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Famed Attorney Writes Op-ed Urging Second Look at Sandusky Case!

I believe Sandusky's window to appeal closes at end of business TOMORROW**

Sorry, no direct link/source avail right now. Think I saw it in @JMMYW's twitter feed the other day.

This post was edited on 4/1 4:47 PM by ChiTownLion
 
You don't know that...

a jury doesn't have an option to vote innocent. It's guilty or not guilty. Unless you polled the jury following a not guilty verdict, you wouldn't know whether their not guilty means that the state didn't prove its case or whether they believe the guy is innocent.
 
Re: All this talk of Sandusky being railroaded does a real disservice


Originally posted by CDW3333:
to the jury. They heard all the evidence, they were in a position to judge the credibility of the witnesses, they listened to the legal arguments, and they found, unanimously and beyond a reasonable doubt, that Sandusky was guilty on 45 charges.

The Sandusky acolytes are essentially claiming that the jury screwed up (or maybe they were in it too!).

And Sandusky got a better defense than about 99% of the criminal defendants get in this country. The 2nd Mile's insurance company alone paid $500,000 in defense fees and costs. Of course that pales in comparison with what's being spent on the defenses of Curley, Schultz, and Spanier but the defense costs in that case have gone beyond reason.
I think that Sandusky is guilty, but I disagree with what you are saying here.

The jury made a decision based on the evidence presented to it. But I do not think that the judge handled this case properly. Sandusky was effectively on trial for his life. There is no way that the judge should have allowed this case to proceed at the pace that it did. I will not be the least bit surprised if he eventually gets a new trial. That's not the jury's fault -- it's the judge's.
 
Re: This is a disturbing thread

Originally posted by WPB_lion:

Here is a citation for the lower number which is .027% (or 99.973% being properly convicted):
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/26/opinion/26marquis.html?_r=1

It is far from an exact science and the percentage will change depending on who you speak to as it is inherently speculative. I have seen arguments that this number is as great as 4% (which is small but not miniscule) but that is totally collateral to the point I was trying to make in my post which is:
Far from an exact science is an understatement. The guy does a back of the envelope calculation in an opinion piece, and you're citing it as a statistic as if it was some kind of fact. I suppose the denominator lumps murders, rapes, etc in with traffic citations too huh?
 
Re: the prosecuters had more porn on their computers ....


Originally posted by mn78psu83:

A "serial pedophile" with no child pornography on his computer? Sorry, something doesn't add up here...

It is a curious missing piece of evidence. I could be wrong without the statistical data to back it up, but he would seem to be an outlier on that count.
Keep in mind that Tom Corbett gave Jerry Sandusky and The Second Mile 2.5 YEARS before issuing the search warrants. For example, we already know TSM "lost"/destroyed 2-3 years of records from before and after the 2001 incident. #ShredBabyShred

But, Ephrata does make a good point about the smut-encrusted hard drives belonging to Frank Fina and the OAG gang. Comes down to criminals prosecuting criminals.
This post was edited on 4/1 4:13 PM by ChiTownLion
 
Looks like it will be filed under seal

due to GJ secrecy concerns
 
With all due respect.....BALONEY!


And you either know better....or you are the dumbest lawyer on two legs.

It is not a "disservice to the jury" to be concerned that the state/prosecution behaved very badly in the way the case was presented to that jury.

Again, I am confident you know better.....but just can't help but to try to use whatever disingenuous means necessary to frame your perspective.


th
 
Re: I believe Sandusky's window to appeal closes at end of business TOMORROW**

Yes, his PCRA appeal is due tomorrow.

