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Hudson Clement, WV Redshirt Freshman, has historic 1st game

Kasparaitis said:
Look in a mirror. The kid is obviously a great athlete and it’s a revealing story. Overlooked by all the “experts” he’s given a shot by the hometown team and is well on his way to making it pay off big time. Makes you wonder, why would anyone be reluctant to acknowledge the obvious?
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Not sure what you are asserting. I'm happy for the kid and wvu. That doesn't mean PSU should have had anything to do with him. He scored a bunch of TDs in the WV state championship and demlion (as I recall) asserted that the staff should do 'something' as a result.

Some, me included, noted that if PSU has an $8m coach and is trying to land top 10 recruiting classes averaging 4*, then it better not be scouring the panhandle of WV for kids with no ratings and zero D1 offers, in December, because it needs players to fill a recruiting class.
I've been very consistent on this. For example, John Urschel wound up a great player for PSU, but the fact that he wound up at PSU was an absolute indictment of the state of the program at the time. He had zero offers, after his final game of his senior season. If Paterno was fully functioning at that point, there's no way PSU wouldn't have had options, and would have needed to scour the back roads of NY for hidden gems, just to fill a class.

Good luck to Hudson. He may wind up having a nice college career. But that means nothing to anyone at Penn State, and demlion continuing to post stories about his success, as if it buttresses his assertion that the PSU staff dropped the ball or something, is illogical.
 
heckmans said:
Not sure what you are asserting. I'm happy for the kid and wvu. That doesn't mean PSU should have had anything to do with him. He scored a bunch of TDs in the WV state championship and demlion (as I recall) asserted that the staff should do 'something' as a result.

Some, me included, noted that if PSU has an $8m coach and is trying to land top 10 recruiting classes averaging 4*, then it better not be scouring the panhandle of WV for kids with no ratings and zero D1 offers, in December, because it needs players to fill a recruiting class.
I've been very consistent on this. For example, John Urschel wound up a great player for PSU, but the fact that he wound up at PSU was an absolute indictment of the state of the program at the time. He had zero offers, after his final game of his senior season. If Paterno was fully functioning at that point, there's no way PSU wouldn't have had options, and would have needed to scour the back roads of NY for hidden gems, just to fill a class.

Good luck to Hudson. He may wind up having a nice college career. But that means nothing to anyone at Penn State, and demlion continuing to post stories about his success, as if it buttresses his assertion that the PSU staff dropped the ball or something, is illogical.
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Curt Warner. Except, he was a Parade All American at the time, I believe.
 
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Rip_E_2_Joe_PA said:
Curt Warner. Except, he was a Parade All American at the time, I believe.
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not sure what a parade all-american has in common with a young man that no one ever heard of until his final game of his senior season who had zero offers and no ratings.
 
demlion said:
Some of you may recall a couple years ago when I asked if PSU had any interest in this kid from Martinsburg, WV. He had scored EIGHT TDs in the state championship game the year before as a wideout. Anyway, some of you interpreted this as suggesting PSU should have offered him a scholarship, and gave me the usual guff about how he wasn't listed on the recruiting services, blah, blah, blah.

Well, he finally got to play in WVU's game against Duquesne this past Saturday. RS Freshman. The first time he touched the ball? TD. 5 catches for 177 yds. THREE TDs.
https://apnews.com/article/west-vir...ineers-dukes-d880c6eefe4a040a2293e465e6bb3de1.
No idea how much he plays going forward, but I would call this a good start.
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I have no problem with any school leaving a number of scholarships open to players who for whatever reason didn't get recognized, playing time or competition. I think the transfer portal is exposing weaknesses in recruiting from the top-rated down. I think these players can push some of the higher-rated ones who seem to go backwards or even just plateau when the competition gets tougher. It's take the post-Paterno era nearly a dozen years to produce a high draft prospect in the OL despite all the banter about how bad the old recruiting and strength training was...and the annual hopes that 'this is the year for the OL'...at least the premature applause for the S&C program has leveled off.
 
