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184 Wrestle Off

Funny, I don't remember Morgan McIntosh towering over the field either.
Jefe, I agree I am not that worried about his height, for 97. He just needs to have the strength to handle 97 and early reports on Cutch look promising, in that regard.
 
Why not? The NCAA rule is that you can't be under 5% body fat -- hence the minimum weight. If that happens to equal a weight class, so be it.
What percentage of body fat was Cutch when he certified? If he certified at 174 in a hydrated state his body fat had to be 5.00%, for him not to be able to wrestle at 173.99 right?
 
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Anyone feel like elaborating ??

I see two of you guys dropping subtle hints.

The guys from Flo mentioned that PSU is still in the running for Fix, in spite of the RBY signing. They also mentioned that they still viewed the Cowpokes as the favorites to land him.

Our friends from OSU must be slightly nervous waiting for the decision. I recall our favorite Okie, Mike T., joking that Daton was keeping Cael in suspense so we didn't get anyone else while we waited. At least I think he was joking. Guess that theory went by the wayside when RBY signed.
 
Isn't Cutch 5'10" the same height or at least very close to the height of Kyle Snyder?
Back in the day I was 6 foot, not 60 yet and already shrinking. Probably about 5'11" and Matt is noticeably shorter than me. So is Morgan.
 
The guys from Flo mentioned that PSU is still in the running for Fix, in spite of the RBY signing. They also mentioned that they still viewed the Cowpokes as the favorites to land him.

Our friends from OSU must be slightly nervous waiting for the decision. I recall our favorite Okie, Mike T., joking that Daton was keeping Cael in suspense so we didn't get anyone else while we waited. At least I think he was joking. Guess that theory went by the wayside when RBY signed.
You know I'm always around, ready to strike
 
What percentage of body fat was Cutch when he certified? If he certified at 174 in a hydrated state his body fat had to be 5.00%, for him not to be able to wrestle at 173.99 right?
That's not how certification works. It's about calculating your minimum allowable weight.

You get weighed in a fully hydrated state, and give a urine sample to confirm hydration level. You get weighed and body fat measured. Then your weight at 5% fat is calculated mathematically from your current state.

Current body composition is part of the equation, but otherwise irrelevant. It doesn't matter if (to make up numbers) he was at 174/5% or at 200/20% on certification day.
 
That's not how certification works. It's about calculating your minimum allowable weight.

You get weighed in a fully hydrated state, and give a urine sample to confirm hydration level. You get weighed and body fat measured. Then your weight at 5% fat is calculated mathematically from your current state.

Current body composition is part of the equation, but otherwise irrelevant. It doesn't matter if (to make up numbers) he was at 174/5% or at 200/20% on certification day.
I just went through the other thread that went through this so I have a question. We know Cutch certified at 174, so he had to weigh 174.0 or less. How, mathematically, could a person in a fully hydrated state be 174.0 with 20% body fat and then have the calculation at the same hydration level at 5% body fat be equal the same 174.0? This is why I believe that Cutch had to be near 5% body fat for this to be true. Do we know his actual weight at the weigh in?
 
I just went through the other thread that went through this so I have a question. We know Cutch certified at 174, so he had to weigh 174.0 or less. How, mathematically, could a person in a fully hydrated state be 174.0 with 20% body fat and then have the calculation at the same hydration level at 5% body fat be equal the same 174.0? This is why I believe that Cutch had to be near 5% body fat for this to be true. Do we know his actual weight at the weigh in?
Again, this is not how certification works.

You weigh whatever you weigh on certification day. Your body fat is whatever it is on that day. Then your certification weight is calculated.

For his minimum weight to be 174 lb, he had to have lean mass = (174.0 x 95%) = 165.3 lb.

