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Guys getting "caught"

RoarLions1

RoarLions1

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May 11, 2012
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With the Hidlay pin on Friday (2/18), Cass getting pinned earlier in the season, and the "other" notable and maybe unexpected falls in history, I wonder what you think about the term "getting caught".

I like to give total credit to the guy getting the pin, as he has just accomplished the ultimate in this sport. At the same time, Cassioppi is not likely to lose to DelGarbino (4-7 this season) if they wrestle again, and I'd give money that others that were pinned would not lose often either.

Problem is imo, saying a wrestler "gets caught" minimizes the opponents accomplishment. Yet it is true, is it not?
 
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RoarLions1 said:
With the Hidlay pin on Friday (2/18), Cass getting pinned earlier in the season, and the "other" notable and maybe unexpected falls in history, I wonder what you think about the term "getting caught".

I like to give total credit to the guy getting the pin, as he has just accomplished the ultimate in this sport. At the same time, Cassioppi is not likely to lose to DelGarbino (4-7 this season) if they wrestle again, and I'd give money that others that were pinned would not lose often either.

Problem is imo, saying a wrestler "gets caught" minimizes the opponents accomplishment. Yet it is true, is it not?
Click to expand...
I will openly admit that I “caught” a returning Sr State Champ as a undersized sophomore wrestling up two weights. Going into the match my “hopes” were to get through the first period without being embarrassed. I think I was “counting the lights” before I went out on the mat so I would already know how many there were when I got that view, LOL! Doesn’t lessen the accomplishment for me in any way.
 
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KCLion said:
I will openly admit that I “caught” a returning Sr State Champ as a undersized sophomore wrestling up two weights. Going into the match my “hopes” were to get through the first period without being embarrassed. I think I was “counting the lights” before I went out on the mat so I would already know how many there were when I got that view, LOL! Doesn’t lessen the accomplishment for me in any way.
Click to expand...
Pretty much exactly what I was asking about, sentence structure and grammar aside.
 
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#5 Hidlay wrestled a #9 kid(so he was no pushover) and the UNC wrestler countered with a good move similar to the one that Bo used to pin Myles Martin. I don't think he got caught at all. He got out wrestled and pinned. He should get full credit I agree with the "got caught" excuse. It seems to diminish a win. A wrestler doesn't get caught if they got pinned and the winner deserves the credit. When a higher ranked kid wins and pins an opponent, nobody talks about the lower ranked opponent just got caught. They recognize that he pinned his opponent and give him full. credit
 
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In discussing the particulars of any match between two wrestlers, you're essentially forced to discuss it from one vantage point at a time. Wrestler A "got in on a leg" while Wrestler B "let him in on his leg." Both vantages are 100% true, but your inherent bias renders you more likely to describe it from your wrestler's vantage. (And that's fine.)

But "got caught," by itself, is a passive form for "catch," so when you use it you're effectively telling the story from the vantage of the wrestler who was pinned. I mean, you could say that Wrestler A "caught" Wrestler B, but if you're an alum of College B, you're more likely to say that Wrestler B "got caught" because his/her narrative is more interesting to you. Or the wrestler with the larger resume.

But match particulars play a part too. I don't think anyone thought that IMar "got caught" by Cenzo because the match had played out evenly to that point, even though IMar came in as a heavy favorite. But if you were up 8-1 and left your knee too close to your head from bottom and suddenly you're pinned, it's fairer to say you "got caught."

The term also implies that the wrestler who "got caught" made a mistake that he/she ordinarily wouldn't have made, and would likely win in a rematch. That can be either inherent bias (home fans are more likely to see it that way), or entirely accurate, or a mix of both.
 
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Grammar aside, I think it’s tough to have seen the match prior to the move and say that Hidlay didn’t get caught.
 
I think it's fair to say that Hidlay "got caught" but also that saying so doesn't diminish Lautt's elevator. It's not as if Hidlay fell to his back, Lautt executed it perfectly. More like Hidlay ignored or was oblivious to the likelihood that Lautt would be able to pull that off. He certainly know now and I'd take Hidlay in a rematch.
 
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I mean it doesn’t mean the match didn’t happen, it’s more so that I believe the better wrestler lost in a way that doesn’t happen 9 times out of 10 and maybe more.
 
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CSauertiegPSU said:
Grammar aside, I think it’s tough to have seen the match prior to the move and say that Hidlay didn’t get caught.
Click to expand...


tumblr_myiau3cXlY1risusro1_500.gif
 
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…”getting caught” can happen to anyone but my favorite move was Wade Schalles using a leg elevator and pinning John Chatman in the PIAA Championships more years ago than I care ro reveal…
… Wade’s reputation for crazy moves was well known and he intimidated lots of good wrestlers…
…an example occurred in the All Star meet held at Lehigh when Wade was in college… someone more computer friendly than I can uncover the date…at the first whistle starting the match… after the opening hand shake Wade turned his back to his opponent and backed toward him… the other guy refused to engage and backed up… Wade continued backing toward him and his opponent backed completely off the mat, having never touched Wade… the crowd was at first puzzled, then laughing …I never had seen that happen before and I have never seen it since…🤷🏽‍♂️
 
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tikk10 said:
In discussing the particulars of any match between two wrestlers, you're essentially forced to discuss it from one vantage point at a time. Wrestler A "got in on a leg" while Wrestler B "let him in on his leg." Both vantages are 100% true, but your inherent bias renders you more likely to describe it from your wrestler's vantage. (And that's fine.)

