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- Thread starter Nittany Ned2
- Start date
I don't think anyone should go hungry and certainly universities need to be cognizant of students who might be struggling to eat.
However, George Washington University is one of the more expensive universities ($56K per year) in one of the most expensive neighborhoods (West End/Foggy Bottom) in one of the most expensive cities in the U.S. It is NOT the place to go to school is you have financial worries. I ate moderately well (for a college student) at PSU, but I would have been screwed at GWU just due to cost of living.
Fair point. But like any budgeting, unless something changes after you have enrolled, you shouldn't be surprised by what things cost. If you can't afford to go to school (and eat), at Place X (whether that is PSU or GWU or a Community College), go somewhere cheaper, or work for a couple of years and save money and then go to school.
Again, I support the idea that universities need programs to help students who might be struggling. But hopefully they are struggling for a better reason that "I had no idea the meal plan was so expensive."
Where I went to school, you had to have a housing plan and a meal plan, or you didnt go to school. You either lived in the dorm and ate in the cafeteria, or you lived in a Frat house and ate there (or the cafeteria) but you couldnt go to school without a plan, and paying for those things. If you had enough money, you could live off campus your senior year, but the school had to approve you for off campus living.
When I was a senior at Penn State in the late 1960s, 6 of us lived in a dilapidated house on Pugh Street. We always had enough to eat. Every day we ate the same dinner. We bought macaroni in large boxes at Weis Markets along with the cheapest hamburger (plenty of grease). One of the guys was able to get blocks of surplus Velveeta cheese for free. Every day we ate macaroni with hamburger grease and Velveeta cheese for dinner. We saved the leftovers for the next day's lunch. We also ate Velveeta cheese sandwiches for lunch. We were able to feed 6 guys for a week on less than $5. We were never hungry. We were happy and kind of proud about how resourceful we were.
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My freshman year I pretty much lived off of Chicken cosmo's. Maybe that's what led to my freshman 15...
http://news.psu.edu/story/189341/2008/03/31/end-cosmo-dining-commons-tradition-runs-its-course
http://news.psu.edu/story/189341/2008/03/31/end-cosmo-dining-commons-tradition-runs-its-course
FYI, there is a food bank on campus called "the Lion's Pantry". Any student can stop in and get food. It's not a solution to the greater problem but it is a nice short term fix if you were hungry.
http://sites.psu.edu/lionspantrypsu/
http://sites.psu.edu/lionspantrypsu/
I do not believe for a second that these kids are struggling to eat. Probably making choices for other things besides food. Food is cheaper than it has ever been. Spaghetti Os is a prepared food. A bag of black beans and and a bag rice... feed someone for a week, costs about $2.
Now, on the other hand, the housing issue... or whhatever they call it "housing security" is likely a big problem. And that may drive kids to not eat properly.
This all stems from people going to schools they cannot afford, or going to school when they really shouldn't. The money may not be adequate for their circumstances.
It's a shame. I wish there was enough money for everyone to spend 5 years going to school and eating whatever they want, but this doesn't exist.
There is an array of situations... abusers of the system and then kids who get completely screwed by the system. There's no fix.
LdN
I recall buying "Finast" brand boxed mac and cheese, which I think was 30 cents a box (in 1993-94). I'd get two meals out of a box, so if you include the milk and butter needed to make it, that was about 25 a meal. I'd eat that 3 or 4 times a week. As a result, I couldn't eat mac and cheese for about 15 year after that, but I wasn't hungry at PSU despite not having a lot of money.
Right but the article also points out that many of these people were low income going into college. Likely their "food insecurity" issues existed prior to going to college and will continue after college until they get secure income.
These studies are rarely in depth. It would be better to actually monitor the spending of the students to see where the money actually goes. It would be eye opening.
The one girl had $100. Said her choice was laundry or food. That says a lot right there about the decision making process.
LdN
This is not exactly breaking news...
