the nation for feelings deep seeded on a man raised in Brooklyn and who ran a program in the north east(yes, we are not in the midwest, but in the north east).

These people follow UDub(Washington, they remember Sonny Sixkiller for cripes sake), Cal Berkeley, Stanford, Arizona(not state, but the wild cats in Tucson), UCLA, Fresno State, Utah, etc....

They have zero stake, they are neutral people. My point is that the OVERVIEW and the Narrative, are beginning to change. Time has made it happen. Enough yet? Of course not, that's not the point. The point, is that we are finally seeing change.

 

[psuro]

True, but they are a very vocal minority. VERY VOCAL.

That's because they are all you choose to hear. You discount and/or ignore anyone else.

 

[psuro]

This board generally has a detrimental affect toward the overall cause if you're talking about outsiders.

People here tend to fly off the handle and are wholly unable put one iota of objectivity in any discussion that's Paterno or scandal related. Everything the university does is seen through the Paterno lens. This board perpetrates the "cult" mentality to all of those who see it.

With all of this said.....no one should give a damn what others think. We all know what Joe stood for, and what he/his family meant for Penn State, State College, Centre County, Pennsylvania, etc.

That's good that you said that, because I don't give a damn what you think.

 

[PSUnormal]

That's because they are all you choose to hear. You discount and/or ignore anyone else.

That's just not true. I love Penn. State as much or more than you. I just disagree with the vile hatred some hold towards others.

 

[baircub1!]

Long talk with a few folks from Tempe Az, on Sunday, they were at the sports bar watching the games early9 am pacific, including PSU game, and talked with a bunch of people) regarding Joe...everyone now agreed that it's more commonly accepted now, that Joe did not know anything, did his part as far as what he even knew to do, and the nation engaged in a witch hunt afterward.

These are people who follow Pac 12 football, exclusively, from all the major markets, Seattle, LA, San Francisco, and Phoenix.

Agree but also ran into a guy from the West Coast while in the Salt Lake City Airport ..Bar -Pub...he was/is convinced that Joe was the "President" and had full control of everything that happened at the Universe...and that he "had" to know what Sandusky was doing....had to know because of how powerful he was...

Amazing how much damage the media did...

The only difference in our "discussion"...is that he was arguing on emotion...I was arguing on facts...

 

[Nittany Ziggy]

No. In fact, its probably doing just the opposite, with all the Sandusky is innocent Ziggy cheerleading posts. As a PSU fan every time someone posts to update on Ziggy's latest escapade's I cringe and smack my forehead.

I wish you would just cringe and smack your forehead repeatedly like a monkey on crack. Get busy, will ya?

 

[Rip_E_2_Joe_PA]

First hand reports like this are encouraging, but I don't know if they represent a change in the narrative, or just isolated incidents. Certainly we also hear stories of people being heckled for wearing Penn State gear. Still, every positive report represents progress, so I'll say I'm optimistic.

Same here in SEC country. I meet UT ...Ga ...vanderbilt and Ala fans in my business all the time...they express these same opinions....

 

[fairgambit]

I sure haven't seen or heard of people getting heckled for wearing Penn State gear. In fact I see more people than ever who are wearing Penn State gear and are proud Penn State fans!

People have reported incidents of heckling on this Board.

 

[DonP74]

Sorry to bombard this thread Bushwood-style with multiple posts in a row. Chalk another dumb thread up to our most heard from troll.

It's been my experience that the entire Sandusky Scandal, including the firing of JoePa and charges against C/S/S, hasn't changed opinions on Penn State at all in the grand scheme of things.

Here me out:

Those out there that always hated PSU are the most vocal, and hate us even more. We lost nothing here.

Those out there that always liked PSU aren't as vocal, but are still there, and still like us.

The rest, the overwhelming vast majority, just don't give a shit.

Correct. Like Pitt and Rutgers fans.

 

[LafayetteBear]

However, people from other parts of the country who respected PSU from a distance have no desire to believe the wrong narrative -- so they're open to what the actual facts say and what they don't say.

This ^^^ has been my experience here in California.

 

[Lefty Hill]

Agree but also ran into a guy from the West Coast while in the Salt Lake City Airport ..Bar -Pub...he was/is convinced that Joe was the "President" and had full control of everything that happened at the Universe...and that he "had" to know what Sandusky was doing....had to know because of how powerful he was...

Amazing how much damage the media did...


The only difference in our "discussion"...is that he was arguing on emotion...I was arguing on facts...

Also amazing how stupid some people are.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

No. In fact, its probably doing just the opposite, with all the Sandusky is innocent Ziggy cheerleading posts. As a PSU fan every time someone posts to update on Ziggy's latest escapade's I cringe and smack my forehead.

Fighting the injustices of the tyrannous and corrupt conspirators of the False Narrative, including the intentional, cowardly, dishonorabe, unrighteous, self-serving lies, libel and slander they have committed upon PSU, PSU Athletics and the PSU Community at-large IS NOT defending Jerry Sandusky or any of the things he did while using the imprimatur and authority granted to him by the State via State-licensed adoption, foster-parenting, group homes and a children-dedicated fraud charity in symbiotic relationships with the State, and powerful political forces within the State, that persisted for MORE THAN FOUR DECADES! But I wouldn't expect a lowlife, hypocritical, corrupt, morally-vaccuous, unprincipled butt-wipe and demagogue, such as yourself, to "understand" that rather simple distinction.

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

Fighting the injustices of the tyrannous and corrupt conspirators of the False Narrative, including the intentional, cowardly, dishonorabe, unrighteous, self-serving lies, libel and slander they have committed upon PSU, PSU Athletics and the PSU Community at-large IS NOT defending Jerry Sandusky or any of the things he did while using the imprimatur and authority granted to him by the State via State-licensed adoption, foster-parenting, group homes and a children-dedicated fraud charity in symbiotic relationships with the State, and powerful political forces within the State, that persisted for MORE THAN FOUR DECADES! But I wouldn't expect a lowlife, hypocritical, corrupt, morally-vaccuous, unprincipled butt-wipe and demagogue, such as yourself, to "understand" that rather simple distinction.

Edgar Allen Bushwood.

 

[Marshall30]

That's just not true. I love Penn. State as much or more than you. I just disagree with the vile hatred some hold towards others.

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Marshall30]

Phut PhilyPhan the Phenn Lhive throll ohn ihgnore.

 

[Victor E. Bell]

I do believe you are right. That's why some of the TV commentators are beginning to talk about him so freely as well. I've learned thorough some of my business dealings, 20% of the people will always love you no matter what and be in your camp, 20% of the people will not like you no matter what you do. That leaves the 60% in the middle that can sway either way, with some that just don't care one way or the other. Hopefully that 60% is starting to come back around to know that Joe was not involved but was innocently crucified.

This is so true. There was an old baseball manager, I forget who, maybe Casey or Durocher who used to say his basic job was to keep the 8 guys who hated him away from the 8 who haven't made up their mind.