Social Security goes broke and can't be funded 7 years from now.

[artsandletters]

Well the discussion was on the viability of SS. So
. there is no money to borrow - it is all a paper entry. Do you believe in the lock box?
. to the extent all money is co mingled, SS has funded ALL govt spending. To single out one item of govt spending is both simplistic and off topic. It makes no more sense than saying SS $ was used to fund subsidies for rich Tesla owners or ethanol subsidies for rich farmers OR to buy Obama's drones or his Obamacare.
It is fine to be against the Iraq war or all defense spending for that matter but it seems to be the topic of a separate thread.

I'm a simple man. Help me. Do employers send the SS money deducted each week to the federal government? If so, where is the money sent? Once received, where does that money go? Are you saying that there is not one specific fund that is stand alone SS money? If it is all one big pile of money isn't there are record of which part of that pile was sent in by employers specifically for SS deductions? When SS makes payments to retirees, where does that money come from? A general fund or a stand alone SS fund?

 

[pierremc]

Let's be honest here. Republicans don't hate Social Security because it's not a true investment program. They don't hate it because the country can't afford it (the country can EASILY afford it).

They hate Social Security because it exists -- and they always have, for 80 years. SS just offends their sense of morality. They hate it for the some reason they hate Medicare and Obamacare.

Some people just think "freedom" means old people who haven't got enough money saved should just live on the streets and beg for their food just like the good old days before Social Security. Because having gangs of starving old people hanging out outside the grocery store would be such a GREAT moral lesson for our sons and daughters.

Republicans would never say this of course, but their Social Security "reform" always involves a lot of street begging and a lot of old people eating cat food. Just like their idea of Medicare "reform" involves telling old people -- too bad, you used up your $3,000 health care voucher, I guess your time is up!

Just like Paul Ryan's brilliant "replacement" for Obamacare -- which is just to repeal all the taxes, all the mandates, all the subsidies, so that health insurance becomes so expensive that only the top third of Americans can afford it. Let's make a health care system where only the wealthiest can afford hospitals -- that's a Republican dream!

All of this -- old people eating cat food, sick people just dying already instead of health insurance -- all this just gives Republicans a warm fuzzy feeling, especially if it involves tax cuts so the wealthiest Americans can buy more beach houses and yachts and private planes, so they can gold-plate their kitchen tables and their bathroom walls. Heck, so they can gold-plate the gold plate, because you can never have too much of that. Because, again, we want our sons and daughters to grow up in a country where the top 1% poop gold -- because it will motivate our sons and daughters to work really hard so they can poop gold as well. Because money is life, and life is money!

Maybe the poor and the working class just aren't suffering enough these days -- wouldn't it just feel good to turn the screws and make their lives a LOT more miserable? And while we're at it, let's abolish that darned minimum wage because $7.25 an hour is just too damn much money when we could be paying $2 an hour...

Crazy thing is you actually believe this. The word "nutjob" comes to mind...

 

[aferrelli]

It's a simple solution:
Take the cap off of SS contributions.
Make everyone pay SS tax on every dollar that they make.

Is that fair? Yes. If we are a civilized society, and we can't take care of our neediest, then what does that say for our country?
A country that outspends most other civilized countries in defense spending, 10 fold.

 

[roswelllion]

I'm a simple man. Help me. Do employers send the SS money deducted each week to the federal government? If so, where is the money sent? Once received, where does that money go? Are you saying that there is not one specific fund that is stand alone SS money? If it is all one big pile of money isn't there are record of which part of that pile was sent in by employers specifically for SS deductions? When SS makes payments to retirees, where does that money come from? A general fund or a stand alone SS fund?

Many folks in this thread have explained it. Think of a bucket. US collects $100 from all sources. Some nerd in the corner writes on a piece of paper [really electronically] $20 of this comes from SS collections. Same guy writes $15 paid out out when SS payments are made, but the money really came out of the same $100 bucket. The SS "checkbook", [with no real money in it] has run a surplus for many years but now is forecast to be empty in a few years. That is why many have said there really is no money in the SS fund. That is why I keep calling it a paper entry. Using the the same analogy the US really spends $110 so it is $10 short each year. [deficits] To do this they say to you and me I'll pay you back in the future if you give me $10 today. [US treasuries] Some call this printing money.
What the Fed has done is said well we'll give you the $10 if you pay us back. That really is like printing money.

 

[artsandletters]

Many folks in this thread have explained it. Think of a bucket. US collects $100 from all sources. Some nerd in the corner writes on a piece of paper [really electronically] $20 of this comes from SS collections. Same guy writes $15 paid out out when SS payments are made, but the money really came out of the same $100 bucket. The SS "checkbook", [with no real money in it] has run a surplus for many years but now is forecast to be empty in a few years. That is why many have said there really is no money in the SS fund. That is why I keep calling it a paper entry. Using the the same analogy the US really spends $110 so it is $10 short each year. [deficits] To do this they say to you and me I'll pay you back in the future if you give me $10 today. [US treasuries] Some call this printing money.
What the Fed has done is said well we'll give you the $10 if you pay us back. That really is like printing money.

