What's the HS transfer culture like in PA?

[CropDuster507]

As is brought up often, I'm from Minnesota. Transfer rules in HS are pretty simple, and often taken advantage of, in Minnesota. Teams like Apple Valley have been notorious for making a pick-up or two in the off-season. St. Michael (Thorn's HS) made a recent push, as of the last few years. Shakopee made huge rifts this off-season, as Carson Manville and Aaron Cashman have shown up, there. AAA seems to be the free-agent class. Most of the powers have kids move in, and a lot of it seems to come from club friendships that are formed, as well as off-season state team wrestling. Basically, you're allowed 1 free move (meaning you can legally show a change of residence) after 9th grade, I believe. Up until 9th grade, you're pretty much untouchable. There are exceptions and ways around the rules, and some do the ol' "buy a cheap piece of property/real estate in the area, but live in prior residence and commute" in the smaller towns.

I honestly have little issue in it. I don't really think they "recruit", and I can't ever see myself saying "Sorry, you can't wrestle here, even though you moved into our district, because people will think we cheated." There are teams who have been busted for recruiting, but the penalties are pretty weak, here. I do despise recruiting, as it relies on the ethics of the coach. However, Jim Jackson is respected, but also hated because teams that he coaches (prior Valley coach in the crazy transfer era, current Shakopee coach) seem to have kids pop up left and right. I don't suspect him of recruiting, but there are definitely people in the state that do. He's had teams with like, 5 transfers of state-placers/champs on the roster.

What's the scene like in PA? Is transferring a rampant problem? I think that I read that the rule was each AD/principal looks at transfers to decide whether or not it's athletics-related?

 

[Pennstate1985]

Transfers happen in PA, but only if no one complains. If a complaint is filed by the losing district/coach that the move was athletic based rather than academic/family economics, then it goes into the court system often times. I see both sides, as high school should be primarily about education. That said, it is then disingenuous to allow the school losing the kid to file a complaint that the move was athletic based when the complaint itself is based on the losing school feeling they are losing a good athlete!

In the end, the parents should make decisions regarding the well being of their child. They are the closest people to the child, have raised them, and have discussed the child's future a thousand times more than everyone else combined has done. Can that trust be abused? Sure. However, a school district filing a complaint is more abusive in that they cannot honestly say they have the child's interest at heart since they have no real interest in the child beyond age 18.

 

[El-Jefe]

The rule is that any transfer must be signed by both schools involved (outgoing and incoming). And it may not be for athletic purposes. One year ban if found ineligible.

It only applies if both are PIAA schools. All public schools belong. Some private schools belong (mostly Catholic schools), some do not (Malvern Prep, Wyoming Seminary, etc.). Example: Seth Janney transferred from South Western (PIAA) to Malvern Prep (non) after 10th.

Also does not apply if a kid transfers from out of state. Example: Ryan Diehl transferred from West Virginia to Trinity HS.

Also does not apply if a kid transfers before HS (before 9th) -- so quite a few kids transfer before 8th.

Back to the approval process ... it's very rare for the receiving school to reject a kid, so we'll ignore that. If the departing school refuses to sign, then the kid can appeal to the District board. Whichever side loses has a final appeal to the PIAA. No other schools can challenge a transfer (unless there are allegations of payments or other improprieties).

Some more examples:

Zain transferred from Line Mountain to Benton after 10th. Both are very small rural schools in District 4, about 45 min apart. Zain's father got a work reassignment and moved the family; however, there were about 20 other schools closer to his new work site than Benton. Line Mt refused to sign the transfer. D4 agreed that the move to Benton was for athletics and ruled Zain ineligible. PIAA agreed, so Zain lost 11th for wrestling -- but was allowed to play soccer because he never had at Line Mt.

Cody Wiercioch transferred from Charleroi (small school, not a wrestling power) to Canon McMillan (national power), both in District 7 (Pittsburgh suburbs). Charleroi did not sign. District 7 ruled against. PIAA ruled for Wiercioch. This one was clear-cut: Wiercioch's father tried to move the family to another school earlier that offseason, but the home purchase fell through. Only then did they move to Caninsburg.

