I think youre wrong on PSU not being a domlnant program. From 68-87 they were undefeated 5x, played in 4 national title games winning 2. Thats pretty darn dominant. Thats the era i started watching and following PSU.
Believe me, USC will still be happy to scarf up Franklin...
- Thread starter Jerry
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small world…I coached high school for Grantis Bell 2 years…he is an NFL referee now..
well I guess you were right if we weren't on our 3rd OC and offensive system in 3 years. Tough to have any type of "QB system" when you keep changing the system every year. Give Clifford credit to be able to pick up MY system in 6 months. Obviously for what ever the reason TRob has not put the effort into picking up the system. It not just TRob, the TV announcers made a comment that Brooks is doing better at Mike due to the fact he is putting in the effort. Sounds like it a problem at multiple positions.
But we got embarrassed by WVU. And Toledo was good, but still a MAC team. And those just came to mind….I’m sure I could find other games where Paterno lost to teams with less talent over the years….and the dark years were filled with bad losses.
The point is, if one guy is making a mistake, you can point to one guy not doing his job. If no one is doing there job, what is it, bad luck? you surely can see the stupidity in rattling off mistake after mistake and not putting any of the accountability on to the coach, right?
Depends on what you call dominate. There were plenty of years during that stretch where we had a pretty average record. Did we have a lot of good/great seasons, yes, but there were quite a few of so so seasons that would get a lot of SEC coaches fired these days.
In one game? How about the win over Wiscy? How about the win over Auburn? We were on our way to 6-0 when our QB got hurt….not too many mistakes. Certainly not rattling off mistake after mistake. Folks are acting like we’re 0-7….if that were the case, your argument would have merit. What if your team at work was killing it, then had a bad quarter because a couple of your top employees were out sick and the others didn’t know how to do their job as well….should you get fired as their boss?
No but it’s his job to coach them up and teach the fundamentals of the game to limit those kind of mistakes. Ultimately if the people under you dont perform as the boss and leader you are ultimately held accountable.
Taking the 7-6 seasons out of context with the sanctions is disingenuous.
How many programs have 3 11 win seasons since 2016? No one else in the conference besides osu. Michigan has none.
Ron zook never won more than 9 games, which he did once.
We were embarrassed today
A. So what
B. PSU had already been spanked by USC. Anyone who couldn’t understand that wouldn’t be a special season were clueless.
After the ‘97-‘99 disappointments, I was convinced the days of a MNC under Paterno were done. I would have preferred someone in his inner circle had convinced him to retire.
Here’s the thing t
still staring down the barrel of two consecutive losing seasons while milking the university for more and more $$$
You compared him to Ron Zook… whose best seasons as a coach were 9-4, 8-5, 8-5. At least compare him to the other mediocre coaches who’ve managed to win 11 games 3 times in 6 years.
I mean, you’re acting as if this was one bad game. this Is a pattern. depending on what you include in his comp, he’s getting paid top ten money. Do you believe that we’re on the way to a top ten season? Were we last year? How about next year when we lose maybe the best receiver in school history and apparently the only qb on our roster?
So it’s the players who stink? Nah, not many great ones on this team, but few bad ones.
A head coach is hired to win by putting together a staff that can evaluate, recruit, and develop talent. Last year CJF failed and this year it is now headed in a bad direction.
Quit the dumb excuses. Al Davis had it right “Just win baby!” Nothing else much matters. The rest is noise and bullshit.
A head coach is hired to win by putting together a staff that can evaluate, recruit, and develop talent. Last year CJF failed and this year it is now headed in a bad direction.
Quit the dumb excuses. Al Davis had it right “Just win baby!” Nothing else much matters. The rest is noise and bullshit.
From 1950 -2000 Penn State had tbe best record against strength of schedule. So yes, that did exist.
It was one bad game. We won the first five and we’re on the way to winning the sixth. The wins may not be up to your expectations, but we won. And I’ve been hearing about all the guys we were losing every year and how we’ll suck because of it, even when we were winning 42 games in four years.
We don’t need better coaches. We need better players. We had several chances to win but the players didn’t make the plays that would have won the game. They got beat consistently at the LOC, and dropped passes, missed an interception, and didn’t tackle well.
How many NC’s? How many conference championships since joining the Big? How many NC’s since ‘86?
Using 5* Tua and 5* Caleb as examples, who were each one of the top rated recruits of their entire class, certainly does not make the intended point.
It's like the Yankees complaining about injuries during the Mariano / Jeter / etc. dynasty...yes it is accurate that they had injuries to star players, but their replacements were also star players, so it didn't hurt as much as it would hurt a team such as the Phillies losing a star player...
Also, when OSU won the championship with Cardale Jones, will you really compare the talent on the offensive line of that OSU team or the Clemson Trevor Lawrence team with the current PSU offensive line? After all, there are entire threads complaining about the OL on this site (which is justified for the run blocking, but probably unjustified for pass blocking imho).
So yes, the drop-off between PSU first team and second team is greater than the corresponding drop-off between the teams that you reference...that speaks more to depth in recruiting rather than speaking to "preparedness". In spite of that, PSU recruiting has been at a higher level than it has been for a long time...and still typically ranks below the teams you reference fwiw.
