Spencer would still have more career losses than Dake. Spencer also got stuck by Picc, Dake was not pinned in any of his losses. I would still have Dake ahead.
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Plus Dake beat Taylor. Spencer beat Nick, but beating Nick is not the same as beating Taylor.
This aint gif-games JMad, you aint gonna win this here.
Tell your goldenboy to jump a class and knock off a 2x finalist (ala KD) and then you might have an arguement.
But then little golden boy would lose and then there wouldn't be an argument lol.
I was more going by diceman’s analysis regarding Spencer having “bad losses” versus others. I prove Dake has worse losses and we switch to better wins. Which is more important?
In addition to Dake doing it at four different weight classes, Dake also wrestled full seasons. I get that he's nursing real injuries, but it should still count against Lee that he's not exactly going through the same grind as his competition. In 2021 he wrestled in four duals, and this coming year it's expected he'll carry a similarly light load.
He doesnt like tough schedules.
Do you really want to do this????
First of all, MY ANALYSIS clearly pointed to wins as well - see Zain post. You're taking one post out of context.
For kicks will do the losses first and then the wins. And we will do it year by year, so it is a good comparison.
Freshman year
Dake (2009-2010)
Lost by DEC to RS Senior Reese Humphrey - returning finalist who would go on to make 3 world teams for the US
Lost by DEC to RS Junior Zack Bailey - No credentials, but Bailey was returning from a severe shoulder suffered in 2008 when he was a budding star and would AA in both of his appearances (4th, 7th)
Spencer (2017-18)
Lost by DEC to RS Junior Nathan Tomasello - NCAA Champ (in 2016), finished 3rd in 2017, 3x AA
Lost by DEC to RS Junior Ronnie Bresser - No credentials, would go on to finish as a 2x AA (7th, 8th)
Sophomore year
Dake (2010-11)
Lost by DEC OT to Senior Kevin LeValley - Returning AA (7th), would go on to be a 2x AA (7th, 7th)
Lost by DEC to RS Sophomore Donnie Vinson - No credentials, would go on to be an AA (3rd)
Spencer (2018-19)
Lost by DEC to RS Sophomore Sebastian Rivera - Returning AA( 6th), would go on to be a 4x AA (6th, 3rd, 4th, 3rd)
Lost by FALL to RS Junior Nick Piccinini - Returning NQ, AA in 16-17 (4th), would go on to be a 2x AA (4th, 5th)
Lost by DEC OT to RS Sophomore Sebastian Rivera - see above
If I'm ranking the losses from worst to "least worst":
1. Piccininni - gets decked by a kid who peaked as a freshman
2. Bresser - no credentials to that point, ends up finishing 7th and 8th at 125
3. Vinson - close with Bresser, but Vinson was more talented and finished 3rd the next year at 149
4. LeValley - returning AA, Senior who would AA that year
5. Bailey - see his resume above, seems like a bad loss but isn't. 2 for 2 at NCAAs and finished 4th that year
6. Rivera - at this point in his career this is not much better of a loss than Bailey as SeaBass had finished 6th the year before and would finish 3rd at 125
6. Rivera - AGAIN. Spencer beat him twice the year before and then lost to him twice this year
8. Humphrey - this should be Tomasello here because Humphrey in 2010 is a FAR better wrestler and a trajectory pointing up, while Tomasello has plateaued but I'll give it to you because you'll whine that NT won a championship in 2016.
9. Tomasello - again, this is not correct, but will give it to you.
So Dake wins the above pretty clearly, not even to mention that his 4 losses were in 141 bouts against better competition (see below), while SL five losses are in 83.
Now let's go to wins - look at who they beat to get their championships:
Freshman
-kind of an odd coincidence, but both Dake and SL had significant wins in the semis their FR year to get to the finals and then not again
Dake
Beats Humphreys in Semis - see above
Beats RS Sophomore Montell Marion in Finals - no credentials, would go on to be a 2x finalist and 3x AA
Spencer
Beats Tomasello in Semis - see above
Beats Sophomore Nick Suriano - no credentials (injured as a frosh), would go on the be a 2x NC and 3x AA
Note - this is about as good as it gets for Spencer - he beat Rivera as well that year
Sophomore
Dake
Beats RS Junior Frank Molinaro - Returning 2x AA (8th and 5th), would go on to be a NC and 3x AA
Dake beat Molinaro a couple of times that year
Spencer
Beats Junior Jack Mueller - Returning NQ, AA'd (6th) in 2017, would go on to be a 3x AA
Junior
Dake
Beats RS Sophomore Derek St. John - returning AA (4th) would go on to be a NC and a 3x AA
Spencer
Best win in the Covid shortened season is against Piccinini
Senior
Dake
Beats RS Junior David Taylor - returning NC who would go on to be a 2x NC, 4x AA, World and Olympic Champ
Spencer
Beats Junior Brandon Courtney - no credentials but was ranked 7th in the Covid year.
So Dake wins losses, crushes Spencer in wins, AND was
Dake - 137-4 at 141 to 165 with a 77-match winning streak which included putting it on the line 3x against David Taylor
Spencer - let's say 90-5 at 125 and ending with a, let's say, 50-match winning streak against pretty much nobody
Those careers are not even close to being comparable. Spencer could have closed the gap this year by bumping up with all of his new muscles to 133 in a weight class that includes 2x NC RBY and 3x finalist Fix, but didn't. His choice, his legacy.
That was a spanking 😱
Could someone copy and paste into HR and ask Ironbird for his thoughts 😆
Dake’s dad never had to call Mineo 27 times in 35 minutes to say he’d done nothing wrong either
Spencer got pinned, by default a worse loss compared to any of Dake's 4. Spencer has more losses. Dake beat Taylor, twice (not counting all star match).
Quit making me defend Dake, and quit making me belittle Spencer.
Spencer is great, has always been great, but is not the GOAT.
Dice, who put you onto Spencer?
Dake wrestled against better comp by far. Spenser is genetically small and wrestles mostly by far inferior much younger kids that are still growing into themselves. Being a 125 is his best asset. That’s not to say he isn’t great but Dake all day not close.
That was very embarrassing, for Madden, yet he continues.
