Financial Times: The US college debt bubble is becoming dangerous

[BobPSU92]

See the link below. I sleep well knowing that president barren has this all under control.

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/04/10/the-us-college-debt-bubble-is-becoming-dangerous.html

 

[BobPSU92]

barry and art will appreciate this from the above article:

"Rising college education costs will not help shrink those numbers. While the headline consumer price index is 2.7 percent, between 2016 and 2017 published tuition and fee prices rose by 9 percent at four-year state institutions, and 13 percent at posher private colleges.

A large chunk of the hike was due to schools hiring more administrators (who "brand build" and recruit wealthy donors) and building expensive facilities designed to lure wealthier, full-fee-paying students."

 

[bjf1991]

barry and art will appreciate this from the above article:

"Rising college education costs will not help shrink those numbers. While the headline consumer price index is 2.7 percent, between 2016 and 2017 published tuition and fee prices rose by 9 percent at four-year state institutions, and 13 percent at posher private colleges.

A large chunk of the hike was due to schools hiring more administrators (who "brand build" and recruit wealthy donors) and building expensive facilities designed to lure wealthier, full-fee-paying students."

GOOD LORD!!!!

Where have I heard that before?

While our Trustees - ALL OF THEM - continue to spew their "don't blame us" nonsense about the State Appropriation

_______________________



"Penn State Tuition: Part 1
Is Penn State's Tuition too High?

We need to learn, and recognize, THE TRUTH!

...
Penn State - according to their own financial statements - is overcharging their students by over $8,000 per year.

Today, nearly 1/3 of all Tuition dollars no longer go towards their intended purpose....INSTRUCTING AND EDUCATING our students.

Instead, Administrative Bloat, and Wasteful (and probably fraudulent) Capital Spending Costs have driven tuition costs to ridiculous levels.

We need to understand the TRUTH.....is we are ever to achieve Responsible Governance."

Tune in for Parts 2 and 3 ("Barry Fenchak for Trustee" on FaceBook), to learn what we can do, and what we must do, to regain control over Tuition Costs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPIinxUkOfg

 

[voltz99]

See the link below. I sleep well knowing that president barren has this all under control.

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/04/10/the-us-college-debt-bubble-is-becoming-dangerous.html

Do you want an education at a reasonable price or do you want a 5 star hotel/dorm with flat screen TVs, private baths, private rooms, and high end chefs?

Let me know when students and parents want to give up all the perks.

 

[voltz99]

GOOD LORD!!!!

Where have I heard that before?

While our Trustees - ALL OF THEM - continue to spew their "don't blame us" nonsense about the State Appropriation

_______________________



"Penn State Tuition: Part 1
Is Penn State's Tuition too High?

We need to learn, and recognize, THE TRUTH!

...
Penn State - according to their own financial statements - is overcharging their students by over $8,000 per year.

Today, nearly 1/3 of all Tuition dollars no longer go towards their intended purpose....INSTRUCTING AND EDUCATING our students.

Instead, Administrative Bloat, and Wasteful (and probably fraudulent) Capital Spending Costs have driven tuition costs to ridiculous levels.

We need to understand the TRUTH.....is we are ever to achieve Responsible Governance."

Tune in for Parts 2 and 3 ("Barry Fenchak for Trustee" on FaceBook), to learn what we can do, and what we must do, to regain control over Tuition Costs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPIinxUkOfg

Did the story even mention PSU?

 

[Nitt1300]

no worries, they will get a bail out - paid for by people who had nothing to do with taking or making the loans

 

[Obliviax]

"President Barron, can you demonstrated how college students should place their hands when being fleeced by universities?"

 

[NittPicker]

A large chunk of the hike was due to schools hiring more administrators (who "brand build" and recruit wealthy donors) and building expensive facilities designed to lure wealthier, full-fee-paying students."

Oh yeah. Could there be more Asst. AD positions on the horizon?

 

[voltz99]

"President Barron, can you demonstrated how college students should place their hands when being fleeced by universities?"

Fleeced? YOU mean providing all the perks you want and charging the exact price they quoted?

Let us know when you want to give up all the perks and they will stop charging for those perks.

 

[PSUPhreak]

Do you want an education at a reasonable price or do you want a 5 star hotel/dorm with flat screen TVs, private baths, private rooms, and high end chefs?

Let me know when students and parents want to give up all the perks.

What bizzaro world are you living on?