We need more good players. We have good players, just no depth. Unfortunately, I think that’s something that PSU will always battle as do most teams.
2 National Championship
1 shared National Championship (NYT poll in 1994)
More unbeaten, untied seasons without being awarded a mythical national championship than all other programs combined (think about that).
How many since Franklin arrived? Hey Franklin is a good coach. Some are just pointing out that we may have seen his ceiling.
Joe’s ceiling was the best there is and was.
Just to address the bolded statement, Cain gets the RB touches because he has demonstrated good ball security...Lee may have been running better, but his early-season fumbles directly affected his snaps.
I remember another former PSU head coach who valued ball security. I know that your point is that it was in OT, but are you going to pass every play?
It could have been worse with QB-related TURNOVERS, which, as limited as Clifford appeared, he had zero. 🤷♂️
To reiterate another post, Roberson could have made the decision easy for the coaches to play him over an injured Clifford by playing well enough for them to have significant confidence in him. The fact that the decision was difficult or controversial unfortunately reveals that no such level of confidence has been achieved.
‘94 was not a NC. And Joe was not the best once he joined the Big outside of one year. Joe won three conference championships in 18 years….Franklin has won one in 8 and Joe didn’t have to deal with sanctions. Joe had four losing seasons in 18 years and Franklin has had one in 8 years. They seem to be on a pretty even track.
Franklins isn’t going anywhere. I’m fairly confident that we won’t make the CFP with him. Best hope is occasional 10 win seasons. I just hope he stops running his mouth about playing championship football, being elite, etc and entertaining every offer that comes. We’re a slighly better Michigan state, now I realize it.
Michigan state has made the playoff. We can make it but it’d be a scenario where a significant amount of luck/things falling into place occur. He’s never going to get to a point where you can pencil him in.
None in almost 3 decades.
Dream on, Matt Rhule is not coming back to the college ranks any time soon and if he did it would most likely not be for PSU. Ultimately PSU will likely need to roll the dice between an NFL assistant who wants a shot at a head coaching gig or a younger relatively unknown non-P5 head coach who is looking for the next step up.
This.
HCJF's discussion of QB reps this week seems convoluted given the examples you cite here......and I feel like there are quite a few other examples you could have cited.
However, our folks here seem to be convinced WE cannot do it because QBs will transfer.
Horrors !!!!!
I mean qbs did transfer in the first two scenarios and the third we will see.
Lawrence was a .9999 recruit. Tua was .9843 and Caleb was .9969.
Unfortunately that isn’t what we’ve been bringing in.
So Franklin > or = to Joe? Keep digging.
comparing the end of Joe’s career with the beginning of Franklin’s?
Pretty even track? I guess you will argue anything? That is laughable!
I provided the proper qualification (NYT). That team earned it in the field. They certainly did not lose it in the field.
I know what they were trying to do. And they were using a QB that couldn’t run. A game plan with little chance of success. Did this after knowing Bielema challenged the toughness of his team. Yes I agree they treated the game as a practice which is a recipe for disaster. You can have the last word.
I think you can divide Joe's reign into pre-Big Suck and post-Big Suck. Pre-Big Suck, Penn State had some down seasons but was one of the elite programs in the college game. Post-Big Suck, the dynamic changed...and after awhile, so did Joe. There was the one dominant team in 1994 and then Michael Robinson's big year in 2005, which was reminiscent of the Old Days. But let's face it, Penn State hasn't been "elite" since the mid-90's.
Getting back to Franklin, I've been following the debate here in this thread and others with great interest, and I guess I come down in the wimpy middle. I've always been a big fan of his, think he's done some very good things at Penn State -- look at the record -- and believe he remains, even after yesterday, one of the hottest coaching commodities in the game. Also, no way in hell he's on the "hot seat" now. In fact, it's not even warm.
That said, honestly, I think he's a bit burned out. We saw indications of that last year. The intensity and pressure of the position at places like Penn State add up. Not to mention the sheer frustration of being league Red-Headed Stepchild, with the regular hose-jobs by the refs...plus the two backbreakers to Ohio State, which haunt the program to this day...it all takes a toll. Even with the great recruiting, never better than next year's class (for the moment), I think there's a very good chance that he'll be offered...and take...the USC job.
Nope, not saying Franklin is better than Joe….I’m saying selective memory from some on this board is hilarious. Posters act like Franklin took an Alabama level program and made them a Michigan State type program. Guess what, Joe did that. We’re currently at the level we’ve been for about 30 years, I’m not sure why people expect so much more. The 80’s was a long time ago.
You could be right about all of that. No one knows but Franklin. I think Paterno was able to last so long because he understood there would be up years and down years and there were times when we need to lower our expectations. Joe changed as he got older and more locked into his position and winning became less of an obsession, so he didn’t get as burned out. I think Franklin is obsessed with winning and losses kill him a lot more than they kill us. He wants to build an elite program and I think he’s realizing he’s not going to be able to do it at PSU (and nobody will be able to). So he may go somewhere else.