------------ a timeline of filings, appeals, articles, etc.:

6/5/2012 Amendola made sealed motion to withdraw from case. It was later unsealed.
http://co.centre.pa.us/centreco/media/upload/SANDUSKY%2C%20GERALD%20060512%20Motion%20To%20Withdraw%20Before%20JS.pdf

6/11/2012 First day of trial

1/10/2013 Evidentiary Hearing scheduled

1/30/2013 Appeal Rejected, Commonwealth Court, Cleland
http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2013/01/jerry_sandusky_appeal_is_denie.html

http://co.centre.pa.us/centreco/media/upload/SANDUSKY%20OPINION%20ADDRESSING%20THE%20DEFENDANTS%20POST%20SENTENCE%20MOTIONS.pdf

2/21/2013 Notice of Appeal

10/2/2013 Appeal Rejected, Superior Court
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/02/jerry-sandusky-appeal-denied_n_4031099.html

http://www.pacourts.us/assets/files/setting-3425/file-3090.pdf?cb=9a18e6

4/2/2014 Appeal Rejected, Supreme Court
http://www.statecollege.com/news/local-news/state-supreme-court-turns-down-jerry-sandusky-appeal,1458597/

The Pennsylvania Supreme Court slaps down an appeal from convicted child sex abuser Jerry Sandusky.
In a one sentence decision released Wednesday, the court says, "AND NOW, this 2nd day of April, 2014, the Petition for Allowance of Appeal is DENIED."
Sandusky's attorney took the case to the supreme court last October after an earlier appeal to the superior court was also denied.

http://www.collegian.psu.edu/news/crime_courts/article_7eca580c-bac1-11e3-a4f6-0017a43b2370.html

State College Attorney Matt McClenahen said the next step after the appeal denial is to file a post-conviction relief act and argue ineffective council at trial.
McClenahen said when appellate rights are exhausted, PCRAs are typically filed. While most often ineffective council is argued, a person can also argue other issues, such as later discovered evidence or showing the commonwealth held evidence back, he said.
If Sandusky wins the post-conviction relief act, he will get a new trial, but McClenahen said they are rarely granted.
"It is very, very difficult to win a PCRA," he said.
McClenahen said the evidence at trial was so overwhelming, he's not sure any lawyer could have won.
"It's the kind of case that the only way a defense lawyer … could win was if the prosecutors threw the case," he said.

6/30/2014 New Sandusky Lawyer plans New Appeal
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/06/30/jerry-sandusky-new-lawyer_n_5545491.html

Al Lindsay, who leads the Pittsburgh area firm of Lindsay Law Firm, said he plans to file the appeal in the same court in Bellefonte, Pennsylvania, where Sandusky, now 70, was sentenced in 2012 to 30 to 60 years in prison.

Lindsay would not go into detail about the grounds for a new appeal, although legal experts said that under the Pennsylvania Post-Conviction Relief Act, a claim of ineffective legal counsel is one of the few roads open to Sandusky. Nor would he say how he was retained.

"It's a long story," Lindsay said. "I got a call."

The deadline for filing the appeal is a year from April 2, the date on which the Pennsylvania Supreme Court shut down the former coach's original round of appeals. His lawyer at the time, Norris Gelman, had argued that the state's case rested on the credibility of the victims and since some of the complaints dated back as long as 16 years, that should have warranted an instruction to the jury on the failure to make a prompt report of sexual abuse.

8/5/2014 New Sandusky Lawyer plans to appeal
http://www.centredaily.com/2014/08/05/4293094/new-sandusky-lawyer-plans-to-appeal.html

Lindsay, an attorney from Butler, previously told the Centre Daily Times he is representing Sandusky in a Post-Conviction Relief Act appeal.
The act gives people who have been convicted of a crime - and who have exhausted other opportunities for appeal - another chance to have their cases heard.

Lindsay didn't respond when asked for comment Tuesday about the case.

It's not clear on what grounds Sandusky would make the PCRA appeal, which is limited to certain arguments.

In a previous appeal to the state Superior Court, Sandusky's then-lawyer, Norris Gelman, argued that trial defense attorneys were rushed and couldn't properly prepare and that Cleland was wrong on several matters during the proceedings.

The Superior Court shot down Sandusky's appeal, and the state Supreme Court later declined to hear the case.


Read more here: http://www.centredaily.com/2014/08/05/4293094/new-sandusky-lawyer-plans-to-appeal.html#storylink=cpy
--------------------
--------------------


Amendola - Crazy like a fox?

12/10/2011 http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2011/12/jerry_sanduskys_lawyer_cuts_un.html

"I do have a strategy. There is a method to my madness," Amendola, 63, told The Associated Press. "This has been a well-thought-out strategy."

