Aller running... why?

[KnightWhoSaysNit]

Our RPO usually has 3 to 4 run pass options on each play. Hand to back, QB run, QB throw quickly or QB start to run and dump to safety valve. For Allar the QB running option will usually be #3 or #4 but still an option to pick up needed first downs or open yards. Allar needs to learn reads and make quick decisions. He seems to be really learning quickly. Running now and then is part of the deal. it also keeps teams from just bringing it to a stationary QB. Much more likely to be hurt standing in pocket and getting hit while throwing than running the ball and learning to get down without taking big shots. I don't want him to run over people although he probably could.

There seems to be a lot of pure passing plays that start with that hand-off fake. They are not quick passes. I would rather see the QB totally focused on the rush and pass defense down field. Making a move with the RB is an unnecessary distraction. It has to be hard enough to get the rush and pass defense right.

Second issue is the pass blocking. If you start with that fake the RB can't be free as easily to provide blocking support.

From a pistol or I-formation it would seem to me to be easier for the RB to pick up a blitz. He's in a position to see the line from end to end.

We'll find out soon enough when we play a team with more size and speed. I think it's going to take a wider playbook, if recent PSU history is any indication. I hope Yurcich gets it done. He has the skill players. Not sure yet if he has the OL.

 

[bdgan]

We're we just getting him reps or were we trying to make future teams assign someone to keep him from scrambling? I realize that he's not fragile but the risk of injury is real and he was running in meaningless time, mostly because the OL couldn't open holes in garbage time.

The good news is Veilleux appears to be ready.

 

[OaktonDave]

Again, so you're saying coaching decisions can't be questioned?
Pick a lane...

To clarify - posters questioning the coaching should never be questioned?

 

[marshall23]

To clarify - posters questioning the coaching should never be questioned?

Touche

 

[OaktonDave]

Our RPO usually has 3 to 4 run pass options on each play. Hand to back, QB run, QB throw quickly or QB start to run and dump to safety valve. For Allar the QB running option will usually be #3 or #4 but still an option to pick up needed first downs or open yards. Allar needs to learn reads and make quick decisions. He seems to be really learning quickly. Running now and then is part of the deal. it also keeps teams from just bringing it to a stationary QB. Much more likely to be hurt standing in pocket and getting hit while throwing than running the ball and learning to get down without taking big shots. I don't want him to run over people although he probably could.

This. In discussions of QBs getting injured by running, the vulnerability of a QB in the pocket often gets lost. Texas doesn't run Ewers, but lost him for a few weeks because of a hit he took while standing in the pocket. I think the situation was similar with Pitt losing Slovis. No, I don't want to see any PSU QB taking on a tackler to gain an extra yard unless the game is on the line, but if we don't want to risk the QB getting hit, we'd better be prepared to accept a lot of three step drops and quick hand-offs from the offense.

 

[OaktonDave]

Touche

We'll agree to disagree on fans criticizing coaches. IMHO, it's fine; it's what fans do and part of the reason to have message boards. There are caveats. First, fans, starting with me, shouldn't take themselves seriously when doing it. If it was as obvious as we think it is, successful FBS coaches would be a dime a dozen. Second, don't fuss when another fan has a different view and agrees with the coach. As a mentor of mine used to say, "Those with alligator mouths surrender the right to have hummingbird a**es."

 

[AWS1022]

We'll agree to disagree on fans criticizing coaches. IMHO, it's fine; it's what fans do and part of the reason to have message boards. There are caveats. First, fans, starting with me, shouldn't take themselves seriously when doing it. If it was as obvious as we think it is, successful FBS coaches would be a dime a dozen. Second, don't fuss when another fan has a different view and agrees with the coach. As a mentor of mine used to say, "Those with alligator mouths surrender the right to have hummingbird a**es."

And fans shouldn’t act like they know more than the coaches. If Joe the drywaller sitting at home sees something, I’m quite certain the coaches see it as well.

