Heroin kills more people than cars 27,000 per year(Frontline)

[jjg247]

That is "15K a Month" for our beloved politicians for just hanging around Washington for six years, and Boyer worries about a Vice Cop!!!

Tasty sound bite, but not even close to factual. Just like any other Fed, congressional pensions are calculated using years of service and high 3 salary.

http://www.factcheck.org/2015/01/congressional-pensions-update/

 

[LaJolla Lion]

I would recommend you just get informed. Read up on the issue. There's been no shortage of draconian sentences. We've had to basically double the size of the federal prison system to handle all the people serving long sentences for drug offenses. Maybe you want to double it again or quadruple it again. But you could throw another million people in prison (which is SUPER expensive by the way) and it still wouldn't stop people from using drugs and distributing drugs. There are limits to what government can accomplish, and both liberals and conservatives need to be reminded of that from time to time.

I think the whole idea is really really dumb. Like most of you, I pay a LOT of taxes to the federal government. I want that money spent well. When I pay money for police and prisons, I want those resources used in a way that makes me safe. Taking crack addicts and small-time dealers and throwing them in prison for decades does NOT make me safer. In fact the space they take up means it is more likely that violent criminals get out sooner.

The job of police, the job of prisons, should ultimately be to make our lives safer. It should not be to enforce some people's idea of morality. We have enough problems in the world; we just can't be wasting precious taxpayer resources throwing people in jail over nonviolent drug offenses.

And this is no radical opinion. There is a bipartisan consenses emerging in Washington on this -- some very liberal and very conservative people in Congress are starting to look at it this way. Changes are coming..

Agree. He keeps going to Freddie Gray which is a joke. The drug problem is real and prison hasn't solved it. You take Freddie Gray off the streets and the epidemic still exists. Maybe if we lock up all inner city dealers and druggies, the problem is fixed. LOL

I've carried caskets due to this epidemic and I don't blame the dealers. The world isn't perfect,but caging people for drugs has not worked at all. It keeps good people employed though so there are 2 sides to this business. It has to make you wonder.

 

[wilbury]

You are right on the money Spin Master. I keep hearing that individuals who sold an ounce of MJ end up with 20-25 years in prison. Nothing could be further from the truth. Our prisons are "full of repeat offenders" meaning at least 95% of them have committed felony crimes before. And, that is the crimes that they were arrested of convicted of.

If these maggots would have just served the sentence they originally received, 15-20 years, You can bet your ass there would not be an overflow problem with the need to build more prisons. And, your point about the Welfare system and the continuous birth out of wedlock, namely in our cities, continually turns these fatherless kids into hard core criminals, Gang Bangers who also start collecting welfare and think life is good by selling more drugs. Thanks to Obama, they now have a free cell phone to conduct their business.

These liberal politicians will do anything to just keep the votes they need to stay in office. I'm talking about politicians that are "liberal multi-millionaires" Polosi, Reid, the Clintons just made "145 million dollars" and Hillary is trying to pander to the black community by bringing up racism, and she thinks she is for the "middle class." Nothing could be further from the truth.

Boyer says that Vice Detectives are making 160K a year with over time from drug cases. Maybe some are, but I can speak right form the horses mouth that a lot of them don't come close to making that kind of money. But, "Politicians" serve six years in congress and get a life time pension of "15K" with every benefit you can think of, and they Do Not contribute one stinking dime to get that insane pension!!!

Even if detectives are making $160k per month, I don't see how you can infer that they are in some way and individually perpetuating the drug issue so that they can remain employed and well paid. That's like saying I'm an engineer so I'm intentionally keeping roads and bridges in poor condition so I continually have work to do.

 

[Michael.Felli]

Even if detectives are making $160k per month, I don't see how you can infer that they are in some way and individually perpetuating the drug issue so that they can remain employed and well paid. That's like saying I'm an engineer so I'm intentionally keeping roads and bridges in poor condition so I continually have work to do.

Not an accurate analogy. Broken roads don't keep people addicted.

There is a plethora of data to support how crack addicts and heroin addicts act. Two of the most telling movies are "Requiem for a Dream" and "The Fighter". Both encapsulate, IMO, the struggles addicts face and what they will do for their fix.

Look at the cigarette industry...get them hooked and you've got a product they will be addicted to for life.

 

[Michael.Felli]

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Yeah, great point by point comeback.

And so many have listened to your liberal, feel-good tripe that the drug problem just gets worse and worse. Its the liberal policies that destroyed the families of the poor, black and white. Policies that brought us fatherless kids, teenage pregnancies, high school drop outs, women with five kids to three or four different men....and none of them acting as responsible fathers. I know a guy that student taught 8th grade. In one class of 24 kids, four girls were pregnant, one with her second child! Eighth-frickin-grade!!! Those girls and their kids have about no chance of a decent life.

