Anyone heard a response on why or was this Franklin's once a game folley of overcoaching?
Failed 2 point conversion
- Thread starter Fayette_LION
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Just a typical Big Game James coaching decision. Fortunately it didn’t affect the outcome this time. But I had visions of a one point loss decided by not kicking the extra point at the time.
Well I didn’t like the call but he is far from the only coach who does this.
I’d rather him try it on the first touchdown where you know how to play the rest of the game because of it than doing it late.
I recall that strategy of going for 2 on the 1st TD not working out for the Steelers vs Cowboys in 2016.
The Steelers chased those missed points all game. And eventually lost.
Also, what kind of confidence does it convey to tour new kicker that the 1st opportunity for him to perform that you opt and fail a 2 pt. conversion attempt?
Memories of the misguided attempt of a 2 pt. conversion at the end of the half against OSU last season are still way too fresh in mind.
I don't understand the risk reward component of making that decision at that point of time in the game.
I was thrilled with seeing it. First game of the year, on the road, and playing aggressive, not to lose. I give WVa. credit for covering it, however, you get that 8 point lead. All the Monday morning QB's come out when things like this don't work but I wonder how many "what a great call" would be posted if it was successful. Bottom line for me is game one, first score, on the road, play to win, not to lose. Loved it.
And how about the confidence it gives the offense if successful or how deflating to the defense that it says "we are coming into your house after the first score and going for two"
If anyone asked him, I know the answer
JF: "the analytics say..."
I like everything about JF except his actual coaching.. especially in game. Sometimes it seems like he could be replaced by an intern and a laminated analytics sheet on gameday. AI could put him out of a job if he is relying on computer models for his decision making.
PSU FB org:
Head coach: IBM Watson
Head recruiter/Public relations: JF
Does the offense derive any confidence from scoring a TD? Can your opponent quell your momentum by denying the 2 pt. conversion?
If you go for 2 at that stage of the gamer, you better make it, or that can erode the momentum gained by scoring a TD. See OSU last year.....
Beating the spread, upset alert and a worthy highly touted opponent in a hostile atmosphere....with 3 new coordinators is just another "meaningless game"....and another opportunity for the real football coaches to critique hapless, hopeless Franklin. We deserve better!
It’s not Monday Morning Quarterbacking when you say while they are huddling for the conversion kick the damn PAT.
You are over analyzing this from a kicking standpoint. Florida State ran a 2 pt play after their first touchdown week 0. Their kicker still made 2 50+ yards FGs in the game. Oregon used to go for 2 quite a bit.
It's just a strategy. Good or bad, like it or dislike it, if it hurts your kickers confidence then you probably have bigger problems with your kicking game.
Our kicker went on to subsequently make 4 XPs after this.
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If Beau had thrown the ball when the receiver was open, and not 2 seconds later, no one would be bitching. It usually comes down to execution.
Play to win? If JF thinks we needed to chase pts that early by going for 2, then this team isn't all that good. It is idiotic to do it that early, whether u convert or not. JF routinely does this and it hardly ever works. Some programs do it often and it is part of their DNA....it isn't for ours. I was thrilled with our willingness to throw the ball deeper than last year and be more aggressive. But, like last seasons 2 pt attempt at OSU...this was dumb.
It’s airways a great call when it works. Coached are always idiots when it doesn’t.
Multiple things can be true...still wasn't smart even if we made it. Logically, it didn't make sense. The momentum halts and helps WVU knowing they can win with a TD.
So this isn't true. A lot of people don't like going for 2 early in games regardless of the outcome. We convert that and I'm still complaining about the call.
Any other mindless criticism you have about Franklin you wish to share? I mean geez, I would have kicked the PAT myself but claiming that Franklin was chasing 2 points after the first TD because he didn’t think his team is any good makes my top 5 asinine comments lists easily.
It's sarcasm...relax. I threw it out there because coming up with a reason was hard to do.
Exactly. The odds actually argue going for 2 (for most teams - 2PT Conversion Rate for all teams across time is greater than 50%, but that does not mean that all teams are equally effective in short-yardage situations). You could argue that his not going for 2 the entire game was the poor decision - if you're going to play the averages, you have to do it every single time, switching between the X-PT and 2PT kills the averages and will result in you averaging >1 point.
More on this topic.... the Expected Value (i.e., Conversion Value x Conversion Rate) of 2-PT Conversion is higher (X-Point Conversion Rate is thought to be ~95%, while 2PT Conversion Rate somewhere in low-to-mid 50s). It is the Expected Value that matters.
There's nothing better than replacing data and logic with old man hunches and "that's the way we always do things, 'round here" thinking.
It was a classic case of a coach thinking he’s smarter than the game. Utterly stupid move and I love CJF.
I'd want to get the kicker reps if that's the case
Perhaps.
FTR, FSU's kicker is a senior who made 19-21 FGA in 2023 and a multi year stater.
Sahaydak missed 2 FG's against WVU last year which led to him losing his job as placekicker for the remainder of the season.
I'm a basketball guy and I kind of equate free throw shooting with field goal kicking.
And I believe that ALOT of the problems that people have with being proficient in both of these tasks is mental and confidence related.
As a player, I want my coach to show confidence in me by allowing me to do my job when the 1st opportunity arose.
Thinking that this was the reason for him missing another relatively short and easy FG late in the game is certainly not definitive. But it is plausible.
Whatever the reason, hopefully we get the FG kicking issues resolved and yesterday's missed FG was just an anomaly.
This is probably mathematically correct- as was the fad years ago when the small college coach in Minnesota always went on 4th down. Our high school coach followed the trend for 2 years...enough to get fired. Thankfully that concept is in the past.
I'm with the poster who almost fainted...
I'll be honest--if his confidence was thrown off because Franklin went for 2 early then I don't want him as the kicker.
All the more reason to get your kicker reps. If EPs are questionable, that is a problem.
Considering he came out and made 4 other XPs before the missed FG, I would say it had nothing to do with his kicker and everything to do with wanting a 2 pt play early.
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