at least as far as a shooter, is there any question that he's the GOAT?
Steph Curry
- Thread starter Obliviax
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Living in the Bay Area, I watch most Warriors games, and the stuff he does, amazing as it is, is no longer surprising. Klay can really go off, too. What makes me realize how special these guys are as shooters is when I watch an NBA game that does NOT involve the Warriors. It often resembles a convention of bricklayers.
Curry is great and probably the GOAT. However, there have been great shooters in the past and it is hard to compare them to Curry. Guys like Bill Sharman, Ray Allen, Larry Bird, Rick Barry, Austin Carr, Chris Mullen, and Reggie Miller were great shooters too.
Curry is the GOAT when you consider career shooting. However, this year, he has been quite average. Not average for Steph, but average for the league. Not sure if he is hurt, or father time is starting to catch up, but Curry's 3 point shooting has regressed greatly...
Yeah, Steph is the best ever IMO.
His younger brother Seth is quite a shooter, too with a career avg. slightly better than Steph (but fewer shots and not the range). Kevin Durant is a great shooter, who also happens to be 7-ft tall.
His younger brother Seth is quite a shooter, too with a career avg. slightly better than Steph (but fewer shots and not the range). Kevin Durant is a great shooter, who also happens to be 7-ft tall.
It's always tough to compare guys across eras. The 3pt line was introduced in 1979 - bird and magic's rookie year. Those guys played their entire career, having never considered the 3pt line until the NBA. Guys today have never played a basketball game, at any level, that did not incorporate the 3. 3pt percentages over the years bear this out, and the NBA game with analytics have increased 3pt attempts.
It's tough to beat bird on shooting prowess. Curry may be the goat, but it's worth a conversation if bird had grown up with the 3, how they would compare.
Another interesting stat...
Curry's 3pt percentage is .427
In the 80s, Dale Ellis was .411, Bird was .377
Now the crazy part...
Ellis made 472 3s in the 80s
Bird made 455 3s in the 80s
Curry has made 3093 in 12 years
The number of attempts for shooters today is massively higher.
Having watched Curry play long enough, his percentage is hurt due to the fact that he he takes such long 3s, it is also hurt because everytime he is in the game at the end of a quarter or half, he is the one taking a desperation heave.
Not trying to argue. Steph is obviously fantastic, but I'd ask why he takes such long 3s? What in his game makes him take such long 3s instead instead of getting good looks from closer in?
Spacing. Being a threat at that distance means you have to be guarded that far out, which creates even more spacing for the offense on the floor. That is the theory which is statistically proven to be advantageous and optimal for overall offensivive efficiency at a minimum shooting percentage at the distance.
The women's ball is an inch smaller in circumference.
On the margins that's a big difference.
LdN
You seem to know a lot about small balls.
I don't want to participate in your gay fantasies. Please use your inside voice for that.
LdN
The fact that you can't handle that a woman is a phenomenal shooter is classic small dick syndrome. 🤏🍌
I don't want to participate in your gay fantasies. Please use your inside voice for that.
LdN
Since this does not seem to be clear to you, I do not support you, your little dick nation, or your gay sexual fantasies.
Curry is better than all those guys you just mentioned, and it’s not really even that close.
Maybe so. Curry is my favorite current player and he is probably the shooting GOAT. It would be great if somehow each of these players in their prime could get together and have a shooting contest. We might be surprised by the result. Guys like Bill Sharman, Rick Barry, and Chris Mullen could hit dozens of shots in a row without a miss. Likely one of them would get hot and win the contest. Maybe Curry. Maybe not.
I doubt Curry has some secret shooting technique that makes him a better shooter than most of the other top SGs of the past.
The game has changed a lot. Likely has a major impact on his ability to play healthy more.
Perhaps he is the best ever but I think it is debatable.
Ldn
If some of those guys who played back in the 70s 80s and 90s or given the same analytic approach to spacing and shooting as well as training methods I'd think you'd have seen Pistol Pete or Reggie Miller or someone like that should do similar things as Steph. He may be the best I've ever seen but it's not definitive to me.
