Is anybody here planning on..
- Thread starter PSU_522
- Start date
A bus trip would be cool. Possibly the Capital Chapter Alumni Association might be planning one. If they are, maybe my grandson & myself would sign on.
Check the Harrisburg chapter, they have a home page with up coming events.
Check the Harrisburg chapter, they have a home page with up coming events.
Absolutely will be there. My oldest son just graduated last month from PSU, younger son will be senior at VT when we play there in 2020.
So, son no.1 and I will be in our blue and white, son no. 2 maroon and orange, and my wife will go totally neutral, like green.......
As I tell everyone, oldest chose PSU, younger was down to choosing between PSU and VT and chose VT. It was his call, but he has chosen to be my 2nd favorite son....
Color blender on a neutral color for the bride to wear....Absolutely will be there. My oldest son just graduated last month from PSU, younger son will be senior at VT when we play there in 2020.
So, son no.1 and I will be in our blue and white, son no. 2 maroon and orange, and my wife will go totally neutral, like green.......
As I tell everyone, oldest chose PSU, younger was down to choosing between PSU and VT and chose VT. It was his call, but he has chosen to be my 2nd favorite son....
https://trycolors.com/
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I worked at the VPI nat one summer and lived at Foxridge.Its to far of a drive for one day.Ill be there.Also,there is a nice tribute to Penn State near Burse Hall(their Old Main) for the contribution that was made for the 4/15 mass shooting.I wish I could post John Urshals speech before the Blue/White game.I still have two of the tshirt that were sold to raise money.
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As of now, I plan to go.
Those of us who are going might consider sharing hotel info, and maybe have a BWI happy hour on the Friday night before, or a post-game gathering, or something.
Or not.
Those of us who are going might consider sharing hotel info, and maybe have a BWI happy hour on the Friday night before, or a post-game gathering, or something.
Or not.
I’ll be there, my father, grandfather and several cousins went there. It is a beautiful campus. I went to a game at Lane in 92 or 93. VT stunk and was playing a ranked NC State team. Tech led the whole game, NC State kicked a long FG at the buzzer to end the game in a tie, buzzkill.
Daughter just graduated from VT and our entire extended family will be there. I'll be in a PSU jersey and VT ballcap. We have "connections" to get good tickets, but I will be an island in the VT ocean on the home side (all friendly though).
Our whiteouts are phenomenal, but "Enter Sandman" at VT, especially for night games, is really something special. It will be electric.
Yeah I am definitely planning on going to Auburn as well, not sure if I can convince my wife to go or if I’ll have to try and find some friends for a road trip. Kinda hoping it’s a night game for the atmosphere but probably will make it a more difficult too win.
I hear ya, but that's all right. Win, and you accomplish something. Lose, and at least you fall to a worthy opponent.
Much better than the steady stream of dog doo we've been paying top dollar for.
I live in NoVA (Springfield), and it's virtually the same time to drive to drive to SC or BG. Consequently, I don't perceive the game in BG to be any more convenient.
No more than non-PSU'ers hearing the repeated "growl" at the Beav. Seriously though, it's a great gameday experience. Their tailgating has a long way to go to catch PSU (I taunt them incessantly), but the fans and stadium are great.
I understand, not trying to flam just asking. I know fffffooooouuuurrrrrtttthhhh ddddoooowwwwwnnnn can get under your skin.
As an engineer, the terms "electric" & "stadiums" always gained my interest. I had seats in the upper south end of the stadium for 10 years. The seating was located in rows AA & BB, at the very tip of the overhanging cantilever of the decks. During the 2008 Ohio game, the stadium rocked (literally) and we were bouncing up and down similar to being on the end of a diving board. Knowing the vibrations and movements of structures due to live impact loads, even I became a bit unsettled. Great time though at that game.
After the season, a few of my grandchildren, wife and D-I-law were visiting LJ, Sr. in State College. During lunch down town, Larry told the family that after the game PSU had the stadiums undergo a structural inspection. Johnson told the kids that the creaking of the steel stadium could be heard downtown during the game.
