AKB -- Car maintenance question

[BrucePa]

I'm by no means a car expert, and my 2010 Highlander hybrid has been holding up well at 110K miles. But for the past year or so, I go the Toyota dealer to get regular maintenance at about 5000 mile intervals, and I feel like i'm getting scammed every time. I'm looking for an oil change and tire rotation, and it's as if the maintenance people are on commission -- you need new tires ($1000), you need a timing belt ($2500), you name it.

What do I do? Continue going back and fight like hell to not get fleeced, or somehow find an honest mechanic who only does what needs to be done and only recommends absolutely necessary repairs? Where does such a mechanic exist?

 

[sluggo72]

I'm by no means a car expert, and my 2010 Highlander hybrid has been holding up well at 110K miles. But for the past year or so, I go the Toyota dealer to get regular maintenance at about 5000 mile intervals, and I feel like i'm getting scammed every time. I'm looking for an oil change and tire rotation, and it's as if the maintenance people are on commission -- you need new tires ($1000), you need a timing belt ($2500), you name it.

What do I do? Continue going back and fight like hell to not get fleeced, or somehow find an honest mechanic who only does what needs to be done and only recommends absolutely necessary repairs? Where does such a mechanic exist?

I'd tell them to do what you asked them to do, and nothing more, the next go to another Toyota dealership or another 'brand name' place and see what they say.

that said, I guarantee you in the Toyota maintenance manual they say to change the timing belt at 100k miles, maybe before.

 

[psuro]

I'm by no means a car expert, and my 2010 Highlander hybrid has been holding up well at 110K miles. But for the past year or so, I go the Toyota dealer to get regular maintenance at about 5000 mile intervals, and I feel like i'm getting scammed every time. I'm looking for an oil change and tire rotation, and it's as if the maintenance people are on commission -- you need new tires ($1000), you need a timing belt ($2500), you name it.

What do I do? Continue going back and fight like hell to not get fleeced, or somehow find an honest mechanic who only does what needs to be done and only recommends absolutely necessary repairs? Where does such a mechanic exist?

Assuming you have had the car since new and have the Owner's Manual - check in there for the recommended replacement schedule for timing belts and other mechanical things. Tires and brakes are based on wear and tear.

 

[Obliviax]

I'm by no means a car expert, and my 2010 Highlander hybrid has been holding up well at 110K miles. But for the past year or so, I go the Toyota dealer to get regular maintenance at about 5000 mile intervals, and I feel like i'm getting scammed every time. I'm looking for an oil change and tire rotation, and it's as if the maintenance people are on commission -- you need new tires ($1000), you need a timing belt ($2500), you name it.

What do I do? Continue going back and fight like hell to not get fleeced, or somehow find an honest mechanic who only does what needs to be done and only recommends absolutely necessary repairs? Where does such a mechanic exist?

you've been getting fleeced. sorry.

Ask around and find a local person for most issues. As an example, my wife's passenger door auto lock quit working after she looked herself out the the police "jimmied" the door to open it. The dealership told us it would cost $400 to fix. I was telling a friend who said take it to my husband. He sells tires and does low end maintenance like tires. I dropped it off and went across the street for lunch. I came back and he said "all fixed, no charge." What? He said he took the inside door cover off and the cable was bent by the cop. He straitened the cable. Its worked ever since. I gave him $100...he refused it several times, but finally took the money.

Similar story for a catalytic converter. Dealer was 2.5 x the local guy's fee.

The only thing I go to the dealership for is warranty work or something that the smaller guys can't handle.

 

[Sproul]

Lol. Who goes to the dealer for service? Good lord

 

[ClarkstonMark]

you've been getting fleeced. sorry.

Ask around and find a local person for most issues. As an example, my wife's passenger door auto lock quit working after she looked herself out the the police "jimmied" the door to open it. The dealership told us it would cost $400 to fix. I was telling a friend who said take it to my husband. He sells tires and does low end maintenance like tires. I dropped it off and went across the street for lunch. I came back and he said "all fixed, no charge." What? He said he took the inside door cover off and the cable was bent by the cop. He straitened the cable. Its worked ever since. I gave him $100...he refused it several times, but finally took the money.

