Baltimore Police Chief: 'We Are Part Of The Problem'

[demlion]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/...ml?ir=Black+Voices&ncid=fcbklnkushpmg00000047
Notice how he does not call the rioters "animals?"

Notice how he does not attempt to try the case of the cops in the media?

This is what leadership looks like. When you get this guy on the same page as the massive numbers of people who came out and cleaned up after the riots, you really have a chance to make some progress.

I know that will be heartbreaking to some, but I suspect if you actually live in Baltimore you take this as good news.

 

[psuro]

in 5...4...3...2...1......

 

[demlion]

I'm a big guy 'ro. I can take it.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/...ml?ir=Black+Voices&ncid=fcbklnkushpmg00000047
Notice how he does not call the rioters "animals?"

Notice how he does not attempt to try the case of the cops in the media?

This is what leadership looks like. When you get this guy on the same page as the massive numbers of people who came out and cleaned up after the riots, you really have a chance to make some progress.

I know that will be heartbreaking to some, but I suspect if you actually live in Baltimore you take this a good news.

Didn't you also ask if the cops were animals too in that same thread? I believe you followed up with an either or when it came to the rioters or the cops? I know I said both were, but you could have replaced animals with idiots or criminals and my point still stood. What part is heartbreaking or who are the some? Heartbreaking pretty much describes the hole damn thing...so I'm not sure where you get some.

Is he a new a Police Chief within the last 9 days? Did he come from the outside? Honest questions because if not he was privy to the culture ahead of time and is using the benefit of hindsight. We all know how well that works out. Great they are cleaning it up, but politicizing crap does nothing for me. When that occurs it just tends to be the same old song and dance. It's obviously a bigger issue than Baltimore, but inner city communities as a whole need to start holding themselves accountable for the real issues that plague them. It's apparent neither party will help them.

 

[BBrown]

Didn't you also ask if the cops were animals too in that same thread? I believe you followed up with an either or when it came to the rioters or the cops? I know I said both were, but you could have replaced animals with idiots or criminals and my point still stood. What part is heartbreaking or who are the some? Heartbreaking pretty much describes the hole damn thing...so I'm not sure where you get some.

Is he a new a Police Chief within the last 9 days? Did he come from the outside? Honest questions because if not he was privy to the culture ahead of time and is using the benefit of hindsight. We all know how well that works out. Great they are cleaning it up, but politicizing crap does nothing for me. When that occurs it just tends to be the same old song and dance. It's obviously a bigger issue than Baltimore, but inner city communities as a whole need to start holding themselves accountable for the real issues that plague them. It's apparent neither party will help them.

IIRC this should be about his 3rd year as Commish. He came from Oakland but there was some baggage with him.

"He got totally screwed in Oakland," said Geoff Collins, who served as president of the Oakland Police Foundation, which Batts revived to help raise money for the agency. "Oakland is one of the most dysfunctional political systems in the country, and … Tony got caught in the grinder. He's really excellent, and he'll be a great asset to your department."

Oakland City Council President Larry Reid said he agreed that Batts was handcuffed in Oakland with a lack of resources and little autonomy. Batts "understood [the challenges we face here]. He was accessible."

But after seeing first hand for the last 25+ years I doubt Baltimore's political system is much different.
I don't know about other cities but Baltimore has had a Horrible run with police commissioners since Ed Norris.

 

[Ten Thousan Marbles]

Didn't you also ask if the cops were animals too in that same thread? I believe you followed up with an either or when it came to the rioters or the cops? I know I said both were, but you could have replaced animals with idiots or criminals and my point still stood. What part is heartbreaking or who are the some? Heartbreaking pretty much describes the hole damn thing...so I'm not sure where you get some.

Is he a new a Police Chief within the last 9 days? Did he come from the outside? Honest questions because if not he was privy to the culture ahead of time and is using the benefit of hindsight. We all know how well that works out. Great they are cleaning it up, but politicizing crap does nothing for me. When that occurs it just tends to be the same old song and dance. It's obviously a bigger issue than Baltimore, but inner city communities as a whole need to start holding themselves accountable for the real issues that plague them. It's apparent neither party will help them.

