NYC is awesome if you're uber wealthy. Otherwise it's awful. I'd much rather live in LA. Son1s surfed 2 weeks ago and just got back from snowboarding montana. That's AWESOME
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Driving through some old PA towns today...
- Thread starter NealPaige
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My bride and I have been perusing Lancaster City Real Estate for a few months. While the industry in general is way up- it is safe to say that the gentrification of Lancaster City is hotter than the proverbial fox in a forest fire. Flippers are doing amazing things with old properties- and I'd bet that the growth won't stop when interest rates go up. Essentially they are re-creating the vision of what the original poster wrote about- albeit with a very hipster/sanctuary city/liberal vibe in the middle of James Carville's Pennsyltucky.
My son's start up just moved back to LA- where he plans to stay until mid June. Then it is an open question if they move to NYC (our preference) or possibly become Los Angelinos. Two very different cities- each with pros and cons- LA definitely wins the weather and lack of urine smells in subway stations- primarily because they don't have subways!
That's exactly where we are looking : ) Chestnut Hill South of Harrisburg down to Grant West of Prince, and College Park. Did you close on your property in North East? Just put bottom paint on my scanoe last weekend to either use or sell- gonna trout fish the season on creeks here then maybe head down to launch from the community park.
LA has a subway system but the problem is not many people use it. Maybe that's because they don't know it exists.
I'll take 10 miles outside State College over State College anytime. SEPA or NJ never.
Grew up in a small town in SEPA- worked in Manhattan for 15 years living in Bergen County NJ, Upper West Side, and FAirfield County, CT. Great places to live and work if you make great coin and have an open expense account. We moved back to my hometown to raise our kids and haven't looked back. There is a time and place for everything. Unlike many of our 50 something peers who are empty nesting and looking for adventure (along with what could've been/ add in Covid and we are seeing a string of divorces) we are quite content.
They have the light rail- which my son used every day to commute from USC to Culver City- but it isn't the same as a subway. People are less likely to pee above ground in public view. I remember the predominant smell of fetid Summer urine as the worst in the city : )
bwifan
Well-Known Member
1 thing I will say and its not just exclusive to PA and it started before Covid but now is at a ridiculous level but the drain of people and businesses leaving the northeast and mid atlantic for the south is staggering. I can't believe the amount of people and businesses flooding here into Florida and other southern states. No idea what this will do to the tax base of these places with it shrinking but many of these northern states have a huge underfunded pension liability and to me it should be very concerning for many living in those states.
This. Pa, NY, NJ are just getting hammered with people leaving. New England was already sort of at steady state and built out pretty much due to small state sizes and is seeing less issues. Delaware taxes are low so you have some retirees moving there to be by the beach and pay low taxes (poor man's Florida). Maryland has the DC boom enough to stay relevant.
But Pa, NY, NJ have been so poorly run the last 25 years that they tax rates are just going up and up and up. The rest of the country has caught up mainly to their schools systems which used to be some of the best in the country. People retiring in those states are moving south. People who grew up in the those states are not coming back to work. You will also start to see movement based on politics very soon as NY/NJ are so blue that republicans are going to start moving south to goto red states also.
Our financial plan has versions where we eliminate my teachers pension (which won't be huge- only been in for 15 years- may not be in much longer) and/or Social Security. It is safe to say that one of the two won't be paying out or they each will underdeliver. Aim small/miss small.
Staying put. The lot I was buying was a mess and the only other sweet one was sold. Prob 2 more summers then moms wants to sell and run around the USA in a phat RV with Simple Cub. All I gotta work out is a solid RV internet connection. Son2 may start Columbia MBA soon, we’ll stay as a home base for him then sell.
I grew up in a small town in Bedford County, not that there's a big town in Bedford. I thought it was great, but of course I didn't know any different. Bedford has really grown lately with several factories opening up. The leadership there works really hard to attract jobs to the area.