Next time you're at a HS soccer, base ball, football, etc. event sitting on bleachers.....food for thought below
Below is an excerpt from web site called "Engineering Tips" which I frequent if I have a problem identifying-understanding certain codes or practices.
Those of you that have seats in the upper north end of the stadium....next time you're walking the wide ramp to the upper deck, look at those huge, concrete cantilever beams supporting the deck seating. Take notice to the black, 2" diameter steel tendons (rods) placed parallel to the overhang and connected to very large end plates on either end of the cantilever. This was a post-tension repair because the concrete cantilever beams had numerous stress crackling. I don't remember whether the stress cracking was found after the initial season of the stadium use or after the construction was completed. Couldn't find the engineering article. Maybe some on here could shed addition info to the subject.
Enjoy
Bleacher Design
USFEngineer (Structural)
(OP)
13 May 09 12:04
I am currently working on a project for a local university. The project includes the design of an aluminum bleacher/grandstands. My question is for those who have designed bleachers, what typically is the design dead load?
Other than the main beams and stringers (structural steel) all other components are aluminum. Are there any guidelines? I did not find anything in ASCE, IBC or ICC 300.
The bleacher manufacturer has used 100 psf as a reference for dead load in the past. That seems rather high!
Any info would be appreciated.
Replies continue below
Recommended for you
RE: Bleacher Design
jrisebo (Structural)13 May 09 13:09
The dead load is what it is. The live load I would use is 100, people jam pack bleachers sometimes, and standing, sitting, they are tight.
RE: Bleacher Design
USFEngineer (Structural)
(OP)
13 May 09 13:14
That's what I figured. It is what it is! Just didn't know if there was a standard of sorts.
Thanks
RE: Bleacher Design
JAE (Structural)13 May 09 13:58
Per ASCE 7 - bleacher live load = 100 psf
I once interviewed with a bleacher manufacturer for a position. They had no engineers on staff and wanted to get an engineer in to do full blown analyses, finite elements, etc. to fine tune their bleacher designs.
I asked the guy how they came up with the design they currently used and he stated that they built prototypes, loaded them up with sand bags until the bleacher collapsed, then added up the weight to see how well it did.
I didn't take the job and always after that felt a little uneasy sitting on high school bleachers.
RE: Bleacher Design
5
boo1 (Mechanical)13 May 09 17:51
Design Loads.
1. Live load: 100 psf gross horizontal projection.
2. Lateral sway load: 24 plf seat planks.
3. Perpendicular sway load: 10 plf seat planks.
4. Live load, seat and tread planks: 120 plf.
5. Guard Rail load:
a. Vertical load: 100 plf.
b. Horizontal load: 50 plf.
c. Point load: 200 pounds.
6. Wind load: Per local building code (if outside)
For capacity use 18" per person
International Building Code (IBC) of the International Code Council (ICC) lists requirements for
Guardrails:
Guardrails are required on open sides which are more than 30 inches above the floor or grade below. Guards must be at least 42 inches high, measured vertically above the leading edge of the tread, adjacent walking surface, or adjacent seatboard.
Open guards shall have balusters or ornamental patterns such that a 4-inch diameter sphere cannot pass through any opening up to a height of 34 inches. From a height of 34 inches to 42 inches above the adjacent walking surfaces, a
sphere of 8 inches in diameter shall not pass.
Openings:
Where footboards are more than 30 inches above grade, openings between the seat and footboards shall not allow the passage of a sphere greater than 4 inches.
When projected on a horizontal plane, horizontal gaps shall not exceed 0.25 inch between footboards and seatboards. At aisles, horizontal gaps shall not exceed 0.25 inch between footboards.
RE: Bleacher Design
JAE (Structural)13 May 09 19:14
boo1...nice.
RE: Bleacher Design
USFEngineer (Structural)
(OP)
14 May 09 00:41
Thanks...