Actually, despite the love letters to Baltimore that we have seen, Baltimore is a BIG factor in the issue.....all politics aside.

Let's just call it anthropology or something.

There is data regarding the life expectancey in the poorest neighborhoods in Baltimre. It is a horror story.

Baltimore was just recently named as the toughest city in the nation for people to rise out of poverty. The toughest. in. the. nation.

Some people find it easy to ignore the lingering issue of lead paint and lead poisoning in the poorest neighborhoods. We should not let it be easy for those that choose to do so.

it is a nightmare, Inner Harbor improvements aside.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

IIRC this should be about his 3rd year as Commish. He came from Oakland but there was some baggage with him.

"He got totally screwed in Oakland," said Geoff Collins, who served as president of the Oakland Police Foundation, which Batts revived to help raise money for the agency. "Oakland is one of the most dysfunctional political systems in the country, and … Tony got caught in the grinder. He's really excellent, and he'll be a great asset to your department."

Oakland City Council President Larry Reid said he agreed that Batts was handcuffed in Oakland with a lack of resources and little autonomy. Batts "understood [the challenges we face here]. He was accessible."

But after seeing first hand for the last 25+ years I doubt Baltimore's political system is much different.
I don't know about other cities but Baltimore has had a Horrible run with police commissioners since Ed Norris.

At some point you have to wonder if all of these police chiefs that suffer in major cities are failing due to the lack of real leadership upstream from them. Something is broke and it's far greater than just one or two cities.

 

[demlion]

Didn't you also ask if the cops were animals too in that same thread? I believe you followed up with an either or when it came to the rioters or the cops? I know I said both were, but you could have replaced animals with idiots or criminals and my point still stood. What part is heartbreaking or who are the some? Heartbreaking pretty much describes the hole damn thing...so I'm not sure where you get some.

Is he a new a Police Chief within the last 9 days? Did he come from the outside? Honest questions because if not he was privy to the culture ahead of time and is using the benefit of hindsight. We all know how well that works out. Great they are cleaning it up, but politicizing crap does nothing for me. When that occurs it just tends to be the same old song and dance. It's obviously a bigger issue than Baltimore, but inner city communities as a whole need to start holding themselves accountable for the real issues that plague them. It's apparent neither party will help them.

Your inability to determine what I meant is on you, but here is 9808's post and my response:
psufan9808 said: ↑
Marbles,

You can dismiss it if you like because it does not fit your agenda, but the big picture is that a potential injustice which has yet to be examined fully DOES NOT AND NEVER WILL JUSTIFY BURNING AND LOOTING YOUR OWN CITY. Further, even if in a court of law the injustice is proven (too little information for us to know at this point), it doesn't justify the crimes that your team seems to want to rationalize. The animals (as defined by their actions) are not acting rationally.

For political purposes, the tragedy, the victim's family, and a race and a class of people are being exploited and our rule of law is being undermined. Congratulations! You are hurting this Country and the people for which you claim empathy superficially.
Click to expand...
Who are "animals" again? The people who trashed cars or the men and women with badges who killed a guy?

Now, any fair person would have to concede that I was pointing out that his use of the term "animal," was a degrading reference to other human beings as less than human. I was calling him out on the one-way use of that term. As if that were not enough, I made it directly clear in later posts. So go on with whatever self-justification follows next, but the Chief gets it. Unlike you and the others who I am sure, will be heartbroken that he seems in a conciliatory mood.

 

[BBrown]

At some point you have to wonder if all of these police chiefs that suffer in major cities are failing due to the lack of real leadership upstream from them. Something is broke and it's far greater than just one or two cities.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that is exactly what it is. I'm not a fan of Stephanie Rawlings Blake (current mayor) the last mayor
got canned for basically stealing gift cards for the poor. The Mayor before was O'Malley and he's probably personally responsible for a lot of the distrust with the police with his zero tolerance blitz krieg. The Mayor before him was Kurt Schmoke and while he was a nice guy he didn't have a clue. The city council is a wreck so yea I'm thinking its a leadership problem from the very top.

