this week I will be attending a conference of university research professionals from R1 schools. PSU has several presenters in multiple areas. OSU is one of the other presenters from the BIG. it makes one proud to be an alum of PSU. one thing that stands out re OSU research is they are the big dog in their state in terms of research $$$$. Case is #2 but half the number of OSU. by contrast PSU shares the spotlight among PA schools, as several have significant research $$$. compared to OSU though, i think our research is more broad based particularly from the federal agencies (NSF, NIH, DOE, etc). OSU probably does a better job with their PR in bragging about their research.
Attending a Univ Research Conf - PSU one of the presenters
- Thread starter blion72
- Start date
And, as usual, you would be wrong. PSU is no more broad based in research than OSU, though the two schools are concentrated in different areas. In terms of Federal funding, 51% of PSU's come from the DOD. 59% of OSU's is from HHS. In total, PSU receives 63% from the Federal government, OSU 53%.
Oh, and BTW, PSU is number 2 in PA in funded research, behind Pitt by $85mm.
There are two universities that are ranked most frequently in the top ten (dollars) across the different research disciplines. That would be Hopkins and Penn State. So despite the sanctimonious rantings from Art (the insecure guy who brags about his income on a free football message board), Penn State does excel in a wide range of research. They have the top Material Science expertise in the world. The Millennial Science Complex is staggering! Ask Lockheed Martin which university is tops in their annual hiring. There is so much to be proud of in terms of faculty and facilities.
Whatever you say, THT. As for bragging about my income, I've used the comment about not being able to afford the pay cut in about a half dozen different contexts, so I don't know what that says. But at least I'm secure enough in my person not to post under multiple handles.
One handle thank you. Your constant negative drumbeat is telling. You have no clue about the research conducted with the amazing facilities and top notch faculty at Penn State. And BTW, industry views the current administration very positively. That doesn’t happen via Norm’a rain man pivot table analysis. It takes great leadership. Radical improvement in the start up eco-system on main campus and around the state. This all drives desperately needed state wide economic growth. Again, all driven by the current administration. So stick your personal attacks ( please send in your picture. I’m sure you are a model of fitness) up your gazoo.
You really think the administration has something to do with a PSU getting federal research dollars? It doesn't. It's the Faculty that drives this. You even said it yourself. Even an admin as incapable as ours is/was of handling a fake crisis, knows enough not to get in the way. Yeah, I know facilities are important and everything but, again, that's a no-brainer. The question then becomes the cost of building and maintaining those facilities, a topic already discussed ad nauseum on this Board.
Maybe Pitt should take that extra $85 million and build a museum.
By the way, I appreciate your use of "mm" for million instead of M like some. Don't want to start a debate (apparently both are acceptable), I just prefer mm (or MM) because that's how it's done daily at my job.
PSU receives less then 5% of its R&D funding (OSU: 17%) from business. State and local governments, and non-profits contribute more.
Avoid "m" because it can be interpreted as either thousand (mille) or million. "K" and "mm" prevents that.
Same thing here when "m" is used, look for the context. Sometimes it requires more though that it should.
We use "k" and "mm" internally. Documents intended for external use spell out thousands, millions, billions (though it's hard to mistake "bn" for anything else).
Don’t you think the administration is responsible for hiring the academics who have the ability to compete effectively for the research grants? As stated it’s very competitive and without top notch principle investigators, those funds would go elsewhere.
Depends on what one defines as "administration" and the level of the PI. For someone like Jim Allison, it's top down. So who have Barron, Jones, Hillemeier, and Sharkey brought in (i.e. for the recruitment of which new researchers were they on point)?
I don't think this person is THT. THT was an unapologetic SJW, but not a defender of the bureaucracy.
There has been a ton of negativity regarding our dear leaders and their recent propensity for spending like drunken sailors on shore leave with absolutely no oversight. This one suddenly appears, defending all things administrative, telling us all how great they are and how wonderfully they're viewed amongst titans of industry.
