Dave Jones credits 4 people for the survival of PSU FB. Any guesses?

[Obliviax]

After reading this, it smells like a "pay to play" article. It works like this...someone from PSU PR, representing the BOT, approaches a newsie and says "hey, you want access to coach CJR for an exclusive? Write an article with these talking points. Thanks and we'll be in touch." Happens in politics all the time. That's why these guys are pretty much classified as "left" or "right", that's where they get their news; from doing favors.

 

[BUFFALO LION]

Any guesses?

OK. I guess I am going to have to waste 5 minutes of my day looking for a link because of this stupid click bull sh!+.

 

[Victor E. Bell]

What is the "Central PA Bubble," anyway? Does Jones read the comments in his own rag? A lotta, lotta people in Central PA friggin DESPISE Penn State, including all the sports desks at the newspapers. Is this some bubble where there are no taxes and groceries and gas are free, or what? How fast do you have to drive to pop this bubble, and where are its geographic boundaries?

 

[Victor E. Bell]

After reading this, it smells like a "pay to play" article. It works like this...someone from PSU PR, representing the BOT, approaches a newsie and says "hey, you want access to coach CJR for an exclusive? Write an article with these talking points. Thanks and we'll be in touch." Happens in politics all the time. That's why these guys are pretty much classified as "left" or "right", that's where they get their news; from doing favors.

+1 BAZILLION

 

[Obliviax]

What is the "Central PA Bubble," anyway? Does Jones read the comments in his own rag? A lotta, lotta people in Central PA friggin DESPISE Penn State, including all the sports desks at the newspapers. Is this some bubble where there are no taxes and groceries and gas are free, or what? How fast do you have to drive to pop this bubble, and where are its geographic boundaries?

Apparently, nobody in central PA has high speed internet or access to cable TV. Central PA = Pennslytucky.

 

[Aoshiro]

+1 and this is well stated. I believe the national firestorm was wrong, it was misguided, it was largely caused by a series of errors and accidents, from the careless handling of the grand jury presentment to Freeh's speculation and grandstanding.

But it was a media/public opinion firestorm like I have never seen in my lifetime. I worked in media for 22 years and I have never seen this level of national anger directed at an institution. Just about the whole country wanted to see Penn State burned to the ground. It was almost a perfect storm.

For whatever Erickson's and the board's mistakes -- you really can't imagine what it had to be like to be in their shoes. You have to give them some slack because the pressure was so extreme. In the atmosphere after Freeh's press conference, to stand up to the NCAA really might have backfired. Heck, even Congress was starting to get involved. Corbett, who has always hated Penn State, might have been able to get the legislature to just slam PSU and eliminate its independence -- whcih would have done tremendous harm to PSU the academic university.

In the end the proof is in the pudding. They accepted the sanctions knowing they could be reversed -- and they were right. And here we are today. PSU the football program survived, but more importantly PSU the university survived and thrives.

I was as angry as anybody about the sanctions but that's how I see it now. It's almost comical but even the football team did okay -- they only ended up losing a few games they wouldn't have lost under Paterno. In the end they didn't even get a single losing season.

You conveniently ignore the fact that certain trustees were deliberately and maliciously fueling that firestorm.

 

[PSUMATT85]

If it keeps you from getting lynched, maybe. And that was the way the public was at that time. I *do* live outside the Happy Valley bubble (sadly, I live inside the tOSU bubble--to which locals are equally oblivious). It was pretty nasty at times. I have some personal examples and stuff that happened to friends.

And let's face facts--some of this stuff *did* happen on PSU's property. There is a certain amount of responsibility there. We're still not sure of Old Main did anything wrong (personally, I think they missed things that are obvious *in hindsight*--but were not then) or if they were criminally responsible.

So rod sacrificed the universities reputation to save football,......even if accurate, isn't that the fundamental problem?

 

[Chickenman Testa]

Any guesses?

As a joke I was going to say old Michigan/Buckeye Jimbo Delany.

What do you know - I nailed it!