But "got caught," by itself, is a passive form for "catch," so when you use it you're effectively telling the story from the vantage of the wrestler who was pinned. I mean, you could say that Wrestler A "caught" Wrestler B, but if you're an alum of College B, you're more likely to say that Wrestler B "got caught" because his/her narrative is more interesting to you. Or the wrestler with the larger resume.

But match particulars play a part too. I don't think anyone thought that IMar "got caught" by Cenzo because the match had played out evenly to that point, even though IMar came in as a heavy favorite. But if you were up 8-1 and left your knee too close to your head from bottom and suddenly you're pinned, it's fairer to say you "got caught."

The term also implies that the wrestler who "got caught" made a mistake that he/she ordinarily wouldn't have made, and would likely win in a rematch. That can be either inherent bias (home fans are more likely to see it that way), or entirely accurate, or a mix of both.
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Agreed, but... was the answer:

Yes it diminishes the catching wrestler to use passive voice (it's implicit in inherent bias when supporting one's own wrestler to diminish the other).

Or No. A wrestler should never feel diminished by another's fan base.
 
Why do folks get so sensitive to such things.

In football it's a thing with a'hail Mary' you toss the ball with no time left on the clock and hope for a miracle of sorts. Usually it's a situation where the other team has earned the win, but...

In wrestling it has a meaning. Bo didn't 'catch' Miles because he had demonstrated over a career he was the superior wrestler and likely the most dangerous one in the nation from all three positions.

If you have a situation where wrestler A is superior and is likely to win 9 out of 10 matches, and in the 1 where he loses get gets pinned while winning on points due to finding his way into a bad position, in my mind he gets 'caught'. It's still a loss on the ledger and there are no asterisks, but the term getting caught when used properly conveys appropriate meaning and context.
 
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androcles said:
…”getting caught” can happen to anyone but my favorite move was Wade Schalles using a leg elevator and pinning John Chatman in the PIAA Championships more years ago than I care ro reveal…
… Wade’s reputation for crazy moves was well known and he intimidated lots of good wrestlers…
…an example occurred in the All Star meet held at Lehigh when Wade was in college… someone more computer friendly than I can uncover the date…at the first whistle starting the match… after the opening hand shake Wade turned his back to his opponent and backed toward him… the other guy refused to engage and backed up… Wade continued backing toward him and his opponent backed completely off the mat, having never touched Wade… the crowd was at first puzzled, then laughing …I never had seen that happen before and I have never seen it since…🤷🏽‍♂️
Click to expand...
At the time of the Chatman (returning state champ, hadn't ever lost a junior or senior high match) pin Wade's reputation was not a real thing just yet. The Chatman match gave birth to the Schalles legend/reputation.
By the time the match you described occurred, Wade had become a full blown walking, talking scary legend.
 
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Don't like the term but have used it to make our teams kid feel a little better about getting pinned. Something I've noticed is alot of times when the higher ranked wrestler "gets caught" they aren't as skilled at fighting off back as someone who's been there before. It's a skill that needs practiced problem is you need a partner that's good enough to put you there.
 
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I see the Thursday FRL discussion has bled over to here!

Interesting discussion nevertheless.
 
Sure, some unreasonable fans will unfairly use "got caught" to justify their guy's unexpected loss and diminish the victor's win. But I agree with KCLion and don't see it as a pejorative term. To me, it's similar to saying a guy "caught fire" or "caught lightening in a bottle." It conveys the fact that the wrestler did something incredible beyond their expected/historical performance.

One of the things I love about college wrestling is that the skill level is so high that on any given night a lower ranked wrestler can "catch" a higher ranked wrestler who underestimated him.
 
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Cass was of a flukey situation and I’d call that getting caught. Hidlay the kid hit a flying cement job. They both win that match 19/20 times.
 
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What do we say when one of the best or best PSU wrestler got pinned by his old work mate in the match for the NCAA tournament his freshman year. It really looked like he got caught. But he still is maybe thought of as our best ever.
 
RoarLions1 said:
With the Hidlay pin on Friday (2/18), Cass getting pinned earlier in the season, and the "other" notable and maybe unexpected falls in history, I wonder what you think about the term "getting caught".

I like to give total credit to the guy getting the pin, as he has just accomplished the ultimate in this sport. At the same time, Cassioppi is not likely to lose to DelGarbino (4-7 this season) if they wrestle again, and I'd give money that others that were pinned would not lose often either.