Artie Walsh transferred multiple times, most famously because his father bought a hot dog cart 3 hrs away -- and then sold it a year later. All of these moves were signed by both schools. The joke was that each school was relieved to lose him.

There are other examples, but I'm on vacation.

Hope this helps!

 

[CropDuster507]

Interesting stuff, guys. Thanks for the input. It seems like it's practically the wild west, out here, in MN. As long as you move, you're good. Heck, we've had kids who didn't move, but got approved due to not being allowed back at their old school and/or "bullying"-type issues.

I looked back, out of interest. Some interesting moves in MN since '08:
Destin McCauley to AV from Sioux City, IA (WI, Nebraska, UN-Kearney)
Eric DeVos to AV to Waverly Shell-Rock, IA (Penn, Wartburg)
Justin Lavalle to AV from Moorhead, MN (NDSU)
Jake Waste to AV from Anoka, MN (Buffalo, Cal-Baptist)
Tyler Lehman to AV to West Fargo, MN (Nebraska, NDSU)
Dan Woiwor to AV from Becker, MN (IA State)
Steve Keough to AV from Thief River Falls, MN (Minnesota, NDSU)
Mark Hall to AV from Kentucky, Michigan (PSU)
Lance Benick to Totino Grace from Forest Lake, MN (Arizona State)
Dayton Racer to AV to Border West, MN to Waverly Shell-Rock, IA (Virginia Tech, Iowa Central CC)
Mason Manville to AV to Blair Academy to Wyoming Seminary (PSU)
Ben Sullivan to AV from Alaska (Northwestern)
Mitch McKee to Kimball, MN to St. Michael-Albertville, MN (Minnesota)
Brock Morgan to AV from Missouri (Columbia)
Bobby Steveson to AV from Indiana (Minnesota)
Jake Allar to St. Michael-Albertville from Benilde-St. Margaret's (IA State)
Luke Norland to Jackson County Central, MN from Spirit Lake, IA (Purdue?)
Travis Rutt to JCC from New Prague, MN (Wisconsin, Oklahoma)

That's only guys that went Division 1/signed Division 1 since '08. There's also an interesting correlation to guys that didn't stay where they committed.

I love Valley. I cheer for them every state tournament. This isn't anti-anyone in MN. Get yours, ya know? But it's just become common-place that every fall, wrestling fans in MN go "Well, I wondered who changed schools, this year?" And some of these even take place in the fall, after school has already started.

 

[El-Jefe]

I should add that very few PA transfers get challenged unless the kid goes to a regional or state power, especially one nearby, and especially one with a reputation (deserved or not) for recruiting.

In Zain's case, a lot of D4 schools think Benton recruits. Line Mt's superintendent said publicly he would've approved Zain going to any other school.

Likewise, Canon Mac has that reputation in D7.

Bethlehem Catholic has that reputation in D11 -- and they're pretty obvious about it -- for example, Zeke Moisey went to Beca, brother Cade stayed home at Northampton. But they pull in kids in junior high, so the PIAA can't stop that.

Another interesting recent case was Spencer Lee and Devin Brown transferring together from Saegertown (D10, NW PA, near Erie) to Franklin Regional (D7). Saegertown let Lee go but blocked Brown. (Lee's case was clear -- his father got a high level job at Carnegie Mellon, and FRHS is the closest suburban school.) Brown won the PIAA appeal by showing his uncle was his guardian and needed to move to Pittsburgh for medical treatment. But the guardianship was in question -- Brown was widely believed to be living with the Lees. But wait, there's more! One year earlier Brown transferred to SHS from Ohio, while his mother stayed behind.

Francis Duggan has now transferred 2x in 2 years, from Cumberland Valley (D3, suburban Harrisburg) to North Allegheny (D7) and now to Cedar Cliff (D3). All were approved.

 

[El-Jefe]

One more, and then I'm back to vacation. And you can google (most of) this story.