Absolutely true. There is no way to definitively say. Same goes for football when we compare players from the wishbone era to the Full-back/run-first era to today's Spread/pass-first offenses.
We need to look no further than PSU football. Here's a list of the Top 20 QBs by passing yards in PSU history. The top 3 just happen to be the last 3 starting QBs. Trace is a gritty winner, but no one would call him, Hack, or Clifford the GOATs of PSU QBs. The game has changed. Let's not even consider rule changes that have significantly limited DBs ability to defend as they did in past eras. What would Bobby Engram's numbers have looked like if he played in the Franklin era?
Penn State's all-time leading passers in Nittany Lions history
Penn State quarterback Sean Clifford has a chance to be a top-three all-time passer at Penn State in 2021.
nittanylionswire.usatoday.com
Back to the NBA, Bird won the first (3), 3pt All-star contests. His shooting ability was unmatched. It's impossible to tell how Bird would have compared if he was the same age as Steph. Hell, take even Craig Hodges, who played from 82-92. He also took his first 3 point shot in the NBA (NCAA didn't add till '86). The guy won 3, 3-pt contests and lost in 2 other finals. If he grew up with the 3, and the NBA game then, was spreading the floor and bombing long range 3s, who knows.
Bottom line, it's nearly impossible to compare players across eras, given changes in strategy and rules, let alone training improvements. We also cannot discount league expansion which dilutes talent.
Consider this - The NBA has added 7 teams since 1988, going from 23 to 30 teams. That is a 30% increase...that means that day in and day out, today's players face about 1/3 less talent each night than Bird did in the prime of his career. These are not small factors.
Agreed And Bird was, well, a different bird. He could create shots and shoot at different angles and make them all. However, he played with several top 50 players so that helped. Steph is amazing at not only making shots but being active and getting open. IMHO, still a better pure shooter than anyone I"ve ever seen including Miller and my favorite, Mark Price.Absolutely true. There is no way to definitively say. Same goes for football when we compare players from the wishbone era to the Full-back/run-first era to today's Spread/pass-first offenses.
We need to look no further than PSU football. Here's a list of the Top 20 QBs by passing yards in PSU history. The top 3 just happen to be the last 3 starting QBs. Trace is a gritty winner, but no one would call him, Hack, or Clifford the GOATs of PSU QBs. The game has changed. Let's not even consider rule changes that have significantly limited DBs ability to defend as they did in past eras. What would Bobby Engram's numbers have looked like if he played in the Franklin era?
Penn State's all-time leading passers in Nittany Lions history
Penn State quarterback Sean Clifford has a chance to be a top-three all-time passer at Penn State in 2021.
Back to the NBA, Bird won the first (3), 3pt All-star contests. His shooting ability was unmatched. It's impossible to tell how Bird would have compared if he was the same age as Steph. Hell, take even Craig Hodges, who played from 82-92. He also took his first 3 point shot in the NBA (NCAA didn't add till '86). The guy won 3, 3-pt contests and lost in 2 other finals. If he grew up with the 3, and the NBA game then, was spreading the floor and bombing long range 3s, who knows.
Bottom line, it's nearly impossible to compare players across eras, given changes in strategy and rules, let alone training improvements. We also cannot discount league expansion which dilutes talent.
Consider this - The NBA has added 7 teams since 1988, going from 23 to 30 teams. That is a 30% increase...that means that day in and day out, today's players face about 1/3 less talent each night than Bird did in the prime of his career. These are not small factors.
I am most definitely not the shooter Mark Price was (I did have some scholly offers way back when though) but playing pick up a few weeks ago and one of the HS kids called me Mark Price after I knocked down a few long range ones. Unfortunately none of the other kids knew who he was talking about.
Price was one of the best pure shooters ever. At one point, I recall him hitting like 100 free throws in a row. He was just automatic at the free throw line. The downside is that the Knicks, Hawks and Pistons just beat the living crap out of him during games and that really limited his stamina and playing ability deep into seasons and during back to backs.
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