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Let's be real--if he was in the portal right now no major program would show interest. Happy for the kid--hope he continues to contribute but this thread existing is comical.
 
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KC-KS-Lion said:
I have no problem with any school leaving a number of scholarships open to players who for whatever reason didn't get recognized, playing time or competition. I think the transfer portal is exposing weaknesses in recruiting from the top-rated down. I think these players can push some of the higher-rated ones who seem to go backwards or even just plateau when the competition gets tougher. It's take the post-Paterno era nearly a dozen years to produce a high draft prospect in the OL despite all the banter about how bad the old recruiting and strength training was...and the annual hopes that 'this is the year for the OL'...at least the premature applause for the S&C program has leveled off.
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FINALLY someone seems to understand! Maybe the star rankings are wrong sometimes. Maybe some of the 4 and 5 stars just are not that good, or built up great stats because their QB had all day to throw. The idea that the star-ranking system is the only way to know if a player is any good is ridiculous. Brock Purdy was the LAST guy chosen in the draft. He is going to the super bowl next month.
 
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demlion said:
FINALLY someone seems to understand! Maybe the star rankings are wrong sometimes. Maybe some of the 4 and 5 stars just are not that good, or built up great stats because their QB had all day to throw. The idea that the star-ranking system is the only way to know if a player is any good is ridiculous. Brock Purdy was the LAST guy chosen in the draft. He is going to the super bowl next month.
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That is not the point you were trying to make in this thread
And every single person alive comprehends that the rankings aren't right
You're focus is Clement not the system--own it
 
KC-KS-Lion said:
I have no problem with any school leaving a number of scholarships open to players who for whatever reason didn't get recognized, playing time or competition. I think the transfer portal is exposing weaknesses in recruiting from the top-rated down. I think these players can push some of the higher-rated ones who seem to go backwards or even just plateau when the competition gets tougher. It's take the post-Paterno era nearly a dozen years to produce a high draft prospect in the OL despite all the banter about how bad the old recruiting and strength training was...and the annual hopes that 'this is the year for the OL'...at least the premature applause for the S&C program has leveled off.
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So your summation is that a school should dedicate a number (10% would be 2-3/yr) of schollies to kids with no/few offers in December of their senior year, instead of pursuing kids that have performed well and have been deemed to have a solid likelihood of success on the college level?

So, in effect, you're saying a school should pursue a strategy of replacing approx 10% of its 3-4* recruits with 0-2* recruits?
No offense intended, but this strategy would have a statistically significant negative impact to the quality of football a team could hope to field.
 
LandoComando said:
That is not the point you were trying to make in this thread
And every single person alive comprehends that the rankings aren't right
You're focus is Clement not the system--own it
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Clement is the one I know personally. As others pointed out, the transfer portal tells us lots of kids are in the wrong place. I never said PSU should have recruited him, I merely asked if anyone from PSU ever even had him on the radar. Not even a criticism, just a question.
 
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demlion said:
FINALLY someone seems to understand! Maybe the star rankings are wrong sometimes. Maybe some of the 4 and 5 stars just are not that good, or built up great stats because their QB had all day to throw. The idea that the star-ranking system is the only way to know if a player is any good is ridiculous. Brock Purdy was the LAST guy chosen in the draft. He is going to the super bowl next month.
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Maybe maybe maybe. Could a shoulda woulda.
Respectfully, there is something you DON'T understand, it seems.
The PSU staff has limited hours during the year to recruit. It's impossible to touch every kid playing HS football. PSU has been performing in approx the 90th percentile of CFB under JF.
Honest and basic math question. Do you think PSU will successfully recruit a higher volume of good players by focusing their limited time on the pool of known high-performing HS kids, or getting in the 'American Pickers' van and driving the back roads of America looking for John Urschel?
It's a simple game of numbers. No top school is concerned about missing on Hudson Clement (or John Urschel) because spending the time to find him, means not spending time to recruit 5 other known high-value players.....and for the sake of argument, I'm granting your assumption that Clement will be a P5 "star"...but in reality, it's far too soon to tell. I'm 2023 he only had success against the worst teams in the B12 and against UNC that was without 7 starters, including their NFL QB who would have kept the ball away from the wvu offense far more.

