Question about all of this Suriano release talk...

[PA Power]

I am seeing a lot of chatter about how Cael should/shouldn't release Nick Suriano and how that would impact a potential transfer to Rutgers. I'm a bit confused because I assumed that the internal BIG10 transfer rule that requires student athletes to lose a year of competitive eligibility had nothing to do with whether the coach "releases" the athlete or not.

Let's say Cael does not release Suriano and he decides to transfer to Rider or some other non BIG10 school. Couldn't he just redshirt his first year there and he would still have three remaining years of eligibility? I'm just not understanding how giving or not giving a release to an athlete who still has an available redshirt is really relevant to their ability to compete at the NCAA level. I'm probably missing something super simple and obvious but if someone could explain it to me I'd really appreciate it.

 

[El-Jefe]

You have it right on both counts.

Only missing piece: out of conference transfer without release means no athletic money for the first year.

 

[dicemen99]

I am seeing a lot of chatter about how Cael should/shouldn't release Nick Suriano and how that would impact a potential transfer to Rutgers. I'm a bit confused because I assumed that the internal BIG10 transfer rule that requires student athletes to lose a year of competitive eligibility had nothing to do with whether the coach "releases" the athlete or not.

Let's say Cael does not release Suriano and he decides to transfer to Rider or some other non BIG10 school. Couldn't he just redshirt his first year there and he would still have three remaining years of eligibility? I'm just not understanding how giving or not giving a release to an athlete who still has an available redshirt is really relevant to their ability to compete at the NCAA level. I'm probably missing something super simple and obvious but if someone could explain it to me I'd really appreciate it.

The B1G and NCAA rules are separate and not connected. Tikk did a great job explaining this on another board by describing this as a Venn diagram where two circles do not connect. Unfortunately, this seems to have gone right over most heads.

Cael release - NCAA issue. You are correct that if he chose to go to Rider, he has a RS available and could use it next year. Also applies to Rutgers in relation to the NCAA.

B1G rule - penalizes one competition year for transfer inside the conference. Hardship waiver requirements are unclear, but this is obviously uncommon despite many parties attempts to paint it not. Cael granting a release may or may not be relevant to the B1G when deciding, it's basically conjecture.

 

[Pennstate1985]

So without a hardship waiver, Nick would have two years of competition remaining if he goes to Rutgers whether he gets the release from PSU or not. Nick currently has four more years to complete three more years of competition at PSU. If he goes to Rutgers without being granted the hardship waiver, he would have 3 years remaining to complete two years of competition. Correct?

 

[dicemen99]

So without a hardship waiver, Nick would have two years of competition remaining if he goes to Rutgers whether he gets the release from PSU or not. Nick currently has four more years to complete three more years of competition at PSU. If he goes to Rutgers without being granted the hardship waiver, he would have 3 years remaining to complete two years of competition. Correct?

Correct.

 

[Pennstate1985]

Correct.

So this whole release issue is simply a red herring then as it pertains to Rutgers. Whether Nick could wrestle for 3 more years is really up to the B1G.

 

[Pennstate1985]

The release issue is strictly a money issue and not a competition one as it pertains to Rutgers. Correct?

 

[dicemen99]

So this whole release issue is simply a red herring then as it pertains to Rutgers. Whether Nick could wrestle for 3 more years is really up to the B1G.

Yes, but there is also a lot of uncertainty about what the B1G would consider in terms of the hardship waiver. I think it's safe to say that it would have some kind of negative impact on the hearing if it wasn't granted, not so safe to say that it would be a positive outcome if Cael would sign off on it.

But it's in RU's best interest to promote the latter, so I would surmise that's how they are painting it.

 

[dicemen99]

The release issue is strictly a money issue and not a competition one as it pertains to Rutgers. Correct?

No. The rule was changed around 5 years ago. It used to prohibit the acceptance of athletic grant-in-aid for transfers in the conference. It was changed to a one-year competition penalty around 2010 I think.

 

[NoVa Lion]

The release issue is strictly a money issue and not a competition one as it pertains to Rutgers. Correct?