Similar story for a catalytic converter. Dealer was 2.5 x the local guy's fee.

The only thing I go to the dealership for is warranty work or something that the smaller guys can't handle.

You may have put a hot (stolen) cat in your car - I’d be careful with cat converters

 

[Obliviax]

You may have put a hot (stolen) cat in your car - I’d be careful with cat converters

I understand your point.

The underlying issue is that the SUV has 150,000 miles on it. The "book" converter was something like $2,500 but that was all the dealer was allowed to install. I wanted to get it fixed, pass inspection and sell it. I got something like $5,000 for it but would have had to get $6,500 if I did the dealership route. Its really a scaling issue. There is no need or necessity for putting that kind of money into a car that is that old versus one that just came off the showroom floor 18 months before. You've got to find someone you can trust as well.

 

[Still in State College]

Those services departments are commonly referred to as "Stealers." That said oe maintenance item you should always do in my mind is the timing belt/chain replacement.

I get lifetime state inspections at the dealer but everytime I go I am informed that my brake fluid or antifreeze needs flushed. I am always surprised when they try to sell tires. I don't know anybody that buys tires at a car dealer.

 

[Hotshoe]

you've been getting fleeced. sorry.

Ask around and find a local person for most issues. As an example, my wife's passenger door auto lock quit working after she looked herself out the the police "jimmied" the door to open it. The dealership told us it would cost $400 to fix. I was telling a friend who said take it to my husband. He sells tires and does low end maintenance like tires. I dropped it off and went across the street for lunch. I came back and he said "all fixed, no charge." What? He said he took the inside door cover off and the cable was bent by the cop. He straitened the cable. Its worked ever since. I gave him $100...he refused it several times, but finally took the money.

Similar story for a catalytic converter. Dealer was 2.5 x the local guy's fee.

The only thing I go to the dealership for is warranty work or something that the smaller guys can't handle.

This, after warrante, find a highly reputable local mechanic. I'm on the road daily for miles. My mechanic is one of my best friends. Good mechanics know their clients and their needs. I pull in, I get my work done. Dealerships simply don't do that.

 

[not so fast my friend]

I'm by no means a car expert, and my 2010 Highlander hybrid has been holding up well at 110K miles. But for the past year or so, I go the Toyota dealer to get regular maintenance at about 5000 mile intervals, and I feel like i'm getting scammed every time. I'm looking for an oil change and tire rotation, and it's as if the maintenance people are on commission -- you need new tires ($1000), you need a timing belt ($2500), you name it.

What do I do? Continue going back and fight like hell to not get fleeced, or somehow find an honest mechanic who only does what needs to be done and only recommends absolutely necessary repairs? Where does such a mechanic exist?

I never go to the dealer except initial covered maintenance or recall work. That said, you do have to find a local mechanic who you trust. Ask around, read reviews. For example, my 10 year old BMW had two recalls. I did think it had oil leak. They wanted to replace valve cover, oil pan gasket, and oil filter housing gasket for $4000. It has 110K and I wasn't doubting the need. But after they fixed the recall stuff, I took it to my local mechanic who I trust. He replaced all 3 for $1700. It probably took him longer to do than BMW, but I have a spare vehicle. The dealerships aren't always trying to rip you off. However, their labor rates are often much higher. They have to pay much more overhead like the "service agents", etc. My local mechanic answers the phone, takes my money, AND does the work. The dealership has three people for each of those jobs. Thus the higher rates.

 

[massimoManca II]

stealers are a joke... but in this case they’re actually trying to help you as 90k is the recommendation for Toyota timing belt changes - you’re on borrowed time IMHO... (make sure you replace the water pump at that time as well - don’t ask me how I know) .... were it me I’d also bite the bullet and have them do plugs and coil packs, cam/crank seals, as these will be issues on your driving horizon... you’d be sailing for another worry-free 100k+ miles for what amounts to a few car payments

 

[emertmakeshiteup]