It's actually pretty scary. The company that I am checking these bleachers out for pretty much told me that all of there bleachers in the past are built from "industry standard". All of the main beams, stringers, columns, braces and even footings are just copied and pasted into each project without any review. I hope whomever set the "industry standard" was conservative with his designs?
Just until recentlly I have reviewed a few of there more "complicated" projects.
I was familiar with the live loads and horizontal loads per ASCE and ICC 300. The contractor asked me if there was a "typical" dead load for bleachers. But thanks for the replies.
RE: Bleacher Design
MiketheEngineer (Structural)14 May 09 11:35
Boo1 is quite correct.
However - if this going to Europe - I would double the numbers.
Those soccer(football) fans are just plain nuts....
RE: Bleacher Design
boo1 (Mechanical)15 May 09 16:27
Would Finite Element Analysis (FEA) Techniques can be apropriate to model the modes of vibration or natural frequencies of structure? Is ADA access required?
RE: Bleacher Design
USFEngineer (Structural)
(OP)
2 Jun 09 10:31
Thanks for the replies.
One other question. The wind load design. What category if any would this fit under in ASCE 7? It is not an Open building or a Solid Freestanding Wall or Solid Sign? The only other category is other structures. However, when calculating the value of Cf it does not fit into any of the figures 6-12 thru 6-23. Any insight?
RE: Bleacher Design
youngstructural (Structural)2 Jun 09 15:08
I have been involved in the design of two major grandstands here in New Zealand, as well as several smaller stands such as the one you are currently building. These are absolute monsters; They are prone to fatigue (specific checks must be undertaken), prone to horrendous vibration problems (again, specific checks required), prone to collapse (very common in the smaller stands), and prone to exposure problems. They're one of the few structures I can think of that you can actually have full loads on one side, with everyone jumping up and down, and an empty stand on the other side.
Regarding wind design most codes would deem this to be a special or unique structure requiring advanced computer modeling or scale model wind tunnels. Obviously that's not going to work for your small project, so I would just advise being as caution and conservative as possible. The local joint standard (AS/NZS 1170) actually does a pretty good job with grandstands... Might be worth getting a copy for your project. It is an excellent code with a detailed commentary.
I cannot recall off the top of my head whether it deals specifically with grandstand wind loading, however I know that it does the cantilevering roofs above in Wind.
If you can't get anyone to assist with your own code, I'd be happy to dig up some notes and post something for you.
Cheers,
YS
B.Eng (Carleton)
Working in New Zealand, thinking of my snow covered home...
RE: Bleacher Design
USFEngineer (Structural)
(OP)
2 Jun 09 15:21
YS,
Thanks for the info. I have found out the hard way that there is more than meets the eye when it comes to bleacher/grandstand design. Only after becoming partially involved in the the design did I realize the complexity of the design. I am curently working on a submittal to be reviewed by another structural firm so I want to make absolutely sure all the bases are covered.
Any information that you can provided would be appreciated.
RE: Bleacher Design
SteveGregory (Structural)3 Jun 09 09:38
RE: Wind Loads
I investigated some aluminum grandstands (12 rows of seats??) for a high school soccer field that flipped over. The contractor did not want to anchor the stands down to a concrete pad foundation. He was given the option of using helical screw anchors similar to the ones used for mobile homes.
We found a box with the helical section of the anchor rods sawed off. I guess they had a hard time "driving" the rods in with those funny plates welded to them. It wasn't funny seeing the stands upside down in the middle of the field.
For wind loading, consider them to be like a lightweight sail.
RE: Bleacher Design
steve1 (Structural)3 Jun 09 11:21
Many years ago I worked for a firm that designed and manufactured bleacher systems. There are many unique problems associated with this type of structure. If you're not familiar with their design parameters then perhaps you are working outside of your area of expertise.
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I live in DC/NOVA and alumni here have been excited about going to the game since it was scheduled. I expect a large contingent of PSU there.