But legal experts wonder if Amendola, a small-town solo practitioner working in the glare of the national spotlight, is at loose ends - or crazy like a fox.

-----
9/5/2012 - plan to claim he's ineffective counsel
http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2012/09/post_409.html

Calling himself ineffective?￾

By the end of the year, Amendola will have stepped aside from the Sandusky case.

His plan is to sacrifice his ego, take the stand and declare himself an ineffective attorney in an attempt to help his client get a new trial.

It's a tactic he has used before. A few years ago, after losing a rape case, he hired a Philadelphia attorney to handle the appeal, took the stand and called himself incompetent to help the 20-something college student who had been convicted.
 
GJ are secrect?? In the Sandusky case?? Who knew???

fight be the first time!!
 
Re: GJ are secrect?? In the Sandusky case?? Who knew???


Originally posted by sluggo72:
fight be the first time!!
Hah..I know right??

If GJ testimony is supposed to always be secret, then why does LE never go after the unnamed "leaks" to the press (unless you're an enemy of Frank Fina's of course then they're all over you)? The press tries to stand behind some PA law that allows them to apparently break the law to avoid giving up a source.

Also why is the state allowed to publicly release a GJP that supposedly is based on GJ testimony, but they don't provide the "secret" GJ testimony to back up the presentment??

GJP's can basically smear completely tangential, non involved people and there's nothing they can really do about it, and also taint the jury pool against the person the GJP is written about if it becomes public.

GJP aren't required to be 100% accurate to the testimony and aren't considered fact, only what the Prosecutor thinks they can prove beyond a reasonable doubt.

Because of this, IMO, ALL GJP's should be sealed from the public, the damage a public GJP can cause is why most states and the federal govt doesn't use GJP's anymore.
 
Re: This is a disturbing thread

Originally posted by jjsocrates:

Originally posted by WPB_lion:

Here is a citation for the lower number which is .027% (or 99.973% being properly convicted):
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/26/opinion/26marquis.html?_r=1

It is far from an exact science and the percentage will change depending on who you speak to as it is inherently speculative. I have seen arguments that this number is as great as 4% (which is small but not miniscule) but that is totally collateral to the point I was trying to make in my post which is:
Far from an exact science is an understatement. The guy does a back of the envelope calculation in an opinion piece, and you're citing it as a statistic as if it was some kind of fact. I suppose the denominator lumps murders, rapes, etc in with traffic citations too huh?
I am not sure exactly what point you are trying to make. If you are trying to get me to concede that there is no exact science to calculating the number of innocent people in jail, the concession has already been made. However, by any estimation, it is a low percentage. I would also venture to guess that almost all of the wrongfully convicted prisoners who have later been exonerated did not have the resources and / or quality attorneys available to them at their original trial that Jerry Sandusky had.
 
Re: the prosecuters had more porn on their computers ....

Sure there is. Countless victims and he is sitting in prison. Those leading this charge for Jerry are a big odd as there has been nothing hard that has come out that has vindicated this man...nothing.
 
Re: Do you think that.....

Convicted on 40 or so counts. Don't be so naive and unless you have real proof he didn't do it, you're pissing into the wind.
 
Re: I guess if Matt Sandusky says Jerry is guilty...

Yeah, it was just Matt and no other victims. You guys need a video of this apparently, but the 40 or so convictions > than anything anyone has brought to light. It's that simple. Jerry Sandusky is a serial pedophile and will die in prison.
 
Re: well done...

Because he is a sick SOB and pedophiles aren't exactly the honest type. I guess Clemente got it all wrong in his report. It cuts both ways as people were touting that report as the reason Joe was fooled, but now everyone was fooled by all of his victims. What a load of BS people are trying to pass around here with ZERO proof JS is innocent in any way shape or form. Shooting holes in the victims and witnesses is what every defense does, but it doesn't make them all liars.
 
