I recall being thown into a OL position on two series in HS...Never played OL

[Rip_E_2_Joe_PA]

I was undersized played WR and OLB/Safety. All our guards on one side were hurt. Coach asked if anyone wanted to jump in at guard before the half. I said yes. I really wanted to punish a linebacker for hitting people ... and kicking them after the whistle. They guy played at Pitt later.... he was a douche and a failure there. Anyway, my head coach asked me if I knew any blocking assignments for the Guard position. I said no. He asked if I could listen to the center and block as I was told to block. I said "sure coach". I went in... the play was called 51 blast of some such thing... center started talking and I walked up to the live and drove block the guy in front of me about 8 yards down field and stayed on the block. Same thing every time the next 4 plays over two sets of downs regardless of the play called. The third down and last down I was in blocking netted 2 running tds right through the holes made by my skinny butt.

The message of my f-ing story is this. If you don't know your blocking assignment boys..... but know how to block and love to hit and have the will to sustain... just hit the guy in front of you and make him not want to ever see you again after the first miserable 10-15 seconds of your time in the game owning his ass until the whistle blows. After that you are set. All the coach could say during films the next week..... who is that skinny ass driving people down field. Not the most cerebral thing I ever did in my life.... but it made sense to me at the time. If you are a linemen and you don't want to hit, lock and punish someone ... why the hell are you a lineman was my thought? Graduated at 6' 1" and 189 lbs. Would do it again if I could.

With an 11-12 play offense..... how could you go wrong doing this? I figured the goal was to neutralize the enemy so my guys could have some space to do some damage.... it didn't matter if I cracked back or pulled or anything.... I just needed to knock someone back and out of the way. We had a hell of a lot more plays every qtr in HS than PSU showed all game last weekend... same in JV too... come to think of it...same in JH, too. Touch dancing did not seem a viable option. I gotta ask... how could the PSU OL start the second half not wanting to punish any Red jersey in their line of sight? Is this the Ghandi Line or a PSU line?

There was a PSU OL that played with the Eagles that I admired... Named Ron Heller.... some said he was a dirty player... All I know is that he owned whoever he blocked till the whistle blew.... He wanted to hit people and wear their asses out. I really like Ron Heller..... Perhaps the PSU OL of this season should watch some Heller tapes. .

 

[jj410]

I was undersized played WR and OLB/Safety. All our guards on one side were hurt. Coach asked if anyone wanted to jump in at guard before the half. I said yes. I really wanted to punish a linebacker for hitting people ... and kicking them after the whistle. They guy played at Pitt later.... he was a douche and a failure there. Anyway, my head coach asked me if I knew any blocking assignments for the Guard position. I said no. He asked if I could listen to the center and block as I was told to block. I said "sure coach". I went in... the play was called 51 blast of some such thing... center started talking and I walked up to the live and drove block the guy in front of me about 8 yards down field and stayed on the block. Same thing every time the next 4 plays over two sets of downs regardless of the play called. The third down and last down I was in blocking netted 2 running tds right through the holes made by my skinny butt.

The message of my f-ing story is this. If you don't know your blocking assignment boys..... but know how to block and love to hit and have the will to sustain... just hit the guy in front of you and make him not want to ever see you again after the first miserable 10-15 seconds of your time in the game owning his ass until the whistle blows. After that you are set. All the coach could say during films the next week..... who is that skinny ass driving people down field. Not the most cerebral thing I ever did in my life.... but it made sense to me at the time. If you are a linemen and you don't want to hit, lock and punish someone ... why the hell are you a lineman was my thought? Graduated at 6' 1" and 189 lbs. Would do it again if I could.

With an 11-12 play offense..... how could you go wrong doing this? I figured the goal was to neutralize the enemy so my guys could have some space to do some damage.... it didn't matter if I cracked back or pulled or anything.... I just needed to knock someone back and out of the way. We had a hell of a lot more plays every qtr in HS than PSU showed all game last weekend... same in JV too... come to think of it...same in JH, too. Touch dancing did not seem a viable option. I gotta ask... how could the PSU OL start the second half not wanting to punish any Red jersey in their line of sight? Is this the Ghandi Line or a PSU line?

There was a PSU OL that played with the Eagles that I admired... Named Ron Heller.... some said he was a dirty player... All I know is that he owned whoever he blocked till the whistle blew.... He wanted to hit people and wear their asses out. I really like Ron Heller..... Perhaps the PSU OL of this season should watch some Heller tapes. .