Personal experience no exception: through every fault that was my own, I had a food budget around $10/ week back in the fall of 1985 when I was living off campus at Behrend.... quickly got my 6’3 frame down to 185lbs
Upon arrival to West Halls at Univ. Park in January 1986... Waring dining hall was my Disneyland
Personal experience no exception: through every fault that was my own, I had a food budget around $10/ week back in the fall of 1985 when I was living off campus at Behrend.... quickly got my 6’3 frame down to 185lbs
Upon arrival to West Halls at Univ. Park in January 1986... Waring dining hall was my Disneyland
I would also point out that there is a difference between being hungry (which is not necessarily bad; most of our country is overweight) vs being malnourished.
Being malnourished is bad, but there are plenty of folks who have plenty to eat, but are still malnourished (i.e. because they eat junk food and no vegetables). I was probably malnourished at PSU (see my comment above about mac and cheese consumption).
If you have so little to eat that you drop below a healthy weight for your body type, then that's a big problem. But being "hungry" isn't the end of the world.
Anyway, it's a complicated issue. I'd love to see food banks (at colleges and elsewhere) focus on distributing healthy food only (rather than shelf stable food, which is generally not super healthy) but I realize that there are logistical problems with this concept.
Being malnourished is bad, but there are plenty of folks who have plenty to eat, but are still malnourished (i.e. because they eat junk food and no vegetables). I was probably malnourished at PSU (see my comment above about mac and cheese consumption).
If you have so little to eat that you drop below a healthy weight for your body type, then that's a big problem. But being "hungry" isn't the end of the world.
Anyway, it's a complicated issue. I'd love to see food banks (at colleges and elsewhere) focus on distributing healthy food only (rather than shelf stable food, which is generally not super healthy) but I realize that there are logistical problems with this concept.
we have enough problems without making them up.
My school didn't serve food on the weekends. So we'd go into Friday with two dollars sometimes. I'd buy a pack of hot dogs and a loaf of bread. I'd go to burger chef and steal a handfull of ketchup packages. I had a can of wylers lemon-aid mix. That was my weekend. Today, kids get a dozen eggs and a box of ramen noodles for about $4. Carbs and protein, what could be better?
Go go any college town and count the "help wanted" signs at every minimum wage place in the city. I'll be I can find 50 "help wanted" signs within five minutes from my home.
If kids are starving today, it is their own fault. My guess is that this study shows kids that aren't getting their nutrients but it isn't because they don't have access, but because they are spending their time and money on 'Dew and Sunflower seeds.
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anon_xdc8rmuek44eq
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It’s probably not worth sharing news with any social/economic significance here. You get the same, scripted responses from folks who are aghast that others can’t do what they did (in a different era, with much different costs, and when going to college wasn’t as much of a necessity as it is today).
But thanks for sharing anyway.
I bet they all have iPhone 8s with unlimited data plans.
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anon_xdc8rmuek44eq
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Of course they do. At least the ones not working three jobs.
I was on campus to take classes and do research the summer before my junior year. My roommate bought one of the lesser meal plans and ran out of points about halfway through the 8-week session. As he was running out of points, he threw bagels, apples, and bananas from the dining hall in his backpack for other meals. When he ran out out points, he lived on peanut butter sandwiches and canned soup or asked if I or someone else in the dorm had points to spare. I had extra points and helped out however I could. It was sad to see how desperate he was.
There was a particular pinball machine in the student union: if you knocked down all the targets once, it lit one up that you could hit for a free game. I used to go in there and run up 8 or 10 free games then sell them to the "rich kids" for half off (8 games for a $1). That buck was used for the washer and dryer ($.25 for a load of colors, one for whites, then two spins on the dryer). Of course, that was about twice a semester wether my clothes needed to be washed or not.
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anon_xdc8rmuek44eq
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There. Is. No. Fix!
I got by because my dad, after retiring as an enlisted Marine, worked in food service and sent me to school with coolers full of institutional food items - chicken patties, pasta, etc. The $80 a pay check I got from work study got me some take out when I had anything left over. My roommates were all kids I knew from Beaver County and most were the first in their family to go to college. We all got loans for tuition and books and worked jobs to have food and spending money. Cell phones weren’t critical to everyday life and if I was lucky I’d get a beer or two from Pennsylvania Pizza’s bottle shop for the weekend.
