Well, given your snide remark about Paterno in your post above, it appears that it’s all about Joe for you concerning your position on Sandusky. I will never fathom the hatred for Paterno by “Penn Staters” – truly baffling and sad. Given what the man did for PSU and how he lived his life it’s remarkable the contempt some have for him.
Kevin Slaten Comes "Out" For Sandusky's Innocence in Interview with John Ziegler
- Thread starter JohnZiegler
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Well, given your snide remark about Paterno in your post above, it appears that it’s all about Joe for you concerning your position on Sandusky. I will never fathom the hatred for Paterno by “Penn Staters” – truly baffling and sad. Given what the man did for PSU and how he lived his life it’s remarkable the contempt some have for him.
By far, the most stupid comment ever written on this board!
I never hated him and never said so. I just don't understand why people put him on a pedestal and worship him. I think he was a great man but had his faults. Joe has nothing to do with how a feel about Sandusky. To me it about the failure to act by many highly paid administrators who failed to protect the children and the university.
I'll fill you in. Jerry Sandusky used a childrens charity to groom the community and hand pick kids to abuse. He then molested around a dozen or so(probably more), 9 of them stories were presented at the trial. A few stated he forced them to give oral and he abused them. He was convicted on 45 counts and he will die in jail. Now you're up to speed.
A few think because he didn't have a good attorney he got a raw deal. Even though they still admit the man is probably guilty. IMO they are holding out hope like NUT stated because they somehow thing it will all be walked back one day. Kind of like kids that know Santa isn't real, but are in a bit of denial.
It should IMO. Their is too much sh--t going on these in law enforcement not to be concerned.
wrong place at wrong time with LE w/o oversight equals bad news for us all.
45 Convictions. Yeah...this isn't the case to play that card on. While law enforcement is not perfect, this wasn't the one they got wrong. I know that is a tough pill for some to swallow, but why not actually spend time and effort on legit cases that should be overturned? Jerry is NOT innocent, but I'm sure there are innocent people in jail. Why not help them instead of the child rapist?
45 convictions are nothing to the members of the "pics or it didn't happen" contingent.
A few things
Every celebrity has been put on a pedestal in the history of this country and since at least the turn of the 20th century sports celebrities have been put on a pedestal more so than probably any others. So lets stop with the grade school comments about hero worship. And given the fact that Paterno was put on a pedestal doesn't mean we don't realize he had faults. The fact is Paterno appeared to be a decent and honorable man who was unfairly wrapped up in this case and didn't do anything wrong. He is held in contempt because people inherently love to destroy others (especiallly those who are put on that proverbial pedestal), and because he was perceived to not have "done enough" - as if he is the archangel Michael hovering over the state of PA dispensing justice with his sword (Paterno tried on several occasions to convey that he couldn't grasp/relate the whole issue of CSA - almost certainly due to a generational gap). That is a standared no human can live up to which makes it all the more maddening to have to deal with the moral hyprocrites spouting off about Paterno, especially from those members of the the generations born after WWII - many of whom don't even have a moral compass to begin with when it comes to sexual mores. Yea, hang Joe, while I sit here and download porn to my phone.
As for your outrage at PSU officials - that is fine if it proves that they actually did anything illegal and nefarious; however, I hope you hold the overwhelming bulk of your contempt for the various public/state agencies (child welfare, law enforcement, etc) that failed miserably to catch sandusky for nearly 30 years while he established a huge children's charity right under their noses and adopted several kids and fostered a number of others - not to mention they completely blew the 1998 investigation. Also, how about the fact that none of PA's elected representatives has even bothered to launch an investigation concerning how this could have happened so that maybe we can prevent the next sandusky in the future. Hey, but everyone cares about the children - yea bite me. From a macro level viewpoint CSS are almost irrelevant given the massive failure of the PA state government pre and post sandusky. I think this is part of the lesson Blehar has been trying to get across. Truth is t a number of PA government officials both past and present should be rounded up and collectively lynched before we even discuss the possible failures of people at PSU.
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Free Jerry will free our soul of the torment we at Penn State live with every day.