Delany did the equivalent of hand us a hand towel after we just survived a multi-year Tsunami. Eff that balding Midwestern meat-loaf eating choad!

 

[doctornick]

Totally agree. The jury is still out on C, S & S (figuratively and literally). But nobody, outside of HV, knew who those people were. Joe was, and still is to some extent, the PSU brand. You MUST protect the brand. I get them separating from C S & S, but they should have a) asked for cooler heads while they did an investigation (putting joe on leave) and b) defended him when evidence showed he followed the law, procedures and was a willing participant.

Exactly this. I remember constantly screaming at my TV set in Nov 2011 saying "why the hell are no officials from PSU screaming constantly and loudly how Paterno is not implicated in any wrongdoing, followed the appropriate university protocols in 2001 and is cooperating with the prosecution and a witness for them?". Paterno's "involvement" is what made this a major headline, so the University should have made every effort possible to correctly reiterate the facts regarding his (lack of) involvement in anything wrong. Doing things right in fall 2011 would have saved tons of heartache later.

 

[Player2BNamedL8r]

Serious question - is Davey J. really as clueless as his work suggests, or is he a shrewd hack being paid in wads of cash to write a given narrative? Sometimes I really don't know.

 

[doctornick]

Abso freakin lutely.
I like O'Brien but even he didn't give the alums and the fans enough credit.

And that is IMHO one of the things that you have to love about Franklin, regardless of your opinion of his in game management.

 

[Madsol]

I have three STRONG disagreements

• They threw Joe under the bus on day one. He was and is the PSU brand. That was ludicrous. There was NEVER any evidence that Joe participated...none. They should have put him on leave pending investigation
• They allowed, probably promoted, Freeh throwing Joe under the bus. This is unspeakably horrible. And, it occurred months later (when the storm was no longer blowing).
• We now know that the NCAA never floated the death penalty....that Rod capitulated, without the entire BOT, and that was made up to protect him.

Those three issues, to me, totally invalidates any sympathy or "good' the BOT performed.

Exactly, obli, especially with regard to your first bullet. The day that Frank Fina stated on national television that there was no evidence that Paterno was involved in a coverup, there should have been a Penn State PR rep on every news show in America repeating Fina's statement. There should have press releases, grand pronouncements from the University how the lead Sandusky prosecutor had said there was no evidence that Paterno was involved in any coverup. Instead...deafening silence.

 

[thecoolestfish]

Totally agree. The jury is still out on C, S & S (figuratively and literally). But nobody, outside of HV, knew who those people were. Joe was, and still is to some extent, the PSU brand. You MUST protect the brand. I get them separating from C S & S, but they should have a) asked for cooler heads while they did an investigation (putting joe on leave) and b) defended him when evidence showed he followed the law, procedures and was a willing participant.

I really is that simple. Period.

But personal vendettas against Joe, along with personal CYA, were in play. The vendettas and CYA didn't allow our weak-minded BoT to think straight, and we all payed the price.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Can someone just list the four names? Thanks.

 

[thecoolestfish]

• We now know that the NCAA never floated the death penalty....that Rod capitulated, without the entire BOT, and that was made up to protect him.

Btw, I'm glad you finally came around and now agree that their claim that the NCAA threatening the DP was complete horse$hit.

 

[kgilbert78]

So rod sacrificed the universities reputation to save football,......even if accurate, isn't that the fundamental problem?

I'm not saying Rod was completely right at all. He should have had the backbone to stand up to the NCAA in private on some of the issues--and he didn't. But it was a lynch mob mentality--and sometimes the safest thing to do is to get out of Dodge.

 

[Zenophile]

For whatever Erickson's and the board's mistakes -- you really can't imagine what it had to be like to be in their shoes. You have to give them some slack because the pressure was so extreme.

I would have been -- sincerely -- overjoyed to cut them some slack. But instead of asking for that moment, they just kept doubling down on their own bad decisions (a strategy they continue to employ to this day) until they managed to place the blame on all of us for "valuing football over human decency".

You know what my favorite part was? Immediately after accepting the scarlet letter on my behalf, they informed me that I should just "move on".