Change the damn system and save the next generation as it is too late for the last two or three.

Well, yeah, the system does need changing. Drug education needs to start in grammar school and CONTINUE throughout high school. I've stated many times that we, also, need mandatory community service in the public education system (notably, nursing homes and jails). Kids "need" to see first hand their future (nursing homes) and a possible future (jails). You want a CHANGE in systems, these kids, once adults and in power will be educated from day one to effectively enact change. It's up to OUR generation to get it started by MANDATING drug education, sex education starting in grammar school and MANDATING community service hours to progress from grade-to-grade.

 

[tboyer]

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I recommend you go back and re-read the thread. No one....not one....said anything about jailing addicts. Or even small dealers. Or marijuana users.

...and I'm not saying there's no role for law enforcement in trying to stop heroin/cocaine distribution.

But anybody who suggests we can solve the problem by arresting another million people and building another 100 prisons -- it won't work. We already tried it with Prohibition and Prohibition II. The US has the world's highest incarceration rate ALREADY and illegal drug use is more widespread than it has ever been. It is one of the biggest reasons the U.S. economy isn't growing -- drug enforcement has removed so many people from the potential work force because they can't get jobs -- they can't even get educated.

We desperately need to be imprisoning FEWER people not more. We need to be using our prisons for violent criminals, period.

This thread started with some statistic about 27,000 people dying of heroin overdoses. If you want to try to save their lives, you had better think about new ways to approach the problem. Because the old ways aren't working. They are not saving anybody from heroin, but they are putting lots of people in jail and making lots of money for the army of people involved in drug enforcement. I am very tired of paying for this with my taxes because I don't see much benefit. There are 1000 better things to spend our money on.

 

[PSU20]

. Iran has executed thousands of people in a bid to deter drug trafficking in the country, even though the authorities have admitted it doesn’t work.

When you enter Singapore on the back of your customs card are big bold letters, "Death to Drug Traffickers", and Singapore Does Not have a drug problem. No crack houses, no one on street corners selling drugs, none!
Regarding Freddie Gray, if he would have had to serve out the mandatory sentence, just one time with all the arrests he had, "He would still be alive today"

 

[The Spin Meister]

The world isn't perfect,but caging people for drugs has not worked at all. It keeps good people employed though so there are 2 sides to this business. It has to make you wonder.

Look at the cigarette industry...get them hooked and you've got a product they will be addicted to for life.

So its the Prison Industrial Complex that is running the drug epidemic. Thats just toooo funny.

 

[The Spin Meister]

...and I'm not saying there's no role for law enforcement in trying to stop heroin/cocaine distribution.

But anybody who suggests we can solve the problem by arresting another million people and building another 100 prisons -- it won't work. We already tried it with Prohibition and Prohibition II. The US has the world's highest incarceration rate ALREADY and illegal drug use is more widespread than it has ever been. It is one of the biggest reasons the U.S. economy isn't growing -- drug enforcement has removed so many people from the potential work force because they can't get jobs -- they can't even get educated.

We desperately need to be imprisoning FEWER people not more. We need to be using our prisons for violent criminals, period.

This thread started with some statistic about 27,000 people dying of heroin overdoses. If you want to try to save their lives, you had better think about new ways to approach the problem. Because the old ways aren't working. They are not saving anybody from heroin, but they are putting lots of people in jail and making lots of money for the army of people involved in drug enforcement. I am very tired of paying for this with my taxes because I don't see much benefit. There are 1000 better things to spend our money on.

---------------------------------------------
Again, go back a re-read the thread. I posted several things that need to be done other than just imprisoning people. Takes a lot of effort on several fronts. I agree with Felli *gasp* that kids should do charity work including in prisons. Would do them a world of good. But you need to attack both demand side and supply side to solve the problem.

Had a friend addicted to crack and blew his brains out with a .44 Mag. Poor wife ran to bedroom to witness the carnage...left behind two kids...imagine how traumatized they were...are as that will never leave them. Dealers who sell this sh!t should be tried for 2nd degree murder, at the least.

PS thanks to mods for leaving this post on board as it has been very informative.

 

[massimoManca II]

. "Heroin Kills More People Than Cars..."

I've seen people put things like nitrous and ethanol in their cars, but never opiates.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

So its the Prison Industrial Complex that is running the drug epidemic. Thats just toooo funny.

2 sides has a different meaning to you I guess. I'm not really surprised that some here don't like hearing about how the war on drugs is a failure. It is and it has done NOTHING to stop drug abuse. A few token arrests and seizures every now and then.....whooooopeee! Stiffer penalties won't stop the problem, but who really cares about dealers and junkies? I mean they are worthless right. Maybe you can invest in the booming private prison industry!!!