Lots of "one off disasters" happen to every team. Michigan State - with a real chance at the CFB, lost in a terrible upset

[PSUEngineer89]

to ruin their season.

The point is - don't evaluate coaches on one game, one instance. It happens to everyone, every coach.

Evaluate coaches by taking into account the totality of what they've done, and what they're currently doing.

 

[Indian rocks rich]

to ruin their season.

The point is - don't evaluate coaches on one game, one instance. It happens to everyone, every coach.

Evaluate coaches by taking into account the totality of what they've done, and what they're currently doing.

Good luck trying to get your point across on this message board.It’s loaded with trolls

 

[Jerry]

to ruin their season.

The point is - don't evaluate coaches on one game, one instance. It happens to everyone, every coach.

Evaluate coaches by taking into account the totality of what they've done, and what they're currently doing.

It seems a shocker, but Vegas was ahead of the game: Michigan State went in as only a 3-point favorite. Now we know why.

Purdue turns out to be pretty darn good. Remember they beat Iowa by 17 in Iowa City. But I agree with your point.

That said, the issue with Franklin goes beyond the Illinois fiasco. I'm not a Franklin-basher. I just would like to know whether he's staying or going.

 

[Obliviax]

to ruin their season.

The point is - don't evaluate coaches on one game, one instance. It happens to everyone, every coach.

Evaluate coaches by taking into account the totality of what they've done, and what they're currently doing.

Ok. We’ve got three losses, largely due to not developing a second team QB coming off a season with a losing record despite having very good recruiting classes

 

[KCLion]

to ruin their season.

The point is - don't evaluate coaches on one game, one instance. It happens to everyone, every coach.

Evaluate coaches by taking into account the totality of what they've done, and what they're currently doing.

Purdue is tied for first on their side of the Big10 conference. Illinois is not.

 

[CJFisJoePaII]

Didn't just lose, but got beat quite soundly. Purdue put up almost 600 yards of offense on them and led for 90% of the game (MSU never led in this game!). Purdue was up 31-21 midway through 3rd and continued to build that lead such that they were up 37-21 with only 9 minutes remaining. Final score was 40-29 and the final result was really not in doubt for the entire final quarter.

 

[psuro]

The Big Ten will cannibalize itself this year. As far fetched as it sounds, (and it's not that far fetched) Ohio State can still lose a couple of division games. And then no Big Ten team in the College Football Invitational.

Pretty sure that would mean all Big Ten coaches in the East will lose their jobs.

 

[Lion Lineage]

Ok. We’ve got three losses, largely due to not developing a second team QB coming off a season with a losing record despite having very good recruiting classes

Our backup QB is playing for Kentucky. Couldn’t keep him. He wanted to play and is having a good season.

 

[KCLion]

Our backup QB is playing for Kentucky. Couldn’t keep him. He wanted to play and is having a good season.

BTW, he threw a pick 6 to end the game vs Tennessee last night.

 

[Jerry]

The Big Ten will cannibalize itself this year. As far fetched as it sounds, (and it's not that far fetched) Ohio State can still lose a couple of division games. And then no Big Ten team in the College Football Invitational.

Pretty sure that would mean all Big Ten coaches in the East will lose their jobs.

Ohio State looks far from dominant this year. They've got Purdue, Michigan State, and Michigan over the next three weeks, and I'd be really surprised if they don't lose at least one of those games.

But if they do win out, to include the conference championship, they'll definitely get a playoff bid...and will deserve one.

 

[psuro]

Ohio State looks far from dominant this year. They've got Purdue, Michigan State, and Michigan over the next three weeks, and I'd be really surprised if they don't lose at least one of those games.

But if they do win out, to include the conference championship, they'll definitely get a playoff bid...and will deserve one.

It would not break my heart to see Ohio State lose to any of those teams, or in the CCG against....whomever (Wisky?).

Not. Break. My. Heart. At. All.

 

[Obliviax]

Our backup QB is playing for Kentucky. Couldn’t keep him. He wanted to play and is having a good season.

Agreed. But that comes down to the coaches. WL left plenty of time to get the number two QB coached up enough to, at least, take snaps without the entire OL false stating.