I now live in Lilly, Cambria County. It's your typical old coal mining town that looks like a shell of what it once was. Most of the houses are older and run down and empty storefronts. Not much money in the town. Cambria County fails miserably attracting new jobs to the area.
As stated above, there's good and bad living in small towns. I like the peace and quiet. People are mostly friendly. If I want "city life", Pittsburgh isn't that far away to make a day trip down there. I have no interest in moving down there though.
I now live in Lilly, Cambria County. It's your typical old coal mining town that looks like a shell of what it once was. Most of the houses are older and run down and empty storefronts. Not much money in the town. Cambria County fails miserably attracting new jobs to the area.
As stated above, there's good and bad living in small towns. I like the peace and quiet. People are mostly friendly. If I want "city life", Pittsburgh isn't that far away to make a day trip down there. I have no interest in moving down there though.
Son 1 is in echo park just next to sunset. It’s super gritty and artsy, he digs it the most.
I don't know the nuances of light rail vs. subway but two lines of the LA Metro are underground. Not that it matters though as it pertains to the OP.
Ro, what’s the bottle count up to? Rising quickly I would guess.
For the record, I have a conflicted opinion about small towns. I love that they exist. I love that some people really love what it provides for them. Personally, I hate being in a small town for an extended time. I feel a sense of desperation, isolation when I am there. My wife is from a town of 2,000 people with no town of note within a 1/2 hour drive and it hits me immediately when I get there. Small town is just not for me.
For the record, I have a conflicted opinion about small towns. I love that they exist. I love that some people really love what it provides for them. Personally, I hate being in a small town for an extended time. I feel a sense of desperation, isolation when I am there. My wife is from a town of 2,000 people with no town of note within a 1/2 hour drive and it hits me immediately when I get there. Small town is just not for me.
Philadelphia gets $2.57 for each $1.00 it pays in. And Allegheny County (Pittsburgh ) gets less than a $1.00 for each $1.00 paid in.
I distinctly remember the planning of a HS National Honor Society trip to NY. Everyone except about 4 or 5 of us in the back was excitedly talking about going to see cats, and then, the killer blow - “if we have extra time, we might be able to catch another show”.
🤣
Best part about those small towns is I never had to lock my car/house door at night. If you were on the side of the road with a flat, you'd have almost every single person stop and offer help. Never saw that in eastern PA near philly or any 'big' city for that matter
Small world- that is where my son was from Oct-mid Dec. He loved it too. At the moment he is living in the pool house of his girlfriends' mother....but I think is heading back to Echo Park for his rental. His start up is arts based technology- so that is the place to be!
FWIW we didn't lock out doors in our Upper West Side apartment building. 27 Floors up and a doorman helped! Very, very safe in Lincoln Towers. Agree on the kindness factor- the $100 pick up that I bought for my kids to learn to drive on broke down one day after school. Three different drivers stopped to offer help. That's part of why we moved back- real community
Ughhh Cats. I cant believe that the same guy that helped to give us Jesus Christ Superstar gave us Cats. Apparently Webber needs Tim Rice.I distinctly remember the planning of a HS National Honor Society trip to NY. Everyone except about 4 or 5 of us in the back was excitedly talking about going to see cats, and then, the killer blow - “if we have extra time, we might be able to catch another show”.
But yea big NO! for me on that as well.
You probably took US6 for part of your trip at least. I highly recommend that road. Beautiful scenery and small towns and a pretty easy drive. I think I've driven all of it between Scranton and Erie over the course of my life.
I’ve got a great Andrew Lloyd Webber related story, but it’ll take a bit to describe. Need to revisit this thread in a bit
You hit the key to making a small town great... Leadership. When (not if) the big coal mines or lumber mills close, how does the leadership react and try to maintain jobs and reinvent the area to attract money and not lose the younger population. Community pride is big and it starts with the leadership.
Titusville is a nice area, as are many of the small towns in that area.
Now you're onto something. Give Phila, Montgomery and Chester counties to Jersey (which has much more in common with SEPA than anything to the west) and the rest of the state will be just fine.