Something doesn't smell right with our new friend, but it doesn't smell like THT either imo.
An emphatic NO! You know who recruits and hires new faculty? The current faculty. That’s who. The admin has little involvement in this part of academia. What the admin does do is get in the way by making the recruiting and hiring process so much more cumbersome than it needs to be. Of course, PSU might be different, but that’s been my experience in higher education for the past 2 decades.
It’s not one vs. the other, it’s both.I wonder how many top notch researchers (who, if it is done anywhere close to "right", should be able to more than recoup their "cost" - several times over) PSU could have recruited for $85,000,000?
And one wonders why tuition rises as fast as it does. BTW, you never provided a source for your contention that tuition for PA residents attending PSU is the same on an inflation adjusted basis as it was 50 years ago. And while your at it you could also provide the list that I asked for of top researchers that Barron & Co are directly responsible for bringing to PSU.
Source for those stats? Last I saw, DoD was <30% of total research funding and <45% of Federal funding to PSU.
Also, OSU research has been in decline for the past 4-5 years while PSU continues to grow - but god forbid we acknowledge a positive about Penn State on a Penn State message board.
NSF. Numbers are for 2017, most recent published. For that five year period, OSU's research went from $793mm to $864mm. PSU's from $837mm to $859mm.
Take a tour of the Millennial Science Complex sometime. $265 million just for the building. Underground vibration proof labs that facilitate internationally recognized research. It would make any rational alum proud. Offering graduate students projects that advance their exposure to industry and the scientific world in general. This basic research offers baseline commercial opportunities for industry, potentially makes out country safer from our adversaries. Endless positives. Basically the definition of a leading research university’s mission. And yet, we here from a nothing like Norm about the evils of investment. Bear in mind he has never been in a position of leadership. With his personality, leading his neighborhood watch group would be out of his reach.
All organizations can improve. Penn State is doing amazing things everyday!
All organizations can improve. Penn State is doing amazing things everyday!
So proud?
Yet so anonymous?
I wonder why?
LOL.
The fact that your “pride” is highlighted by your excitation at how much was spent, is kinda’ telling
Maybe it's anonymous because he got the name wrong: it's the Millennium Science Complex. Also, kind of ironic that a building housing cutting-edge material science research was plagued by bricks on its facade cracking, endangering pedestrians below.
Not sure how big a deal the cracking bricks are/were. But if someone wants to lead with his or her chin, far be it from me not to take a poke at it.
The admin hire the provosts who hire the deans who hire the faculty. It all starts at the top. Often the admin is more directly involved for example as just happened with the new Dean of Liberal Arts where there was a position filled by a trailing spouse as part of the package.
I'll let ouirpsu deal with this one. He can handle it much better than I can. Just a reminder that I'm waiting for your answers on a) names of top-flight researchers that Barron & Co have brought to PSU; and b) substantiation of your claim that PA-resident students at PSU are paying the same tuition that those did 50 years ago.
Wow. Hitting a nerve with the cabal of PSU negativity! Time for some more positives.
PSU’s industry extremely friendly intellectual property policy. Super smart and very well received. Try working out a license agreement with MIT.
The establishment of centers of excellence. For example, faculty report to a college and can also work for a center of excellence. This cross functional approach is very appealing to industry. When you have a project, typically it touches multiple disciplines. Penn State’a unique approach matches the process. Smart!!
Hiding under a skirt? Former C Level in the Consumer Health industry here. Dealt with lower level types like Norm (without the obvious narcissistic complex) my entire career. No great organization or business saves itself to greatness.
It takes vision and sound decision making. No fist pounding myopic bean counter like Norm ever benefited an organization.
But, to the point. So many positives and proud of Penn State.
PSU’s industry extremely friendly intellectual property policy. Super smart and very well received. Try working out a license agreement with MIT.