I'm planning on being there. First meeting ever so it'll be a big deal. Going to be a tough ticket. Only 66,000 seat stadium. Hope it's a night game, blackout, and whatever other special thing they do for big games. Will definitely be a lot of fun. Same with the games at WVU and Auburn. F Pitt
WOW! the price of tickets in the north end zone underneath the overhang just plummeted for the Michigan gameAs an engineer, the terms "electric" & "stadiums" always gained my interest. I had seats in the upper south end of the stadium for 10 years. The seating was located in rows AA & BB, at the very tip of the overhanging cantilever of the decks. During the 2008 Ohio game, the stadium rocked (literally) and we were bouncing up and down similar to being on the end of a diving board. Knowing the vibrations and movements of structures due to live impact loads, even I became a bit unsettled. Great time though at that game.
After the season, a few of my grandchildren, wife and D-I-law were visiting LJ, Sr. in State College. During lunch down town, Larry told the family that after the game PSU had the stadiums undergo a structural inspection. Johnson told the kids that the creaking of the steel stadium could be heard downtown during the game.
Next time you're at a HS soccer, base ball, football, etc. event sitting on bleachers.....food for thought below
Below is an excerpt from web site called "Engineering Tips" which I frequent if I have a problem identifying-understanding certain codes or practices.
Those of you that have seats in the upper north end of the stadium....next time you're walking the wide ramp to the upper deck, look at those huge, concrete cantilever beams supporting the deck seating. Take notice to the black, 2" diameter steel tendons (rods) placed parallel to the overhang and connected to very large end plates on either end of the cantilever. This was a post-tension repair because the concrete cantilever beams had numerous stress crackling. I don't remember whether the stress cracking was found after the initial season of the stadium use or after the construction was completed. Couldn't find the engineering article. Maybe some on here could shed addition info to the subject.
Enjoy
Bleacher Design
USFEngineer (Structural)
(OP)
13 May 09 12:04
I am currently working on a project for a local university. The project includes the design of an aluminum bleacher/grandstands. My question is for those who have designed bleachers, what typically is the design dead load?
Other than the main beams and stringers (structural steel) all other components are aluminum. Are there any guidelines? I did not find anything in ASCE, IBC or ICC 300.
The bleacher manufacturer has used 100 psf as a reference for dead load in the past. That seems rather high!
Any info would be appreciated.
Replies continue below
Recommended for you
RE: Bleacher Design
jrisebo (Structural)13 May 09 13:09
The dead load is what it is. The live load I would use is 100, people jam pack bleachers sometimes, and standing, sitting, they are tight.
RE: Bleacher Design
USFEngineer (Structural)
(OP)
13 May 09 13:14
That's what I figured. It is what it is! Just didn't know if there was a standard of sorts.
Thanks
RE: Bleacher Design
JAE (Structural)13 May 09 13:58
Per ASCE 7 - bleacher live load = 100 psf
I once interviewed with a bleacher manufacturer for a position. They had no engineers on staff and wanted to get an engineer in to do full blown analyses, finite elements, etc. to fine tune their bleacher designs.
I asked the guy how they came up with the design they currently used and he stated that they built prototypes, loaded them up with sand bags until the bleacher collapsed, then added up the weight to see how well it did.
I didn't take the job and always after that felt a little uneasy sitting on high school bleachers.
RE: Bleacher Design
5
boo1 (Mechanical)13 May 09 17:51
Design Loads.
1. Live load: 100 psf gross horizontal projection.
2. Lateral sway load: 24 plf seat planks.
3. Perpendicular sway load: 10 plf seat planks.
4. Live load, seat and tread planks: 120 plf.
5. Guard Rail load:
a. Vertical load: 100 plf.
b. Horizontal load: 50 plf.
c. Point load: 200 pounds.
6. Wind load: Per local building code (if outside)
For capacity use 18" per person
International Building Code (IBC) of the International Code Council (ICC) lists requirements for
Guardrails:
Guardrails are required on open sides which are more than 30 inches above the floor or grade below. Guards must be at least 42 inches high, measured vertically above the leading edge of the tread, adjacent walking surface, or adjacent seatboard.