Move the Delaware River west of Philly and don't build any bridges back across.
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Ha. my wife is from south jersey and she said they dont want philly either....
Well this thread went as expected, with the usual suspects being on a higher intellectual plane as everyone else......
@NealPaige, I agree with you regarding the small towns of PA. Some really really cool spots. However I’d say every state has that. I’ve lived in NC the last 11 years. Tons of those small towns down here as well. Relics of decades past.
I grew up on a dairy farm between Airville and Delta. Couple small towns I can remember were Fawn Grove, Gatchelville, New Park, Delta, New Bridgeville, Felton, Crossroads. Nothing really special about any of them. Just cool rural back-country towns in south-central PA around my old stomping grounds.
@NealPaige, I agree with you regarding the small towns of PA. Some really really cool spots. However I’d say every state has that. I’ve lived in NC the last 11 years. Tons of those small towns down here as well. Relics of decades past.
I grew up on a dairy farm between Airville and Delta. Couple small towns I can remember were Fawn Grove, Gatchelville, New Park, Delta, New Bridgeville, Felton, Crossroads. Nothing really special about any of them. Just cool rural back-country towns in south-central PA around my old stomping grounds.
I'm not super familiar with Jersey thankfully, but I've always gotten the feeling that north and south jersey are as different as southeastern and western PA.
+100. I grew up in Somerset, PA. I liked it but there was no place for me there as a Graphic Designer.
The biggest issue I have with it, when I go home, is the lack of foresight by the "leadership". They've completely abandoned the "uptown" area. The buildings are an eye sore. The old Penn Traffic building on the Diamond has been a blight for 20 years and they do nothing about it. Instead they tear down historic houses and make parking lots.
The area from the Turnpike to the uptown area is a mess. Some very nice houses next door to what looks like Meth Central.
Everything new that comes into town has to be placed out by the Walmart, which pretty much killed every mom and pop place.
Coal was huge and when it went south they never seemed to adjust.
I grew up in a small town in western PA in the 70's. I think my HS graduating class was the largest in the school's history, so I guess you could say I was there during the area's height in economic stature. It was a great place to grow up. Most folks were solidly middle-class, a few that we thought were wealthy (mainly business owners). There was a fair amount of people living below the poverty line also, but they didn't appear as destitute as what you see there today. I had a blast growing up there. Great school with lots of spirit. Most of these towns were that way and the communities were all proud of their schools, sports teams. There were a lot of rivalries between towns and schools, and a lot of pride in your particular town/school.
Unfortunately, most of the larger businesses (glass factory, box factory, coal companies, specialty steel mills, etc) are gone. I rarely go back. All of my family has left. None of my HS friends stayed. Most of us were the first gen to attend college so we all left for greener pastures. Those that stayed work for the state, a local school, college, or try to make it go with a small business. The retention rate for those that go to college is practically zero.
I used to think that my hometown would bounce back, but anyone with a higher education or a sought-after skill is gone. Outside of maybe distribution centers, it would be a hard sell to attract many businesses.
Unfortunately, most of the larger businesses (glass factory, box factory, coal companies, specialty steel mills, etc) are gone. I rarely go back. All of my family has left. None of my HS friends stayed. Most of us were the first gen to attend college so we all left for greener pastures. Those that stayed work for the state, a local school, college, or try to make it go with a small business. The retention rate for those that go to college is practically zero.
I used to think that my hometown would bounce back, but anyone with a higher education or a sought-after skill is gone. Outside of maybe distribution centers, it would be a hard sell to attract many businesses.
Somerset is another great example of poor leadership.
Johnstown has to be the shining beacon of shitty leadership though. Add up all the issues with that town, and I would be looking to get the hell out asap. I'm not sure why a young person with any ambition would stay there.
Altoona isn't much better, but at least with the I-99 corridor, you have the infrastructure to get people and products in and out to attract businesses. 219 and 56 are disasters in comparison.
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