 

[Texas Lion]

Didn't just lose, but got beat quite soundly. Purdue put up almost 600 yards of offense on them and led for 90% of the game (MSU never led in this game!). Purdue was up 31-21 midway through 3rd and continued to build that lead such that they were up 37-21 with only 9 minutes remaining. Final score was 40-29 and the final result was really not in doubt for the entire final quarter.

If Msu never led wouldn’t Purdue have led 100% of the time?

 

[CJFisJoePaII]

If Msu never led wouldn’t Purdue have led 100% of the time?

No, because they were tied at the start.... then Purdue led 7-0.... then MSU briefly tied it 7-7 before Purdue took a 14-7 lead, then a 21-7 lead. MSU scored next 14 to very briefly tie it at 21-21, but Purdue immediately scored a TD, then a FG to lead 31-21 midway through 3rd Period. Purdue continued to build their lead such that they were up 37-21 with only 9 minutes remaining in game. MSU scored and converted a 2-point conversion with 5 minutes remaining making it 37-28, but Purdue again went on a scoring drive to close out the scoring at 40-29.

So while it is true that Purdue never trailed in the game, it is not accurate to say they lead 100% of the game.

 

[The Spin Meister]

BTW, he threw a pick 6 to end the game vs Tennessee last night.

Yep, after passing for three TDS and running for two more....

 

[auxgym]

BTW, he threw a pick 6 to end the game vs Tennessee last night.

That's not an accurate statement. Is that you George Costanza???

The interception happened in the middle of the third quarter.....and Kentucky still had chances to win the game.

Just making stuff up George???

 

[PSUEngineer89]

Ok. We’ve got three losses, largely due to not developing a second team QB coming off a season with a losing record despite having very good recruiting classes

Reasonable.

 

[PSUEngineer89]

Purdue is tied for first on their side of the Big10 conference. Illinois is not.

Really, doesn't change the point.

Upsets happen to all teams.

 

[CJFisJoePaII]

Ohio State looks far from dominant this year. They've got Purdue, Michigan State, and Michigan over the next three weeks, and I'd be really surprised if they don't lose at least one of those games.

But if they do win out, to include the conference championship, they'll definitely get a playoff bid...and will deserve one.

Agree with this, PSU is not nearly as good as they were coming into the season - injuries have decimated PSU.... and PSU gave duhO$U everything they wanted. duhO$U did not look very good this week and the Officials noticeably bailed them out at the end when UNL had taken the momentum - a horrendous non-called PI in the final minutes on a UNL 3rd down throw was glaring (the FOX announcers outright called it a horrendous non-call on a beyond obvious PI penalty). UNL had scored to cut the lead to 23-17 and were moving the ball again when the obvious non-call occurred - if the beyond obvious penalty is called, UNL has the ball near midfield with just over 5 minutes remaining. Instead, UNL was forced to punt and duhO$U kicks a 46 yard FG with a minute and one-half remaining on ensuing possession to put the game out of reach (put duhO$U up by 2 scores 26-17).

duhO$U is not one of the best teams in the Country imho - they're a good team, but will get pasted if they make the CFB Invitational.

 

[lockhavenlion3]

Good luck trying to get your point across on this message board.It’s loaded with trolls

yep, and most of them are our own .

 

[PSUEngineer89]

Agree with this, PSU is not nearly as good as they were coming into the season - injuries have decimated PSU.... and PSU gave duhO$U everything they wanted. duhO$U did not look very good this week and the Officials noticeably bailed them out at the end when UNL had taken the momentum - a horrendous non-called PI in the final minutes on a UNL 3rd down throw was glaring (the FOX announcers outright called it a horrendous non-call on a beyond obvious PI penalty). UNL had scored to cut the lead to 23-17 and were moving the ball again when the obvious non-call occurred - if the beyond obvious penalty is called, UNL has the ball near midfield with just over 5 minutes remaining. Instead, UNL was forced to punt and duhO$U kicks a 46 yard FG with a minute and one-half remaining on ensuing possession to put the game out of reach (put duhO$U up by 2 scores 26-17).

duhO$U is not one of the best teams in the Country imho - they're a good team, but will get pasted if they make the CFB Invitational.

you really should change your screen name.