Jim Clemente seemed convinced Jerry was in the top 1% of

nice guy predators. He only does this for a living and has for years after being a victim. You guys have lost it with the quest to clear Joe's name when you took an awful turn somewhere that pointed down a path that is saying JS is somehow innocent. It sucks Joe's name was ruined over this sick SOB, but this stance of Jerry is innocent is simply awful. No real proof of his innocence, tons of victims, and 45 convictions. Yeah, pretty hard to put that on a scale and weigh it,,,isn't it?

This post was edited on 4/1 5:32 PM by LaJolla Lion
 
Re: This is a disturbing thread

I would like to see a new trial. I can't help but wonder what effect testimony from Curley and Shultz might have had. It troubles me that PSP were exposed lying and not only did it not result in a mistrial, but I have not heard anything about charges against them. Since PSP were willing to mislead potential victims, as proven by the tape, how can we assume that the others were not similarly swayed along with promises of riches?
The crying janitor "excited utterence" hearsay exception seems shaky to say the least. With 50+ credible victims itching to testify, why even go there?
The alleged incidents that led to the destruction of PSU could not produce a victim? I always thought we lived in a country that valued the right to the assumption of innocence. I am not proclaiming Sandusky's innocence. I just don't think he got a fair trial.
 
Re: All this talk of Sandusky being railroaded does a real disservice


Originally posted by Aoshiro:

Originally posted by CDW3333:
to the jury. They heard all the evidence, they were in a position to judge the credibility of the witnesses, they listened to the legal arguments, and they found, unanimously and beyond a reasonable doubt, that Sandusky was guilty on 45 charges.

The Sandusky acolytes are essentially claiming that the jury screwed up (or maybe they were in it too!).

And Sandusky got a better defense than about 99% of the criminal defendants get in this country. The 2nd Mile's insurance company alone paid $500,000 in defense fees and costs. Of course that pales in comparison with what's being spent on the defenses of Curley, Schultz, and Spanier but the defense costs in that case have gone beyond reason.
I think that Sandusky is guilty, but I disagree with what you are saying here.

The jury made a decision based on the evidence presented to it. But I do not think that the judge handled this case properly. Sandusky was effectively on trial for his life. There is no way that the judge should have allowed this case to proceed at the pace that it did. I will not be the least bit surprised if he eventually gets a new trial. That's not the jury's fault -- it's the judge's.
Amendola said he wouldn't have done anything differently if he'd had more time.

Sandusky got a fair trial.
 
Did Clemente refute Jerry's convictions when he examined

the situation? No, he labeled him in the top 1% of nice guy predators which he is. Playing the victim for this guy or raising the flag of injustice for Jerry is an absolute joke to me. I have yet to hear anyone even make a coherent case as to why Jerry is innocent other than attacking every witness or victim. Class defense move, but it doesn't convince me Jerry is somehow innocent. Do me a favor and let me know when solid proof comes out as I stopped caring about that POS a long time ago.

This post was edited on 4/1 5:35 PM by LaJolla Lion
 
Re: This is a disturbing thread

crickets of course. Your agenda is common sense and a wee bit of faith in a justice system that sometimes can be flawed. I just don't see this is that the shining light example some are wishing it was. It's as if some here are in fantasy land with this JS is innocent crap.
 
Re: the prosecuters had more porn on their computers ....

Keep in mind that Tom Corbett gave Jerry Sandusky and The Second
Mile 2.5 YEARS before issuing the search warrants. For example, we
already know TSM "lost"/destroyed 2-3 years of records from before and
after the 2001 incident. #ShredBabyShred

Thank you for the reminder.
 
Re: well done...

Jerry being Jerry is being a serial pedophile according to one of the country's best experts That is what they do according to Clemente and he offered no real alternative to what Jerry is. You can't sit there and tell me you think he's innocent because it wasn't on tape, but that is apparently what a few here need. JS is a pedophile and that really isn't up for debate outside some PSU fans/alums holding out due to some shaky attacks on the witnesses and the victims. They were all in on it and he was just a guy who is the real victim here. I just shake my head thinking that people are actually attempting to say this right now. Oh well, he'll die in jail...which is actually letting him off easy.
 