If you own a driveway or garage you can do 80% or more things yourself. Now days with the www, if you aren't sure how, google it. Purchase tools a little at a time as you need for the current project. For something that requires an expensive tool, parts stores will lend it to you if you purchase the part there. The only negative I've found is I'm obsessive about not wanting anyone else touching my rigs and also obsessive about general maintenance. As an example, I've been using Mobil 1 for probably 40 years, however, the "sick" part of that is I waist $ (a lot of) changing oil and filter in my truck and our Subaru every 5K! Again, been wasting for 40 years! Since they've gone to plugs lasting 50K have not messed with, thinking hard to get out and concerned about stripping threads. Never even look to see what access would be like. Have two jacks and two jack stands so tire rotations every 7K. Obsess about that too. Corner to corner; front to back or l to r then c to c again and then, depending how you did move #2, move 4 you'll be back home. Have fun!

 

[LionDeNittany]

you've been getting fleeced. sorry.

Ask around and find a local person for most issues. As an example, my wife's passenger door auto lock quit working after she looked herself out the the police "jimmied" the door to open it. The dealership told us it would cost $400 to fix. I was telling a friend who said take it to my husband. He sells tires and does low end maintenance like tires. I dropped it off and went across the street for lunch. I came back and he said "all fixed, no charge." What? He said he took the inside door cover off and the cable was bent by the cop. He straitened the cable. Its worked ever since. I gave him $100...he refused it several times, but finally took the money.

Similar story for a catalytic converter. Dealer was 2.5 x the local guy's fee.

The only thing I go to the dealership for is warranty work or something that the smaller guys can't handle.

Dealerships do not repair they generally replace.

So if the power lock isn't working they will quote you the cost to replace the mechanism without even looking.

Most repairs like this can be done with youtube and a $30 set of tools.

LdN

 

[RockyMtnLion]

I think the hybrid may change the equation for you. I had a Camry hybrid on lease and turned it in very satisfied, however the cost of a major rebuild on the engine isn’t factored in for the batteries. That is an uncertainty that limited my willingness to maximize the miles.

 

[Hotshoe]

I think I'll just lay this out there regarding kids. My belief, if you're not teaching your kids regarding cars and repairs at home, you're doing a huge disservice to them. It's the best time with your kids doing maintenance or rebuilding. I bought my son a Jeep Wrangler a year and a half ago. 1997. There is literally nothing better than doing this with your kids. We, as a society, have lost this. It's sad. The smiles from your kid is worth millions.

 

[cavic]

I'm by no means a car expert, and my 2010 Highlander hybrid has been holding up well at 110K miles. But for the past year or so, I go the Toyota dealer to get regular maintenance at about 5000 mile intervals, and I feel like i'm getting scammed every time. I'm looking for an oil change and tire rotation, and it's as if the maintenance people are on commission -- you need new tires ($1000), you need a timing belt ($2500), you name it.

What do I do? Continue going back and fight like hell to not get fleeced, or somehow find an honest mechanic who only does what needs to be done and only recommends absolutely necessary repairs? Where does such a mechanic exist?

I didn't bother to Google it , but do you know for sure that you even have a timing belt? My wife has the '10 Rav4, and it has a timing chain.

Seems such an obvious thing that I wouldn't think they'd try to scam you there. But then again, they are a car dealership ....

 

[Art]

I'm by no means a car expert, and my 2010 Highlander hybrid has been holding up well at 110K miles. But for the past year or so, I go the Toyota dealer to get regular maintenance at about 5000 mile intervals, and I feel like i'm getting scammed every time. I'm looking for an oil change and tire rotation, and it's as if the maintenance people are on commission -- you need new tires ($1000), you need a timing belt ($2500), you name it.

What do I do? Continue going back and fight like hell to not get fleeced, or somehow find an honest mechanic who only does what needs to be done and only recommends absolutely necessary repairs? Where does such a mechanic exist?

stealers are a joke... but in this case they’re actually trying to help you as 90k is the recommendation for Toyota timing belt changes - you’re on borrowed time IMHO... (make sure you replace the water pump at that time as well - don’t ask me how I know) .... were it me I’d also bite the bullet and have them do plugs and coil packs, cam/crank seals, as these will be issues on your driving horizon... you’d be sailing for another worry-free 100k+ miles for what amounts to a few car payments

What mMII wrote is good advice. At 110Kmiles your vehicle has reached a stage where a number of parts should be replaced and/or service performed to keep it running without a major breakdown. You might have gotten more mileage out of the timing belt, but you not want to deal with the agony and expense of it snapping while you're driving around. That said, $2,500 seems very expensive, but I'm not familiar with your vehicle, and I'd expect that amount would include replacement of the water pump, too (the biggest part of the cost by a longshot is labor and once they've got everything apart, the water pump is easily accessible so might as well just do it).