You don't understand. Playing OL is harder than brain surgery. Learning exactly how to hit defenders running right at you is incredibly complex. It takes many many many years of training and experience of people working together to get it just right. The idea that it takes less than four years to get highly conditioned blue chip athletes to learn to keep people from killing the QB is ridiculous, it takes the skills of a boxer combined with the footwork of a ballet dancer and the intelligence of a rocket scientist.

 

[Nittany Ziggy]

I was undersized played WR and OLB/Safety. All our guards on one side were hurt. Coach asked if anyone wanted to jump in at guard before the half. I said yes. I really wanted to punish a linebacker for hitting people ... and kicking them after the whistle. They guy played at Pitt later.... he was a douche and a failure there. Anyway, my head coach asked me if I knew any blocking assignments for the Guard position. I said no. He asked if I could listen to the center and block as I was told to block. I said "sure coach". I went in... the play was called 51 blast of some such thing... center started talking and I walked up to the live and drove block the guy in front of me about 8 yards down field and stayed on the block. Same thing every time the next 4 plays over two sets of downs regardless of the play called. The third down and last down I was in blocking netted 2 running tds right through the holes made by my skinny butt.

The message of my f-ing story is this. If you don't know your blocking assignment boys..... but know how to block and love to hit and have the will to sustain... just hit the guy in front of you and make him not want to ever see you again after the first miserable 10-15 seconds of your time in the game owning his ass until the whistle blows. After that you are set. All the coach could say during films the next week..... who is that skinny ass driving people down field. Not the most cerebral thing I ever did in my life.... but it made sense to me at the time. If you are a linemen and you don't want to hit, lock and punish someone ... why the hell are you a lineman was my thought? Graduated at 6' 1" and 189 lbs. Would do it again if I could.

There was a PSU OL that played with the Eagles that I admired... Named Ron Heller.... some said he was a dirty player... All I know is that he owned whoever he blocked till the whistle blew.... He wanted to hit people and wear their asses out. I really like Ron Heller..... Perhaps the PSU OL of this season should watch some Heller tapes. .

Your story reminds me of a situation I was thrown into in the back seat of a '68 Chevy in my senior year! I also would do it again (if I could).

 

[Rip_E_2_Joe_PA]

What I witnessed last Saturday was a couple OLmen with what appeared to be a sever allergy to contact. Never saw it before... was waiting for a coach to send in doctors and stretchers and haul a couple guys off to The Hershey Medical Center for Quarantine. It appeared the no contact allergy they had might be contagious! Peculiar for an allergy.... but hey..... there was plenty of evidence.

 

[ziplock]

Rip,
It's a great story and a great memory for you. Where I caution all of us is when we start comparing that era of football to the modern day version. It is not even remotely the same game and the size/speed of the athletes is completely different. Offensive and defensive systems are very different now than they were back then.

As a data point, when Ron Heller played at PSU, he was basically the same height and weight as Mike Gesicki is now. How many of us would slide Mike Gesicki into the interior of the OL??

In re: the pass protection during the Temple game, I would submit to you the following observations as an OL coach ->
** Sacks 1, 3, 5 and 9 were delays and stunts. Whose responsibility they were in protection depends upon the protection they were in. Also, the little clock in your head goes off on at least two of those sacks, IMO.
** Sack 2 is on what we refer to as a tag play. Look closely at the OL and you will see that this is run/pass read. The RB is running bender and left side of OL is blocking bender. Right side (read side) is blocking 'tag' with receivers in routes. IMO, Hack reads tag wrong and should have given bender.
** Sack 4 is almost assuredly on Hack. He knows protection and that edge rusher is unaccounted for. Ball should be out rather than sack here.
** Sack 6 is lack of communication. I'm fairly certain that Palmer believes he's got inside help from Mahon. He does not react like an OT who is pinned one-on-one.
** Sacks 7, 8 and 10 are on Palmer, Dowrey and Richardson individually, IMO. In all three instances, they get out of a good position and get beat.

I am impressed with some of Temple's blitzes. They dialed up some nice blitzes that, frankly, an NFL QB would shred but will typically make a college QB pretty confused. Also, those blitzes work best with a QB who doesn't like to check down or throw it away. It really was a perfect storm in that regard.

Take care.
ziplock

 

[PSU87]

I was undersized played WR and OLB/Safety. All our guards on one side were hurt. Coach asked if anyone wanted to jump in at guard before the half. I said yes. I really wanted to punish a linebacker for hitting people ... and kicking them after the whistle. They guy played at Pitt later.... he was a douche and a failure there. Anyway, my head coach asked me if I knew any blocking assignments for the Guard position. I said no. He asked if I could listen to the center and block as I was told to block. I said "sure coach". I went in... the play was called 51 blast of some such thing... center started talking and I walked up to the live and drove block the guy in front of me about 8 yards down field and stayed on the block. Same thing every time the next 4 plays over two sets of downs regardless of the play called. The third down and last down I was in blocking netted 2 running tds right through the holes made by my skinny butt.