April Fools, ha ha. Perhaps there is an eyelash's value in doing that, but isn't it all premature? It my opinion that the odds of Sandusky is the only pervert looking for victims at the Second Mile. To believe otherwise is discouraged. Our getting the football scholarships and the wins back speaks ONLY to the arrogant and corrupt nature, people, inside the Bot, Louis Freeh (Waco, Tx) and the NCAA.

There are so many questions, Trials, Law suits still pending how could anyone think enough facts are yet known.

Tell me exactly happened in 1998

Tell me exactly what happened to Ray Gricar.

Tell me exactly who gave Sandusky the keys to our facilities effectively making themselves accessories before the fact to Sandusky's crimes.

Tell me exactly why Tom Corbett waited many years, what, 5 years as AG and one as Governor to investigate what was going on at a 'Charity' he supported and received campaign money.

You tell me that and I can make up my own mind.



"Will Rogers



"What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know. It's what we know for sure that just ain't so" - [/I]Mark Twain


"When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic." - Benjamin Franklin



"The silent colossal National Lie that is the support and confederate of all the tyrannies and shams and inequalities and unfairness that afflict the peoples - that is the one to throw bricks and sermons at."[/I] -Mark Twain




"Why shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction after all, has to make sense[/I]." Mark Twain
 
Ok, I am just going to go ahead and say what everyone else is saying. I apologize in advance if this comes off as rude.

@ CDW3333: ...... No words for you.

@ getmyjive11: See below.

@ LaJolla Lion: Are you seriously that thick? Can you not comprehend what people here are trying to say? How you keep coming up with "You all are just bat shit crazy trying to state/prove that JS is innocent".. are you kidding me..?!?!? Who the hell is saying he is innocent?? All people here are trying to state is that he was not given a fair trial. Is that really that hard to comprehend? You keep harping on the same thing again and again and again.. Jeez, give it a rest.

Look, no one is claiming JS is innocent. We all know he is where he belongs. But surely you cannot agree that he got a fair trial, can you? And you state that you don't care what kind of trial he got since he is a pedo and deserves to rot in hell. Like really?? just because he is a monster, he doesn't deserve a fair trial? Well in that case, from hence forth let every person accused of murder, rape, being a pedo or whtevr get a fast tracked trial like that based on popular public opinion. To hell with the justice system and let mob mentality rule/drive the courts and the jury's decision.... right? Who cares if the person is actually innocent or guilty. (AGAIN: NOONE IS CLAIMING JS IS INNOCENT. (Please don't be naïve and twist people's words). This was a wrong precedent that was set since it not only involved JS's life, but a lot of other lives were attached to this case. It ruined C/S/S/JVP (rightly or wrongly). If that doesn't bother you, then you Sir are a first class assole!

I WILL SAY THIS AGAIN AND AS SIMPLE AS I CAN. NO ONE IS CLAIMING THAT JS IS "INNOCENT". That is NOT what is being discussed here. Please read properly and try to comprehend what is being discussed. People are discussing that the trial he got was not fair. Yes, sure lets do another trial.. this time a FAIR one and im sure he will still come out guilty. Being convicted of 40 counts is guilty and being convicted of just 1 count is also guilty. So JS is where he belongs. But atleast this time around, the court/jury system should not be abused or directed by public opinion since it is a very complicated case not just involving JS but a lot of other people and institutions.

Good day!

This post was edited on 4/2 3:22 AM by pkg5002

This post was edited on 4/2 3:30 AM by pkg5002
 
Originally posted by pkg5002:
Ok, I am just going to go ahead and say what everyone else is saying. I apologize in advance if this comes off as rude.

@ CDW3333: ...... No words for you.

@ getmyjive11: See below.

@ LaJolla Lion: Are you seriously that thick? Can you not comprehend what people here are trying to say? How you keep coming up with "You all are just bat shit crazy trying to state/prove that JS is innocent".. are you kidding me..?!?!? Who the hell is saying he is innocent?? All people here are trying to state is that he was not given a fair trial. Is that really that hard to comprehend? You keep harping on the same thing again and again and again.. Jeez, give it a rest.