CJF is not even in the same hemisphere as JoePa.

Really, it discredits what is otherwise a reasonable post.

 

[JayWye]

Ok. We’ve got three losses, largely due to not developing a second team QB coming off a season with a losing record despite having very good recruiting classes

Get your point, but the last two recruiting classes were mediocre...which is why there are depth problems throughout the roster.

 

[N&B4PSU]

BTW, he threw a pick 6 to end the game vs Tennessee last night.

Um, no. He threw that much earlier in he game and it put his team down 38-28. They clawed back to 48-45 and he converted on 4th and a mile with a minute left to put them in FG range (apparently their kicker is not capable of hitting a 50 yarder so they went for it on 4th and 10.

Worst thing he did was miss on 4 straight pass attempts (did not see it but i'd imagine UT brought plenty of pressure...even so, 0-4 at the crunch).

Prior to the last 4 tosses, he was 31-45 for 372 yards, 3TD's and that int (finished with 31-49).

He also rushed for 2 TD's. Not sure how many sacks (at least 2). ESPN said (i'm implying from some of the accounts of his feats) Levis was pretty much a one man wrecking crew... unfortunately for Wil and KY, not at the very end.

 

[Jerry]

It would not break my heart to see Ohio State lose to any of those teams, or in the CCG against....whomever (Wisky?).

Not. Break. My. Heart. At. All.

Roger that. I'm rooting for them to lose all of them. Well, except maybe Michigan. In that game, I'm rooting for both teams to lose.

 

[KCLion]

Um, no. He threw that much earlier in he game and it put his team down 38-28. They clawed back to 48-45 and he converted on 4th and a mile with a minute left to put them in FG range (apparently their kicker is not capable of hitting a 50 yarder so they went for it on 4th and 10.

Worst thing he did was miss on 4 straight pass attempts (did not see it but i'd imagine UT brought plenty of pressure...even so, 0-4 at the crunch).

Prior to the last 4 tosses, he was 31-45 for 372 yards, 3TD's and that int (finished with 31-49).

He also rushed for 2 TD's. Not sure how many sacks (at least 2). ESPN said (i'm implying from some of the accounts of his feats) Levis was pretty much a one man wrecking crew... unfortunately for Wil and KY, not at the very end.

My mistake, I’m a Levis fan from the beginning. I was watching several games and unfortunately mistook that finish with another game.

 

[The Spin Meister]

Um, no. He threw that much earlier in he game and it put his team down 38-28. They clawed back to 48-45 and he converted on 4th and a mile with a minute left to put them in FG range (apparently their kicker is not capable of hitting a 50 yarder so they went for it on 4th and 10.

Worst thing he did was miss on 4 straight pass attempts (did not see it but i'd imagine UT brought plenty of pressure...even so, 0-4 at the crunch).

Prior to the last 4 tosses, he was 31-45 for 372 yards, 3TD's and that int (finished with 31-49).

He also rushed for 2 TD's. Not sure how many sacks (at least 2). ESPN said (i'm implying from some of the accounts of his feats) Levis was pretty much a one man wrecking crew... unfortunately for Wil and KY, not at the very end.

There were also several drops. Don’t remember if any came on those last four attempts.

 

[N&B4PSU]

My mistake, I’m a Levis fan from the beginning. I was watching several games and unfortunately mistook that finish with another game.

No worries... i make more than my share lol. I'm happy for the kid and hope he gets a shot in the pros. would love to have had him as backup here as we likely win iowa and illinois and SC comes back much healthier for osu. Oh well.

Reason i never blamed Franklin that much for illinois was he likely had no idea who his starting qb would be til he realized deep into week 2 of prep that he had no chance without Sean. Hard to prep that way.

 

[fastlax16]

Yep, after passing for three TDS and running for two more....

Only the interception is Franklins fault

 

[c1976]

Does having your coach named as leaving for LSU or USC with such certainty by some of the talking heads cause distractions to a team?