 

[bjf1991]

Do you want an education at a reasonable price or do you want a 5 star hotel/dorm with flat screen TVs, private baths, private rooms, and high end chefs?

Let me know when students and parents want to give up all the perks.

Who's getting the 5 Star Hotels? And all the perks?

Penn State Dorm Room

Penn State Classroom

$6,000,000 + Bonuses

$1,000,000 + Bonuses + a Staff of 26 Assistant/Associate ADs

$50,000,000 Dormitory "Project"

1996: 1 "Administrator" for every 4 "Faculty/Staff"

2016: 1 "Administrator" for every 2 "Faculty/Staff"

 

[artsandletters]

Do you want an education at a reasonable price or do you want a 5 star hotel/dorm with flat screen TVs, private baths, private rooms, and high end chefs?

Let me know when students and parents want to give up all the perks.

Granite or marble countertops is a must.

 

[Art]

barry and art will appreciate this from the above article:

"Rising college education costs will not help shrink those numbers. While the headline consumer price index is 2.7 percent, between 2016 and 2017 published tuition and fee prices rose by 9 percent at four-year state institutions, and 13 percent at posher private colleges.

A large chunk of the hike was due to schools hiring more administrators (who "brand build" and recruit wealthy donors) and building expensive facilities designed to lure wealthier, full-fee-paying students."

Yes, but spending what will likely wind up being more than $1bn on athletic facilities upgrades is just fine because ICA is "self-funding."

 

[NitNE73]

The federal government is partially responsible for this debt. First, the Clinton administration made college debt exempt from bankruptcy. Second, the administration treats all post high school education the same, and many for-profit programs have students borrowing federally guaranteed loans who graduate with few skills and fewer chances to pay back loans. Even legitimate schools encourage marginal students to borrow despite evidence that the degree will hardly enhance the students' employment opportunities. The government should be excluding institutions whose failure rate exceeds a set percentage.

Finally, the feds have done nothing to help universities keep tuition more in line with the inflation rate. I realize that price controls don't work, but the feds spend millions in research. These dollars could be conditional on institutions meeting specific tuition and post-graduation employment parameters. Higher education has grown unchecked, and now declining enrollments mean more schools will go after a shrinking pie of students.

Meanwhile, try to find a plumber or electrician who can do small jobs at reasonable prices.

 

[JoeDidntKnow]

This is all Al Lord's fault... or at least that's what I've read

 

[Cletus11]

Something I have thought about. You have a child who is not going to be the next brain surgeon. Instead of sending him to a 4 year university to get a degree in business or communications and come out with no job prospects and a mountain of debt (or if you pay for their college, a lot of wasted money spent). Send them to a two year program to get a blue collar skill, ie...electrician, plumber, carpenter, etc...Take the money that would have been spent in college and when he gets out, give them 50% of that money over another 2 year period so they can live a little bit as everybody knows the first few years learning on the job in those professions is pretty brutal. Take the other 50% of the money and put it in an account that he gets 5+ years out. So essentially taking the money that would have been spent on college and give it to them to encourage to go into a skilled trade.

 

[voltz99]

Who's getting the 5 Star Hotels? And all the perks?

$50,000,000 Dormitory "Project"



1996: 1 "Administrator" for every 4 "Faculty/Staff"

2016: 1 "Administrator" for every 2 "Faculty/Staff"

Where are the pics of the $50 million dorm that YOU listed?

1996: three roommates in 150 sq ft room designed for two.
2017: private rooms and private baths.

1996 cafeteria.
2017: Food courts, multiple restaurants around campus with chefs.

Give us a list of perks that you are willing to give up. Once you give up YOUR perks the schools and get rid of all the staff that oversea the crap that YOU wanted.

Did the story even mention PSU?

 

[step.eng69]

Well, I’LL BE, it looks like the university did a complete makeover of our dorms from the 60’s. Same bed, same desk, same window.

 

[voltz99]

The federal government is partially responsible for this debt. First, the Clinton administration made college debt exempt from bankruptcy. Second, the administration treats all post high school education the same, and many for-profit programs have students borrowing federally guaranteed loans who graduate with few skills and fewer chances to pay back loans. Even legitimate schools encourage marginal students to borrow despite evidence that the degree will hardly enhance the students' employment opportunities. The government should be excluding institutions whose failure rate exceeds a set percentage.

Finally, the feds have done nothing to help universities keep tuition more in line with the inflation rate. I realize that price controls don't work, but the feds spend millions in research. These dollars could be conditional on institutions meeting specific tuition and post-graduation employment parameters. Higher education has grown unchecked, and now declining enrollments mean more schools will go after a shrinking pie of students.