 

[getmyjive11]

Jones is dead on with Erickson, OBrien, and Mitchell. Replace Delany with Corman and the PSU fans who showed up at the games and it's they who saved PSU football.

No, Jones is dumber than shit.

The top four were...

1) BOB
2) Mauti/Zordich
3) McGloin
4) The fans

 

[mn78psu83]

Can someone just list the four names? Thanks.

Erickson, O'Brien, Mitchell, Delany.

 

[BUFFALO LION]

Any guesses?

OK. I had to give Jones 4 clicks before I found the article since there was no direct link.

I totally agree with him on O'Brien and Delany. Without those two, we would have been toast and would have been lucky to have been playing in the PSAC.

I can see his point about Mitchell, but agree with others that Mauti/Zordich (the players that stayed) and Corman trump Mitchell.

The Rod is just plain off the wall nuts.

What would have been fascinating to watch would have been if we actually DID get the Death Penalty, and Corman would have subsequently won his lawsuit. We could have literally owned the NCAA.

 

[71camaro]

"Many people I respect who know more about the legal process than I have told me the case was a slam-dunk in Penn State's favor had it immediately contended the NCAA's decision to move outside its stated enforcement protocol and lay down penalties from its executive level for what was a criminal act."

So even if you are innocent, it's better to plead guilty if people are very very angry with you. Good lesson to be learned there, kids.

Sad as it is, the highlighted part is a huge part of the criminal justice system. 90+% of prosecutions end in a plea bargain. I doubt 90+% of prosecuted cases are situations where a person is actually guilty. People plea down to avoid uncertainty, even if it isn't in their total interest.

Watch PBS Frontline's "The Plea," it's fascinating.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Erickson, O'Brien, Mitchell, Delany.

 

[mn78psu83]

Dave would like to get some feedback I'm sure. He's an attention getter.

 

[thecoolestfish]

I'm not saying Rod was completely right at all. He should have had the backbone to stand up to the NCAA in private on some of the issues--and he didn't. But it was a lynch mob mentality--and sometimes the safest thing to do is to get out of Dodge.

I still don't get this way of thinking. What was the risk if Penn State stood up and defended itself from the NCAA and the so-called "lynch mob mentality" rather than take what everyone was dishing?? Were students going to stop applying to Penn State??? WTF? No. Of course not. So, what was the threat of this so-called "lynch mob?"

 

[thecoolestfish]

OK. I had to give Jones 4 clicks before I found the article since there was no direct link.

I totally agree with him on O'Brien and Delany. Without those two, we would have been toast and would have been lucky to have been playing in the PSAC.

Hmmmm.... Can't tell if serious.

 

[JoeBatters1]

Here's a thought - nobody "saved" PSU football because it didn't need saving. Paterno had made the brand so strong it could withstand even the firestorm brought about by this "scandal." It was truly built to last. Thank you Joe!

 

[bjf1984]

OK. I had to give Jones 4 clicks before I found the article since there was no direct link.

I totally agree with him on O'Brien and Delany. Without those two, we would have been toast and would have been lucky to have been playing in the PSAC.

I can see his point about Mitchell, but agree with others that Mauti/Zordich (the players that stayed) and Corman trump Mitchell.

The Rod is just plain off the wall nuts.

What would have been fascinating to watch would have been if we actually DID get the Death Penalty, and Corman would have subsequently won his lawsuit. We could have literally owned the NCAA.

Dear Rodney, Jim, and George -

Thanks for all your help

 

[Aoshiro]

I'm not saying Rod was completely right at all. He should have had the backbone to stand up to the NCAA in private on some of the issues--and he didn't. But it was a lynch mob mentality--and sometimes the safest thing to do is to get out of Dodge.

It is completely dishonest to ignore the fact that there were trustees who were encouraging the lynch mob.

 

[psusmacko]

Jones is dead on with Erickson, OBrien, and Mitchell. Replace Delany with Corman and the PSU fans who showed up at the games and it's they who saved PSU football.