Look, no one is claiming JS is innocent. We all know he is where he belongs. But surely you cannot agree that he got a fair trial, can you? And you state that you don't care what kind of trial he got since he is a pedo and deserves to rot in hell. Like really?? just because he is a monster, he doesn't deserve a fair trial? Well in that case, from hence forth let every person accused of murder, rape, being a pedo or whtevr get a fast tracked trial like that based on popular public opinion. To hell with the justice system and let mob mentality rule/drive the courts and the jury's decision.... right? Who cares if the person is actually innocent or guilty. (AGAIN: NOONE IS CLAIMING JS IS INNOCENT. (Please don't be naïve and twist people's words). This was a wrong precedent that was set since it not only involved JS's life, but a lot of other lives were attached to this case. It ruined C/S/S/JVP (rightly or wrongly). If that doesn't bother you, then you Sir are a first class assole!

I WILL SAY THIS AGAIN AND AS SIMPLE AS I CAN. NO ONE IS CLAIMING THAT JS IS "INNOCENT". That is NOT what is being discussed here. Please read properly and try to comprehend what is being discussed. People are discussing that the trial he got was not fair. Yes, sure lets do another trial.. this time a FAIR one and im sure he will still come out guilty. Being convicted of 40 counts is guilty and being convicted of just 1 count is also guilty. So JS is where he belongs. But atleast this time around, the court/jury system should not be abused or directed by public opinion since it is a very complicated case not just involving JS but a lot of other people and institutions.

Good day!



So... you're saying that you think JS is innocent?
 
LOL


th



The amazing thing is....what you posted isn't far from what has ben going on.
 
Re: well, OBL confessed*

Originally posted by indynittany:

Originally posted by getmyjive11:
Originally posted by aferrelli:

Originally posted by LaJolla Lion:
True. Jerry is still in denial.
LaJolla Lion, why would intelligent people say that the evidence (or lack of in this case) warrants a second look at this case? One could say that you are in denial of being sensible. Everything about this case has stank from day 1. It's too bad you haven't been following it.
What evidence do you expect to see for charges that stem from incidents over a decade ago? Typically, in these type of cases, the only evidence is the witnesses' testimonies. Get real.
That works both ways. How is the accused supposed to defend himself when, for example as in the janitor case, there was no report of a crime, no established date for said crime, no known victim of a crime, no physical evidence of a crime, and no witness of a crime? Now we learn that there might even be recorded evidence that the witness exonerated JS in the incident. Doesn't the accused have the right to face his accuser?

That's five counts that should have never seen a courtroom.
Why would someone be accused of child molestation by 10 different victims if he were innocent (actually it was more than that as we all know)??? You are stuck on the MM incident but interestingly enough, that one had a 3rd party witness who testified against Jerry (Mike himself). It also had Paterno's statements which verified that MM at least brought the incident up with him. That makes it reasonable to believe that it happened considering MM has absolutely nothing to gain (and everything to lose) by coming forward.
 
Originally posted by pkg5002:
Ok, I am just going to go ahead and say what everyone else is saying. I apologize in advance if this comes off as rude.

@ CDW3333: ...... No words for you.

@ getmyjive11: See below.

@ LaJolla Lion: Are you seriously that thick? Can you not comprehend what people here are trying to say? How you keep coming up with "You all are just bat shit crazy trying to state/prove that JS is innocent".. are you kidding me..?!?!? Who the hell is saying he is innocent?? All people here are trying to state is that he was not given a fair trial. Is that really that hard to comprehend? You keep harping on the same thing again and again and again.. Jeez, give it a rest.

Look, no one is claiming JS is innocent. We all know he is where he belongs. But surely you cannot agree that he got a fair trial, can you? And you state that you don't care what kind of trial he got since he is a pedo and deserves to rot in hell. Like really?? just because he is a monster, he doesn't deserve a fair trial? Well in that case, from hence forth let every person accused of murder, rape, being a pedo or whtevr get a fast tracked trial like that based on popular public opinion. To hell with the justice system and let mob mentality rule/drive the courts and the jury's decision.... right? Who cares if the person is actually innocent or guilty. (AGAIN: NOONE IS CLAIMING JS IS INNOCENT. (Please don't be naïve and twist people's words). This was a wrong precedent that was set since it not only involved JS's life, but a lot of other lives were attached to this case. It ruined C/S/S/JVP (rightly or wrongly). If that doesn't bother you, then you Sir are a first class assole!