Tire replacement is based on wear and tear, so you should be able to see whether they need to be replaced.

I do a lot of the routine maintenance on my vehicles. For things that are beyond my ability or patience, I have an independent mechanic who I've been using for years. He's probably not much cheaper than the dealer service department, but I'm confident he'll do the job right. A lot of dealer techs I've talked to know less than me.

 

[Art]

Here's an estimate for your timing belt replacement.
https://repairpal.com/estimator/toyota/highlander/timing-belt-replacement-cost
Looks like they think it should be under $800. I checked and timing belts for your vehicle are typically kitted with a water pump and all associated pulleys seals etc. In addition, you should replace every wearable part that the mechanic can get to with little effort.

Agree with that article on the water pump, but the additional cost is way too high, $200-300 max. Idler pulley is a maybe, s.b. no more than $100-150. Rest is ridiculous.

 

[creamery]

I have a 2014 Highlander - great car and I love driving it.

I found a local guy who works on foreign cars ONLY. I believe that is the trick because that is the advantage of going to the Toyota dealer - those guys work on Toyota's every day so they know them inside and out. I pay a little less going to this guy and most importantly, as others have said, I trust him. But I wouldn't take my Toyota or Honda to the regular guy down the street unless they have experience with these cars.

Secondly, when I've gone to the dealer (we have a lot of Hondas), I don't always do what they recommend unless it's a critical issue - or they'll get you every time for something. I'll ask them, 'does this have to be done now, can it wait until the next oil change?' And, then last, there are certain repairs that I will shop around for - like tires. Some money can be saved there - I just got Continentals for @$800 installed with an alignment.

 

[Art]

I have a 2014 Highlander - great car and I love driving it.

I found a local guy who works on foreign cars ONLY. I believe that is the trick because that is the advantage of going to the Toyota dealer - those guys work on Toyota's every day so they know them inside and out. I pay a little less going to this guy and most importantly, as others have said, I trust him. But I wouldn't take my Toyota or Honda to the regular guy down the street unless they have experience with these cars.

Secondly, when I've gone to the dealer (we have a lot of Hondas), I don't always do what they recommend unless it's a critical issue - or they'll get you every time for something. I'll ask them, 'does this have to be done now, can it wait until the next oil change?' And, then last, there are certain repairs that I will shop around for - like tires. Some money can be saved there - I just got Continentals for @$800 installed with an alignment.

Might agree with you on the expertise of dealer techs, but I've found that it's a crap shoot. The guys who've been working on a particular make for years know their stuff. Others, not so much.

On anything complicated, they've go to go to the manuals. A good independent mechanic will have access to these on-line. Experience is a big help in comprehension.

 

[YeOldeCup]

I have a 2010 Highlander Limited that I turned over to my eldest in 2015, now at 175K miles. I enjoy doing most of the routine work needed (oil/filter changes, air filters, hoses, belts, tire rotation, etc.), did the O2 sensors last summer, and just replaced the transmission fluid and filter. I've also done the brakes and rotors when needed. It's still a great ride and pretty good on gas (lost 2MPG since it was new). Both daughters know how to check/top off their oil/water/tire pressure, and use a portable jump-starter on a dead battery. I walked one through changing a halogen headlamp bulb over the phone.

As other's have posted, I only return to the dealer when recalls are issued and they do the work for free. Of course they always recommend a dozen or so other services when I pick up the vehicle - I just smile and say thanks.

 

[Air Force 1]

My 07 civic has over 400,000 miles no problems I change the oil and transmission fluids as recommended is a must! Just changed my serpentine belt.

 

[Art]

it's the "Churn". It's a profit center.

You may want to buy an OBD2 scanner.

View embedded media

It might give you some piece of mind.

