FC/OT: Better Call Saul Season Finale! Anyone watch? *SPOILERS*

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Didn't watch any of the men's final last night (and just found out Duke won) because I treated myself to a second viewing of the Mad Men season premiere and the finale to Better Call Saul. Mad Men got better with a second viewing. Better Call Saul, however, was a bit disappointing, especially after the build up of the last few episodes.

I liked Jimmy for making the pragmatic choice and taking the money offered by HHM. Strange to see Hamlin tell Jimmy he has always been on his side and that his brother Chuck has been the one not wanting anything to do with him. Without knowing what happens in Breaking Bad, you might think Jimmy is well on his way to a pretty successful career and maybe a new romance with Kim. But, before all that, Jimmy has some decompressing to do and does it in pretty entertaining fashion in Chicago with his old buddy Marco. The stuff in Chicago was fun and you get a sense of why Chuck feels the way he does about Jimmy. Some great cons to be sure. But, after Marco dies during their last con Jimmy sort of has a change of heart. He blows off the interview at the new firm and talks to Mike about how dumb he was to pass on the free money they could have had if he wasn't bound by loyalty to his brother (and wanting to make him proud). Chuck's treatment of Jimmy is really what changed everything.

Knowing that, I was still disappointed Jimmy didn't take the high road. He had it all there for him - a lucrative case, that he discovered, to work on; a potentially great new job; and best of all, a great female friend who is always taking care of him. That he would throw all that away out of spite for his brother is curious given all the work Jimmy has done to get where he is. And he never seemed like the kind of guy to just give up. I guess we'll see Saul Goodman for the first time next year, but I'll miss Jimmy. What did everyone else think?

This post was edited on 4/7 10:02 AM by Midnighter

 

[dmk228]

I see what you're saying, but in the end, I think the show needs to move on from Jimmy for practical reasons - where could the show possibly go if Jimmy chose the straight path? It's not going to become Law and Order. In the end, everyone who's seen Breaking Bad knows where the story ends, so rather than keeping Jimmy on the straight and narrow for another season, for practical reasons, they need to move on with it.

It would be fun in the first episode next season if the episode starts with Jimmy having a change of heart as he's driving away and going back to meet with the lawyers and maybe pulling some kind of con on them. I doubt it happens, but it would be fun anyway.

That said, I'm excited that now the chains are off and Jimmy / Saul can start his shady dealings and introduce a whole new cast of characters.

 

[Grant Green]

First. ."I didn't know his kids were in the back of the car". Great line. That scene was fantastic story telling although a little strange given the setting.

I think blowing off the interview had as much to do with Marco. He looks down at the ring before deciding to turn around. Maybe he realized that law firm just wasn't him after all.
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[Obliviax]

I did the same

IMHO, Jimmy blew off the interview because he realized he didn't want to be just another corporate suit. While he would get a nice job, he'd be stuck in an office kissing partner butt. At the end of that realization, he asks Mike why they left the money on the table. Jimmy's response was "never again" and he stormed off to "Smoke on the Water" (which is what Marco was singing before he died).

Jimmy "Broke Bad" at that point. All of season one was a setup to him "breaking bad" and becoming Saul instead of Jimmy. He'll use the "elder money" to create his evil legal empire (with Mike, whom he now trusts). Remember "this is the rock on which I will build my church").

Why smoke on the water? its basically about a rock band that eschews the corporate way to stay true to the rock and roll:


They burned down the gambling house
It died with an awful sound
Funky Claude was running in and out
Pulling kids out the ground
When it all was over
We had to find another place
But Swiss time was running out
It seemed that we would lose the race
Smoke on the water, fire in the sky

We ended up at the Grand Hotel
It was empty cold and bare
But with the Rolling truck Stones thing just outside
Making our music there
With a few red lights and a few old beds
We make a place to sweat
No matter what we get out of this
I know we'll never forget
Smoke on the water, fire in the sky

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Re: I did the same

Originally posted by Obliviax:
IMHO, Jimmy blew off the interview because he realized he didn't want to be just another corporate suit. While he would get a nice job, he'd be stuck in an office kissing partner butt. At the end of that realization, he asks Mike why they left the money on the table. Jimmy's response was "never again" and he stormed off to "Smoke on the Water" (which is what Marco was singing before he died).

Jimmy "Broke Bad" at that point. All of season one was a setup to him "breaking bad" and becoming Saul instead of Jimmy. He'll use the "elder money" to create his evil legal empire (with Mike, whom he now trusts). Remember "this is the rock on which I will build my church").