I WILL SAY THIS AGAIN AND AS SIMPLE AS I CAN. NO ONE IS CLAIMING THAT JS IS "INNOCENT". That is NOT what is being discussed here. Please read properly and try to comprehend what is being discussed. People are discussing that the trial he got was not fair. Yes, sure lets do another trial.. this time a FAIR one and im sure he will still come out guilty. Being convicted of 40 counts is guilty and being convicted of just 1 count is also guilty. So JS is where he belongs. But atleast this time around, the court/jury system should not be abused or directed by public opinion since it is a very complicated case not just involving JS but a lot of other people and institutions.

Good day!

This post was edited on 4/2 3:22 AM by pkg5002
This post was edited on 4/2 3:30 AM by pkg5002
Look, I understand the position and I understand WHY people have that position on this board (they want a retrial in hopes that JS is found not guilty on the 5 counts pertaining to the victim that MM saw with Jerry). Please stop giving me this procedural crap. We all know that you and everyone else in here wouldn't give a crap if this was some other pedo not named Jerry Sandusky. Jerry did get a fair trial. He was able to go up on the stand and plead his case and he refused to do it. Why? Because what the hell was he going to say? When you are a guilty man going against SO MANY accusers, there are no words.

This thread, like many others, makes PSU alumni look terrible.
 
Re: well, OBL confessed*


Originally posted by getmyjive11:
Originally posted by indynittany:

Originally posted by getmyjive11:
Originally posted by aferrelli:

Originally posted by LaJolla Lion:
True. Jerry is still in denial.
LaJolla Lion, why would intelligent people say that the evidence (or lack of in this case) warrants a second look at this case? One could say that you are in denial of being sensible. Everything about this case has stank from day 1. It's too bad you haven't been following it.
What evidence do you expect to see for charges that stem from incidents over a decade ago? Typically, in these type of cases, the only evidence is the witnesses' testimonies. Get real.
That works both ways. How is the accused supposed to defend himself when, for example as in the janitor case, there was no report of a crime, no established date for said crime, no known victim of a crime, no physical evidence of a crime, and no witness of a crime? Now we learn that there might even be recorded evidence that the witness exonerated JS in the incident. Doesn't the accused have the right to face his accuser?

That's five counts that should have never seen a courtroom.
Why would someone be accused of child molestation by 10 different victims if he were innocent (actually it was more than that as we all know)??? You are stuck on the MM incident but interestingly enough, that one had a 3rd party witness who testified against Jerry (Mike himself). It also had Paterno's statements which verified that MM at least brought the incident up with him. That makes it reasonable to believe that it happened considering MM has absolutely nothing to gain (and everything to lose) by coming forward.
How many actually claimed a sexual encounter initially? Two? How solid are those claims? How many were convinced that they were being groomed by the prosecution?

All I've really argued is that maybe JS wasn't the monster he was portrayed to be and that would explain how he was able to go so long without being exposed. It would also explain how JS had fooled those at PSU.
 
Re: How much did Jerry use a computer? If it was hardly at all,

I was surprised to find out JS was online as early as 98. How do I know this? Because it is a direct quote from Alycia Chambers 98 report (last line of 2nd to last paragraph):

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/msnbc/sections/news/Chambers_Sandusky_Report_Redacted1.pdf

I've always wondered about the lack of computer evidence in this case. But I also believe JS had ample time to destroy any.
 
Re: well, OBL confessed*

Originally posted by getmyjive11:
Why would someone be accused of child molestation by 10 different victims if he were innocent (actually it was more than that as we all know)???
I'd like to play Devil's advocate for a minute... Me and 9 buddies all think you stole $100,000 in cash from my home. That might be a surprise to you, but we have 10 people who will say you did it. Why would the 10 of us say that if you were innocent?