 

[psuro]

Looting is wrong. So is endangering the life of a person through orchestrated reckless driving

 

[LaJolla Lion]

Your inability to determine what I meant is on you, but here is 9808's post and my response:
psufan9808 said: ↑
Marbles,

You can dismiss it if you like because it does not fit your agenda, but the big picture is that a potential injustice which has yet to be examined fully DOES NOT AND NEVER WILL JUSTIFY BURNING AND LOOTING YOUR OWN CITY. Further, even if in a court of law the injustice is proven (too little information for us to know at this point), it doesn't justify the crimes that your team seems to want to rationalize. The animals (as defined by their actions) are not acting rationally.

For political purposes, the tragedy, the victim's family, and a race and a class of people are being exploited and our rule of law is being undermined. Congratulations! You are hurting this Country and the people for which you claim empathy superficially.
Click to expand...
Who are "animals" again? The people who trashed cars or the men and women with badges who killed a guy?

Now, any fair person would have to concede that I was pointing out that his use of the term "animal," was a degrading reference to other human beings as less than human. I was calling him out on the one-way use of that term. As if that were not enough, I made it directly clear in later posts. So go on with whatever self-justification follows next, but the Chief gets it. Unlike you and the others who I am sure, will be heartbroken that he seems in a conciliatory mood.

Why would that bother me. Better late than never I guess.

 

[Sullivan]

Looting is wrong. So is endangering the life of a person through orchestrated reckless driving

At this point, we know that people looted. Have we seen any video or eyewitness accounts showing wreckless driving?

 

[CDW3333]

At some point you have to wonder if all of these police chiefs that suffer in major cities are failing due to the lack of real leadership upstream from them. Something is broke and it's far greater than just one or two cities.

No, the problem is the cops are out of control. Prosecutors won't prosecute them because if they do, they won't get any more cooperation from the police department. Other cops are afraid to come forward because if they do, they'll not be getting any backup when they need it (that is if they don't get set up by their fellow cops). The DOJ has its hands cuffed because of a bunch of bad Supreme Court rulings over the last 30 years.

A lot of sociopaths become cops (I have cop clients and that's what they tell me) and they're out of control because they know they can act with impunity. That's what you get after 40-50 years of "don't stop the cops from doing their jobs."

 

[LaJolla Lion]

No, the problem is the cops are out of control. Prosecutors won't prosecute them because if they do, they won't get any more cooperation from the police department. Other cops are afraid to come forward because if they do, they'll not be getting any backup when they need it (that is if they don't get set up by their fellow cops). The DOJ has its hands cuffed because of a bunch of bad Supreme Court rulings over the last 30 years.

A lot of sociopaths become cops (I have cop clients and that's what they tell me) and they're out of control because they know they can act with impunity. That's what you get after 40-50 years of "don't stop the cops from doing their jobs."

I'm sure you believe that. Now if you used the words some cops or a handful of cops, maybe I would listen. Instead you used this big broad brush to paint all cops as the bad guy. Congrats Richard, you clearly keep on trying hard to be that guy.

 

[Pardlion]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/...ml?ir=Black+Voices&ncid=fcbklnkushpmg00000047
Notice how he does not call the rioters "animals?"

Notice how he does not attempt to try the case of the cops in the media?

This is what leadership looks like. When you get this guy on the same page as the massive numbers of people who came out and cleaned up after the riots, you really have a chance to make some progress.

I know that will be heartbreaking to some, but I suspect if you actually live in Baltimore you take this a good news.

I agree. This is a much better approach and more thoughtful approach to the issue than the prosecutor's half-cocked, half-assed charges against individual cops who very possibly simply performed as they were taught/learned, and were limited by the PD's procedures and equipment.