Meanwhile, try to find a plumber or electrician who can do small jobs at reasonable prices.

What have the students and alumni done to keep costs down? Nothing. THey demand more and more and when they get it they complain about the costs.

.

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

Who's getting the 5 Star Hotels? And all the perks?

Penn State Dorm Room

Penn State Classroom

$6,000,000 + Bonuses

$1,000,000 + Bonuses + a Staff of 26 Assistant/Associate ADs

$50,000,000 Dormitory "Project"

1996: 1 "Administrator" for every 4 "Faculty/Staff"

2016: 1 "Administrator" for every 2 "Faculty/Staff"

Showing a photo of what looks to be 100 Thomas Building and implying it's representative of most Penn State class is more than a bit misleading.

 

[bjf1991]

Showing a photo of what looks to be 100 Thomas Building and implying it's representative of most Penn State class is more than a bit misleading.

True.....

Thomas Building is much nicer .......MUCH NICER........than the Forum, Willard, or any number of classroom buildings on campus.

Of course, folks who can do "math", don't need to consternate (Circle-Jerk?) over a photo to know that over $0.40 of every $1.00 of tuition - as opposed to just 16 years ago - is no longer used to pay for Education and Instruction of Students........
But is now funneled into Bloated Administration and Empire Building.

Of course, being able to do add/subtract/multiply/divide math, is not a skill that all of us have

 

[voltz99]

Granite or marble countertops is a must.

Granite, marble, flat screens, private chefs, private rooms and so on.

Every room at the new dorm at Temple has a flat screen.

 

[bjf1991]

Showing a photo of what looks to be 100 Thomas Building and implying it's representative of most Penn State class is more than a bit misleading.

Posting on a message board - - - and implying that you know dick about anything - - - - is misleading.

Just saying

 

[voltz99]

True.....

Thomas Building is much nicer .......MUCH NICER........than the Forum, Willard, or any number of classroom buildings on campus.

Of course, folks who can do "math", don't need to consternate (Circle-Jerk?) over a photo to know that over $0.40 of every $1.00 of tuition - as opposed to just 16 years ago - is no longer used to pay for Education and Instruction of Students........
But is now funneled into Bloated Administration and Empire Building.

Of course, being able to do add/subtract/multiply/divide math, is not a skill that all of us have

Did you do the math when you were picking colleges?

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

Posting on a message board - - - and implying that you know dick about anything - - - - is misleading.

Just saying

LOL

Barry, you're my hero. My idiotic, narcissistic, hypocritical, megalomaniac, alcoholic hero.

 

[Art]

Did you do the math when you were picking colleges?

Sure as hell did. My parents forced me and my brother to figure out the annual cost, including those expenses that wouldn't appear on the school bill. Then they told us how much they would contribute. From there we figured out our share and where the rest would come from.

Fortunately for my kids, the exercise wasn't required. However, each on their own went through it and asked if we were okay with footing a bill of that size.

 

[lyndj]

True.....

Thomas Building is much nicer .......MUCH NICER........than the Forum, Willard, or any number of classroom buildings on campus.

Of course, folks who can do "math", don't need to consternate (Circle-Jerk?) over a photo to know that over $0.40 of every $1.00 of tuition - as opposed to just 16 years ago - is no longer used to pay for Education and Instruction of Students........
But is now funneled into Bloated Administration and Empire Building.

Of course, being able to do add/subtract/multiply/divide math, is not a skill that all of us have

As a full tuition-paying parent, the buildings are fine and new buildings are also fine and the campus looks great. Granted, SOME of the dorms are a bit dated--but some of the newer dorms are quite nice. You might be much happier if you didn't pontificate so much!

 

[lyndj]

Granite, marble, flat screens, private chefs, private rooms and so on.

Every room at the new dorm at Temple has a flat screen.

I suppose they're trying to make it more inviting. The surrounding area is kind of a dump though.

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

Sure as hell did. My parents forced me and my brother to figure out the annual cost, including those expenses that wouldn't appear on the school bill. Then they told us how much they would contribute. From there we figured out our share and where the rest would come from.

Fortunately for my kids, the exercise wasn't required. However, each on their own went through it and asked if we were okay with footing a bill of that size.

You were blessed with good parents.

Not everyone is, and out of those, not everyone has someone to explain things to them.

