Penn State Quarterback

[bdgan]

Just to play Devils Advocate, was/is Will Howard elite? Yet he won a National Championship mainly because he had elite receivers running wide open all over the field.

I don't think Will Howard is elite but he had better stats than Allar when they played head to head. Your argument is that he had Smith and Egbuka at WR which is fair. I would counter with the fact that Allar had a better OL and TE for that game which is also fair.

OSU had a good QB, good OL, and elite WRs. I would have given the nod to PSU IF they had an elite QB, better OL, an elite TE, and worse WRs. Probably better RBs too. But it didn't happen. In fact Allar hasn't beat a true elite team (OSU, UM, OR, ND) during his career. I'm not trying to diss on him. I'm just saying the bar is high if you want to be considered elite.

 

[baircub1!]

I don't think Will Howard is elite but he had better stats than Allar when they played head to head. Your argument is that he had Smith and Egbuka at WR which is fair. I would counter with the fact that Allar had a better OL and TE for that game which is also fair.

OSU had a good QB, good OL, and elite WRs. I would have given the nod to PSU IF they had an elite QB, better OL, an elite TE, and worse WRs. Probably better RBs too. But it didn't happen. In fact Allar hasn't beat a true elite team (OSU, UM, OR, ND) during his career. I'm not trying to diss on him. I'm just saying the bar is high if you want to be considered elite.

Read somewhere that Knowles provided a very in depth scouting report he prepared while at OSU on Penn States offense.. and interesting comment was that they knew Allar put a lot of air onto his deep balls enabling dbacks recovery time to react to the ball where applicable..the high air ball
Works when you have elite receivers who can go get it.. if you watch Howard’s play against us.. he threw basic darts..non touch passes..thinking Knowles contribution to Penn State certainly extends well beyond the defense..

 

[bdgan]

The challenge with QBs is that, once you determine they have the physical abilities to play the position, the rest is decision making. Leadership, retention, thick skin, work ethic, decision making, progressions.....none of those can be measured on a spread sheet.

Allar has a strong arm and John Allen size. I also think he's a good student of the game and very coachable. The question is does he have the "IT" factor. My observation is that he gets tight in big games and starts hearing footsteps. He seems better when we're losing by multiple scores. When we're in a hurry up offense he just lets it fly instead of thinking about it as much. That's the hurdle he has to get over.

JMO

 

[Obliviax]

Allar has a strong arm and John Allen size. I also think he's a good student of the game and very coachable. The question is does he have the "IT" factor. My observation is that he gets tight in big games and starts hearing footsteps. He seems better when we're losing by multiple scores. When we're in a hurry up offense he just lets it fly instead of thinking about it as much. That's the hurdle he has to get over.

JMO

Agree but that isn't uncommon.

First, when you play good teams, they have better players. So it is more difficult to make the throws. Second, when the windows are tighter, you have to take more risks. More risks mean more mistakes. And when you are losing by multiple scores, the defenders play soft to not give up big plays, which opens the underneath routes. The stats get padded, but a loss is a loss.

But I do agree, he needs to play better against a good team. But I don't know if the deficiency is on him or on the WRs who are not getting open against good CBs and Safeties. I'd like to see how many ran zone versus man-to-man against us. My guess is that they went heavy man-to-man because they knew they'd win that battle.

 

[LandoComando]

I don't think Will Howard is elite but he had better stats than Allar when they played head to head. Your argument is that he had Smith and Egbuka at WR which is fair. I would counter with the fact that Allar had a better OL and TE for that game which is also fair.

OSU had a good QB, good OL, and elite WRs. I would have given the nod to PSU IF they had an elite QB, better OL, an elite TE, and worse WRs. Probably better RBs too. But it didn't happen. In fact Allar hasn't beat a true elite team (OSU, UM, OR, ND) during his career. I'm not trying to diss on him. I'm just saying the bar is high if you want to be considered elite.

Put Allar on Ohio State and he has better numbers than Howard.
Lots of elite college QBs couldn't win a big game. Wasn't that the knock on Manning?
Teams win or lose game...the coaching in big games has to improve. Our struggles against great teams goes back much further than Allar's arrival. He didn't get a blocked kick to win a game.