I don;t think it's even a money issue. I checked and can't find anything that says he can;t get ship money from RU if we don't grant a release and even if that was true at this point in time schools already have their 9.9 ships for the upcoming school year committed so RU would have no ship money to offer and if they did have any it would probably be pretty minimal.

 

[Pennstate1985]

Thanks guys. So this may be an attempt by someone to increase the odds on a hardship waiver being granted. So a whole lotta nothing. Honestly, if I take my glasses off, I still don't see any hardship as seen in the past when any were granted. That said, Delany isn't our friend, so who knows. If someone like a Suriano who has zero hardship that I can see gets a waiver, then the waiver rule would be a paper tiger.

 

[El-Jefe]

Tom and the mods: perhaps this thread could be locked right now so it doesn't get diluted, and pinned until the situation ends?

 

[RoarLions1]

I don;t think it's even a money issue. I checked and can't find anything that says he can;t get ship money from RU if we don't grant a release and even if that was true at this point in time schools already have their 9.9 ships for the upcoming school year committed so RU would have no ship money to offer and if they did have any it would probably be pretty minimal.

It's in the "Permission to Contact" language. Basically,

The Student-Athlete may transfer anyway, without a “Permission to Contact” Letter, but cannot get financial aid for one year. He is allowed to practice with the new school’s team.

As with all of these rules, there's an appeals process.

 

[Still in State College]

I believe there are really two issues. The first is granting a release to allow an athlete to receive grant-in-aid. This is an NCAA issue regardless of where the athlete transfers. Without a release you can enroll somewhere but you can't receive scholarship for a year.

The Big Ten exception is part two. If you receive a release you can transfer to another Big Ten school and receive a scholarship immediately but you must sit out a season to get a year in residence.

 

[csiebott]

I don;t think it's even a money issue. I checked and can't find anything that says he can;t get ship money from RU if we don't grant a release and even if that was true at this point in time schools already have their 9.9 ships for the upcoming school year committed so RU would have no ship money to offer and if they did have any it would probably be pretty minimal.

They might, Paetzell's coming off the books, right?

 

[tikk10]

I don;t think it's even a money issue. I checked and can't find anything that says he can;t get ship money from RU if we don't grant a release and even if that was true at this point in time schools already have their 9.9 ships for the upcoming school year committed so RU would have no ship money to offer and if they did have any it would probably be pretty minimal.

Notwithstanding your point about the 9.9 in all likelihood being already allocated, rendering the following point moot, here's the NCAA transfer guide on transferring w/o getting a permission to contact letter (and thus also w/o getting a release):

You may still transfer to your new school, but you will not be eligible for an athletics scholarship until you have attended your new school for one academic year.​

That's pretty definitive. No athletic scholarship from the new school for a year. The only wiggle room I can see is that it applies only to athletic scholarships, meaning that it might be circumvented, circumstances permitting, by piecing together non-athletic scholarships.

 

[matter7172]

So without a hardship waiver, Nick would have two years of competition remaining if he goes to Rutgers whether he gets the release from PSU or not. Nick currently has four more years to complete three more years of competition at PSU. If he goes to Rutgers without being granted the hardship waiver, he would have 3 years remaining to complete two years of competition. Correct?

Or would he have four years to complete two years of competition? That part isn't clear to me.

 

[PSUisawesome]

So without a hardship waiver, Nick would have two years of competition remaining if he goes to Rutgers whether he gets the release from PSU or not. Nick currently has four more years to complete three more years of competition at PSU. If he goes to Rutgers without being granted the hardship waiver, he would have 3 years remaining to complete two years of competition. Correct?

Thanks everyone this was super clear and helpful.

 

[RockyMountainLion]

But wait. What if he did get a release, but didn't get a permission to contact letter, but did get a non-academic scholarship, and he did get a hardship waiver from the BIG, but the NCAA didn't approve it, and he already is from New Jersey? Would he be allowed to wrestle?

 

[CowboyUp61]

But wait. What if he did get a release, but didn't get a permission to contact letter, but did get a non-academic scholarship, and he did get a hardship waiver from the BIG, but the NCAA didn't approve it, and he already is from New Jersey? Would he be allowed to wrestle?