Problem is imo, saying a wrestler "gets caught" minimizes the opponents accomplishment. Yet it is true, is it not?
Click to expand...
In my mind a wrestler who was caught means they ended up in a bad position which led to the pin of course the pinning wrestler played a role but less of one. Not sure any of that makes sense other than in my head
 
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I think you could flip it. "Caught" doesn't necessarily reduce the accomplishment of the winning wrestler. It could be a badge of honor. If I'm an underdog against a superior wrestler and find a way to win with a fall, I'd wear the phrase "I caught him" as a badge of honor. Whether I was down big or just caught (see I did it and didn't mean to) an opportunistic cradle. I just think people in general want to insert too much meaning into words these days.

No issue with using the term at all.
 
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The greatest "getting caught"moment on the biggest stage. Don Rohn had to be proud of his nephew hitting a Northampton Cement mixer.

www.ncaa.com

Rohn's Cement Job

Lehigh's Rob Rohn pins Josh Lambrecht after trailing 14-3 at one points to claim the NCAA DI national title in the 184-lb. weight class.
www.ncaa.com www.ncaa.com
 
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Callthestall said:
The greatest "getting caught"moment on the biggest stage. Don Rohn had to be proud of his nephew hitting a Northampton Cement mixer.

www.ncaa.com

Rohn's Cement Job

Lehigh's Rob Rohn pins Josh Lambrecht after trailing 14-3 at one points to claim the NCAA DI national title in the 184-lb. weight class.
www.ncaa.com www.ncaa.com
Click to expand...
Most of those tilt points against Rohn should never have been counted. The wrist was never released and points should not have been awarded until the tilt hold was released. However, it was a helluva cement mixer.
 
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androcles said:
…”getting caught” can happen to anyone but my favorite move was Wade Schalles using a leg elevator and pinning John Chatman in the PIAA Championships more years ago than I care ro reveal…
… Wade’s reputation for crazy moves was well known and he intimidated lots of good wrestlers…
…an example occurred in the All Star meet held at Lehigh when Wade was in college… someone more computer friendly than I can uncover the date…at the first whistle starting the match… after the opening hand shake Wade turned his back to his opponent and backed toward him… the other guy refused to engage and backed up… Wade continued backing toward him and his opponent backed completely off the mat, having never touched Wade… the crowd was at first puzzled, then laughing …I never had seen that happen before and I have never seen it since…🤷🏽‍♂️
Click to expand...
I was at the PIAA's that year, 1969, (as a spectator) and was shocked along with everyone else. Up that point in the 3rd period Chatman had dominated the match, even if the score wasn't too bad (something like 5-2). Schalles really hadn't been able to do much of anything to Chatman. Then lightning struck quickly and it was over! Rec Hall exploded! Chatman was a defending state champ and seemed invincible. Chatman went on to have a very solid career at PItt, but nothing like Wade's!
 
Similar storyline.
Saucon Valley's Don Rohn got pinned his Senior year in Finals going for his 3rd State title.
 
Cstroke said:
I got caught a fair amount during my high school career.. only once as an adult and I should have injury defaulted out of that one. the bro code tells pawresling to keep his trap shut.
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How many times can a guy get “caught” before its not considered getting “caught” anymore?
 
1970 NCAAs Andy Matter was, I believe the #2 seed, and after coming off of a 16-1 decision in the preliminaries, and got pinned by unseeded John Lightner from Oklahoma State. Lightner was on top and behind Matter when Matter reached back for Lightner's head and Matter got caught reaching and Lightner clamped him in a half and tight waist and pinned him. Always thought that Matter could have been a 3 time NCAA champ if he had not "got caught." This is semantics only. Norm Palovsic where are you?
 
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To me the term "Getting Caught" is achieved in 2 parts. As the above post talks about it in Andy Matter lost.
When I hear the term, I normally associate it with
A. The better wrestler got beat by pin or big throw to back that was the difference in outcome.
B. The move that created "Getting Caught" was either started by the better wrestler doing something "stupid" or the underdog kid hitting something that is very seldom successful against a quality opponent.
Examples; I don't consider what Bo did to Martin or Joseph pin of Martinez as getting caught. Similar skilled wrestlers.
Rohn Cement Mixer on Lembrect was "Getting Caught".
 
In 20 years, the scorebook will still say “Fall 4:33.” That’s all there is to the debate. Getting caught is fun to talk about on a forum. Fun, but irrelevant.
 
Quick question Did PSU release our tickets to Nationals yet. I have two lower level that I am going to have to sell and did not get them yet
 
Abe Assad definitely got caught last night and it was glorious. Lance couldn't quite finish off the what would have been the biggest upset of the season, but it made for a thrilling second half of that match.
 
Thank you, everyone. At the risk of being PC, I appreciate everyone's perspective. Our differences of opinion, and acceptance of reasonable differences are what respectful dialogue is all about. This thread stayed between the ditches, and I'm sure will continue.
 
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