 

[Wallace Breen]

Agree but that isn't uncommon.

First, when you play good teams, they have better players. So it is more difficult to make the throws. Second, when the windows are tighter, you have to take more risks. More risks mean more mistakes. And when you are losing by multiple scores, the defenders play soft to not give up big plays, which opens the underneath routes. The stats get padded, but a loss is a loss.

But I do agree, he needs to play better against a good team. But I don't know if the deficiency is on him or on the WRs who are not getting open against good CBs and Safeties. I'd like to see how many ran zone versus man-to-man against us. My guess is that they went heavy man-to-man because they knew they'd win that battle.

That was team dependent. Oregon was essentially in a prevent defense early in the second quarter with six or seven in coverage on almost every play (hence the 'gaudy' rushing numbers). Ohio State played us straight up like they always do because they aren't afraid of us. Mostly zone, some man. Notre Dame's early plan didn't work well though they kept us out of the end zone while Golden figured out Andy's gimmicks. Once he did, the game was over. When looking at Allar, he played 11 scrubs during the regular season, two in the playoffs. He played 10 scrubs in 23. He is hard to rate due to the quality of competition. He generally plays poorly against good teams. Is that him or is it the lack of good teams on the schedule? We don't know. I think he is fine for competition we play but don't think he is a day one or two pick. Physically, he looks like a top 20 pick but plays like a third or fourth rounder.

 

[Obliviax]

That was team dependent. Oregon was essentially in a prevent defense early in the second quarter with six or seven in coverage on almost every play (hence the 'gaudy' rushing numbers). Ohio State played us straight up like they always do because they aren't afraid of us. Mostly zone, some man. Notre Dame's early plan didn't work well though they kept us out of the end zone while Golden figured out Andy's gimmicks. Once he did, the game was over. When looking at Allar, he played 11 scrubs during the regular season, two in the playoffs. He played 10 scrubs in 23. He is hard to rate due to the quality of competition. He generally plays poorly against good teams. Is that him or is it the lack of good teams on the schedule? We don't know. I think he is fine for competition we play but don't think he is a day one or two pick. Physically, he looks like a top 20 pick but plays like a third or fourth rounder.

His schedule was really no different than any other college football teams.

 

[bdgan]

Agree but that isn't uncommon.

First, when you play good teams, they have better players. So it is more difficult to make the throws. Second, when the windows are tighter, you have to take more risks. More risks mean more mistakes. And when you are losing by multiple scores, the defenders play soft to not give up big plays, which opens the underneath routes. The stats get padded, but a loss is a loss.

But I do agree, he needs to play better against a good team. But I don't know if the deficiency is on him or on the WRs who are not getting open against good CBs and Safeties. I'd like to see how many ran zone versus man-to-man against us. My guess is that they went heavy man-to-man because they knew they'd win that battle.

I think most would agree that Allar has better size and arm strength than players like McSorley or McGloin. He might even have a better work ethic and know better how to read defenses. I'm not sure if he has as much moxie as either of them.

 

[80lion]

The Big Ten championship was over in the first quarter. The game wasn't competitive in a real sense. Allar did not lose the game. Nor did he lose the game against Notre Dame. He shouldn't have thrown the ball because he should have recognized the receiver didn't run the route properly but the INT is more on Franklin who should have been playing for overtime because Notre Dame largely dominated the second half.

In the Oregan game, we had the ball on the 50 yard line with 2 minutes left. Down by 8 points. The running backs were getting 7-8 yards a carry.. no need to throw a 50/50 ball to end the game. Notre Dame game, Allar admitted he made a mistake. Those two plays cost us in each game.

 

[baircub1!]

I think most would agree that Allar has better size and arm strength than players like McSorley or McGloin. He might even have a better work ethic and know better how to read defenses. I'm not sure if he has as much moxie as either of them.

I would agree with you here..

 

[royboy]

In the Oregan game, we had the ball on the 50 yard line with 2 minutes left. Down by 8 points. The running backs were getting 7-8 yards a carry.. no need to throw a 50/50 ball to end the game. Notre Dame game, Allar admitted he made a mistake. Those two plays cost us in each game.

I think most would agree that Allar has better size and arm strength than players like McSorley or McGloin. He might even have a better work ethic and know better how to read defenses. I'm not sure if he has as much moxie as either of them.