The establishment of centers of excellence. For example, faculty report to a college and can also work for a center of excellence. This cross functional approach is very appealing to industry. When you have a project, typically it touches multiple disciplines. Penn State’a unique approach matches the process. Smart!!
Hiding under a skirt? Former C Level in the Consumer Health industry here. Dealt with lower level types like Norm (without the obvious narcissistic complex) my entire career. No great organization or business saves itself to greatness.
It takes vision and sound decision making. No fist pounding myopic bean counter like Norm ever benefited an organization.
But, to the point. So many positives and proud of Penn State.
[FIFY]
So... the answer?
I should take that to mean "Yes, you ARE going to stay behind Momma's skirt"?
The issue - as you either ignore while shoving your nose up Momma's rear end, or can't see while shoving your head up your sphincter - is the leadership of the University. And the direction they are driving the University towards through their waste, dereliction, and corruption.
Howzabout you plug in your thinker and explain why the leadership has taken their entire governance process underground... since it is such an effective and world-class operation?
[I'd ask you to enlighten us all on the efficacy of adding mountains of waste and graft to every aspect of the process.... but I am quite certain you are "all in" on that endeavor
You know, all those things you like to overlook.
Have someone let me know when you decide to stand up like a man - - - - - or even a little boy - - - - instead of a toddler wrapped up in Momma's pantaloons.
Oh my. I getting full “Crazy Norm” treatment. Just read your post Barry. Then think about why you will never have the opportunity to lead an organization. Why would anyone want to spend time with you discussing anything? Why would anyone vote for you? Is there a reason you run your own inconsequential firm? Your lack of respect for people is off the charts. Again, fist pounders like you destroy organizations. I’m off to work. We look for companies with great management teams!
Barry,
I've said this before, but I believe it's worth repeating: just because some of us are critical of Penn State doesn't mean we think that it's not good, great, wonderful, awesome or whatever other superlative one wishes to apply. It's just that we recognize it's not perfect and want it to be better.
With regard to this thread, I wasn't dumping on PSU's research. I was dumping on the OP, who was simply wrong, is generally wrong, and takes a passive/aggressive stance to frequently knock Franklin and the football program. If someone wants to prove me wrong in this case, knock yourself out.
WHY is penn state so expensive?
I have heard it said that the profs are paid in line with other state universities, so if true that is not the reason.
Does it have more admin ex- prof personnel per student and are they paid more than average?
Is it’s physical plant more expensive per student than others?
Is it something else?
Mgmt should not be allowed to stay in their jobs with such woeful performance. They are making the school less and less competitive.
Anecdote: I went to the gym yesterday ( I live in SE Pa.), saw a Pitt and Ohio State tee shirt on teo parents/ grandparents, and no PSU. This would never have beenthe case 20 years ago. Pitt did not exist here in those days.
I have heard it said that the profs are paid in line with other state universities, so if true that is not the reason.
Does it have more admin ex- prof personnel per student and are they paid more than average?
Is it’s physical plant more expensive per student than others?
Is it something else?
Mgmt should not be allowed to stay in their jobs with such woeful performance. They are making the school less and less competitive.
Anecdote: I went to the gym yesterday ( I live in SE Pa.), saw a Pitt and Ohio State tee shirt on teo parents/ grandparents, and no PSU. This would never have beenthe case 20 years ago. Pitt did not exist here in those days.
I strongly suspect that whatever the “books” say, the costs of Penn State’s continued maintenance and operation of nearly 20 branch campuses, and all of their requisite chancellors, administrations, physical plants, etc. are a major, major, major money loser.
Edit: that’s on top of the operation of two separate law schools and the other “special mission” campuses - I suspect that the med school makes money given the biomed research dollars that it brings in, but I don’t know enough about Penn Tech in Williamsport or the grad school in the Philly area to say. I can say with a relatively high degree of confidence that the two law schools are likely not profitable.