The Jerry is guilty lie, proves, if you say it, you are a liar.
N i t t a n y A m e r i c a
The Jerry is guilty lie, proves, if you say it, you are a liar.
N i t t a n y A m e r i c a
unfortunately, certain board members whom I won't mention by name but we know who they are, always have to reply in a condescending manner. When will these windbags ever grow up? There are some serious issues with the prosecution of JS. I don't believe that he is innocent but he may not be guilty of all of the charges he was convicted of. Why doesn't PA drop the charges against Spanier, Curley and Schultz? If they really had a case it would never take this long to bring to trial
Come on, PSU_Nut. Don't be PC, just say it. You hated Joe, you always hated Joe, despite your repeated assertions to the contrary. Through cyber osmosis, I guess, I have inherited the powers of LaJolla. I can read your mind. So please don't be a coward, just come clean and admit your personal bias against all things JVP.
It's interesting. How does one receive a fair trial when the jury pool is so tainted, someone is viewed as a pervert based on what the GJP says and before all evidence has been produced?
I mean, theoretically example, let's say you have a guy accused of murdering a child. Let's say...this guy:
http://movies.uip.de/thegreenmile/img/photos/photo1.jpg
Who if you've seen the movie, you know he is actually innocent of the crime. But what does the jury think? What do people think pre-trial? Do people care that the child-killer didn't get a fair child? Is it embarrassing to read a book or watch a movie that is about a bunch of prison guards wondering if the child-killer is innocent or might be innocent? Was Tom Hank's character part of an insane cult? Because once you start using the LABELS, then you've already opened your mind...and you'll refuse to listen to any facts or any evidence.
And the fact that so many of you trolls fail to see the diffference between asking if someone is innoncent and asking if someone received a fair trial - well, that shows you're either really not bright or you're here with some agenda.
Hell, why bother to actually offer fair trials to ANYONE? I'm sure it worked well in Soviet Russia! Don't like someone, or is someone your political opponent? Charge them with treason - there is no way that traitor deserves a fair trial! In fact, you know, I don't give a crap whether that piece of $hit traitor ever got a fair trial. I'm glad the rest of his life is misery. (Nevermind if the charge is bull$hit, right?)
Don't believe JS is totally innocent
Do believe Fina and OAG are generally lying about a great deal in this case
should concern everyone when justice is screwed with in regard to anyone
don't understand why, when something is revealed that could possibly be construed to exonerate JS......the name calling accelerates?
Do believe Fina and OAG are generally lying about a great deal in this case
should concern everyone when justice is screwed with in regard to anyone
don't understand why, when something is revealed that could possibly be construed to exonerate JS......the name calling accelerates?
Your mangina still hurting? He pretty much did state what was on his mind. A few of you nutbags who follow JZ really hope and pray that the entire prosecution, law enforcement community, Jerry's lawyers, and victims were a part of the biggest cash grab scam ever. Who ever coordinated this all to come together with Jerry being convicted was a pure genius. I wonder how much their cut was. Hell they even got the courts to go along with it. I wonder if the jury was paid a % too.
Not really, CS&S are just exhausting all of their options. The state can't forbid them to do so. You do want them to get due process, right?
Reading back through the history of this case, it's apparent that both sides are exhausting their options. In fact, the judge assigned to this case is dragging his feet as much as any of the lawyers. I sincerely doubt this ever goes to trial.
For the millionth time, yes, the defense has filed a lot of motions but those motions wouldn't have been necessary if the OAG hadn't tried to severally violate CSS's rights (ex post facto, statue of limitations, Baldwin mess, etc.). Any defense lawyer with half a brain would have filed these motions.
Then to add more delay Judge Hoover sat on his ass for YEARS without making a ruling on ANY of the defendants motions! And people still try to blame CSS for the delays?? Come on now...use your brains a littler here and drill down to the root cause of the delays -- OAG's violation of CSS's rights and the judge not ruling on motions.
Oh yeah, and now Hoover is taking an open ended medical leave of absence....the case will now be transferred over to some other judge who now has to familiarize himself with the case, motions, etc......oh yay...more delays!!