As Landon said, the fact that this is a thread is ridiculous.
 
demlion said:
Clement is the one I know personally. As others pointed out, the transfer portal tells us lots of kids are in the wrong place. I never said PSU should have recruited him, I merely asked if anyone from PSU ever even had him on the radar. Not even a criticism, just a question.
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The funniest part, perhaps, of this conversation is that the transfer portal makes an even stronger case to ignore all but the top HS players. Let the diamonds in the rough develop in the MAC or at Rutgers, and if they perform well, most will look for bigger and greener pastures.
 
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heckmans said:
The funniest part, perhaps, of this conversation is that the transfer portal makes an even stronger case to ignore all but the top HS players. Let the diamonds in the rough develop in the MAC or at Rutgers, and if they perform well, most will look for bigger and greener pastures.
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The top teams have and will continue to go after the players they have determined are the most talented. And going down the pecking order of teams the teams that can't attract the top players will take flyers on players that they believe have some chance to develop and help them win games. Nothing has changed in that regard.

The portal will allow teams to fill needs more quickly and take more of those players lower rated or not rated at all out of high school that ended up as better players than what was foreseen away from their original colleges. The rich get richer. But from the players perspective some will get to the teams of their dreams which seems to be the american way........
 
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heckmans said:
The funniest part, perhaps, of this conversation is that the transfer portal makes an even stronger case to ignore all but the top HS players. Let the diamonds in the rough develop in the MAC or at Rutgers, and if they perform well, most will look for bigger and greener pastures.
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Agreed. Plus, if you want to find yourself out of a job, try to be the coach that gets famous for finding the 2 and 3 star players that become NFL superstars.
 
heckmans said:
So your summation is that a school should dedicate a number (10% would be 2-3/yr) of schollies to kids with no/few offers in December of their senior year, instead of pursuing kids that have performed well and have been deemed to have a solid likelihood of success on the college level?

So, in effect, you're saying a school should pursue a strategy of replacing approx 10% of its 3-4* recruits with 0-2* recruits?
No offense intended, but this strategy would have a statistically significant negative impact to the quality of football a team could hope to field.
Click to expand...
I'm not suggesting any specific percentage other than more than 0%. Not sure if this is a good example, but the former WR Norwood was a basketball player who ran great short (basketball cutting) routes and caught about everything thrown his way....just caught something on Patrick Mahomes where they reviewed his high school basketball play and compared it to his QB play.

It's situational. There needs to be some foundational knowledge, or relationship with someone who does, on any player...the history with LBs Jack Ham (his high school teammate went to bat for him) and Shane Conlin might have fit this scenario.
 
heckmans said:
The funniest part, perhaps, of this conversation is that the transfer portal makes an even stronger case to ignore all but the top HS players. Let the diamonds in the rough develop in the MAC or at Rutgers, and if they perform well, most will look for bigger and greener pastures.
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This x 1000
 
heckmans said:
The funniest part, perhaps, of this conversation is that the transfer portal makes an even stronger case to ignore all but the top HS players. Let the diamonds in the rough develop in the MAC or at Rutgers, and if they perform well, most will look for bigger and greener pastures.
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😂
 
KC-KS-Lion said:
I have no problem with any school leaving a number of scholarships open to players who for whatever reason didn't get recognized, playing time or competition. I think the transfer portal is exposing weaknesses in recruiting from the top-rated down. I think these players can push some of the higher-rated ones who seem to go backwards or even just plateau when the competition gets tougher. It's take the post-Paterno era nearly a dozen years to produce a high draft prospect in the OL despite all the banter about how bad the old recruiting and strength training was...and the annual hopes that 'this is the year for the OL'...at least the premature applause for the S&C program has leveled off.
Click to expand...
It took the Paterno era a dozen years to produce a high level ol draft prospect. 1 his last 15 years. 3 from 82-2012
 
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heckmans said:
Not sure what you are asserting. I'm happy for the kid and wvu. That doesn't mean PSU should have had anything to do with him. He scored a bunch of TDs in the WV state championship and demlion (as I recall) asserted that the staff should do 'something' as a result.