 

[NC2017]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/...ml?ir=Black+Voices&ncid=fcbklnkushpmg00000047
Notice how he does not call the rioters "animals?"

Notice how he does not attempt to try the case of the cops in the media?

This is what leadership looks like. When you get this guy on the same page as the massive numbers of people who came out and cleaned up after the riots, you really have a chance to make some progress.

I know that will be heartbreaking to some, but I suspect if you actually live in Baltimore you take this a good news.

 

[NC2017]

Mosby & the Mayorette are incompetent and the cops will walk.

 

[CDW3333]

I'm sure you believe that. Now if you used the words some cops or a handful of cops, maybe I would listen. Instead you used this big broad brush to paint all cops as the bad guy. Congrats Richard, you clearly keep on trying hard to be that guy.

Who is Richard?

Are you delusional?

 

[demlion]

Mosby & the Mayorette are incompetent and the cops will walk.

Could be. And no matter what, those people who cleaned up after the riots will likely still live there, and the Chief will still be the Chief. They need to get their heads together to prepare for that eventuality. They will ultimately have the worst city they are collectively willing to tolerate.

 

[Pardlion]

Could be. And no matter what, those people who cleaned up after the riots will likely still live there, and the Chief will still be the Chief. They need to get their heads together to prepare for that eventuality. They will ultimately have the worst city they are collectively willing to tolerate.

Well, there's going to have to be a second set of riots first.

 

[demlion]

Well, there's going to have to be a second set of riots first.

These people just may fool you. Of course that is hardly difficult.

 

[BBrown]

Well, there's going to have to be a second set of riots first.

If she (Mosby) over charged and can't back up her claims, that may be a distinct possibility.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

Who is Richard?

Are you delusional?

You are.

No.

 

[CDW3333]

You are.

No.

I'm delusional? I'll give you an example of how the real world works. I represented a patrol officer. He was standing by the side of a highway when a wheel flew off a trailer and hit him, causing pretty serious injuries for which I represented him. He made a good recovery and after paying me and paying worker's comp, he came away with about $225,000. He told me he was going to retire from the force. I pointed out that he was only 45 and with overtime he was making close to $100,000 a year and no way he'd find another job that would pay that. And he needed to be on the force at age 55 to get his pension (he already had more than 20 years in, plenty to qualify). If he lasted until 55, he was looking at upwards of 60 grand a year for the rest of his life. He said, literally, "I can't do it anymore, counselor. They're too many psychos on the force and they run things."

He cashed out his pension, got about $100 grand for what he'd paid in and opened a bait shop.

That's the real world.

Are all cops psychos? No, but a lot are and they run things.

 

[jj410]

No, the problem is the cops are out of control. Prosecutors won't prosecute them because if they do, they won't get any more cooperation from the police department. Other cops are afraid to come forward because if they do, they'll not be getting any backup when they need it (that is if they don't get set up by their fellow cops). The DOJ has its hands cuffed because of a bunch of bad Supreme Court rulings over the last 30 years.

A lot of sociopaths become cops (I have cop clients and that's what they tell me) and they're out of control because they know they can act with impunity. That's what you get after 40-50 years of "don't stop the cops from doing their jobs."

People want to cling to the idea that the cops are always right.
They want to ignore the obvious fact that a job in which you get to carry a gun and push people around if you want to will attract a lot of bullies, who are essentially in the same business as the criminals.

 

[Aoshiro]

At this point, we know that people looted. Have we seen any video or eyewitness accounts showing wreckless driving?

We know that an unarmed, shackled man died in police custody. Are you disputing that?

 

[Peetz Pool Boy]

This is what leadership looks like.

No, this is what political opportunism looks like. The Chief, having greater aspirations in Baltimore or elsewhere, sees that the Mayor is politically vulnerable and just launched, albeit unofficially, his campaign to become the next Mayor of Baltimore. I'm surprised you missed the hidden agenda basis for his comments.