The message of my f-ing story is this. If you don't know your blocking assignment boys..... but know how to block and love to hit and have the will to sustain... just hit the guy in front of you and make him not want to ever see you again after the first miserable 10-15 seconds of your time in the game owning his ass until the whistle blows. After that you are set. All the coach could say during films the next week..... who is that skinny ass driving people down field. Not the most cerebral thing I ever did in my life.... but it made sense to me at the time. If you are a linemen and you don't want to hit, lock and punish someone ... why the hell are you a lineman was my thought? Graduated at 6' 1" and 189 lbs. Would do it again if I could.

With an 11-12 play offense..... how could you go wrong doing this? I figured the goal was to neutralize the enemy so my guys could have some space to do some damage.... it didn't matter if I cracked back or pulled or anything.... I just needed to knock someone back and out of the way. We had a hell of a lot more plays every qtr in HS than PSU showed all game last weekend... same in JV too... come to think of it...same in JH, too. Touch dancing did not seem a viable option. I gotta ask... how could the PSU OL start the second half not wanting to punish any Red jersey in their line of sight? Is this the Ghandi Line or a PSU line?

There was a PSU OL that played with the Eagles that I admired... Named Ron Heller.... some said he was a dirty player... All I know is that he owned whoever he blocked till the whistle blew.... He wanted to hit people and wear their asses out. I really like Ron Heller..... Perhaps the PSU OL of this season should watch some Heller tapes. .

Do you have any eligibility left?

 

[sluggo72]

Rip,
It's a great story and a great memory for you. Where I caution all of us is when we start comparing that era of football to the modern day version. It is not even remotely the same game and the size/speed of the athletes is completely different. Offensive and defensive systems are very different now than they were back then.

As a data point, when Ron Heller played at PSU, he was basically the same height and weight as Mike Gesicki is now. How many of us would slide Mike Gesicki into the interior of the OL??

In re: the pass protection during the Temple game, I would submit to you the following observations as an OL coach ->
** Sacks 1, 3, 5 and 9 were delays and stunts. Whose responsibility they were in protection depends upon the protection they were in. Also, the little clock in your head goes off on at least two of those sacks, IMO.
** Sack 2 is on what we refer to as a tag play. Look closely at the OL and you will see that this is run/pass read. The RB is running bender and left side of OL is blocking bender. Right side (read side) is blocking 'tag' with receivers in routes. IMO, Hack reads tag wrong and should have given bender.
** Sack 4 is almost assuredly on Hack. He knows protection and that edge rusher is unaccounted for. Ball should be out rather than sack here.
** Sack 6 is lack of communication. I'm fairly certain that Palmer believes he's got inside help from Mahon. He does not react like an OT who is pinned one-on-one.
** Sacks 7, 8 and 10 are on Palmer, Dowrey and Richardson individually, IMO. In all three instances, they get out of a good position and get beat.

I am impressed with some of Temple's blitzes. They dialed up some nice blitzes that, frankly, an NFL QB would shred but will typically make a college QB pretty confused. Also, those blitzes work best with a QB who doesn't like to check down or throw it away. It really was a perfect storm in that regard.

Take care.
ziplock

we agree on most., but I had a long debate on #4 between Hack and the OT. it looked to me like they had a 2 man side to the RHS, the OT looked inside, and not outside to where #2 LOS was, so I think the OT should have taken him. I don't think it was on Hack, as no one looked to take the ball hot, and IIRC at least 2 receivers crossed the DE face. That said Hack, with a free rush coming in his face, probably could have done anything other than what he did ( throw it away, scramble, roll away etc), which was of course take a sack.
To that end, I don't think Temple did anything that exotic with their blitzes a D1 should be able to handle. A few T/E twists, a few read blitzes etc. I don't think PSU has a scheme to handle these those, no sight adjust, no dual reads etc. They better get ready for these as they will seem them for at least the next 4 weeks!!!.
Just some small points.

 

[ziplock]

Sluggo,
Good stuff, man. I see where you're coming from on #4. My read on that was a little different but you may be spot on there. My thought was PSU's first in-game adjustment was sliding to keep the center of the pocket clean so Hack could feel outside pressure but have the ability to work up into a soft spot. When I saw Christian gesture to that edge pre-snap, I assumed he was telling the back it was hot because that side of the line was sliding Louie. Problem is, like you pointed out, neither the back or the receiver broke off hot.