Why smoke on the water? its basically about a rock band that eschews the corporate way to stay true to the rock and roll:


They burned down the gambling house
It died with an awful sound
Funky Claude was running in and out
Pulling kids out the ground
When it all was over
We had to find another place
But Swiss time was running out
It seemed that we would lose the race
Smoke on the water, fire in the sky

We ended up at the Grand Hotel
It was empty cold and bare
But with the Rolling truck Stones thing just outside
Making our music there
With a few red lights and a few old beds
We make a place to sweat
No matter what we get out of this
I know we'll never forget
Smoke on the water, fire in the sky

Good insight. I guess my issue isn't that he did it, rather that it felt so sudden. He spends the whole season doing good work and positioning himself for a better life - one he seems to want to share with Kim. He gets the chance and then, because of a quick journey to Chicago, gives it all up? I don't know. I get we have to move on, but Jimmy has seen what the path of 'Slippin' Jimmy' would have been without his brother (dead like Marco probably; or in jail; and a registered sex offender). The suit path may be boring, but you don't put yourself through law school (correspondence no less) because you lack character or fortitude. I guess he thinks easy money is best? Dunno. And that's the issue with prequels - there's no wiggle room.

 

[Obliviax]

I hear you

but it was the same with Breaking Bad. Walt was also a good guy. However, some bad breaks (and dealing with a bunch of spoiled kids at his school along with is partner screwing him over) and he realizes he's never going to make it in a legit business so turns to a life of crime (justified by all of the creeps in the world).

The new job may have been a setup. I recall him practicing all of the "suck up" terms walking into the meeting. He's just not cut out for that, he is a 'dirty hands" guy. (I think the other partner was pulling his leg and doing the "lie" thing).

HuffPost has some great stuff too.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Key difference IMO....

Walt only ever broke bad because he thought he was going to die of cancer. Sure, he went past the point of no return even after the cancer was no longer an issue, but that was his motivator. Jimmy had a chance to do everything right (I do not think Kiim would set him up), including winning a huge case and he passed - why? Because people would never see him as a legit lawyer? It's a bit weak IMO - especially since he gave up his Slippin' Jimmy days for a decade or so to work in a mail room.

 

[rudedude]

Re: I did the same

Jimmy's perspective is "damned if you do and damned if you don't". Chuck totally crushed his spirit especially with how hard Jimmy tried to do the "right" thing and all he was getting out of it was a paycheck from HHM. It didn't matter that he did all the leg work. Didn't matter all he did for Chuck in Chuck's time of need (as evidenced by Howard's amazement when Jimmy gave him the to do list for Chuck's needs). Even the potential partner job felt like a handout to Jimmy so that is why he questioned Mike about how they let all that $ go and had to answer to no one about it Jimmy now knows it's dog eat dog and being with Marco reinforced that because Marco is one of the few people who loves Jimmy for who he is. Marco's line about Miles Davis not playing the trumpet says it all for me. Jimmy is Slippn' Jimmy, but with a law degree & he realizes he needs to be true to himself.

 

[Obliviax]

I hear you, but that's not how Gilligan rolls

His characters are flawed but sympathetic. None of them, aside from the kid killed on the motorcycle, are "good" people. Yoiu just get to understand how they got that way. Plus, he's "Slippin Jimmy" and those that called him that were right all along. No way he ever fits in with a giant law firm wearing his "Mattlock" suit. I think he finally "got that" after the episode with Marco (the fun and realizing life is finite), practicing his butt kissing, and all of the hypocrisy that he's gone through trying to get a good job.

He'll get rich and do it his way!

 

[LionJim]

Inside.

Originally posted by Midnighter:

Knowing that, I was still disappointed Jimmy didn't take the high road. He had it all there for him - a lucrative case, that he discovered, to work on; a potentially great new job; and best of all, a great female friend who is always taking care of him. That he would throw all that away out of spite for his brother is curious given all the work Jimmy has done to get where he is. And he never seemed like the kind of guy to just give up. I guess we'll see Saul Goodman for the first time next year, but I'll miss Jimmy. What did everyone else think?

This post was edited on 4/7 10:02 AM by Midnighter

I don't think he threw it away to spite Chuck. He simply realized that he'll always be Slippin' Jimmy, S'All Good, man. It was a moment of self-realization, not of spite.



This post was edited on 4/7 4:38 PM by LionJim

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Re: Inside.