 

[PSUSIR]

Man. I would love to see a package of some old fashioned I formation, play action offense with Allar and Singleton. Improve the O Line and it could rival the 94 offense.

We've been trying to improve our O Line through the tenure of 2 coaches now and we still can't run a top back up the middle or off tackle with any consistency. Michigan, Wisconsin, Ohio State and of course Iowa replaces their O line every 2 years with no drop off. Why is that?

 

[OaktonDave]

And fans shouldn’t act like they know more than the coaches. If Joe the drywaller sitting at home sees something, I’m quite certain the coaches see it as well.

I think that goes with not taking yourself too seriously. As badly as Frost did at Nebraska, I have no doubt that he would make any fan look silly in a debate about football X's and O's.

 

[rll1957]

We're we just getting him reps or were we trying to make future teams assign someone to keep him from scrambling? I realize that he's not fragile but the risk of injury is real and he was running in meaningless time, mostly because the OL couldn't open holes in garbage time.

Because for this offense to really excel the qb has to run a little. Not all the time but a little. All the criticism about the running game needs to look around. It’s really hard to run these days. In the nfl it’s basically gone. The defenses are so big and fast. Not saying I love it but the athletic ability now makes running really hard

 

[marshall23]

Man. I would love to see a package of some old fashioned I formation, play action offense with Allar and Singleton. Improve the O Line and it could rival the 94 offense.

Let's pump the breaks on the 94 offense. I would love to see the I again. Nothing says football to me like a FB stepping on the toes of a LB on an ISO.....but alas its gone forever.

 

[AWS1022]

Let's pump the breaks on the 94 offense. I would love to see the I again. Nothing says football to me like a FB stepping on the toes of a LB on an ISO.....but alas its gone forever.

Not to mention in 47 years, Joe had an offense like that once.

 

[PSUSIR]

Maybe we should wrap him in bubble wrap during the games.

I'm still trying to figure out why JF runs out on the field and signals 1 after every opening touchdown before the extra point is attempted. On the other hand after watching Pinegar attempt field goals and PATs I know why. He will cost us game(s) this season. Both of them I think.

 

[LandoComando]

To clarify - posters questioning the coaching should never be questioned?

Nope--they always can be but that's not the issue here as you well know

 

[PAgeologist]

Allar running doesn't really bother me. To be a starter and win games against good teams he'll need to get comfortable picking his spots and running when it makes sense. No, PSU idn't need him to run yesterday to win. But his play yesterday was more about development and learning when and when not to run is part of his development as well as part of him getting comfortable with all aspects of being a top starting QB.

Exactly. Big difference in QB running cause you need to vs picking your spots for nice gains. These guys aren't option QBs.

If Singleton and Allen keep rolling, there's no need to have Clifford or Allar be a main ball carrier.

 

[PSU_Nut]

Man. I would love to see a package of some old fashioned I formation, play action offense with Allar and Singleton. Improve the O Line and it could rival the 94 offense.

Lol there is a reason why people don’t run outdated offenses. That because against modern defenses it doesn’t work. I am sure every DC Penn State plays would love it. It would make their job so easy.

 

[CJFisJoePaII]

We're we just getting him reps or were we trying to make future teams assign someone to keep him from scrambling? I realize that he's not fragile but the risk of injury is real and he was running in meaningless time, mostly because the OL couldn't open holes in garbage time.

Given Allar's size, I'm not too worried.

 

[Petch]

Lol there is a reason why people don’t run outdated offenses. That because against modern defenses it doesn’t work. I am sure every DC Penn State plays would love it. It would make their job so easy.

Perhaps someone should tell Saban.

 

[marshall23]

Why? Because it's not good to walk during a football game.

 

[SR108]

We're we just getting him reps or were we trying to make future teams assign someone to keep him from scrambling? I realize that he's not fragile but the risk of injury is real and he was running in meaningless time, mostly because the OL couldn't open holes in garbage time.

Why? It opens up the running game in general. Part of the problem with the running game last year was Clifford was hurt. People knew he would not pull the ball.