 

[Waltwam]

Ohio State looks far from dominant this year. They've got Purdue, Michigan State, and Michigan over the next three weeks, and I'd be really surprised if they don't lose at least one of those games.

But if they do win out, to include the conference championship, they'll definitely get a playoff bid...and will deserve one.

Would love to see OSU play Georgia in the first round!

 

[Cosmos]

I am willing to give CJF a long leash but I gotta tell ya, his game management or rather, mismanagement, really tests my patience. Like what was that last series right before halftime @ MD? Each possession is freaking gold! You gotta make the most of it. Not to mention what message does it send to the kids when you mail it in like that! No, it's not the losing that's bothersome but rather the way we play.

As for the backup QB situation there's thing called the Transfer Portal. He failed to use it when Will Levis hit the door running. There's no excuse for it. It's either that or he's a poor judge of evaluating QB talent during the recruiting process. It's one or the other so pick your poison. So I'm willing to wait until the season is over before voting 'go' or 'no go'. For CJF it's either adapt or die. In terms of facilities he's got it so much better here than Vandy so why does he 'look a gift horse in the mouth'. My patience wears thin and I know I'm not alone. There's a lot of young, hungry coaching talent out there just waiting for the chance. Gary Patterson arrived at TCU living out of his car. For real.

As for the Big Ten, it looks like Purdue is the closest thing we have to a playoff team and to be brutally honest, they'll get smoked in the playoffs. I watch a lot of college ball and I firmly believe the Big Ten is down this year. Its zenith was reached when we beat Auburn which, as it turns out, is a mediocre SEC team.

College football is cutthroat. You're either moving ahead or you're falling behind. JMO.

 

[NittanyIllinois]

Agree with this, PSU is not nearly as good as they were coming into the season - injuries have decimated PSU.... and PSU gave duhO$U everything they wanted. duhO$U did not look very good this week and the Officials noticeably bailed them out at the end when UNL had taken the momentum - a horrendous non-called PI in the final minutes on a UNL 3rd down throw was glaring (the FOX announcers outright called it a horrendous non-call on a beyond obvious PI penalty). UNL had scored to cut the lead to 23-17 and were moving the ball again when the obvious non-call occurred - if the beyond obvious penalty is called, UNL has the ball near midfield with just over 5 minutes remaining. Instead, UNL was forced to punt and duhO$U kicks a 46 yard FG with a minute and one-half remaining on ensuing possession to put the game out of reach (put duhO$U up by 2 scores 26-17).

duhO$U is not one of the best teams in the Country imho - they're a good team, but will get pasted if they make the CFB Invitational.

Good enough to beat us every single year, apparently.

 

[wolve1972]

The Big Ten will cannibalize itself this year. As far fetched as it sounds, (and it's not that far fetched) Ohio State can still lose a couple of division games. And then no Big Ten team in the College Football Invitational.

Pretty sure that would mean all Big Ten coaches in the East will lose their jobs.

I can see OSU losing to Purdue this weekend - still a long shot - but not to MSU. I've just thought MSU was overrated from the start. Purdue really has an explosive offense.

 

[KC-KS-Lion]

to ruin their season.

The point is - don't evaluate coaches on one game, one instance. It happens to everyone, every coach.

Evaluate coaches by taking into account the totality of what they've done, and what they're currently doing.

I wasn't real impressed with MSU's QB, I guess he was high school teammates with their #1 who is very good. Their RB had a game of his career and any MSU RB...and Michigan kept the door open...I do think they are good, but beatable with some holes or at least less than top notch players at some positions...like most college teams.

 

[Jerry]

I am willing to give CJF a long leash but I gotta tell ya, his game management or rather, mismanagement, really tests my patience. Like what was that last series right before halftime @ MD? Each possession is freaking gold! You gotta make the most of it. Not to mention what message does it send to the kids when you mail it in like that! No, it's not the losing that's bothersome but rather the way we play.