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Re: well, OBL confessed*


Originally posted by getmyjive11:
Originally posted by indynittany:

Originally posted by getmyjive11:
Originally posted by aferrelli:

Originally posted by LaJolla Lion:
True. Jerry is still in denial.
LaJolla Lion, why would intelligent people say that the evidence (or lack of in this case) warrants a second look at this case? One could say that you are in denial of being sensible. Everything about this case has stank from day 1. It's too bad you haven't been following it.
What evidence do you expect to see for charges that stem from incidents over a decade ago? Typically, in these type of cases, the only evidence is the witnesses' testimonies. Get real.
That works both ways. How is the accused supposed to defend himself when, for example as in the janitor case, there was no report of a crime, no established date for said crime, no known victim of a crime, no physical evidence of a crime, and no witness of a crime? Now we learn that there might even be recorded evidence that the witness exonerated JS in the incident. Doesn't the accused have the right to face his accuser?

That's five counts that should have never seen a courtroom.
Why would someone be accused of child molestation by 10 different victims if he were innocent (actually it was more than that as we all know)??? You are stuck on the MM incident but interestingly enough, that one had a 3rd party witness who testified against Jerry (Mike himself). It also had Paterno's statements which verified that MM at least brought the incident up with him. That makes it reasonable to believe that it happened considering MM has absolutely nothing to gain (and everything to lose) by coming forward.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day-care_sex-abuse_hysteria#McMartin_Preschool
 
Re: well, OBL confessed*

Originally posted by getmyjive11:
Why would someone be accused of child molestation by 10 different victims if he were innocent (actually it was more than that as we all know)??? You are stuck on the MM incident but interestingly enough, that one had a 3rd party witness who testified against Jerry (Mike himself).
Let's see? What possible motivation? Hmm.

Grand Jury is released - there are but a few victims.

Prior to trial, Penn State announces they're going to financially compensate each victim of Sandusky.

All of sudden, there are LOTS of victims suddenly showing up.

Its really amazing what kind of "courage" the victims showed after finally seeing the Grand Jury presentment. They finally had the courage to accuse Jerry, right?

Hasn't anybody considered that Penn State saying they would financially compensate Jerry's victims - even BEFORE his guilt was established, even before Schultz or Curley's guilty was established and even before Penn State's responsibility was established - could be considered a form of tampering??

Still something VERY odd about Penn State covering for The Second Mile, and VERY odd about the way Penn State worked hand-in-hand with the OAG on this matter.
 
Re: well, OBL confessed*


Originally posted by getmyjive11:
Originally posted by aferrelli:

Originally posted by LaJolla Lion:
True. Jerry is still in denial.
LaJolla Lion, why would intelligent people say that the evidence (or lack of in this case) warrants a second look at this case? One could say that you are in denial of being sensible. Everything about this case has stank from day 1. It's too bad you haven't been following it.
What evidence do you expect to see for charges that stem from incidents over a decade ago? Typically, in these type of cases, the only evidence is the witnesses' testimonies. Get real.
Get real? I certainly am real and have been following JZ since the beginning.

Just because you aren't abreast of all of the holes in this case, doesn't make your presumption of guilt from the charade of the JS court case correct. Have you followed John Zielgler trying to uncover the truth? No, but I have and that makes me more aware of this travesty of justice.
 
Here's the irony. I would think that Penn State fans that witnessed first hand what happened to the honorable Joe Paterno would certainly understand how the media, investigators, money hungry lawyers, and the grand jury could distort the truth.

But no, even though these people can understand how Joe Paterno was wrongly accused of covering for an accused pedophile; they cannot understand how another person can be equally innocent of the charges of others. They also don't understand how the investigators and lawyers involved manipulated the supposed victims. Millions of dollars being the motivating factor.

This is a cruel world that we live in. Penn State people should be aware of this more than anyone. Many people are evil and will not stop at any length to prove themselves correct especially when millions of dollars are to be gained by lying.

This case was the perfect storm of distorted facts in many ways. Pedophilia is a hot topic and will always be a hot, horrific topic. Supporting someone who has been accused of pedophilia is not a popular stance; and the bad guys involved understand this and use this to their advantage. An innocent person can be wrongly accused. It sounds unbelievable, but this is a crazy world we live in.
 
I think Sandusky is guilty, but rule out absolutely nothing. Agree, it is a crazy f'd up society in which we live.
 
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