Allar has an opportunity to leave a positive legacy for the 2025 Season. The Offense seems to be in place, and the Defense should again be good. A conference and National Championship is possible.

 

[Obliviax]

Allar has an opportunity to leave a positive legacy for the 2025 Season. The Offense seems to be in place, and the Defense should again be good. A conference and National Championship is possible.

totally agree. And, we have to understand that he is a true senior and still only 21 years old. Dillon Gabriel is 24 and Will Howard is 23.

 

[SR108]

In the Oregan game, we had the ball on the 50 yard line with 2 minutes left. Down by 8 points. The running backs were getting 7-8 yards a carry.. no need to throw a 50/50 ball to end the game. Notre Dame game, Allar admitted he made a mistake. Those two plays cost us in each game.

Both games were winnable, we get over the hump this year.

 

[Wallace Breen]

Both games were winnable, we get over the hump this year.

Yeah, whatever. Franklin is still our coach so zero chance. And yes, the Oregon game was over in the first half.

 

[Delcolion915]

Inside word has it that Smolik has pulled even with Grunk. That's good news. Competition makes a better situation.

 

[Obliviax]

 

[PSUSignore]

Read somewhere that Knowles provided a very in depth scouting report he prepared while at OSU on Penn States offense.. and interesting comment was that they knew Allar put a lot of air onto his deep balls enabling dbacks recovery time to react to the ball where applicable..the high air ball
Works when you have elite receivers who can go get it.. if you watch Howard’s play against us.. he threw basic darts..non touch passes..thinking Knowles contribution to Penn State certainly extends well beyond the defense..

I had a different reaction to that takeaway. I was concerned that Allar wasn't already told and aware that he puts too much air under deep balls. We've seen it on the field on a few rare occasions with wide open WRs. The WRs have to slow down waiting for the ball and the DBs are able to catch up a bit. I find it hard to believe Allar hadn't already been told this, I suspect it was just a case of it meaning more or sinking in a little better since it was coming from someone that had coached against him.

 

[The Spin Meister]

I had a different reaction to that takeaway. I was concerned that Allar wasn't already told and aware that he puts too much air under deep balls. We've seen it on the field on a few rare occasions with wide open WRs. The WRs have to slow down waiting for the ball and the DBs are able to catch up a bit. I find it hard to believe Allar hadn't already been told this, I suspect it was just a case of it meaning more or sinking in a little better since it was coming from someone that had coached against him.

I complained about his airballs way back when they happened and was taken to the woodshed for daring to criticize him.

Several deep bad were badly thrown and could have been TDs instead of just big gainers.

And a couple huge TDs would have given both him and receivers greater confidence, which they certainly needed,

Further, it would hsve forced defenses to change coverage. Lay deeper, less blitzing, play wider.

 

[lazydave841]

Inside word has it that Smolik has pulled even with Grunk. That's good news. Competition makes a better situation.

Might be true. Might be fluff to keep both happy. Our coaches hope both stay through spring of '26 and compete for the starting job. Worst case is one of them leaves during the Winter portal, but that will probably be a known thing by conference season (who gets mopup duty in the OOC games? Do they share it?)

I find it hard to believe Allar hadn't already been told this, I suspect it was just a case of it meaning more or sinking in a little better since it was coming from someone that had coached against him

The thing is, Allar was coached by this staff to throw the moon shot deep balls. What I figure it meant was Knowles told him "we weren't concerned with your deep ball because I could have my Corners bump and hold all day and they still had time to look for the ball because you ALWAYS put a ton of air on it."

I don't have an issue with some air, but every single deep ball was thrown this way. I'd rather him miss a laser by 5 yards than throw the same. Exact. Pass. Every single time.

 

[SR108]

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The lists themselves illustrates the these “experts “ are simply throwing darts at pictures.

 

[Obliviax]

The lists themselves illustrates the these “experts “ are simply throwing darts at pictures.

Gotta write something! Just about everything written, and predicted, between now and late August will be complete BS. But else are we going to do, follow the Pirates?

But when I look at this list, I see Drew Allar: big kid, pretty mobile, extends plays, strong arm, three year starter, Natty contender, great RBs, good OL, great OC, favorable schedule...he and this team have all the tools.