As for the backup QB situation there's thing called the Transfer Portal. He failed to use it when Will Levis hit the door running. There's no excuse for it. It's either that or he's a poor judge of evaluating QB talent during the recruiting process. It's one or the other so pick your poison. So I'm willing to wait until the season is over before voting 'go' or 'no go'. For CJF it's either adapt or die. In terms of facilities he's got it so much better here than Vandy so why does he 'look a gift horse in the mouth'. My patience wears thin and I know I'm not alone. There's a lot of young, hungry coaching talent out there just waiting for the chance. Gary Patterson arrived at TCU living out of his car. For real.

As for the Big Ten, it looks like Purdue is the closest thing we have to a playoff team and to be brutally honest, they'll get smoked in the playoffs. I watch a lot of college ball and I firmly believe the Big Ten is down this year. Its zenith was reached when we beat Auburn which, as it turns out, is a mediocre SEC team.

College football is cutthroat. You're either moving ahead or you're falling behind. JMO.

Re: As for the Big Ten, it looks like Purdue is the closest thing we have to a playoff team and to be brutally honest, they'll get smoked in the playoffs. I watch a lot of college ball and I firmly believe the Big Ten is down this year...

Gotta disagree with you on that one, Cos. Honestly, I think that top to bottom, the Big 10 is the best league in college football this year. The SEC's strength is at the top as usual, and yes, their two best teams are better than the Big Ten's two best. But there are probably 8 teams in our league (Penn State is one) that could beat any other conference team on any given Saturday. Meanwhile, the other three power conferences are not even in the conversation.

If the Big-10 gets a playoff team this year, I think it will come out of the East. To me, Wisconsin, after a rocky start, has put it together and looks like the best team in the West. Their D is very good, they've got the running game going, and their QB is finally showing signs of life. If they make it to Indianapolis, they won't be an easy out for any East opponent.

 

[fastlax16]

I am willing to give CJF a long leash but I gotta tell ya, his game management or rather, mismanagement, really tests my patience. Like what was that last series right before halftime @ MD? Each possession is freaking gold! You gotta make the most of it. Not to mention what message does it send to the kids when you mail it in like that! No, it's not the losing that's bothersome but rather the way we play.

As for the backup QB situation there's thing called the Transfer Portal. He failed to use it when Will Levis hit the door running. There's no excuse for it. It's either that or he's a poor judge of evaluating QB talent during the recruiting process. It's one or the other so pick your poison. So I'm willing to wait until the season is over before voting 'go' or 'no go'. For CJF it's either adapt or die. In terms of facilities he's got it so much better here than Vandy so why does he 'look a gift horse in the mouth'. My patience wears thin and I know I'm not alone. There's a lot of young, hungry coaching talent out there just waiting for the chance. Gary Patterson arrived at TCU living out of his car. For real.

As for the Big Ten, it looks like Purdue is the closest thing we have to a playoff team and to be brutally honest, they'll get smoked in the playoffs. I watch a lot of college ball and I firmly believe the Big Ten is down this year. Its zenith was reached when we beat Auburn which, as it turns out, is a mediocre SEC team.

College football is cutthroat. You're either moving ahead or you're falling behind. JMO.

And Day had multiple bone headed 4th down play calls in the redzone against us that could have but didn't burn him since we gave the ball back. Watch any game college or NFL team for multiple games and you'll find poor decisions. Some bite you in the ass some don't. We all know Franklin's issues because we watch him weekly.

As for the QB situation, considering his backup is now starting for Kentucky and the backup prior to Will also transferred into the SEC and started as well, I'd say Franklin's talent evaluation is pretty good. He also was onto Fields before anyone else but thats a different failure.

Why was Levis in the portal? Because he wanted to start this season and it wasn't happening here. Which is why virtually every QB is in the portal. Someone posted a list of 16 "top" transfer portal targets. 14 of the 16 went to schools where the 2020 incumbent was gone. The fact the Levis transferred because he couldn't beat out Clifford was a red flag for anyone else looking to come here with the intention of starting.

What's your sales pitch to a kid who wants to start to come in after your last backup (who was considered one of the top transfer portal QBs) just left because he wasn't going to?

 

[NittanyIllinois]

And Day had multiple bone headed 4th down play calls in the redzone against us that could have but didn't burn him since we gave the ball back. Watch any game college or NFL team for multiple games and you'll find poor decisions. Some bite you in the ass some don't. We all know Franklin's issues because we watch him weekly.

