seeing quite a few young OL in these games

[blion72]

4 FR started for Wisky last night and looked real good. Okie has both OTs as FR. These are programs that have had a full compliment of scholies and also have good depth. We have been depleted, and have not even had 3 deep OL on scholarship.

If teams that are stocked already have FR starting, then why are we focused on upper classmen who may not have the top end skill when we have some 4* OL red shirting? does that make you think that the new guys just are not what they were cracked up to be, so we are using the more experienced guys out of desperation??

some of the more highly regarded OL will be Juniors in 2016. anyhow our team seems to be one that would be ripe for FR starters, given our lack of skill/depth at the position.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

Because some recruited better? Nah, the same coach at PSU currently who has played frosh everywhere the last two years has a special rule for OL. Do you really think the magic bullets on the OL this year were true frosh and that held PSU out of this game? Why are some PSU fans so GD stupid?

 

[Ranger Dan]

I've wondered this myself. Is it that the Freshmen we have aren't good enough to make a difference or that the belief is that it's an absolute rule that true Freshmen O linemen must redshirt. It could be that the O linemen just aren't ready. The freshmen linemen that I've noticed have all been on either top ten teams, or teams that traditionally have superior O linemen.

 

[blion72]

Because some recruited better? Nah, the same coach at PSU currently who has played frosh everywhere the last two years has a special rule for OL. Do you really think the magic bullets on the OL this year were true frosh and that held PSU out of this game? Why are some PSU fans so GD stupid?

just sayin - the guys we have recruited must not be that good. we have zero talent on the OL players. you would assume that the entire Wisky OL (4 FR) would replace our entire group. if our talent is that weak at OL, it doesn't say much for the recruits we have that are not good enough to replace them.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

just sayin - the guys we have recruited must not be that good. we have zero talent on the OL players. you would assume that the entire Wisky OL (4 FR) would replace our entire group. if our talent is that weak at OL, it doesn't say much for the recruits we have that are not good enough to replace them.

No, it really doesn't say that, but you are running with it. Gonzalez came in too heavy and not with good weight. They talked about playing Bates apparently. Jenkins made some strides but most people that had a clue (this excludes you) knew he was a 2-3 year project. You need to go elsewhere for info I guess. Do you honestly think the true frosh OL make this a 10 win team?

 

[psu1969a]

4 FR started for Wisky last night and looked real good. Okie has both OTs as FR. These are programs that have had a full compliment of scholies and also have good depth. We have been depleted, and have not even had 3 deep OL on scholarship.

If teams that are stocked already have FR starting, then why are we focused on upper classmen who may not have the top end skill when we have some 4* OL red shirting? does that make you think that the new guys just are not what they were cracked up to be, so we are using the more experienced guys out of desperation??

some of the more highly regarded OL will be Juniors in 2016. anyhow our team seems to be one that would be ripe for FR starters, given our lack of skill/depth at the position.

think outside the box; future will be OK.

 

[irncty]

Only at Penn State does it require all OL 3 years to get "ready"

 

[LaJolla Lion]

Only at Penn State does it require all OL 3 years to get "ready"

PSU has 1 top 100 OL on their roster. Mahon. Do you think the OL recruiting has been great the last 4-5 years? If you do, read my first post. Last year PSU was playing 2-3 second year players. How come we didn't win the MNC?

 

[Raffycorn]

I wouldn't be surprised if we saw two linemen with freshman eligibility (Menet and Bates) in the starting lineup next year. Three if you think Gonzales and Menet at guard if Bates can handle center.

 

[StinkStankStunk]

4 FR started for Wisky last night and looked real good. Okie has both OTs as FR. These are programs that have had a full compliment of scholies and also have good depth. We have been depleted, and have not even had 3 deep OL on scholarship.

If teams that are stocked already have FR starting, then why are we focused on upper classmen who may not have the top end skill when we have some 4* OL red shirting? does that make you think that the new guys just are not what they were cracked up to be, so we are using the more experienced guys out of desperation??

some of the more highly regarded OL will be Juniors in 2016. anyhow our team seems to be one that would be ripe for FR starters, given our lack of skill/depth at the position.