I like to know exactly what is wrong with my cars and appliances before I walk into a repair shop or dealership. It's based on several "hosings" when I couldn't afford anything.

Or you can have your service tech show you the read out on his. A good OBD2 scanner ain't cheap and they don't exactly tell you what needs to be replaced and how much it will cost.

 

[Fayette_LION]

I'm by no means a car expert, and my 2010 Highlander hybrid has been holding up well at 110K miles. But for the past year or so, I go the Toyota dealer to get regular maintenance at about 5000 mile intervals, and I feel like i'm getting scammed every time. I'm looking for an oil change and tire rotation, and it's as if the maintenance people are on commission -- you need new tires ($1000), you need a timing belt ($2500), you name it.

What do I do? Continue going back and fight like hell to not get fleeced, or somehow find an honest mechanic who only does what needs to be done and only recommends absolutely necessary repairs? Where does such a mechanic exist?

Find a good local mechanic, you're getting ripped off.

 

[Langmuir]

I once almost got kicked out of a Toyota dealership because they kept claiming their service schedule was recommended by the manufacturer and it was much different than what was in the manual. They did not like it when I asked to see the documentation from Toyota that showed a different service schedule from the manual.

We used to take my wife's car to a Volvo dealership and everytime we went, it needed new brakes and rotors. Everytime. We changed to another dealership, 30 miles away and suddently did not need new brakes and rotors so much.

I mostly use a good local mechanic. It is hard to find one that is both competent and honest. If you find one stick with him.

 

[Waste Management Consultant]

I think I'll just lay this out there regarding kids. My belief, if you're not teaching your kids regarding cars and repairs at home, you're doing a huge disservice to them. It's the best time with your kids doing maintenance or rebuilding. I bought my son a Jeep Wrangler a year and a half ago. 1997. There is literally nothing better than doing this with your kids. We, as a society, have lost this. It's sad. The smiles from your kid is worth millions.

I learned from my dad and neighbor’s dad growing up they were mechanics in the coal mine. A $500 Ford Escort w/86k lasted for years, got it to over 200k. My dad took me to sears got a metal craftsman tool box, screwdrivers, hammer, smaller sockets, all my snap-on crescent wrenches, pliers and larger sockets were “donations” from the coal company. Best tools I’ve ever owned. Thanks Dad. Carrying on the tradition with my boys.

 

[nittanyfan333]

Wife has a highlander and we take it to the stealership for mx. one thing I learned is that when they tell you things you “need” to replace, they’re really telling you things that the manufacturer SUGGEST you replace based on mileage.

 

[massimoManca II]

I didn't bother to Google it , but do you know for sure that you even have a timing belt? My wife has the '10 Rav4, and it has a timing chain.

Seems such an obvious thing that I wouldn't think they'd try to scam you there. But then again, they are a car dealership ....

Toyota Highlander 4cyl & V6 = chain
Toyota Highlander Hybrid = belt

 

[massimoManca II]

Wife has a highlander and we take it to the stealership for mx. one thing I learned is that when they tell you things you “need” to replace, they’re really telling you things that the manufacturer SUGGEST you replace based on mileage.

Dude... timing belts aren’t anything to fvck with... particularly on an interference engine like the 3MZ-FE in the Highlander hybrid... timing belt fails and that entire engine is DU$T

 

[91Joe95]

If you own a driveway or garage you can do 80% or more things yourself. Now days with the www, if you aren't sure how, google it. Purchase tools a little at a time as you need for the current project. For something that requires an expensive tool, parts stores will lend it to you if you purchase the part there. The only negative I've found is I'm obsessive about not wanting anyone else touching my rigs and also obsessive about general maintenance. As an example, I've been using Mobil 1 for probably 40 years, however, the "sick" part of that is I waist $ (a lot of) changing oil and filter in my truck and our Subaru every 5K! Again, been wasting for 40 years! Since they've gone to plugs lasting 50K have not messed with, thinking hard to get out and concerned about stripping threads. Never even look to see what access would be like. Have two jacks and two jack stands so tire rotations every 7K. Obsess about that too. Corner to corner; front to back or l to r then c to c again and then, depending how you did move #2, move 4 you'll be back home. Have fun!