As Fina said himself, the state has no intention of prosecuting the CSS cases.
People move the line. CSS trials have nothing to do with Jerry's conviction. It just furthers NUT's post in this thread.
I can see where the OAG's mishandling could cause delays and the need for unnecessary motions, but Hoover can only work with what he has in front of him and CS&S's lawyers have been more than helpful in dragging it out.
It would be nice to see what's being filed and who's doing what, but everything's under seal.
Also, I hadn't seen where Fina had said this. Do you have a link?
It would be nice to see what's being filed and who's doing what, but everything's under seal.
Also, I hadn't seen where Fina had said this. Do you have a link?
I would agree except when it comes to Hoover. Given the issues handed to him, mainly Baldwin and the atty/client issue, he's dealing with a mess. I'd rather they take the time to ensure that this trial only needs to happen ONCE.
Don't make excuses for Hoover. He's part of the problem. Who the heck do you think is putting everything under seal?
Take a deep breath. I'm not making excuses for him. I just feel that between the OAG, CS&S and Hoover, he's the least of the three.
It's not about due process. It's about delay. The first thing Spanier's lawyer did in this most recent appeal was file an application for a stay. That means just stop the whole case. There's no purpose for such an application at this stage other than delay.
The court of appeals rejected the stay in two days and told the defendants not to file any more applications for stay or extensions to file. I've never before seen a court of appeals rule in two days, so I guess the PA court system has gotten tired of the defendant's shenanigans.
I know. I was just being diplomatic. Spanier would appeal to the Galactic Senate on Coruscant if he thought it would buy him an extra 30 minutes...
First, nothing said on a message board will ever "hurt" me. Second, my post to nut was TIC, to demonstrate how inane your arrogant assumptions about others are. You, not surprisingly, didn't pick up on that. Even though I disagree with him on this, I really do believe him when he implies he has no animosity toward Joe. You see, most have the ability to discuss issues without resorting to putting words in people's mouths, or like you do, thoughts in their heads. In any event, this thread has run it's coarse. Has become way to repetitive and emotionally charged to apply any sort of logic.
Actually, not really. Most of the "issues" Hoover was sitting on were straight forward motions about statute of limitations being expired (2001 actual date vs 2002 date the OAG originally used so they could press charges), people not having their own attorneys testify against them (Baldwin), and ex post facto (OAG trying to apply a 2007 law to actions in 2001--US Constitution is VERY clear about this).
It wouldn't take a 1st year law student more than a few weeks to rule on such straight forward motions let alone YEARS -- Hoover sat on and still hasn't ruled on some of the above mentioned motions for YEARS. Let that sink in for a few minutes. Yet there are people wanting to put most of the blame for the 3.5 year delay on the admins....go figure...
Lastly, the people that handed Hoover all of these "issues" was the Pa OAG with their kangaroo court antics trying to file these charges in the first place. When prosecutors flagrantly violate people's Constitutional/State rights one can bet the Judge is going to get a flurry of motions filed from the defense addressing these flagrant violations. IOW Hoover can thank the OAG for handling him a flaming bag of dog poo to deal with.
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CDW, one thing that doesn't make sense to me is that Spanier successfully fought to have his lawsuit vs. Freeh delayed until after resolution of his criminal charges. On the surface, that would seem to indicate he feels pretty confident of the result of any trial. Otherwise, why would he want to delay the civil case? Thoughts?
Well, he didn't want to have to testify in his civil case because that would give the prosecutors a heads up on his criminal trial testimony (as well as being a possible waiver of his 5th Amendment right to not testify). That was my read on why he delayed filing suit for so long. I'm not sure why he suddenly started proceeding with it earlier this year. Maybe he thinks he can delay his deposition until after the criminal trial.
OK, thanks. But on the other hand, I'd also question Freeh's motivation in wanting to have it prior to the trial. Who knows motivation, I guess. I think we're all speculating at this point.
oops! never mind 
apparently the other Ziegler thread bit the dust, LOL
apparently the other Ziegler thread bit the dust, LOL