Originally posted by LionJim:

Originally posted by Midnighter:

Knowing that, I was still disappointed Jimmy didn't take the high road. He had it all there for him - a lucrative case, that he discovered, to work on; a potentially great new job; and best of all, a great female friend who is always taking care of him. That he would throw all that away out of spite for his brother is curious given all the work Jimmy has done to get where he is. And he never seemed like the kind of guy to just give up. I guess we'll see Saul Goodman for the first time next year, but I'll miss Jimmy. What did everyone else think?

This post was edited on 4/7 10:02 AM by Midnighter

I don't think he threw it away to spite Chuck. He simply realized that he'll always be Slippin' Jimmy, S'All Good, man. It was a moment of self-realization, not of spite.



This post was edited on 4/7 4:38 PM by LionJim

You think he'd realize that before putting a decade into the mail room and agonizing over correspondence law school and the New Mexico state bar.....fell a bit flat and forced for me. Otherwise fantastic series.

 

[gfour18]

Re: Inside.

Originally posted by Midnighter:

Originally posted by LionJim:

Originally posted by Midnighter:

Knowing that, I was still disappointed Jimmy didn't take the high road. He had it all there for him - a lucrative case, that he discovered, to work on; a potentially great new job; and best of all, a great female friend who is always taking care of him. That he would throw all that away out of spite for his brother is curious given all the work Jimmy has done to get where he is. And he never seemed like the kind of guy to just give up. I guess we'll see Saul Goodman for the first time next year, but I'll miss Jimmy. What did everyone else think?


This post was edited on 4/7 10:02 AM by Midnighter

I don't think he threw it away to spite Chuck. He simply realized that he'll always be Slippin' Jimmy, S'All Good, man. It was a moment of self-realization, not of spite.




This post was edited on 4/7 4:38 PM by LionJim

You think he'd realize that before putting a decade into the mail room and agonizing over correspondence law school and the New Mexico state bar.....fell a bit flat and forced for me. Otherwise fantastic series.

Jimmy didn't take the high road because quite simply.....it was over. All of the hours in the mailroom , studying law, etc. were not for his own self accomplishment or feeling of self worth. They were also not to win over Kim , she would have just been icing on the cake. This was 100 % about confirmation , love, and acceptance from his brother Chuck. The decision to attend or not to attend that meeting was irrelevant. He just wanted his brother to be proud of him. Without his brother's approval , there is no need to be jimmy.

 

[LionJim]

Point well taken. What felt forced to me was him discussing the $ with Mike

Originally posted by Midnighter:
You think he'd realize that before putting a decade into the mail room and agonizing over correspondence law school and the New Mexico state bar.....fell a bit flat and forced for me. Otherwise fantastic series.

At the end, which you've alluded to in this thread. He gave the money back because Kim needed him to, so she wouldn't get pushed out of HHM. Maybe it was just a case of him asking a rhetorical question, but that didn't feel right. The only way it could feel right to me would be that he was actually doing it for himself, not for Kim; this was his in into HHM.

Hey, a thought: we really don't know much about Kim and her background. Is she like Jimmy, a "pull herself up by the bootstrings" sort of gal? Or is she someone from a good, entitled (for lack of a better phrase) background, as I picture Howard to be? I'd like to see a little detail here, to give the whole situation some perspective.

 

[simons96]

Re: Point well taken. What felt forced to me was him discussing the $ with Mike

Originally posted by LionJim:

Originally posted by Midnighter:
You think he'd realize that before putting a decade into the mail room and agonizing over correspondence law school and the New Mexico state bar.....fell a bit flat and forced for me. Otherwise fantastic series.

At the end, which you've alluded to in this thread. He gave the money back because Kim needed him to, so she wouldn't get pushed out of HHM. Maybe it was just a case of him asking a rhetorical question, but that didn't feel right. The only way it could feel right to me would be that he was actually doing it for himself, not for Kim; this was his in into HHM.

Hey, a thought: we really don't know much about Kim and her background. Is she like Jimmy, a "pull herself up by the bootstrings" sort of gal? Or is she someone from a good, entitled (for lack of a better phrase) background, as I picture Howard to be? I'd like to see a little detail here, to give the whole situation some perspective.

except it isn't about Kim any more. that was the whole point of visiting Marco. Marco said if Jimmy was a lawyer and not filthy rich, he was doing it wrong. Every decision he made for 10 years was about living up to Chuck, who burned him.

hence his parting comments to Mike. He was never again going to be held back by "doing the right thing", because that only brought him heartache and betrayal. I think he did help Kim for her sake, but now he is done helping anyone but himself.