As for the QB situation, considering his backup is now starting for Kentucky and the backup prior to Will also transferred into the SEC and started as well, I'd say Franklin's talent evaluation is pretty good. He also was onto Fields before anyone else but thats a different failure.

Why was Levis in the portal? Because he wanted to start this season and it wasn't happening here. Which is why virtually every QB is in the portal. Someone posted a list of 16 "top" transfer portal targets. 14 of the 16 went to schools where the 2020 incumbent was gone. The fact the Levis transferred because he couldn't beat out Clifford was a red flag for anyone else looking to come here with the intention of starting.

What's your sales pitch to a kid who wants to start to come in after your last backup (who was considered one of the top transfer portal QBs) just left because he wasn't going to?

Day has definitely had plenty of questionable calls. Several of his 4th down attempts this year have been questionable, for example. He had another questionable one against Nebraska -- throwing deep on 4th and short instead of pounding it with Henderson. Watch enough Alabama, and you'll see some bad calls from Bama as well. Ditto with Oklahoma and Lincoln Riley. He's one of the best offensive minds in the game, and still makes some boneheaded calls.

The difference between all of that and Franklin, IMO, is the clock management. It's as if CJF has absolutely no clock awareness late in halves or games. His use of timeouts -- or failure to call TOs -- is bizarre. I'll never forget the sequence at the end of the first half against Memphis.....he used TOs before we scored (rather than attempting to score with as little time as possible), which gave Memphis enough time to march down the field and get a FG. Didn't cost us the game, but it was an inexplicable, nonsensical way to give them 3 points.

He's not a guy that's going to outmaneuver equally-talented teams late in games. He recruits well enough to put a solid product on the field. We'll (mostly) beat teams we out-talent. And we'll (mostly) lose to teams with more talent. We're not going to win many chess matches late in games. It is what it is.

He's a solid 9-3 kind of guy with some 11-2 seasons and some not-as-good seasons.

 

[fastlax16]

We'll (mostly) beat teams we out-talent. And we'll (mostly) lose to teams with more talent. We're not going to win many chess matches late in games. It is what it is.

I mean for the most part that describes just about every college football program. What program over the last 5-10 years consistently beats teams with more talent. Certainly not any of the teams with multiple playoff appearances.

OU is a great example. More talented than everyone in the big 12 every year and zero playoff wins because they've run into someone with more talent.Since the playoffs started OU has beaten arguably one team with more talent than they have (OSU 2017). All their other wins are teams they out talent. They just don't have anyone else with more talent they play consistently since Texas has been a mess. Anyone expecting Oklahoma to make the playoff 4 out of 7 years once they're in the SEC?

Just looking at the current rankings, we are apparently a worse than Auburn and Wisconsin, but no credit for winning either of those games.

 

[CJFisJoePaII]

Would love to see OSU play Georgia in the first round!

Good Lord that would be a royal arse-beating!

 

[CJFisJoePaII]

I mean for the most part that describes just about every college football program. What program over the last 5-10 years consistently beats teams with more talent. Certainly not any of the teams with multiple playoff appearances.

OU is a great example. More talented than everyone in the big 12 every year and zero playoff wins because they've run into someone with more talent.Since the playoffs started OU has beaten arguably one team with more talent than they have (OSU 2017). All their other wins are teams they out talent. They just don't have anyone else with more talent they play consistently since Texas has been a mess. Anyone expecting Oklahoma to make the playoff 4 out of 7 years once they're in the SEC?

Just looking at the current rankings, we are apparently a worse than Auburn and Wisconsin, but no credit for winning either of those games.

I'm a bit mystified by that myself - how can we be 3 spots below Wisconsin and 7 below Auburn in the AP Poll when we beat both of them and currently have the same W-L record as both of them??? The Coaches' Poll is a little more consistent but not by much... Will be interesting to see where we fall in this weeks CFB Invitational Poll as it is supposed to take "# of quality wins" and "head-to-head" outcome into consideration as tie-breakers for teams with similar on-field records.....