My parents didn’t go to college and lived the military lifestyle for 20+ years - civilian life was a shock for them and they had no idea how to prepare to send a kid to college. It was hard, especially when I was able to get out of Lexington House and visit more affluent friends living on Beaver Avenue.
I had a similar friend on my dorm floor freshman and sophomore years. He came from a large family (13 kids, several of whom were at PSU at the same time). His meal plan wasn't big enough, so he had to get creative with meals. He was also very proud and didn't like accepting help. He had to be really hungry to let you buy him a slice of pizza.
On the other hand, he didn't have a part time job during the school year. I worked 2 jobs during the semester and sold my blood plasma. I worked two to three jobs during the summer (to his credit he worked construction over summer break). He would admit that he was too lazy to get a job during the school year and would rather be hungry than work a crappy job.
Yeah, everyone has their own stories. The fact is that food is cheaper than it has ever been relative to income... including minimum wage.
If kids are going hungry then there's another cause than simply food cost.
When I was in college we did a study of one of these studies. Proved it wrong, and moved on. At the time they were saying college kids needed to eat cat and dog food to survive.
I think everyone will agree on the main culprit though... tuitions are too high. But as an economist I will tell you that subsidizing tuition more (grants, loans etc) will just make the problem worse.
LdN
Seems like average weight of student is 20 lbs heavier than when I was a student. So most aren't starving. Sad if there are those who are.
My "get off my lawn" moment, but many kids are not employable today.
The other day I had my employee sitting watching a film on her computer while playing on her phone while a customer was sitting in the seating area. (Computers are allowed for studying for my college employees on a case by case basis)
When I asked her to stop, her response was "Well he's just sitting there waiting for his wife".
It's amazing. No apology.
LdN
Laundry or food!!! Why do laundry? When I was a senior at PSU in the late 1960s I never paid for laundry ever. Sometimes I would scrub dirty clothes in the sink and hang them in my bedroom to dry. I'm puzzled why laundry is even brought up if money is tight.
Yeah that was my not so subtle point. Of all the quotes this article could have used, this was their big one. And it's sort of a joke.
LdN
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anon_xdc8rmuek44eq
Guest
It’s not a joke if laundry is required for a uniform you have to have clean for work. Whether or not $100 is sufficient is another story....
That's on the kids (and the parents) rather than the university/"system" though, right?
yikes....we've had good luck with the current kids but most are no where near as dedicated. In my youth, it was a matter of survival. today, kids seem to feel that there is another job just around the corner. Most want to make $50k per year, have high speed internet and three quares. With that they are good to go. They seem to respond with having more flexible vacay time, social activities tied to work (leagues, after hour social events) and cool workspaces. I suspect, once they have a mortgage and a kid, things will change. (although I do notice the desire for home ownership isn't there). They have also been drilled that charity is way cool, so I try to connect customer service to it being a 'charitable' endeavor of some sort. Seems to work.
Regardless, school is simply a vetting process. I don't feel like I've ever used much formal learning from school but feel the process of learning how to navigate through hurdles to get stuff done was invaluable. Life balance with school work, entertainment, eating, second jobs, etc. was just part of the gig. On won hand, I understand the notion of the experience, but on the other, it is a vetting process to see who has the drive to succeed and who doesn't.
Well as Lion D said it would be helpful to understand the spending habits of students. So for those of you who accept this article without a couple hmms? I simply ask this.
What makes a college student less able to eat than a non college student?
If you make the presumption that college students are somewhat better off than non college students it would follow that of all college age people a considerably higher percentage than 36% go hungry.
For those that say the money is used for tuition or housing I would say unfortunately they are making a bad decision. Their is no college experience that is more valuable than eating.
Perhaps the bigger issue that we can likely all agree on is the cost of attending college has become outrageous. It is very common for a school to now cost 60K per year, including room and board. This would include GW, BC, NYU and many other very good, but not elite schools. For that price no student should be hungry for even one day of their college experience.