Actually the tire manufacturers tell you not to rotate side to side anymore, only front to back. Something about the strains on the steel belts.

I have also found over the years that rotating tires is a big waste of money. On a front wheel drive vehicle your rear tires hardly ever wear out since they essentially just roll and stop, while the front wheels get the power, weight of the engine, and hence more wear. The front tires may last 40k miles instead of 50k, but the economics are still in your favor since you're only ever buying two tires at a time instead of four (the economics really tilt in your favor if you pay to rotate, but you don't). When I buy tires I move the back to the front, and put the two new in the back. For safety reasons, the most grippy tires should always be in the back, for handling they go up front. I choose safety. Now, if you have irregular wear patterns, you probably have a problem with alignment or inflation, and rotating won't fix that. I know you won't do the no rotation, but you should stop the side to side. If you talk to any competent tire guy they will tell you the same about stopping the side to side.

 

[nittanyfan333]

Dude... timing belts aren’t anything to fvck with... particularly on an interference engine like the 3MZ-FE in the Highlander hybrid... timing belt fails and that entire engine is DU$T

woah there guy... I didn’t say to ignore what they say, especially with a timing belt. That said, and what I should have clarified, is there’s nothing wrong with getting a second opinion with your car, because dealership Service sections are notorious for taking a suggested mileage based MX issue and making it sound like it’s needed. At least down here in the greater Fayetteville NC area they are. Could also be that it’s a military town so anything vehicle related is crazy expensive. But I’ve had arguments with the service desk folks when they wanted to charge us over 100$ to replace the cabin air filter, and they told us that at 50k miles, we needed to have a complete tranny fluid drain, clean and refill. Nah brah..... we’re good, then came “we’ll ok, it’s your car but the manufacturer suggest it for a reason blah blah blah”. Super high pressure in my experience. Same thing with my 2018 ram 1500 at the dodge dealer and then wanting to recharge my A/C system to “get it ready for the summer”. Yeah.... that CLOSED SYSTEM A/C system..... on a 2018.....

 

[massimoManca II]

Actually the tire manufacturers tell you not to rotate side to side anymore, only front to back. Something about the strains on the steel belts.

I have also found over the years that rotating tires is a big waste of money. On a front wheel drive vehicle your rear tires hardly ever wear out since they essentially just roll and stop, while the front wheels get the power, weight of the engine, and hence more wear. The front tires may last 40k miles instead of 50k, but the economics are still in your favor since you're only ever buying two tires at a time instead of four (the economics really tilt in your favor if you pay to rotate, but you don't). When I buy tires I move the back to the front, and put the two new in the back. For safety reasons, the most grippy tires should always be in the back, for handling they go up front. I choose safety. Now, if you have irregular wear patterns, you probably have a problem with alignment or inflation, and rotating won't fix that. I know you won't do the no rotation, but you should stop the side to side. If you talk to any competent tire guy they will tell you the same about stopping the side to side.

rotate as recommended and keep tire wear as even as possible , front and rear...

i used to cheap out and buy only two tires when I was in high school when four tires would siphon off my beer and Drakkar budget

My Subaru owners anual still calls for the cross-over rotation... to my knowledge, only time one would NOT want to switch sides is when you’re on directional tires ... most common all-seasons are not directional

 

[massimoManca II]

woah there guy... I didn’t say to ignore what they say, especially with a timing belt. That said, and what I should have clarified, is there’s nothing wrong with getting a second opinion with your car, because dealership Service sections are notorious for taking a suggested mileage based MX issue and making it sound like it’s needed. At least down here in the greater Fayetteville NC area they are. Could also be that it’s a military town so anything vehicle related is crazy expensive. But I’ve had arguments with the service desk folks when they wanted to charge us over 100$ to replace the cabin air filter, and they told us that at 50k miles, we needed to have a complete tranny fluid drain, clean and refill. Nah brah..... we’re good, then came “we’ll ok, it’s your car but the manufacturer suggest it for a reason blah blah blah”. Super high pressure in my experience. Same thing with my 2018 ram 1500 at the dodge dealer and then wanting to recharge my A/C system to “get it ready for the summer”. Yeah.... that CLOSED SYSTEM A/C system..... on a 2018.....

you implied it...