I'm generally more of a freedom of association guy, but this case made me see the darker side of athletics.

About 30 yrs ago, basketball player Brad Vonada transferred from small-school Milton to AAAA state power Williamsport, 20 miles away. (Full disclosure: I grew up in Milton, knew Vonada, am 1 year older than him, was already at PSU when he transferred.)

Vonada was good. Really good. Had legitimate D1 college dreams but wasn't getting noticed in a rural small school (even one with a good team that made the state playoffs regularly). And Williamsport head coach Pete White was a legend. Made sense.

Milton signed the papers, but it wasn't long before the PIAA started sniffing around. I don't know who tipped them off, but it was an open secret that only Brad moved (everybody knew his mother lived 1 block from MHS) and they had no relatives in anywhere else in PA.

Turns out White put Vonada up in an apartment or motel and gave him whatever other off-the-book benefits. White claimed it was a loan, but whatever, busted. He got fired and never coached again. Vonada was ineligible for HS and college, and he didn't take classes seriously enough to go to college without hoops. He unfortunately continued the lifestyle without the game -- knocked up some girl, got messed up with drugs, ended up in jail. (Though I hear he cleaned up his life once he got out.)

Cautionary tale, to put it mildly.

 

[dropster45]

Interesting stuff, guys. Thanks for the input. It seems like it's practically the wild west, out here, in MN. As long as you move, you're good. Heck, we've had kids who didn't move, but got approved due to not being allowed back at their old school and/or "bullying"-type issues.

I looked back, out of interest. Some interesting moves in MN since '08:
Destin McCauley to AV from Sioux City, IA (WI, Nebraska, UN-Kearney)
Eric DeVos to AV to Waverly Shell-Rock, IA (Penn, Wartburg)
Justin Lavalle to AV from Moorhead, MN (NDSU)
Jake Waste to AV from Anoka, MN (Buffalo, Cal-Baptist)
Tyler Lehman to AV to West Fargo, MN (Nebraska, NDSU)
Dan Woiwor to AV from Becker, MN (IA State)
Steve Keough to AV from Thief River Falls, MN (Minnesota, NDSU)
Mark Hall to AV from Kentucky, Michigan (PSU)
Lance Benick to Totino Grace from Forest Lake, MN (Arizona State)
Dayton Racer to AV to Border West, MN to Waverly Shell-Rock, IA (Virginia Tech, Iowa Central CC)
Mason Manville to AV to Blair Academy to Wyoming Seminary (PSU)
Ben Sullivan to AV from Alaska (Northwestern)
Mitch McKee to Kimball, MN to St. Michael-Albertville, MN (Minnesota)
Brock Morgan to AV from Missouri (Columbia)
Bobby Steveson to AV from Indiana (Minnesota)
Jake Allar to St. Michael-Albertville from Benilde-St. Margaret's (IA State)
Luke Norland to Jackson County Central, MN from Spirit Lake, IA (Purdue?)
Travis Rutt to JCC from New Prague, MN (Wisconsin, Oklahoma)

That's only guys that went Division 1/signed Division 1 since '08. There's also an interesting correlation to guys that didn't stay where they committed.

I love Valley. I cheer for them every state tournament. This isn't anti-anyone in MN. Get yours, ya know? But it's just become common-place that every fall, wrestling fans in MN go "Well, I wondered who changed schools, this year?" And some of these even take place in the fall, after school has already started.

For us Pennsylvanians, this reads like a recruiting ad: "Come to Apple Valley and be a Champion!". The people I know out there despise this team, their coaches, and their recruiting tactics.

 

[CropDuster507]

For us Pennsylvanians, this reads like a recruiting ad: "Come to Apple Valley and be a Champion!". The people I know out there despise this team, their coaches, and their recruiting tactics.

I coach for a AAA out-state team... Trust me, that wasn't my plan. They definitely get boo'd in MN.