He could've had any weight/fat composition that day, as long as his lean mass was 165.3 lb. A few possibilities:
- 183.7 lb / 10%
- 194.5 lb / 15%
- 206.6 lb / 20%
 
I disagree with that. I saw the wrestleoff in person. Myself along with a couple other gentlemen were in Lorenzo and were pleased to see that they had an open practice and we were able to watch. Gulibon was the only other one to wrestle off yesterday. He won his match. If Cutch gets down to 174, i do not see Rasheed or anyone else at that weight in the room beating him. He looked like a completely different wrestler yesterday. I don't believe Cael will not have Cutch in the lineup somewhere even if it meant moving Bo to 197 for the team title race. My guess is that if he loses the next wrestle off, we will see him at 174 by the Penn Open.
Lemme make sure I got this right.
So if Bo beats Cutch out at 184 and Cutch can't make 174 you believe Cutch still wrestles 184 Cael moves Bo up to 197 for the team title race? And some other posters consigning this to boot.o_O
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Don't take these to the bank but after seeing both up close at the kickoff event, I would put Mouse at a generous 5'8" and ly aMorgan around 5'10". Does that sound about right, fellas?

5" 8" is probably about right. I don't think he has grown taller since early in HS
 
The guys from Flo mentioned that PSU is still in the running for Fix, in spite of the RBY signing. They also mentioned that they still viewed the Cowpokes as the favorites to land him.

Our friends from OSU must be slightly nervous waiting for the decision. I recall our favorite Okie, Mike T., joking that Daton was keeping Cael in suspense so we didn't get anyone else while we waited. At least I think he was joking. Guess that theory went by the wayside when RBY signed.
The guys at flo made those comments before the lower weight from Florida commited. PSU may not have a scholly limit but there is a cap on flowing golden locks.
 
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Again, this is not how certification works.

You weigh whatever you weigh on certification day. Your body fat is whatever it is on that day. Then your certification weight is calculated.

For his minimum weight to be 174 lb, he had to have lean mass = (174.0 x 95%) = 165.3 lb.

He could've had any weight/fat composition that day, as long as his lean mass was 165.3 lb. A few possibilities:
- 183.7 lb / 10%
- 194.5 lb / 15%
- 206.6 lb / 20%
I appreciate the responses. I guess I misunderstood the certification process. I thought there were 2 calculations. First after passing the hydration steps was that your "actual" weight had to be at or below the weight classification.
The second calculation would be the Minimum safe weight, based on the weight % body fat calculation.
So, by my understanding if Cutch weight 174.0 or 168 he would certify at the 174 weight class. And then a totally separate calculation to determine the minimum safe weight would be based on body fat calculation based on the weight at the time of certification?
 
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I appreciate the responses. I guess I misunderstood the certification process. I thought there were 2 calculations. First after passing the hydration steps was that your "actual" weight had to be at or below the weight classification.
The second calculation would be the Minimum safe weight, based on the weight % body fat calculation.
So, by my understanding if Cutch weight 174.0 or 168 he would certify at 174. And then a totally separate calculation to determine the minimum safe weight would be based on body fat calculation based on the weight at the time of certification?
Getting warmer. There's only 1 calculation, The "first" calculation posited above does not exist. The only calculation is to determine your BW @ 5% fat.

You can weigh anything on certification day. Do not have to be at or even near the weight classification where you're certified.
 
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I disagree with that. I saw the wrestleoff in person. Myself along with a couple other gentlemen were in Lorenzo and were pleased to see that they had an open practice and we were able to watch. Gulibon was the only other one to wrestle off yesterday. He won his match. If Cutch gets down to 174, i do not see Rasheed or anyone else at that weight in the room beating him. He looked like a completely different wrestler yesterday. I don't believe Cael will not have Cutch in the lineup somewhere even if it meant moving Bo to 197 for the team title race. My guess is that if he loses the next wrestle off, we will see him at 174 by the Penn Open.
He will be too weak..Has trouble making 84....
 
Don't take these to the bank but after seeing both up close at the kickoff event, I would put Mouse at a generous 5'8" and Morgan around 5'10". Does that sound about right, fellas?

Yeah, I would guess that McCutcheon is closer to 5'8" than 5'10".

Also, I have now seen references to both Kyle Snyder and Morgan Macintosh regarding shorter guys who were very good wrestlers at 197. I get the point, but at the same time find those two references somewhat amusing, as related to projecting 'Cutch's success at 197.
 
Yeah, I would guess that McCutcheon is closer to 5'8" than 5'10".