 

[Ten Thousan Marbles]

We know that an unarmed, shackled man died in police custody. Are you disputing that?

I learned to reword that. He suffered mortal injuries while in police custody. He died later in a hospital. But, I find that too many people are minimizing the seriousness of what transpired. I really don't know what thrill they get from that. Can't identify.

 

[Ten Thousan Marbles]

No, this is what political opportunism looks like. The Chief, having greater aspirations in Baltimore or elsewhere, sees that the Mayor is politically vulnerable and just launched, albeit unofficially, his campaign to become the next Mayor of Baltimore. I'm surprised you missed the hidden agenda basis for his comments.

Yeah. You are both right, though. The jabs were going out in several directions. He does get points for style and confronting the issue. But, he was definitely positioning himself.

 

[demlion]

He owns a piece of it now. It may not seem so opportunistic if he has to deliver down the road. But issuing threats thru a bullhorn on the rubble of the WTC--I know Poolboy thinks that is PURE leadership.

 

[Peetz Pool Boy]

He owns a piece of it now. It may not seem so opportunistic if he has to deliver down the road. But issuing threats thru a bullhorn on the rubble of the WTC--I know Poolboy thinks that is PURE leadership.

I am unswayed by what 99% of our career politicians say, and I'm still screening the "1% ers", including CR66, for someone who can do more than fog a mirror with their breath.

You only think you know me

 

[KidTwist]

Nothing will change in Baltimore, Newark, Chicago etc. until the people in those communities decide to change their behavior. Stop doing/selling drugs! Stop dropping out of school! Stop having kids out of wedlock that you can't support and have no desire to raise properly, develop a strong work ethic, be on TIME for appointments and job interviews, stop dressing like thugs, learn to speak the English language properly. No one is keeping them in the ghetto but their own actions and poor personal decisions! They are the problems not the Police. The Police are forced to deal with violent thugs everyday and more importantly they have to keep them from coming into decent hardworking areas and victimizing good hard-working people in their peaceful law-abiding neighborhoods. It is a thankless job for the men in blue in these areas.

Do you expect the government or private industry to come into these neighborhoods in Baltimore and start handing out nice high paying jobs to these uneducated thugs? Should the government or CVS have offered a nice decent career heroin dealer and thief like Freddie Gray a nice high paying job maybe $75-80K because he dropped out of school, doesn't like hard work and prefers to sell heroin to kids on the street?? Come on!

You want to be successful in this country? The formula is simple and has worked successfully since the founding of our nation. Work HARD! Don't make excuses and take personal responsibility for your actions, get an EDUCATION, Strengthen your Family bonds, OBEY the LAW! WORK HARD!!! Nice and simple and has a proven track record of success!

 

[jj410]

Nothing will change in Baltimore, Newark, Chicago etc. until the people in those communities decide to change their behavior. Stop doing/selling drugs! Stop dropping out of school! Stop having kids out of wedlock that you can't support and have no desire to raise properly, develop a strong work ethic, be on TIME for appointments and job interviews, stop dressing like thugs, learn to speak the English language properly. No one is keeping them in the ghetto but their own actions and poor personal decisions! They are the problems not the Police. The Police are forced to deal with violent thugs everyday and more importantly they have to keep them from coming into decent hardworking areas and victimizing good hard-working people in their peaceful law-abiding neighborhoods. It is a thankless job for the men in blue in these areas.

Do you expect the government or private industry to come into these neighborhoods in Baltimore and start handing out nice high paying jobs to these uneducated thugs? Should the government or CVS have offered a nice decent career heroin dealer and thief like Freddie Gray a nice high paying job maybe $75-80K because he dropped out of school, doesn't like hard work and prefers to sell heroin to kids on the street?? Come on!

You want to be successful in this country? The formula is simple and has worked successfully since the founding of our nation. Work HARD! Don't make excuses and take personal responsibility for your actions, get an EDUCATION, Strengthen your Family bonds, OBEY the LAW! WORK HARD!!! Nice and simple and has a proven track record of success!