I think people just need to understand that elite wrestlers are more able and willing to move, nowadays. If Mark Hall shows up at your HS because you churn out D1 recruits, you're not going to tell him "No." I can't fault them for that. Now, if they did break any rules (which, in some cases, I think it's families breaking rules moreso than the team), they should be penalized (see Dayton Racer).

 

[NoVa Lion]

Transfers happen in PA, but only if no one complains. If a complaint is filed by the losing district/coach that the move was athletic based rather than academic/family economics, then it goes into the court system often times. I see both sides, as high school should be primarily about education. That said, it is then disingenuous to allow the school losing the kid to file a complaint that the move was athletic based when the complaint itself is based on the losing school feeling they are losing a good athlete!

In the end, the parents should make decisions regarding the well being of their child. They are the closest people to the child, have raised them, and have discussed the child's future a thousand times more than everyone else combined has done. Can that trust be abused? Sure. However, a school district filing a complaint is more abusive in that they cannot honestly say they have the child's interest at heart since they have no real interest in the child beyond age 18.

I'm with 85 on this issue. Unfortunately for the many legit moves there are a small number of coaches out there that abuse the system which makes this an issue for the many coaches & parents that are only looking out for the interest of the kid(s). JMHO.

 

[dropster45]

I coach for a AAA out-state team... Trust me, that wasn't my plan. They definitely get boo'd in MN.

I think people just need to understand that elite wrestlers are more able and willing to move, nowadays. If Mark Hall shows up at your HS because you churn out D1 recruits, you're not going to tell him "No." I can't fault them for that. Now, if they did break any rules (which, in some cases, I think it's families breaking rules moreso than the team), they should be penalized (see Dayton Racer).

Well I don't know Dayton Racer, but can ask Hall next time I see him. You can't blame me for asking the question - you're using a lot of recruiter arguments:
"They just showed up, honest!"
"Everybody's doing it!"
Typical....and recruiting minded people are very vocal with their opinions. They try to convince everyone (including themselves) that what they're doing is normal, rational, and on the up and up.

 

[CropDuster507]

Well I don't know Dayton Racer, but can ask Hall next time I see him. You can't blame me for asking the question - you're using a lot of recruiter arguments:
"They just showed up, honest!"
"Everybody's doing it!"
Typical....and recruiting minded people are very vocal with their opinions. They try to convince everyone (including themselves) that what they're doing is normal, rational, and on the up and up.

For the record, my HS team was in the same conference and playoff section as one of the few teams with coaches who actually got sanctions, and they couldn't even pin him with recruiting (even though it's definite evidence that he was). I'm not pro-recruiting. I just don't think it's fair to assume negative of the situation without knowing more. Frankly, I don't know anyone inside Valley or Shakopee.

 

[minnhawkeye]

Well some say that Baker at Jackson,Mn does some recuriting. Also have been told Kasson does also have no evidence just some fans talk.

 

[nitlion6]

Once father/mother/family move it is nobody's phreaking business and there should be no need for school (receiving/losing) involvement other than academic acknowledgement.

 

[dropster45]

Once father/mother/family move it is nobody's phreaking business and there should be no need for school (receiving/losing) involvement other than academic acknowledgement.

As soon as you move, no questions can be ever asked? Please don't tell me that's what you're saying?

 

[NoVa Lion]

As soon as you move, no questions can be ever asked? Please don't tell me that's what you're saying?

Why? That would be my position too. My should the school have ANY say in where a family lives? Please don't tell me you think that should be the case.

 

[Pennstate1985]

Why? That would be my position too. My should the school have ANY say in where a family lives? Please don't tell me you think that should be the case.

Exactly. The district should have no interest and in actuality has no interest in where a child goes to school as long as the child is being educated. The rule is there strictly to protect the athletic integrity of the school. No more. No less.

 

[nitlion6]

As soon as you move, no questions can be ever asked? Please don't tell me that's what you're saying?