Take care.
ziplock

 

[PSU&Trout]

Sluggo,
Good stuff, man. I see where you're coming from on #4. My read on that was a little different but you may be spot on there. My thought was PSU's first in-game adjustment was sliding to keep the center of the pocket clean so Hack could feel outside pressure but have the ability to work up into a soft spot. When I saw Christian gesture to that edge pre-snap, I assumed he was telling the back it was hot because that side of the line was sliding Louie. Problem is, like you pointed out, neither the back or the receiver broke off hot.

Take care.
ziplock

Great Stuff, you two!! Now the key question, in your minds, is this problem solvable? ?

 

[ziplock]

Trout,
That's the $1M question, man. The answer is yes..... with caveats. There is no way to briefly answer that for me but I would submit the following:
1) A good running game would help quite a bit. As an offense, you have to stay in manageable down-and-distance situations. This allows an OC to keep as much of the playbook available as possible on every play.
2) You have to avoid a back having to help your tackle on every play. This is a recipe for disaster, protection-wise, because now you allow a defense to dial up blitzes that outnumber you.
3) If you need help on an edge, it would be better to crack with a TE on release. You can also roll your pocket some to keep teams off balance in their scheme.
4) Route combinations are also key to helping out here. You need to make sure your QB always has check down routes to get rid of the ball quickly. You also have to have sight recognition adjustments to flood areas vacated by blitzers. Conventional wisdom is to throw through the blitz to the vacated area.
5) Use cut blocks as an effective tool to slow down pass rushers. Defensive players slow down when the fear of being cut stays fresh in their mind. Keep them off balance and guessing.

These are my initial reactions but obviously there are other things that can be utilized as well.

Take care.
ziplock

 

[PSU&Trout]

Trout,
That's the $1M question, man. The answer is yes..... with caveats. There is no way to briefly answer that for me but I would submit the following:
1) A good running game would help quite a bit. As an offense, you have to stay in manageable down-and-distance situations. This allows an OC to keep as much of the playbook available as possible on every play.
2) You have to avoid a back having to help your tackle on every play. This is a recipe for disaster, protection-wise, because now you allow a defense to dial up blitzes that outnumber you.
3) If you need help on an edge, it would be better to crack with a TE on release. You can also roll your pocket some to keep teams off balance in their scheme.
4) Route combinations are also key to helping out here. You need to make sure your QB always has check down routes to get rid of the ball quickly. You also have to have sight recognition adjustments to flood areas vacated by blitzers. Conventional wisdom is to throw through the blitz to the vacated area.
5) Use cut blocks as an effective tool to slow down pass rushers. Defensive players slow down when the fear of being cut stays fresh in their mind. Keep them off balance and guessing.

These are my initial reactions but obviously there are other things that can be utilized as well.

Take care.
ziplock

Nice, all makes sense. we shall see.

 

[sluggo72]

Great Stuff, you two!! Now the key question, in your minds, is this problem solvable? ?

For $1 million a year I can solve it!!! That said refer to what zip lock said !!

 

[The Spin Meister]

Trout,
That's the $1M question, man. The answer is yes..... with caveats. There is no way to briefly answer that for me but I would submit the following:
1) A good running game would help quite a bit. As an offense, you have to stay in manageable down-and-distance situations. This allows an OC to keep as much of the playbook available as possible on every play.
2) You have to avoid a back having to help your tackle on every play. This is a recipe for disaster, protection-wise, because now you allow a defense to dial up blitzes that outnumber you.
3) If you need help on an edge, it would be better to crack with a TE on release. You can also roll your pocket some to keep teams off balance in their scheme.
4) Route combinations are also key to helping out here. You need to make sure your QB always has check down routes to get rid of the ball quickly. You also have to have sight recognition adjustments to flood areas vacated by blitzers. Conventional wisdom is to throw through the blitz to the vacated area.
5) Use cut blocks as an effective tool to slow down pass rushers. Defensive players slow down when the fear of being cut stays fresh in their mind. Keep them off balance and guessing.

These are my initial reactions but obviously there are other things that can be utilized as well.

Take care.
ziplock

------
This is what bothered me most. All of this is fixable but the offense scheme itself was really unprepared. Maybe the staff thought the Temple could be beat just because and didn't put in a lot of options. If so that is in of itself really bad. But the OC just doesn't seem up the the task at hand. All last season many of the same issues arose. Plays take too long, very few checks at line, no hot receivers, Hack taking too many sacks he could avoid.

I think Palmer's biggest problem was game speed and quickness of opponents. Going from JUCO to big time is a huge jump and all the practice in the world ain't the same as game speed. A game against Buffalo may be just the medicine he needs.

It all fixable but not if the OC can't do it. Perhaps the HC and/or QB coach will make a difference with more input.