The MOST highly regarding of that stellar class you constantly yap about was the #64 OT recruit in the country.....and was flipped from the Vanderbilt class

The truth of the matter is - as much as (I think) we all hope Brosnan, Sorrell, Wright, and Beh ALL have fine PSU careers.....not ONE of them had any other big time programs shedding tears when they committed to PSU.

Yap Yap Yap Yap

If ONLY we could put all these dynamite FR on the field, like everyone else. LMAO

 

[Ranger Dan]

They just said that the Clemson O line are all new starters.... with their center starting before, but at guard. Maybe we could have wholesale changes on the O line next year?

 

[LaJolla Lion]

They just said that the Clemson O line are all new starters.... with their center starting before, but at guard. Maybe we could have wholesale changes on the O line next year?

Or maybe the staff puts the best 5 out there regardless of the class. Why would they do that though when this board prilovides such brilliant analysis.

 

[GregInPitt]

4 FR started for Wisky last night and looked real good. Okie has both OTs as FR. These are programs that have had a full compliment of scholies and also have good depth. We have been depleted, and have not even had 3 deep OL on scholarship.

If teams that are stocked already have FR starting, then why are we focused on upper classmen who may not have the top end skill when we have some 4* OL red shirting? does that make you think that the new guys just are not what they were cracked up to be, so we are using the more experienced guys out of desperation??

some of the more highly regarded OL will be Juniors in 2016. anyhow our team seems to be one that would be ripe for FR starters, given our lack of skill/depth at the position.

Who are the "some of the more highly regarded OL" will be Juniors in 2016? The first 4 OL recruits of CJF will be RS sophs, technically Juniors. Brosnan, Wright, Beh, and Sorrell. None were top 100 OL recruits. Beh was under 250 LBs when he graduated from H.S., and Sorrel and Brosnan were long, lean OL recruits that had to put on considerable muscle and weight to compete successfully in the B10. These are not recruits such as Newsome from NJ that already was "big" and highly regarded, and would likely be a better candidate to play early.

Jenkins did not even make his all conference team as a H.S. senior let along being all state, so he is another big framed kid that will likely take at least 3 years to be ready to contribute at a high level.

The only highly regarded recruits now on the roster are Bates and Gonzalez. Hopefully Bates can grab a starting job in 2016 as a redshirt frosh. Gonzalez is in the process of transforming his body to more muscle and CJF also speaks highly of him, but who knows if he will win a starting spot.

From the 2016 class (true freshman in 2016) Menet is really a top OL recruit and if he can get up to near 300 lbs may contribute in 2016. But the vast majority of OL recruits will redshirt their first year of college and most or all of the 4 PSU 2016 OL recruits will likely redshirt.

I'm in the camp that believes the 2016 OL will be somewhat better, with PPalmer bigger and more experienced, Bates making an impact, and 1 or 2 of the redshirt sophs contributing or winning starting jobs.....

Yes, when you have a poor OL one would think the young players could improve the unit. But it really takes big physical OL recruits to do that and we have not gotten these kids recently (i.e. until the 2016 class)

Look at the pitt OL depth chart. Dorian Johnson, very highly rated, as well as Bitnowaty and the kid from Mt Lebo would all likely be at PSU without the sanctions. And they would have been playing for us in 2015 (with the exception of the Lebo kid as I believe he is still a RS freshman...)

 

[Ceasar]

They just said that the Clemson O line are all new starters.... with their center starting before, but at guard. Maybe we could have wholesale changes on the O line next year?

I guess the hope is that next year we will have a core of young o-linemen who have the talent and or the experience to compete at this level. That would include Beh, Sorrell, Jenkins at T and Bates, Gonzales, McGovern, Menet, Wright and Brosnan in the interior. Maybe Menet plays T, not sure where he will line up. I think the FR and RS FR may have the talent to play and the third year kids have been in the program long enough one would hope they can compete. So instead of rotating the samè 6-7 kids there will be a competition.