That sig pic kind of undermines your entire message.

 

[WDLion]

Who is Richard?

Are you delusional?

I think his last name is Head.

 

[psuro]

At this point, we know that people looted. Have we seen any video or eyewitness accounts showing wreckless driving?

I am pretty sure it's all agreed that the nickel ride took place. By all parties involved.

 

[Ten Thousan Marbles]

Nothing will change in Baltimore, Newark, Chicago etc. until the people in those communities decide to change their behavior. Stop doing/selling drugs! Stop dropping out of school! Stop having kids out of wedlock that you can't support and have no desire to raise properly, develop a strong work ethic, be on TIME for appointments and job interviews, stop dressing like thugs, learn to speak the English language properly. No one is keeping them in the ghetto but their own actions and poor personal decisions! They are the problems not the Police. The Police are forced to deal with violent thugs everyday and more importantly they have to keep them from coming into decent hardworking areas and victimizing good hard-working people in their peaceful law-abiding neighborhoods. It is a thankless job for the men in blue in these areas.

Do you expect the government or private industry to come into these neighborhoods in Baltimore and start handing out nice high paying jobs to these uneducated thugs? Should the government or CVS have offered a nice decent career heroin dealer and thief like Freddie Gray a nice high paying job maybe $75-80K because he dropped out of school, doesn't like hard work and prefers to sell heroin to kids on the street?? Come on!

You want to be successful in this country? The formula is simple and has worked successfully since the founding of our nation. Work HARD! Don't make excuses and take personal responsibility for your actions, get an EDUCATION, Strengthen your Family bonds, OBEY the LAW! WORK HARD!!! Nice and simple and has a proven track record of success!

Blah. Blah. Blah.
The cops caused the eventual death of a man in their custody. Period.

 

[Sullivan]

vUOTE="Aoshiro, post: 138189, member: 9090"]We know that an unarmed, shackled man died in police custody. Are you disputing that?[/QUOTE]

Yes, someone died. Nobody is disputing that...

But, we don't know whole story yet. There is no point in making thing up. If you recall, lots of protesters in Ferguson though Trayvon had his hands up. Eyewitness accounts and video evidence proved otherwise...

 

[Sullivan]

I am pretty sure it's all agreed that the nickel ride took place. By all parties involved.

You could very well be wrong...

Again, where is the evidence? Clearly, a speeding and swerving police van would attract the attention of a camera somewhere....

 

[LaJolla Lion]

I'm delusional? I'll give you an example of how the real world works. I represented a patrol officer. He was standing by the side of a highway when a wheel flew off a trailer and hit him, causing pretty serious injuries for which I represented him. He made a good recovery and after paying me and paying worker's comp, he came away with about $225,000. He told me he was going to retire from the force. I pointed out that he was only 45 and with overtime he was making close to $100,000 a year and no way he'd find another job that would pay that. And he needed to be on the force at age 55 to get his pension (he already had more than 20 years in, plenty to qualify). If he lasted until 55, he was looking at upwards of 60 grand a year for the rest of his life. He said, literally, "I can't do it anymore, counselor. They're too many psychos on the force and they run things."

He cashed out his pension, got about $100 grand for what he'd paid in and opened a bait shop.

That's the real world.

Are all cops psychos? No, but a lot are and they run things.

Again with these sweeping statements. Your case represented what percentage of the national averages? Pulling out .00009% on a single case isn't doing much. BTW I answered no to being delusional and still think you are a richard. I'll bet it was the cops fault who got shot in NYC this weekend too. I wonder if he got what he deserved. Wholesale accusations when dealing with minorities is a big problem in this country, but if it is the police you are doing this to,,,,,it's ok then. SMH

 

[Sullivan]

Blah. Blah. Blah.
The cops caused the eventual death of a man in their custody. Period.

Again, you don't know that....