Some, me included, noted that if PSU has an $8m coach and is trying to land top 10 recruiting classes averaging 4*, then it better not be scouring the panhandle of WV for kids with no ratings and zero D1 offers, in December, because it needs players to fill a recruiting class.
I've been very consistent on this. For example, John Urschel wound up a great player for PSU, but the fact that he wound up at PSU was an absolute indictment of the state of the program at the time. He had zero offers, after his final game of his senior season. If Paterno was fully functioning at that point, there's no way PSU wouldn't have had options, and would have needed to scour the back roads of NY for hidden gems, just to fill a class.

Good luck to Hudson. He may wind up having a nice college career. But that means nothing to anyone at Penn State, and demlion continuing to post stories about his success, as if it buttresses his assertion that the PSU staff dropped the ball or something, is illogical.
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That backwoods area put out a pretty good RB at Pitt who was very good friends of the Urschels. PSU wanted him but Pitt had offered, he accepted, and even though PSU offered later, he decided to stick to his commitment.
 
KCLion said:
That backwoods area put out a pretty good RB at Pitt who was very good friends of the Urschels. PSU wanted him but Pitt had offered, he accepted, and even though PSU offered later, he decided to stick to his commitment.
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He committed During sanctions. Psu offered before he committed anywhere.
 
The Spin Meister said:
Dem lives in WV, just pushing his homeboys. No big deal.
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Exactly. A guy points out a great story about a local kid with the potential to beat the odds and right on cue the know-it-alls chime in to downplay it. Then when he actually does start beating the odds they dig in and double down. It’s so predictable it’s just funny to watch. Knowing what I know about exceptional athletes, which this kid appears to be, they will probably have to step up their criticism as his success continues to build.
 
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Kasparaitis said:
Exactly. A guy points out a great story about a local kid with the potential to beat the odds and right on cue the know-it-alls chime in to downplay it. Then when he actually does start beating the odds they dig in and double down. It’s so predictable it’s just funny to watch. Knowing what I know about exceptional athletes, which this kid appears to be, they will probably have to step up their criticism as his success continues to build.
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The discussion isn't him "beating the odds" read between the lines
 
Kasparaitis said:
Exactly. A guy points out a great story about a local kid with the potential to beat the odds and right on cue the know-it-alls chime in to downplay it. Then when he actually does start beating the odds they dig in and double down. It’s so predictable it’s just funny to watch. Knowing what I know about exceptional athletes, which this kid appears to be, they will probably have to step up their criticism as his success continues to build.
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You've missed the story arc of this entirely. It all started when young Hudson, from Martinsburg, WV scored a bunch of TDs in the WV state championship and, as I recall, Demlion asserted that PSU should be involved or dropped the ball or something like that. Others, including myself, noted that PSU is competing for Top 10 recruiting classes and doesn't have the cycles to, nor should they be, scouring the back roads of America searching for players with zero offers at the end of their Senior year. I remember looking him up and the only mention of college FB for young Hudson I could find anywhere was DII Shepherd Univ.
Since then, every time Mr Clement achieves something, Demlion revitalizes this ridiculous thread as some sort of evidence that PSU dropped the ball or something? The premise was absurd at the start, and continuing to post on a PSU board about a WV kid making a couple catches is border line mental.
 
heckmans said:
You've missed the story arc of this entirely. It all started when young Hudson, from Martinsburg, WV scored a bunch of TDs in the WV state championship and, as I recall, Demlion asserted that PSU should be involved or dropped the ball or something like that. Others, including myself, noted that PSU is competing for Top 10 recruiting classes and doesn't have the cycles to, nor should they be, scouring the back roads of America searching for players with zero offers at the end of their Senior year. I remember looking him up and the only mention of college FB for young Hudson I could find anywhere was DII Shepherd Univ.
Since then, every time Mr Clement achieves something, Demlion revitalizes this ridiculous thread as some sort of evidence that PSU dropped the ball or something? The premise was absurd at the start, and continuing to post on a PSU board about a WV kid making a couple catches is border line mental.
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i SIMPLY ASKED IF WE WERE RECRUITING THE KID. JFC, QUIT MAKING STUFF UP.
 