You either change the offense or run the QB in crucial situations.

 

[PSU_Nut]

Perhaps someone should tell Saban.

Alabama is not running the I formation. In 2014 the switched from a Pro style of offense to more spread based offense which they continue to run today. They don't even have a full back on the roster.

 

[Petch]

Alabama is not running the I formation. In 2014 the switched from a Pro style of offense to more spread based offense which they continue to run today. They don't even have a full back on the roster.

So do you think 2014 Alabama would fail miserably today? Are you saying that no successful college or Pro team runs a package of I formation offense?

I‘ll have to look that up. Can’t now though…packing for the Auburn game. Woohoo!!!

 

[lazydave841]

So do you think 2014 Alabama would fail miserably today?

I don't think they would. Might have trouble scoring as many points as they have in the Tua/Jones/Young era though. Otherwise, wouldn't St. Nick have went back to the standard style offense?

Are you saying that no successful college or Pro team runs a package of I formation offense?

The more a team can do successfully the greater stress you put on an opponent. It's not as easy as lining up in the I and telling everybody to run 27 Counter Left. You have to build comfort in those alignments. You have to have a FB who can get up field and block somebody without slowing his TB down.

I liken it to our offense and the current Full House T formation Clifford has scored on twice this year. We used this last year as well, once with Ford lead blocking for Lee or Cain and for another goal line play or two.

It has its purpose but it's probably more along the lines of situational success vs game winning success with its use.

 

[LongJakk]

We need the QBs to run at least a few times a game. I prefer that it be to the outside rather than a draw tho. Inside there is too much danger of a shoulder injury since they are wearing tiny shoulder pads

 

[Jerry]

I think there's a difference between the QB having the quality of "escapability" and taking advantage of that in the offense's game plan, which is practically a must in today's game, and on the other hand building the feature of running plays by the QB into the offense.

At the level of B1G football, the latter is going to eventually get your QB dinged up or worse. Therefore, I think MY should go easy on designing running plays for a kid like Allar. You didn't bring him on board to run the rock. You've got blue-chippers all over the lot to do that.

 

[PSU_Nut]

So do you think 2014 Alabama would fail miserably today? Are you saying that no successful college or Pro team runs a package of I formation offense?

I‘ll have to look that up. Can’t now though…packing for the Auburn game. Woohoo!!!

They ran pro style...I formation with a full back is not pro style. They went away from the pro style offense because they were struggling offensively.

 

[ivan brunetti]

Allar runs VERY upright. He is at risk of getting WRECKED.

I wouldn't ask him to run anything other than a rare qb sneak.

 

[KnightWhoSaysNit]

Allar runs VERY upright. He is at risk of getting WRECKED.

I wouldn't ask him to run anything other than a rare qb sneak.

I'd like to see him rolled out more often with the option to run or pass. That would make the rush more honest. With some space he can protect himself better rather than be that upright target in the pocket, where a lot of injuries occur.

I suspect that we don't have much in the playbook because we haven't had a QB that can do it well. Otherwise such plays could be huge to offset the number of big loss plays in a game as well as significantly lower the odds of injury.

Key is that the QB must be willing to protect himself, throw it away, etc.

Regarding the sneak, we need to be careful not to do this too much. Get some new plays each week from that T-formation. Defensive lines going forward are not going to be an easy push, and we need to keep them honest.

 

[DandyDonII]

I wonder if these are the same people that bitched last week when he didn’t run for the first down against Purdue. They can’t have it both ways.

There is a difference between scrambling for a first down, and designing a running game with your QB being a key feature in the running game. It's cool if Allar scrambles for a first down, it is stupid to have him making designed runs. It is also stupid to have him riding a mesh point as a potential keeper as well, no defense is going to respect him running the ball.

 

[marshall23]

My biggest concern for Allar is how his popularity will plummet here once he plays regularly.....even if he's an All American ... and will he respond to our coaching?