How on earth is a lateral move
- Thread starter steelymcbeem
- Start date
TN has a better chance of being a Top 10 program than PSU within the next 2 years. More exposure for Shoop short term and he wants to be a head coach now. Add to it slightly more money and his family like Tennessee.
He will not pay the buyout and it has nothing to do with Donovan.
Isn't Shoop taking a loss? 3yr, 1mill with 800k buyout at PSU. 3yr, 1.15mill minus 800k.
Something is not right here, and I hope the lazy press starts scrutinizing this more carefully. I.e. Did Shoop leave because CJF is a sinking ship?
Something is not right here, and I hope the lazy press starts scrutinizing this more carefully. I.e. Did Shoop leave because CJF is a sinking ship?
Agree totally. Tenn has a great deal of defensive talent and that talent (none of it Shoop's) will make him look like a defensive genius and get him the head coaching job he wants. All he has to do is line them up.
PSU is still a few years away from that. It will take another 2-3 years for PSU to have the talent they need.
Shoop won't pay a penny of that buyout himself. UT Boosters will pick it up. Even if Shoop despised working with Franklin (and choosing to stay with Franklin for the past 5 years would disprove that) he's not going to pony up 800k out of his own pocket to move on.
As for Donovan Smith's comment, I realize why there's controversy here but what he said is fairly common response to someone changing jobs and chasing their own goals. Shoop is not a long term hire for UT. He's gone in another year or two b/c he has ambitions to be a HC.
U TN boosters could be paying the buyout, via side deal(s).
That's one possibility that has been raised. It's consistent with U TN saying they didn't pay it.
It's not lateral if you take a very short-term view, which I suppose is the norm for guys in his field. If you ask which school will have more wins over the next ten years, it looks very lateral - but I don't think he cares about that beyond a year or two.
I'm sure folks are right that a tenn booster or a combination of tenn boosters are paying the buyout. When it was said that tenn was not responsible for the buyout, that meant the university. Boosters can pay the buyout to Penn State. I'm sure Shoop accepted the tenn offer knowing he would not have to pay the buyout.
danvillenit is right regarding the lateral move issue. It is a lateral move in that Penn State and tenn are comparable programs in terms of history, facilities, prestige, conference affiliation, fanbase, etc. However, Shoop is focused on the short term. He wants to be a head coach soon. To do that, he obviously has to be successful as a defensive coordinator, and he must believe that he can have greater success at tenn in the next couple of years based on their roster. Penn State is still rebuilding and also has to contend with Tosu and um. The job is harder at Penn State right now.
It would not surprise me if Shoop came to Penn State two years ago with his eyes on becoming a head coach soon. Two good years at Penn State (good defense, though an average team overall) did not get him looks at head coaching jobs, so he probably grew impatient and felt he needed to go elsewhere. After spurning LSU and Auburn, tenn finally presented the opportunity he was looking for.
Another possibility, and it is just speculation, is that Shoop and Franklin had a falling out. If so, it likely would happened in the past few weeks looking at Shoop's comments after turning down Auburn. It is possible that Franklin grew tired of the constant distraction and uncertainty and they had words, but we will probably never know that.
danvillenit is right regarding the lateral move issue. It is a lateral move in that Penn State and tenn are comparable programs in terms of history, facilities, prestige, conference affiliation, fanbase, etc. However, Shoop is focused on the short term. He wants to be a head coach soon. To do that, he obviously has to be successful as a defensive coordinator, and he must believe that he can have greater success at tenn in the next couple of years based on their roster. Penn State is still rebuilding and also has to contend with Tosu and um. The job is harder at Penn State right now.
It would not surprise me if Shoop came to Penn State two years ago with his eyes on becoming a head coach soon. Two good years at Penn State (good defense, though an average team overall) did not get him looks at head coaching jobs, so he probably grew impatient and felt he needed to go elsewhere. After spurning LSU and Auburn, tenn finally presented the opportunity he was looking for.
Another possibility, and it is just speculation, is that Shoop and Franklin had a falling out. If so, it likely would happened in the past few weeks looking at Shoop's comments after turning down Auburn. It is possible that Franklin grew tired of the constant distraction and uncertainty and they had words, but we will probably never know that.
I think there's more to it - Franklin knows Shoop moves to an HC role soon and TN wants a very short term DC-mercenary as they are peaking this coming year. Franklin wants to keep Pry and he's not one to let issues 'fester' like Shoop's annual need to be serenaded.
Franklin wants his guys on-board as he understands we are not an environment that is used to the standard college coaching turnstile dynamic of today. I think Franklin tells him, "Bobby, maybe it makes sense you go."
Shoop seeall the DCs getingHC
Exactly. The market is hot right now for DCs to HC but you have to be from a winning programs, Alabama, Michigan, MSU, OSU,
Tennessee may be peaking, but the won't be able to play with the big boys in the SEC West. Their ceiling is winning the East.
I don't buy this theory. Franklin was close to Donovan. Even said it was the hardest decision he has made and has had trouble dealing with it, but it had to be done.
Tennessee is loaded with talent on both sides of the field. They held Bammer to its lowest point total of the season, at Tuscaloser, and lost by 5 points.