 

[mn78psu83]

The surrounding area is kind of a dump though.

Kind of a dump?

Sure as hell did. My parents forced me and my brother to figure out the annual cost, including those expenses that wouldn't appear on the school bill. Then they told us how much they would contribute. From there we figured out our share and where the rest would come from.

Fortunately for my kids, the exercise wasn't required. However, each on their own went through it and asked if we were okay with footing a bill of that size.

Wise parents. A little tough love goes a long way.

 

[kgilbert78]

Proud of my youngest niece who took the deal at the college that's low enough to allow her to work her way thru school without debt. Smart girl (and no, niece by marriage, so she gets it from my wife's side of the family)....

 

[Art]

You were blessed with good parents.

Not everyone is, and out of those, not everyone has someone to explain things to them.

Yes, my brother and I were fortunate. Can't quite fathom from whom my kids learned responsibility; must have been my wife.

Quite honestly, is someone is staring in the teeth of a significant financial obligation without being scared, I really don't know if anyone could help them.

 

[bjf1991]

As a full tuition-paying parent, the buildings are fine and new buildings are also fine and the campus looks great. Granted, SOME of the dorms are a bit dated--but some of the newer dorms are quite nice. You might be much happier if you didn't pontificate so much!

If you want to remain willfully ignorant, by refusing to read an income statement and balance sheet for yourself - - AND going OT when someone does the work for you - - - that's your choice.

Whatever makes you "happy"

I find ignorance to be - rather unpleasant But that's just one guy's opinion, and to each their own.

 

[Art]

Kind of a dump?

Wise parents. A little tough love goes a long way.

Wisdom often comes with money often being an object, or it should.

There is a front page story in the NYT Times today on the same subject. None of the cases cited sound like kids who came from families where money was abundant. Even if the parents were absent or didn't drill financial responsibility into the kids, you'd think they'd develop some sense from their own experiences.

Maybe need-blind admissions policies aren't such a good thing.

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

Quite honestly, is someone is staring in the teeth of a significant financial obligation without being scared, I really don't know if anyone could help them.

I think the trouble is in the fact that some don't understand what a significant financial obligation truly means. There are so many kids out there whose parents don't broach the subject or take time to explain how debt works (both good and bad). As a result, the kid goes into it with blinders on--signing up for their college of choice--because they don't even know the questions to ask.

Many high schools don't have resources that explain this to kids either.

So in the end, the kid with blinders on just gives a few John Hancocks to master promissory notes without knowing how to properly evaluate the playing field or even knowing what questions to ask.

The above isn't to imply that I think anyone is more to blame than the other--or that one has more of a responsibility than the other--rather, it's just an observation after some experience.

 

[BobPSU92]

Well, I’LL BE, it looks like the university did a complete makeover of our dorms from the 60’s. Same bed, same desk, same window.

Yes, but the bidets (one for each student) are behind the camera.

 

[artsandletters]

Yes, my brother and I were fortunate. Can't quite fathom from whom my kids learned responsibility; must have been my wife.

Quite honestly, is someone is staring in the teeth of a significant financial obligation without being scared, I really don't know if anyone could help them.

They could call a Russian oligarch or three.

 

[lionlurker]

Granite, marble, flat screens, private chefs, private rooms and so on.

Every room at the new dorm at Temple has a flat screen.

Well, in fairness, they don't sell non-flatscreen televisions anymore.

 

[BobPSU92]

Well, in fairness, they don't sell non-flatscreen televisions anymore.

 

[Art]

I think the trouble is in the fact that some don't understand what a significant financial obligation truly means. There are so many kids out there whose parents don't broach the subject or take time to explain how debt works (both good and bad). As a result, the kid goes into it with blinders on--signing up for their college of choice--because they don't even know the questions to ask.

Many high schools don't have resources that explain this to kids either.

So in the end, the kid with blinders on just gives a few John Hancocks to master promissory notes without knowing how to properly evaluate the playing field or even knowing what questions to ask.

The above isn't to imply that I think anyone is more to blame than the other--or that one has more of a responsibility than the other--rather, it's just an observation after some experience.

Simple arithmetic: college costs $50k p.a. to attend, school provides a grant of $20k p.a., kid/parents can kick in $5k p.a. so kid has to borrow $25k p.a. If that doesn't cause the kid to swallow real hard, and the amount to cause an involuntary reaction should be a whole lot less, I'm inclined to say it's hopeless.. And that's before multiplying it by four.