Best situation I ever had at PSU was my last term. I was a waiter at TKE. All we had to do was set the tables before lunch and dinner, bring the food out and clear the tables after the guys ate. We ate what they ate and they ate well. Also had social privileges. No money but I ate very well that term. Wish I had stumbled on that way sooner.
My generation ate an awful lot of mac and cheese and frozen pizza. Sometimes just warm leftover beer. Not a lot of protein outside of canned tuna. We might have been malnourished but we weren't starving.
Anyway this is just a reflection of what has happened to American society in our lifetime -- huge huge wealth accumulation at the top and hollowing out of the middle class.
Universities like PSU cater to rich kids because they can get $50-60k a year out of them. So gold-plated new dorms and campus buildings and virtually no financial aid. Middle class kids are welcome too -- if they borrow $100-150k.
I think it's sad that public universities have pretty much abandoned what used to be their mission, which was providing a high quality education to kids from working class families without requiring a lifetime of debt.
Anyway this is just a reflection of what has happened to American society in our lifetime -- huge huge wealth accumulation at the top and hollowing out of the middle class.
Universities like PSU cater to rich kids because they can get $50-60k a year out of them. So gold-plated new dorms and campus buildings and virtually no financial aid. Middle class kids are welcome too -- if they borrow $100-150k.
I think it's sad that public universities have pretty much abandoned what used to be their mission, which was providing a high quality education to kids from working class families without requiring a lifetime of debt.
Going to piggyback on this one with some recent stories of employees being on their phone in front of customers. When I was at the PPL center for the hockey playoffs I went to one of the food stands for a water during the 2nd period. There was no line so as I wound my way through the stanchions and approached the front I expected to be called forward straight away. Instead the young girl at the service station closest to me was on her phone, not paying attention at all. The people that were supposed to be manning the other stations were laughing/joking (screwing around). So I just stood there for a good 30 seconds until someone yelled to the girl at the station in front of me and she then looked up, put her phone down, and asked what I wanted.
A similar thing happened not a week later when I was in a retail clothing store. Except this time it was a woman in her mid-40's that was on her phone at the register and not paying attention to the fact that there was a customer in line.
Now I'm on the younger side of this board from previous polls, but I could never imagine being allowed to be on my cell phone while working in a customer service position - let alone cashier. Not sure who to blame, the parents for not instilling a proper work ethic, or the management who isn't putting their foot down on this kind of behavior.
Well said. Another interesting thing that recently occurred. Was on a college tour (not PSU) recently with my daughter at a major university. The person giving the tour (this school's version of Lion Ambassador's giving a tour, although they did not walk backwards) must have have used the word 'transgender' and 'inclusion' at least a dozen times on the tour, to the point it was obvious it was drilled into their head from the university to stress this unmercifully. During the entire time we were there both in the formal power point presentation and tour, not one mention ever of tuition costs, room and board costs, job programs, etc....ample slides though on traveling abroad (which only had in the fine print that was an extra $10,000).
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anon_xdc8rmuek44eq
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Who is the 'he' in her sentence? Another intern or employee, or the customer? That's bad form either way. One part of my job I enjoy is vetting and selecting interns. We've had really good success the past few years, though we only take at most two per semester/term (fall/summer/spring/winter). Two years ago we had an Ivy League grad student who graduated top ten (overall, not percentage) at Michigan. She now has a prestigious fellowship in DC and has a bright future. The others we've had (from various schools - Indiana, Puget Sound, Davidson, Case Western, U Chicago) have all been diligent and professional and worked their asses off. This year my two are from Illinois (honor program; she's only 18 and a junior) and Brown. Really looking forward to getting them involved - they hit the ground running too. They typically stay at GW's campus with other DC summer interns and it's supposedly a great way to network.
Yes. I guess in very specific circumstances having to have a clean uniform is not a joke.
But the question isn't whether people need clean uniforms. The topic is whether they can eat.
They can.
LdN
The "he" is the customer who was sitting waiting for his wife. The employee was just playing on her phone while watching a movie on a laptop.
The issues are: 1. It sends a bad message to customers and potential customers. 2. When I asked her to stop she had an excuse instead of an apology.
Vetting is difficult but very important.
LdN