That is exactly what I am saying. If I have a son who is a potential division 1 football athlete and I decide to move my family from the Philipsburg-Osceola school district to the State College school district you are damn straight I do not think it is anybody's business why I moved. Especially, but not limited to the Philipsburg-Osceola school district.
I would then be living in and paying property taxes to the State College district. Why anybody would believe for a single second they have some sort of right to block my son's access to anything the State College school district offers to all of their students is beyond my ability to comprehend the level of self importance other adults have of themselves.
Now let's try this differently. Please do not tell me you actually believe differently.

 

[El-Jefe]

Presuming your son was not recruited with SEC style bag men, yes.

Preventing that is a good thing -- if for no other reason, it preserves college athletic eligibility.

PIAA rule goes beyond that, and I'm not awake enough to figure out what it should be. (It's 10 pm here, have been up since 4 am including 3 hrs of hikes in tropical heat plus a flight.)

I'll just add that some HS athletes move while the parents stay behind. In public school where there's no boarding. Lots could go wrong there too -- not the least of which is safety if the kid commutes.

 

[nitlion6]

Presuming your son was not recruited with SEC style bag men, yes.

Preventing that is a good thing -- if for no other reason, it preserves college athletic eligibility.

PIAA rule goes beyond that, and I'm not awake enough to figure out what it should be. (It's 10 pm here, have been up since 4 am including 3 hrs of hikes in tropical heat plus a flight.)

I'll just add that some HS athletes move while the parents stay behind. In public school where there's no boarding. Lots could go wrong there too -- not the least of which is safety if the kid commutes.

I am just using my example. The situation with Zain I view as damn near criminal. My son, and the Line Mountain superintendent and I end up having a nasty conversation. The Line Mountain superintendent's decision accomplished nothing except take experiences and memories away from Zain. Phucking petty, small minded, vindictive adult.

Families who claim a false residence and transport their kid to a non local school, that is the business of the receiving school - IMO not the business of the school that is receiving the tax dollars but not required to deliver services.

 

[dropster45]

I am just using my example. The situation with Zain I view as damn near criminal. My son, and the Line Mountain superintendent and I end up having a nasty conversation. The Line Mountain superintendent's decision accomplished nothing except take experiences and memories away from Zain. Phucking petty, small minded, vindictive adult.

Families who claim a false residence and transport their kid to a non local school, that is the business of the receiving school - IMO not the business of the school that is receiving the tax dollars but not required to deliver services.

Yes, and I agree with this fully. When it's a legitimate move, there should be no questions asked. What I was referring to in my original question was "funny" living arrangements where the parent(s) is/are in a different location & the kid is living in the coaches basement. It's happened before. My whole question was predicated on that. My fault for not explaining that premise more fully.

 

[nitlion6]

Yes, and I agree with this fully. When it's a legitimate move, there should be no questions asked. What I was referring to in my original question was "funny" living arrangements where the parent(s) is/are in a different location & the kid is living in the coaches basement. It's happened before. My whole question was predicated on that. My fault for not explaining that premise more fully.

My response was to the post from jefe.

District 11 has a history of interesting changing lineups. Used to be Easton, Northampton or AA Wilson might have more than one or two kids in their lineups that did not wrestle in those schools' junior high programs or maybe switched after a year or two. Until Beca decided to take recruiting to a completely different level there was nothing like Apple Valley.

Basketball has a different history though.

 

[dicemen99]

My response was to the post from jefe.

District 11 has a history of interesting changing lineups. Used to be Easton, Northampton or AA Wilson might have more than one or two kids in their lineups that did not wrestle in those schools' junior high programs or maybe switched after a year or two. Until Beca decided to take recruiting to a completely different level there was nothing like Apple Valley.

Basketball has a different history though.

Easton has a history of grabbing kids from across the border as well. Northampton with a nice transfer this year (and rumor of a 2nd one, but have not seen him show up on their roster yet). Pretty funny all the squawking coming from D11 about BECA now - most from the teams that are bitchin' because the kid from Palisades or Southern Lehigh is now showing up at BECA instead of their squads.