Timing belts are not in the same league as a cabin air filter... if the manufacturer calls for timing belt replacement at 90k - and you decide it’s wiser to solicit a second opinion - what type of mechanic is gonna tell you to blow timing belt service off?

not sure what you’re driving - but if you happen to have a DSG - i would not defer on the factory recommended the tranny service or deviate from the intervals ...

the “seasonal” A/C service solicitation is worthy of consumer scorn ... i would have pepper-sprayed the service agent

 

[WDLion]

Actually the tire manufacturers tell you not to rotate side to side anymore, only front to back. Something about the strains on the steel belts.

I have also found over the years that rotating tires is a big waste of money. On a front wheel drive vehicle your rear tires hardly ever wear out since they essentially just roll and stop, while the front wheels get the power, weight of the engine, and hence more wear. The front tires may last 40k miles instead of 50k, but the economics are still in your favor since you're only ever buying two tires at a time instead of four (the economics really tilt in your favor if you pay to rotate, but you don't). When I buy tires I move the back to the front, and put the two new in the back. For safety reasons, the most grippy tires should always be in the back, for handling they go up front. I choose safety. Now, if you have irregular wear patterns, you probably have a problem with alignment or inflation, and rotating won't fix that. I know you won't do the no rotation, but you should stop the side to side. If you talk to any competent tire guy they will tell you the same about stopping the side to side.

Two tires go straight front to back or visa versa and the other two crisscross. You do it the same every time. If you do it at regular intervals all four tires receive the same mileage at all four positions.

 

[Air Force 1]

I'm by no means a car expert, and my 2010 Highlander hybrid has been holding up well at 110K miles. But for the past year or so, I go the Toyota dealer to get regular maintenance at about 5000 mile intervals, and I feel like i'm getting scammed every time. I'm looking for an oil change and tire rotation, and it's as if the maintenance people are on commission -- you need new tires ($1000), you need a timing belt ($2500), you name it.

What do I do? Continue going back and fight like hell to not get fleeced, or somehow find an honest mechanic who only does what needs to be done and only recommends absolutely necessary repairs? Where does such a mechanic exist?

Learn to do it yourself. Gives you a reason to be left alone in the garage with a few beers for awhile.

 

[BW Lion]

Two tires go straight front to back or visa versa and the other two crisscross. You do it the same every time. If you do it at regular intervals all four tires receive the same mileage at all four positions.

What is your advice if someone owns a vehicle with directional tires and different front vs. rear wheel diameter dimensions?

 

[Air Force 1]

What is your advice if someone owns a vehicle with directional tires and different front vs. rear wheel diameter dimensions?

Sell it and Buy a 4x4 truck!

 

[WDLion]

What is your advice if someone owns a vehicle with directional tires and different front vs. rear wheel diameter dimensions?

That's their problem.

 

[massimoManca II]

What is your advice if someone owns a vehicle with directional tires and different front vs. rear wheel diameter dimensions?

My advice would be to have them ditch their MembersOnly jacket

Staggered wheels are for the professionals, not poseurs

 

[emertmakeshiteup]

Actually the tire manufacturers tell you not to rotate side to side anymore, only front to back. Something about the strains on the steel belts.

I have also found over the years that rotating tires is a big waste of money. On a front wheel drive vehicle your rear tires hardly ever wear out since they essentially just roll and stop, while the front wheels get the power, weight of the engine, and hence more wear. The front tires may last 40k miles instead of 50k, but the economics are still in your favor since you're only ever buying two tires at a time instead of four (the economics really tilt in your favor if you pay to rotate, but you don't). When I buy tires I move the back to the front, and put the two new in the back. For safety reasons, the most grippy tires should always be in the back, for handling they go up front. I choose safety. Now, if you have irregular wear patterns, you probably have a problem with alignment or inflation, and rotating won't fix that. I know you won't do the no rotation, but you should stop the side to side. If you talk to any competent tire guy they will tell you the same about stopping the side to side.

"On a front wheel drive vehicle your rear tires hardly ever wear" Your point actually illustrates why it is not a waste of time for me, no $ involved!