 

[rocky_dog7]

Look, the group from 13 were all projects, quite frankly I don't expect much out of that bunch unfortunately.

The ol has hit their low water mark, make no mistake.

 

[CDW3333]

PSU has 1 top 100 OL on their roster. Mahon. Do you think the OL recruiting has been great the last 4-5 years? If you do, read my first post. Last year PSU was playing 2-3 second year players. How come we didn't win the MNC?

Wisconsin's four freshman Olineman are two two-stars (Maxwell and Kapoi) and two low rated 5.5 three stars (Benzshawel and Deiter).

So, how does that work? Wisconsin's four freshmen who are starting for a top-20 team are lower rated than Penn State's four freshmen (all three stars) but Penn State's players are riding the pine. I'm searching for an answer here . . . oh, I know. Penn State's offensive coaches (not including Moorhead, obviously) suck.

 

[Ranger Dan]

Wisconsin's four freshman Olineman are two two-stars (Maxwell and Kapoi) and two low rated 5.5 three stars (Benzshawel and Deiter).

So, how does that work? Wisconsin's four freshmen who are starting for a top-20 team are lower rated than Penn State's four freshmen (all three stars) but Penn State's players are riding the pine. I'm searching for an answer here . . . oh, I know. Penn State's offensive coaches (not including Moorhead, obviously) suck.

One positive spin is that CJF or Hand insist on redshirting O linemen or were somehow banking them for an impact year in 2016. Another thought is that the Wisky system is based upon certain types of linemen that are not necessarily highly rated in general... like road grader types who don't have great feet.

 

[PSU.:.]

Maybe the OL coaching is just bad or a combination of both. I don't if I can take another year of horrible OL play. It's getting annoying. Why can't any of these kids improve on the OL.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

Wisconsin's four freshman Olineman are two two-stars (Maxwell and Kapoi) and two low rated 5.5 three stars (Benzshawel and Deiter).

So, how does that work? Wisconsin's four freshmen who are starting for a top-20 team are lower rated than Penn State's four freshmen (all three stars) but Penn State's players are riding the pine. I'm searching for an answer here . . . oh, I know. Penn State's offensive coaches (not including Moorhead, obviously) suck.

What did UW win this year? Oh the RS OL frosh played last year for PSU, how did that work out? Urschel was a 2 star. Logan El was a 5 star. If you still think the majority of OL rankings mean much you're crazy. The top 4-5 tend to stick out and the rest is a best guess.

Do you think Franklin is afraid to play frosh? You can't be that stupid because he has played them everywhere else. So what exactly is your point? I can see why this board barely talks football anymore.

 

[StinkStankStunk]

Wisconsin's four freshman Olineman are two two-stars (Maxwell and Kapoi) and two low rated 5.5 three stars (Benzshawel and Deiter).

So, how does that work? Wisconsin's four freshmen who are starting for a top-20 team are lower rated than Penn State's four freshmen (all three stars) but Penn State's players are riding the pine. I'm searching for an answer here . . . oh, I know. Penn State's offensive coaches (not including Moorhead, obviously) suck.

Yap. Yap. Yap

 

[CDW3333]

What did UW win this year? Oh the RS OL frosh played last year for PSU, how did that work out? Urschel was a 2 star. Logan El was a 5 star. If you still think the majority of OL rankings mean much you're crazy. The top 4-5 tend to stick out and the rest is a best guess.

Do you think Franklin is afraid to play frosh? You can't be that stupid because he has played them everywhere else. So what exactly is your point? I can see why this board barely talks football anymore.

The offensive coaching for the last two years has been horrible. From the schemes to the plays to the techniques have all been awful.

Maybe things will get better with Moorhead as OC.

And Wisconsin is 10-3 and will be in the top-20.

And you were the one complaining that Penn State's OLine was lowly rated. Now you turn around and say that ratings don't matter.

Make up your mind.