 

[nitlion6]

Easton has a history of grabbing kids from across the border as well. Northampton with a nice transfer this year (and rumor of a 2nd one, but have not seen him show up on their roster yet). Pretty funny all the squawking coming from D11 about BECA now - most from the teams that are bitchin' because the kid from Palisades or Southern Lehigh is now showing up at BECA instead of their squads.

The bitching is humorous.

While Nathon Galloway was wrestling for State College Rocky and Harley Anderson, and Matt Storniolo found their way to State College. Nate's dad had a lot to do with that, but my understanding was always the kids benefited either from a better social-economic environment or a more stable home situation. Not sure what the exact situation was and despite having enough of a relationship with Jack I could have ask, I just never felt it was any of my business.

 

[liex26]

I understand the school being penalized for recruiting, but as far the athlete side of it I really think it's nonsense. Even if a student does transfer for athletics why is that wrong? Forget that the coach or competition could be better for a second. What if your son is not starting for one of many reasons, not as good as starter, underclassmen, nepotism, indifference. If a student could go to another school and be better in any way and earn a free education from it who has the right to stop that?

 

[ptomaselli]

10+ years ago Scott Davis transferred from Clarion to Lake-Lehman clear across the state...and was forced to sit a year. Fabulous athlete. HS QB, super baseball player (got a D1 scholly to Kentucky), and won a state wrestling title for Lake-Lehman as a Senior. I don't know the family or any of the details. I do know his dad at one point coached Clarion Univ. Dad and Mom are both from Lake-Lehman...and still owned property when they moved back. Apparently Clarion (or Clarion-Limestone) was VERY upset (at the father I assume) as Lake-Lehman is over 200 miles away. Hardly a cross town rival of Clarion. Maybe they were P-O'd at the dad? On the surface it sure seemed awfully vindictive to challenge a transfer to high school 200 miles away.

Kid are ALWAYS screwed in the end. PIAA has just a horrible transfer policy...something only a vindictive adult could have developed. Can't the PIAA just take the adult hubris out of the process suspending ALL kids 25-30% of a season for any transfer? Just make it a blanket thing and take the emotion out of it. Penalizing a kid an entire season seems like overkill...especially since schools are supposed to be there for the kids...not vice versa. I mean, really. Who's the taxpayer and who's the public servant? The adults never seem act the part.

Davis transfer

 

[nitlion6]

Not sure of exact timing, but Altoona native Danny Forston transfered from Altoona to Shaler high school WPIAL. Of course Altoona carried on and the kid was ruled ineligible his junior year. Around the same time there were 2 big kids from Texas who moved into the Shaler coach's home and since there were no offended PIAA schools those transfers were allowed.

Another kid who played basketball for an athletically weak school west of Pittsburgh but was a pretty darn good player - his father sold the family home, bought a house in the Blackhawk school district and moved his family. The Blackhawk basketball coach was John Miller, university of Arizona headcoach Sean Miller's father, who over his career placed an inordinate number of players on division 1 rosters. The father simply wanted his son to have the best shot at a scholarship, nothing evil, devious or wrong headed or hearted.
Of course there was a big 2do and the kid had to miss a year.
Schools serve the public and exist for the betterment of kids, and phucking piss ant minded school officals/administrators/coaches who lose sight of that fact should resign or be fired.

Oh yeah. The Davis suspension was bullshit and if the PIAA had even a smidgen interest in what works for kids would have told the Clarion school to grow up and shut up.

 

[CropDuster507]

At some point, though, sports and schools are just going to have to part ways. Clubs are the wave. I think other countries do it that way.

 

[lioncrebs]

One more, and then I'm back to vacation. And you can google (most of) this story.

I'm generally more of a freedom of association guy, but this case made me see the darker side of athletics.

About 30 yrs ago, basketball player Brad Vonada transferred from small-school Milton to AAAA state power Williamsport, 20 miles away. (Full disclosure: I grew up in Milton, knew Vonada, am 1 year older than him, was already at PSU when he transferred.)