Also, I have now seen references to both Kyle Snyder and Morgan Macintosh regarding shorter guys who were very good wrestlers at 197. I get the point, but at the same time find those two references somewhat amusing, as related to projecting 'Cutch's success at 197.

You have it backwards and have setup the classic straw man argument. No one said Cutch would be successful because of his height, but many have said he won't be successful because of his height and those two examples AND many more prove that a wrestlers height is not nearly as important as many on these boards like to think it is.
 
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You have it backwards and have setup the classic straw man argument. No one said Cutch would be successful because of his height, but many have said he won't be successful because of his height and those two examples AND many more prove that a wrestlers height is not nearly as important as many on these boards like to think it is.

I think Bruce's point is that people are using two exceptional athletes - Morgan and Snyder were both the top recruits in the country their senior year - to prove that it can be done. There are exceptions to most every rule. To put Cutch in a class with MM and Snyder is reaching - not to be disrespectful to Cutch.
 
I think Bruce's point is that people are using two exceptional athletes - Morgan and Snyder were both the top recruits in the country their senior year - to prove that it can be done. There are exceptions to most every rule. To put Cutch in a class with MM and Snyder is reaching - not to be disrespectful to Cutch.

Once again you missed the point.
 
Once again you missed the point.

I don't think so. I think the point that some are trying to make is that you are not going to be successful at 5'8" at 197 unless you are an exceptional athlete. Not that I agree with it - just think that is their point. I do agree that pointing out MM and Snyder as the examples relative to Cutch is fairly irrelevant.
 
Ok, I'll play along. Two predictions:

1. Cutch will open the season at 197.

2. Cutch will be very successful at 197 this season.
 
I don't think so. I think the point that some are trying to make is that you are not going to be successful at 5'8" at 197 unless you are an exceptional athlete. Not that I agree with it - just think that is their point.
FIFY.
 
Not especially familiar with the international scene but I thought the top-tier guys were all fairly stocky. Don't know if it's because that build suits wrestling best or because of PED use, though.
 
Anybody have an idea when the next wrestle offs will be? Including Morelli/Rasheed/Brill if they haven't already?
 
The guys from Flo mentioned that PSU is still in the running for Fix, in spite of the RBY signing. They also mentioned that they still viewed the Cowpokes as the favorites to land him.

Our friends from OSU must be slightly nervous waiting for the decision. I recall our favorite Okie, Mike T., joking that Daton was keeping Cael in suspense so we didn't get anyone else while we waited. At least I think he was joking. Guess that theory went by the wayside when RBY signed.
Isn't Fix at Ohio State this weekend?
 
I'm trying to think of a match where it looked like Cutch was struggling with the length of an opponent. I'm not coming up with one. To me, it seems length is not a problem for some people, and Cutch might be one of them.
 
Bo better darn well be beating him worse then that if he wants to be National Champ....I heard Bo was not even series till the 3rd period....My buddy goes to practice a lot....When is media day ?

I don't think you can make any conclusions about Bo based on his wrestle off with Cutch being close. These guys wrestle each other every day - so easy to keep it close when you know someone as well as these guys know each other - I think especially so at the heavier weights.

I'm interested in knowing how Hall vs Rasheed looks in the room - anyone know? Two reasons I ask
1) if there's huge Hall advantage AND Cutch can't make 174 - then I have to believe the chances of Hall going this year increase. thoughts?
2) curious to see how Hall handles Rasheed's length - if Hall stays at 174 in college he's going to run into alot of long/lanky/funky guys. Both BJordan and Valencia will have length advantage.
 
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I don't think you can make any conclusions about Bo based on his wrestle off with Cutch being close. These guys wrestle each other every day - so easy to keep it close when you know someone as well as these guys know each other - I think especially so at the heavier weights.

I'm interested in knowing how Hall vs Rasheed looks in the room - anyone know? Two reasons I ask
1) if there's huge Hall advantage AND Cutch can't make 174 - then I have to believe the chances of Hall going this year increase. thoughts?
2) curious to see how Hall handles Rasheed's length - if Hall stays at 174 in college he's going to run into alot of long/lanky/funky guys. Both BJordan and Valencia will have length advantage.
Just my guess, but I believe the chances Hall doesn't red-shirt this year is about as close to zero as it can be without being absolute.
 
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