 

[GregInPitt]

I guess the hope is that next year we will have a core of young o-linemen who have the talent and or the experience to compete at this level. That would include Beh, Sorrell, Jenkins at T and Bates, Gonzales, McGovern, Menet, Wright and Brosnan in the interior. Maybe Menet plays T, not sure where he will line up. I think the FR and RS FR may have the talent to play and the third year kids have been in the program long enough one would hope they can compete. So instead of rotating the samè 6-7 kids there will be a competition.

I doubt Jenkins is in the rotation before 2017 at the earliest.

In 2016 at OT it likely will be Nelson for sure, and then Palmer, Brosnan, Sorrell, and Beh competing for the other spot. Mahon could be at OT next year as well as he played there some this year, but the need in the interior is still likely greater.... Some forget that Nelson and Mahon will only be redshirt juniors in 2016, just coming into their prime playing years.

In 2016 at Guard/Center it will be Mahon, Bates, Wright (big enough to play OT but was reportedly practicing at Guard), Gonzales, and whoever from Laurent/Dowrey/Gaia comes back for their 5th year. Menet is a possibility to play as a true frosh as well, but I'd bet my paycheck that McGovern, Fries, and Gellerstedt redshirt in 2016. From what has been reported it looks like Bates will play Center in 2016 and I expect Laurent to come back and be 2nd team Center. Then in 2017 McGovern will likely play Center, and when he is ready to start it sounds like Bates will move to Guard as it has been reported that is his natural position. Will Menet play OT or Guard? That will be interesting to see. We really have bigger numbers right now of tall OL kids to eventually be OT's, but if they don't develop Menet may play OT. Beh has practied at both Guard and OT and seemed to be higher on the depth chart than the other 3 2014 OL recruits

We will not have a better than average B10 OL until the nucleus of the line is made up of redshirt juniors and seniors because we don't now have a big crew of top 100 olinemen on the roster.

 

[danvillenit]

Good analysis Greg. 2016 we will finally have some numbers to find a decent five, but still hindered by the 2014 group all being projects.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

Anyone just see Bama's LT at 330 pounds SPRINT out and make that block. I guess we have a frosh on the bench who can do that or it was just a better playcall. Bama had 40+ kids from the Under Armor AA game on this roster. PSU was taking 245 pound OT's but there is still some confusion as to where or why some teams are better up front. The sanctions hurt PSU. The OL in particular as you always have misses on the OL. PSU had misses and a kids that were 2-3 year projects. If you can't understand that or see it, that is on you.

 

[Ceasar]

Good analysis Greg. 2016 we will finally have some numbers to find a decent five, but still hindered by the 2014 group all being projects.

Agree, good analysis Greg. The only thing I would mention is conventional wisdom on Jenkins coming out of HS was, big time athlete but a project. But he played HS ball at around 280 pounds. He is now 328. Not sure anyone expected him to be this big so quickly.. I have a feeling he is going to emerge sooner than we thought.

 

[GregInPitt]

Agree, good analysis Greg. The only thing I would mention is conventional wisdom on Jenkins coming out of HS was, big time athlete but a project. But he played HS ball at around 280 pounds. He is now 328. Not sure anyone expected him to be this big so quickly.. I have a feeling he is going to emerge sooner than we thought.

Agree on Jenkins. 2017 will be his redshirt soph year which is sooner than most originally thought. As a H.S. soph and Junior the recruiting evaluators gave him the benefit of the doubt due to his size. Didn't he have a 5 star rating on one of the services initially. But then he didn't really develop in H.S. as some thought or as some kids do and he slid downward in the recruiting rankings. Hey, every kid develops at a different pace due to their physical development, coaching,.... CJF talks up his young kids, and rightly so. It will be great to see Jenkins develop as it seems like the kid is really working at his trade (enrolled early, great progress in the weight room,...). Just hope he stays hungry and stays out of trouble.

We have a kid at USC in the Pittsburgh south hill, Ford, that had nice size early. He committed to Pitt early, but apparently didn't have a great senior year as he did not make all conference. Actually another USC OLinemen did make all conference but does not have the size that Ford does. And Ford has slid down the PA top recruits rankings. But can this kid go to pitt and work hard and end up as a nice college player? Probably if he works hard and is patient for playing time.....