Vonada was good. Really good. Had legitimate D1 college dreams but wasn't getting noticed in a rural small school (even one with a good team that made the state playoffs regularly). And Williamsport head coach Pete White was a legend. Made sense.

Milton signed the papers, but it wasn't long before the PIAA started sniffing around. I don't know who tipped them off, but it was an open secret that only Brad moved (everybody knew his mother lived 1 block from MHS) and they had no relatives in anywhere else in PA.

Turns out White put Vonada up in an apartment or motel and gave him whatever other off-the-book benefits. White claimed it was a loan, but whatever, busted. He got fired and never coached again. Vonada was ineligible for HS and college, and he didn't take classes seriously enough to go to college without hoops. He unfortunately continued the lifestyle without the game -- knocked up some girl, got messed up with drugs, ended up in jail. (Though I hear he cleaned up his life once he got out.)

Cautionary tale, to put it mildly.

 

[lioncrebs]

Hey El-Jefe, I went to Milton, graduated in '89. I remember Vonada very well. I thought he actually ended up playing for Williamsport? What year did ya graduate from Milton??

 

[El-Jefe]

1986.

Brad was 1987. He might have played some before crap hit fan, but pretty sure not a full season.

BTW, he now goes by "Duche Bradley." It's supposed to be pronounced Dutch, but, well... even though I liked him, it's hard to not laugh a little at that.

 

[PA Power]

Canon Mac in their recent run of success had quite a few "non-natives" that were studs. Among these were:

Solomon Chishko (Penn Trafford)
Cody Wiercioch (Charleroi)
Dalton Macri (moved from West Virginia)

A few years back they also had a transfer that was blocked at the PIAA level in heavyweight Sam Brownlee who was forced to sit for a year.

http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/...ble-to-wrestle-this-year/stories/200701190251

 

[kingslayer_85]

reading this I almost forgot I live in America. if I get a new job I can move, if I get a promotion and want to move up I can, if I get fired and need to down size I can. If I want to move my kids to a school district that has a better education system I can but if I want to move my kid to a district that improves his athletic talent I am out of luck. learned a lot last couple of days reading through this thread

 

[manatree]

reading this I almost forgot I live in America. if I get a new job I can move, if I get a promotion and want to move up I can, if I get fired and need to down size I can. If I want to move my kids to a school district that has a better education system I can but if I want to move my kid to a district that improves his athletic talent I am out of luck. learned a lot last couple of days reading through this thread

Only if the jilted school files a formal complaint. In my opinion, transfers/moves happen all of the time. the formal complaints & suspensions are fairly few.

 

[NoVa Lion]

Only if the jilted school files a formal complaint. In my opinion, transfers/moves happen all of the time. the formal complaints & suspensions are fairly few.

.
Formal complaints are few because they only happen with elite athletes so 99.99% of the time no one notices or cares.

 

[nitlion6]

And the point is why does a school district have any say whatsoever.

 

[manatree]

And the point is why does a school district have any say whatsoever.

Because water is wet.

 

[dropster45]

At some point, though, sports and schools are just going to have to part ways. Clubs are the wave. I think other countries do it that way.

The problem with only having clubs though is that it invariably "misses" a lot of kids. I wonder what our Olympic team would have looked like this year if it was all just clubs? I mean, I really don't know, but if I had to guess, we probably wouldn't have had some of those guys in there. Maybe we would be even stronger? There's no way to really know. As a comparison though, the country with the most medals in freestyle wrestling since the advent of the modern day Olympics is...
The USA - no kidding. Russia is number 2, though they have more golds, but they cheat like hell. Man, do they cheat like hell. Paying off refs and doping - whatever it takes. No sense of self-respect there IMO, but I digress. Sweden is number 3 in total count. They used to be tough as nails in the early 1900's (Viking blood perhaps?).
Point is, maybe what we are doing with keeping it socialized at the lower levels is actually making our teams stronger? Then there's the life skills that you can teach a kid, but only if he's in the room. After all, that's what the sport is for - teaching life skills. As a prominent college coach once said, wrestling is just a game.