Tennessee is an all-time Top 10 football program. Forbes recently named Tennessee the 3rd Most Valuable football team behind Texas and Notre Dame.
Shoop took a job at a school where he has the greatest chance to have a Great defense and get much more recognition for his skills as a defensive coordinator.
It was not a lateral move by Shoop.
Tennessee is an all-time Top 10 football program. Forbes recently named Tennessee the 3rd Most Valuable football team behind Texas and Notre Dame.
Shoop took a job at a school where he has the greatest chance to have a Great defense and get much more recognition for his skills as a defensive coordinator.
It was not a lateral move by Shoop.
TN can say what they like, but I'm pretty sure TN has bought the liability under contract law once they offer a party a contract who is already under exclusive contract to another party and that pre-existing contract names a "buyout provision". IOW, if it came to a civil suit, TN would be a named co-defendant and would not have a leg to stand on or any hope whatsoever of successfully defending the suit.
I think the term "peak" is being misused here... "We should be as good as we have been in quite a few years", is a much better way to say it. We just had a 9 win season and our 4 losses came by 17 total points. (lost by 5 at Bama)... I would say our peak is higher than winning the east and we can compete with the west. However, I think 10 or 11 wins and winning the east is a realistic goal for next season.
Moral victories aside, the East hasn't won the SEC title game since 2008, and that isn't changing anytime soon. Like it or not, the west runs the SEC like the east is stacked in the BIG.
Yes, your delusions of grandeur are cute.
Yes, your delusions of grandeur are cute.
I would be less concerned about this, and more concerned about finding a new username.
Yes, but from Shoop's POV, winning the SEC East is a very high ceiling. He's taking the DC job, not the HC position. If they win the East and play (and likely to lose to West winner) in the SEC Championship game, the view will be that TN is in that game in large part because of the great job that Shoop did with TN's defense. That will position him perfectly for a high end HC position very quickly.
All any of Tennessee's opponents have to do is watch Army,Maryland,and Northwestern tapes for runs,and OSU,MSU,and Georgia for passing.
Tennessee the same chance of winning the east as we do,difference is we win the east our chances for a big championship are better.
As Steve Spurrier said you can't spell citrus without UT.
Tennessee the same chance of winning the east as we do,difference is we win the east our chances for a big championship are better.
As Steve Spurrier said you can't spell citrus without UT.
Could be a jump off point for a HC job -- see Kirby Smart. But he'll be compared to Will Muschamp, Smart, and new Bama DC Jeremy Pruitt. And Butch Jones will be quick to pull the trigger if Shoop fails to improve the Vol defense.
Tennessee is a top top 10 program all time? Wow. Self-awareness is a good thing. You should get some.
Another possibility is that PSU let him out of the buyout, or greatly reduced it, because Franklin has already identified a replacement and all sides are ready to move on. I think this might be more likely than anybody paying $800,000 to get a defensive coordinator out of his contract (boosters or otherwise).
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Bama is going to be down next year, as the Tide loses 10 NFL-quality front 7 defenders, their All-Conference CB Jones, their starting QB, and All-Conference C Kelly. And recruiting will be down w/ Saban concentrating on BCSNC game. Look for Ole Miss, Auburn, TAMU (now that it has raided Oklahoma for starting QB Knight), even Arkansas passing the Crimson Tide. Saban will play youngsters like TB Bo Scarborough and point to 2017.
This is one way to keep Brent Pry, by making him the DC. He's just as desirable and a "genius" as Shoop. Depends on who CJF gets as LB coach. Maybe a NJ HS coach who can recruit that state.
Fans are usually blinded by fandom -
Most football fans are blinded by loyalty, I live close to and keep an eye on Tennessee Football. They have struggled since winning the National Championship in late 90's but things are most assuredly looking up.
They have an excellent head coach.
It's been a very long road back to relevance for them.
Does it sound familiar ??
Yeah, we'll be lucky to win 4 games next year with no talent left after everyone leaves. And Saban has always been a slouch at recruiting those years we are in NC game.
Agree on Pry. That's why I think CJF made such a big deal about him staying, Franklin may have known this was on the horizon but couldn't say anything at the time.
Agree this is 1-2 yr deal. After the Auburn deal I think Franklin told him to just go. Shoop also knows team is going to change next year with some key DL going to NFL. The odds are Def will fall off with his stock following. TN will be a bit better with team returning. They are at optimum in short term, and Shoop cannot afford a fall off.
I still think his buyout is personally taxable income, but would like to hear someone weigh in on that.
We led Alabama deep into the 4th quarter in Tuscaloosa before they came back and beat us. It was a defensive breakdown that Shoop was hired to fix.
Please read my other post in this thread regarding the SEC East. As another has posted, self-awareness is a good thing. When the top teams in the East ACTUALLY beat some of the top teams in the West, moral victories aside, then you can start talking.
So when have you beaten MSU and OSU recently? I'm not sure you should be throwing stones. How was your game vs Northwestern? You may want to try on that self awarenessyou speak so much about. Not trying to flame, but your hate for TN has clouded your judgment.