Thank you. Except. Why should the SS money be put into the same bucket with the same risk attached to it? There is no fund. It is a lie. When we spend money on wars it comes from the big bucket with the SS money in it. Correct? Meaning that promised money has been used for purposes other than to reimburse the entitled when it comes due. Correct?

Why is it that the inept -government - and the greedy - Wall Street - see a big pile of money that is not theirs and use it irresponsibly? This is why I hate people.

 

[dawgduice]

Thank you. Except. Why should the SS money be put into the same bucket with the same risk attached to it? There is no fund. It is a lie. When we spend money on wars it comes from the big bucket with the SS money in it. Correct? Meaning that promised money has been used for purposes other than to reimburse the entitled when it comes due. Correct? If so, everyone involved in making these decisions should be hung by the neck until dead. Correct?

Why is it that the inept -government - and the greedy - Wall Street - see a big pile of money that is not theirs and use it irresponsibly? This is why I hate people.

Really, ALL of this comes down to "our" government and WHO they really represent. A clue: NOT anyone on this board nor anyone we know
We want to think they represent us, but let's be real.
Could all be fixed? Yes but we have NO real ability to affect such.

 

[step.eng69]

Thank you. Except. Why should the SS money be put into the same bucket with the same risk attached to it? There is no fund. It is a lie. When we spend money on wars it comes from the big bucket with the SS money in it. Correct? Meaning that promised money has been used for purposes other than to reimburse the entitled when it comes due. Correct? If so, everyone involved in making these decisions should be hung by the neck until dead. Correct?

Why is it that the inept -government - and the greedy - Wall Street - see a big pile of money that is not theirs and use it irresponsibly? This is why I hate people.

I also have begun to "hate everyone" as of the past year.

Double speak to me, sounds like federal accountants playing a shell game with the SS monies.
link SS: https://www.ssa.gov/history/InternetMyths2.html
____________________________________________________________________________
Q1. Which political party took Social Security from the independent trust fund and put it into the general fund so that Congress could spend it?A1: There has never been any change in the way the Social Security program is financed or the way that Social Security payroll taxes are used by the federal government. The Social Security Trust Fund was created in 1939 as part of the Amendments enacted in that year. From its inception, the Trust Fund has always worked the same way. The Social Security Trust Fund has never been "put into the general fund of the government."

Most likely this question comes from a confusion between the financing of the Social Security program and the way the Social Security Trust Fund is treated in federal budget accounting. Starting in 1969 (due to action by the Johnson Administration in 1968) the transactions to the Trust Fund were included in what is known as the "unified budget." This means that every function of the federal government is included in a single budget. This is sometimes described by saying that the Social Security Trust Funds are "on-budget." This budget treatment of the Social Security Trust Fund continued until 1990 when the Trust Funds were again taken "off-budget." This means only that they are shown as a separate account in the federal budget. But whether the Trust Funds are "on-budget" or "off-budget" is primarily a question of accounting practices--it has no effect on the actual operations of the Trust Fund itself.

 

[artsandletters]

I also have begun to "hate everyone" as of the past year.

Double speak to me, sounds like federal accountants playing a shell game with the SS monies.
link SS: https://www.ssa.gov/history/InternetMyths2.html
____________________________________________________________________________
Q1. Which political party took Social Security from the independent trust fund and put it into the general fund so that Congress could spend it?A1: There has never been any change in the way the Social Security program is financed or the way that Social Security payroll taxes are used by the federal government. The Social Security Trust Fund was created in 1939 as part of the Amendments enacted in that year. From its inception, the Trust Fund has always worked the same way. The Social Security Trust Fund has never been "put into the general fund of the government."

Most likely this question comes from a confusion between the financing of the Social Security program and the way the Social Security Trust Fund is treated in federal budget accounting. Starting in 1969 (due to action by the Johnson Administration in 1968) the transactions to the Trust Fund were included in what is known as the "unified budget." This means that every function of the federal government is included in a single budget. This is sometimes described by saying that the Social Security Trust Funds are "on-budget." This budget treatment of the Social Security Trust Fund continued until 1990 when the Trust Funds were again taken "off-budget." This means only that they are shown as a separate account in the federal budget. But whether the Trust Funds are "on-budget" or "off-budget" is primarily a question of accounting practices--it has no effect on the actual operations of the Trust Fund itself.

Sounds like LBJ used the SS money to fund Vietnam starting in '69. The rest, just of bunch of lying, stealing and cheating.

 

[step.eng69]

Sounds like LBJ used the SS money to fund Vietnam starting in '69. The rest, just of bunch of lying, stealing and cheating.

Those are a few of the reasons WE hate people

 

[artsandletters]

Those are a few of the reasons WE hate people

Oh, forgive me, but I hate them more. Please give me that.

 

[step.eng69]

Oh, forgive me, but I hate them more. Please give me that.

OK

 

[artsandletters]

OK

I appreciate your compassion. What's your angle?

 

[step.eng69]

I appreciate your compassion. What's your angle?

...

 

[roswelllion]

I appreciate your compassion. What's your angle?

Don't want to get in the middle of the love fest with you and step, but I couldn't agree more with your last comments. Can't trust anything they say. Either party.