How can anything related to Limp Rod and saving PSU football be considered dead on? Seriously

 

[Zenophile]

Erickson, O'Brien, Mitchell, Delany.

 

[bmw199]

What would have been fascinating to watch would have been if we actually DID get the Death Penalty, and Corman would have subsequently won his lawsuit. We could have literally owned the NCAA.

This would never have happened. What Jones is saying lawyers have told him and I think what most of us are saying and have been is that if we(the University itself) would have fought the sanctions right from the moment they were handed down and not signed the consent decree we would have won a slam dunk case in any court.

If the NCAA would have handed down the death penalty we(again the University, not Corman or the Paternos or anyone else) could have petitioned the court for an injunction to let us play while it got sorted out in court so that there would be no undo harm if we won the court case. And who cares what the reaction of anyone would have been at that point because it was already so bad that it couldn't have gotten any worse.

"WORSE? How could things get any worse? Take a look around here, Ellen. We're at the threshold of hell."

 

[mn78psu83]

Thanks for the laugh. I can't even look at it without losing it.

 

[dawgduice]

He went to moron U, that is all you need know. He hated Joe. By extension he hates PSU. Everything he writes, with his crayons, demonstrates that.

 

[WeR0206]

Re: erickson I guess Davey forgot that he signed a CD that allowed players to transfer without sitting. This alone almost collapsed our program. So how exactly did Erickson save PSU football?? If you ask me Ericksons action of signing the CD (without full aporoval of the BOT mind you) did the opposite. What a hack..

 

[Victor E. Bell]

All the beat writers destroy the place at every opportunity. It's bizarre. But Jones definitely always had a boner for this place and he never passes up an opportunity to paint the fans as morons, the teams as putrid, and the coaches as incompetent. Those are his top 3 story lines right there. I met him at a BW game once and he acted the fool then, berating the fans for even being there, "nothing better to do," that whole spiel. Acted like he had to go cover a wake, like anyplace on earth would be a better job that day. I have absolutely zero time for him.

 

[Madsol]

Sad as it is, the highlighted part is a huge part of the criminal justice system. 90+% of prosecutions end in a plea bargain. I doubt 90+% of prosecuted cases are situations where a person is actually guilty. People plea down to avoid uncertainty, even if it isn't in their total interest.

Watch PBS Frontline's "The Plea," it's fascinating.

But we pled guilty to a charge of being more interested in winning football games than protecting children from being raped. When that's the charge, you have to fight it. You have no choice. Really, what worse thing could be said about someone or about an institution than that they care more about football than kids being sexually assaulted? So what if we fight back and people don't like it. Who cares? They already think we're the worst kind of monsters. Are they going to really, really, really not like us?

 

[Class of 67]

Any guesses?

Without looking at the answer, I'll guess O'Brien, Mauti, Franklin, and sadly, Joyner.

 

[kgilbert78]

It is completely dishonest to ignore the fact that there were trustees who were encouraging the lynch mob.

You are correct, and I am not trying to do that.

 

[psuro]

Here's a thought - nobody "saved" PSU football because it didn't need saving. Paterno had made the brand so strong it could withstand even the firestorm brought about by this "scandal." It was truly built to last. Thank you Joe!

I am gonna cast my vote with this one.

 

[Madsol]

Re: erickson I guess Davey forgot that he signed a CD that allowed players to transfer without sitting. This alone almost collapsed our program. So how exactly did Erickson save PSU football?? If you ask me Ericksons action of signing the CD (without full aporoval of the BOT mind you) did the opposite. What a hack..

WeR...I give you credit, you have been saying this for 3 years. Not sure I've seen anyone else say it. But you are exactly right. The free agency in the Consent Decree was a defacto death penalty. It was entirely reasonable to believe that so many kids would choose to transfer that we would not have been able to field a team. I guess I'm not quite cynical enough to believe that that was the actual motivation of the people making the decisions at PSU. But it wouldn't shock me to find out that it was. But the fact that we didn't have mass transfers and were able to play in 2012 certainly shouldn't get credited to Erickson.