I've read some people lament the pre-season hype. But I've been lucky enough to be surrounded with some incredibly talented and successful people. What has differentiated them with me (who has been modestly successful, IMHO) is that they want it. They need it. They grab the wheel. They give no ****s when they are wrong. They have incredible confidence while still staying hungry. They flourish under and embrace the bright lights. I hope PSU has a sports psychologist because Drew, and the rest, need to embrace the hype and develop a confident swagger. They need to know that if they do the work, they'll win due to their superior talent, experience, and intellect.

 

[SR108]

The lists themselves illustrates the these “experts “ are simply throwing darts at pictures.

Other than Allar.

 

[SR108]

Gotta write something! Just about everything written, and predicted, between now and late August will be complete BS. But else are we going to do, follow the Pirates?

But when I look at this list, I see Drew Allar: big kid, pretty mobile, extends plays, strong arm, three year starter, Natty contender, great RBs, good OL, great OC, favorable schedule...he and this team have all the tools.

I've read some people lament the pre-season hype. But I've been lucky enough to be surrounded with some incredibly talented and successful people. What has differentiated them with me (who has been modestly successful, IMHO) is that they want it. They need it. They grab the wheel. They give no ****s when they are wrong. They have incredible confidence while still staying hungry. They flourish under and embrace the bright lights. I hope PSU has a sports psychologist because Drew, and the rest, need to embrace the hype and develop a confident swagger. They need to know that if they do the work, they'll win due to their superior talent, experience, and intellect.

Yep, all the hype is concerning, hopefully they will embrace it.

 

[SR108]

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How do you make a true freshman, “Underwood” the third best QB in the Big Ten?

 

[Obliviax]

How do you make a true freshman, “Underwood” the third best QB in the Big Ten?

It is really a down year for QB in the B1G. This is one reason why I am encouraged about PSU's regular season. UM and tOSU have kids who don't have much experience. So while they have a lot of talent, inexperienced QBs need to learn how to navigate the 4th qtr when the pressure is on. Both Howard and Gabriel made big mistakes in big games last year, as did Allar.

I also think that people confuse "good QB" with "Good Team". I thought the young kid from Neb was really good last year as a Frosh. But I don't know if Neb can be a good team.

But to your point, two self described "experts" have Drew 1 and Raiola 5. At 2, 3 and 4, they don't even come close to resembling each other.

 

[SR108]

It is really a down year for QB in the B1G. This is one reason why I am encouraged about PSU's regular season. UM and tOSU have kids who don't have much experience. So while they have a lot of talent, inexperienced QBs need to learn how to navigate the 4th qtr when the pressure is on. Both Howard and Gabriel made big mistakes in big games last year, as did Allar.

I also think that people confuse "good QB" with "Good Team". I thought the young kid from Neb was really good last year as a Frosh. But I don't know if Neb can be a good team.

But to your point, two self described "experts" have Drew 1 and Raiola 5. At 2, 3 and 4, they don't even come close to resembling each other.

I think the Illinois QB is good and they have a lot of returning players. They could be the Indiana of the new season, although that is me speculating with out looking at their schedule, which was a big part of Indiana’s success last year.

 

[Obliviax]

I think the Illinois QB is good and they have a lot of returning players. They could be the Indiana of the new season, although that is me speculating with out looking at their schedule, which was a big part of Indiana’s success last year.

I agree. that kid seems to come up big. Their Duke game will be interesting (game 2) against a really good DC. They don't play us, Iowa, UM or Oregon but do tOSU, USC and Washington. Other than tOSU, a pretty easy schedule.

I have no idea what to expect from Wash, UM, USC and even Oregon as they turn over a lot of talent coming into 25. Illinois would be a great dark horse to put some money on to make the playoffs.

 

[Obliviax]

 

[wilbury]

I really like our top three as well, I think we are better with Pribula gone because it will force Andy K to adjust his offense to a pro-style passer. I disagree about Allar though, I am not sure he is top three in the Big Ten much less nationally. Regardless, Allar is perfectly fine against the schedule we play. He probably won't lose a game and will likely win us one.

You just told us this year's schedule is significantly tougher than it has been.