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The Spin Meister said:
Here is the original post;


Seems innocent enough. Especially since it is a homeboy for demlion.
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Look at that. Just as I said. And here comes the triple down. Wait til the kid makes all conference. They’ll tell us yeah but it’s a bad conference.
 
demlion said:
i SIMPLY ASKED IF WE WERE RECRUITING THE KID. JFC, QUIT MAKING STUFF UP.
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Yes. Sure. That was the only you said about the kid or Penn State...and nobody else joined in and said PSU should do something different. Definitely nobody suggested that PSU should be looking at kids with zero schollie offers in December of their Sr year. :rolleyes::rolleyes:
Also, if you had taken 10 seconds and searched the kid's name in the database of any of the recruiting services, you would have known that he wasn't on the radar of a single D1 school...but you already knew all this, didn't you? Because you then divulged that you knew the family. So you knew that he wasn't on the radar of PSU, or anyone for that matter. You just wanted to talk about a kid you know and posted it under false pretenses.

Now seriously. It's been 2 years and 3 months since you started posting nonsense about a kid that has never and will never have anything to do with Penn State football. If you want to talk about the ascent of HC, I'm sure the Mountaineer faithful will be happy to have you. Good luck to the young man. Now knock it off.
 
heckmans said:
Yes. Sure. That was the only you said about the kid or Penn State...and nobody else joined in and said PSU should do something different. Definitely nobody suggested that PSU should be looking at kids with zero schollie offers in December of their Sr year. :rolleyes::rolleyes:
Also, if you had taken 10 seconds and searched the kid's name in the database of any of the recruiting services, you would have known that he wasn't on the radar of a single D1 school...but you already knew all this, didn't you? Because you then divulged that you knew the family. So you knew that he wasn't on the radar of PSU, or anyone for that matter. You just wanted to talk about a kid you know and posted it under false pretenses.

Now seriously. It's been 2 years and 3 months since you started posting nonsense about a kid that has never and will never have anything to do with Penn State football. If you want to talk about the ascent of HC, I'm sure the Mountaineer faithful will be happy to have you. Good luck to the young man. Now knock it off.
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Who made you King of the Forum? Personally I like these types of stories. A guy I went to school with was a phenomenal athlete. He lettered in 4 different sports and had a scholarship offer to play basketball at Clemson. No one was interested in him as a baseball player until his legion season after graduating. A Major League Team signed him as a free agent and he went on to be an All Star and get MVP votes. The point is there are players out there and competent coaches/decision makers who do their homework can find them.
 
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Kasparaitis said:
Who made you King of the Forum? Personally I like these types of stories. A guy I went to school with was a phenomenal athlete. He lettered in 4 different sports and had a scholarship offer to play basketball at Clemson. No one was interested in him as a baseball player until his legion season after graduating. A Major League Team signed him as a free agent and he went on to be an All Star and get MVP votes. The point is there are players out there and competent coaches/decision makers who do their homework can find them.
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He's self-appointed. Picking players is tough. Lots of 4 stars never do squat. It aint the only way to finf a good player
 
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Kasparaitis said:
Who made you King of the Forum? Personally I like these types of stories. A guy I went to school with was a phenomenal athlete. He lettered in 4 different sports and had a scholarship offer to play basketball at Clemson. No one was interested in him as a baseball player until his legion season after graduating. A Major League Team signed him as a free agent and he went on to be an All Star and get MVP votes. The point is there are players out there and competent coaches/decision makers who do their homework can find them.
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He is self appointed.
 
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