 

[olelion]

Well, McSorley was the product of Barkely, Godwin, Gesicki and Moorhead. Nothing more, nothing less. He was an average option QB. As for Allar, the problem with him is that he can't make all the throws. He has the arm to but has inherent flaws that probably can't be coached out of him.

Actually, Moorehead was the product of the players. Geez, who wouldn't shine as an OC with that bunch.? Look at Moorehead since leaving PSU. A failure at Miss, St., Oregon loosing multiple games during his tenure and now his latest debacle at Akron. Why you worship this guy is baffling

 

[lazydave841]

Actually, Moorehead was the product of the players. Geez, who wouldn't shine as an OC with that bunch.? Look at Moorehead since leaving PSU. A failure at Miss, St., Oregon loosing multiple games during his tenure and now his latest debacle at Akron. Why you worship this guy is baffling

Agenda. Anti-JF.

 

[Delcolion915]

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Can probably do without the meek mill, but ok 😂

 

[RickinDayton]

That was team dependent. Oregon was essentially in a prevent defense early in the second quarter with six or seven in coverage on almost every play (hence the 'gaudy' rushing numbers). Ohio State played us straight up like they always do because they aren't afraid of us. Mostly zone, some man. Notre Dame's early plan didn't work well though they kept us out of the end zone while Golden figured out Andy's gimmicks. Once he did, the game was over. When looking at Allar, he played 11 scrubs during the regular season, two in the playoffs. He played 10 scrubs in 23. He is hard to rate due to the quality of competition. He generally plays poorly against good teams. Is that him or is it the lack of good teams on the schedule? We don't know. I think he is fine for competition we play but don't think he is a day one or two pick. Physically, he looks like a top 20 pick but plays like a third or fourth rounder.

So what would you call the teams Josh Allen played against in college while he was QBing Wyoming? Scrubs? No, Allar is not elite at this time but he is young and I think he knows where he has to improve and improvement will most likely occur this year. I guess I'm more concerned about the defense than Allar and the offense.

 

[Wallace Breen]

So what would you call the teams Josh Allen played against in college while he was QBing Wyoming? Scrubs? No, Allar is not elite at this time but he is young and I think he knows where he has to improve and improvement will most likely occur this year. I guess I'm more concerned about the defense than Allar and the offense.

It isn't just who we have played. He struggles to consistently make a number of throws he should have no problem making. These are huge. It isn't just receiver or competition, he struggles with precision despite having good mechanics. He looks like a third round pick.

 

[RickinDayton]

I have no idea where he'll be drafted. I hope he continues to improve; especially in the key games this season. If not, this team will struggle to win 10 games.

 

[dailybuck777]

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Anyone who puts Nico at number 2
and Underwood at number 3 (particularly in light of his terrible spring game) is an idiot.

 

[PSU4U]

Most people here just want to win. They didn't have a problem with Collins or Blackledge.

Allar is a big strong kid with a strong arm. He's been a very good QB so far but he hasn't been elite IMO. Making that jump will probably require him to develop his instincts and remain relaxed when under pressure against top teams.

Alar is Alar he will have to make major self-improvement against the likes of OSU and others (big games) on the schedule. He hasn't done that yet. His receivers should be improved (TE aside) that should help him.

 

[Obliviax]

Klatt has Allar ranked fifth in the NCAA. What is funny is that this is the highest ranking of any QB PSU has had in a long, long time. Regardless, he's got Klubnick ranked first. He then has Manning who has only had 95 pass attempts in college. he then has John Mateer of Oklahoma and Sam Leavitt of Arizona State ahead of Allar. Mateer is a transfer from Washington State.

 

[bdgan]

Klatt has Allar ranked fifth in the NCAA. What is funny is that this is the highest ranking of any QB PSU has had in a long, long time. Regardless, he's got Klubnick ranked first. He then has Manning who has only had 95 pass attempts in college. he then has John Mateer of Oklahoma and Sam Leavitt of Arizona State ahead of Allar. Mateer is a transfer from Washington State.

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The things with Manning might be that he think he's as good as the hype. Confidence is everything. Of course he could also get knocked down and commit a few turnovers. Those kind of things can get into your head.

 

[Obliviax]