Open guards shall have balusters or ornamental patterns such that a 4-inch diameter sphere cannot pass through any opening up to a height of 34 inches. From a height of 34 inches to 42 inches above the adjacent walking surfaces, a
sphere of 8 inches in diameter shall not pass.
Openings:
Where footboards are more than 30 inches above grade, openings between the seat and footboards shall not allow the passage of a sphere greater than 4 inches.
When projected on a horizontal plane, horizontal gaps shall not exceed 0.25 inch between footboards and seatboards. At aisles, horizontal gaps shall not exceed 0.25 inch between footboards.
RE: Bleacher Design
JAE (Structural)13 May 09 19:14
boo1...nice.
RE: Bleacher Design
USFEngineer (Structural)
(OP)
14 May 09 00:41
Thanks...
It's actually pretty scary. The company that I am checking these bleachers out for pretty much told me that all of there bleachers in the past are built from "industry standard". All of the main beams, stringers, columns, braces and even footings are just copied and pasted into each project without any review. I hope whomever set the "industry standard" was conservative with his designs?
Just until recentlly I have reviewed a few of there more "complicated" projects.
I was familiar with the live loads and horizontal loads per ASCE and ICC 300. The contractor asked me if there was a "typical" dead load for bleachers. But thanks for the replies.
RE: Bleacher Design
MiketheEngineer (Structural)14 May 09 11:35
Boo1 is quite correct.
However - if this going to Europe - I would double the numbers.
Those soccer(football) fans are just plain nuts....
RE: Bleacher Design
boo1 (Mechanical)15 May 09 16:27
Would Finite Element Analysis (FEA) Techniques can be apropriate to model the modes of vibration or natural frequencies of structure? Is ADA access required?
RE: Bleacher Design
USFEngineer (Structural)
(OP)
2 Jun 09 10:31
Thanks for the replies.
One other question. The wind load design. What category if any would this fit under in ASCE 7? It is not an Open building or a Solid Freestanding Wall or Solid Sign? The only other category is other structures. However, when calculating the value of Cf it does not fit into any of the figures 6-12 thru 6-23. Any insight?
RE: Bleacher Design
youngstructural (Structural)2 Jun 09 15:08
I have been involved in the design of two major grandstands here in New Zealand, as well as several smaller stands such as the one you are currently building. These are absolute monsters; They are prone to fatigue (specific checks must be undertaken), prone to horrendous vibration problems (again, specific checks required), prone to collapse (very common in the smaller stands), and prone to exposure problems. They're one of the few structures I can think of that you can actually have full loads on one side, with everyone jumping up and down, and an empty stand on the other side.
Regarding wind design most codes would deem this to be a special or unique structure requiring advanced computer modeling or scale model wind tunnels. Obviously that's not going to work for your small project, so I would just advise being as caution and conservative as possible. The local joint standard (AS/NZS 1170) actually does a pretty good job with grandstands... Might be worth getting a copy for your project. It is an excellent code with a detailed commentary.
I cannot recall off the top of my head whether it deals specifically with grandstand wind loading, however I know that it does the cantilevering roofs above in Wind.
If you can't get anyone to assist with your own code, I'd be happy to dig up some notes and post something for you.
Cheers,
YS
B.Eng (Carleton)
Working in New Zealand, thinking of my snow covered home...
RE: Bleacher Design
USFEngineer (Structural)
(OP)
2 Jun 09 15:21
YS,
Thanks for the info. I have found out the hard way that there is more than meets the eye when it comes to bleacher/grandstand design. Only after becoming partially involved in the the design did I realize the complexity of the design. I am curently working on a submittal to be reviewed by another structural firm so I want to make absolutely sure all the bases are covered.
Any information that you can provided would be appreciated.
RE: Bleacher Design
SteveGregory (Structural)3 Jun 09 09:38
RE: Wind Loads
I investigated some aluminum grandstands (12 rows of seats??) for a high school soccer field that flipped over. The contractor did not want to anchor the stands down to a concrete pad foundation. He was given the option of using helical screw anchors similar to the ones used for mobile homes.
We found a box with the helical section of the anchor rods sawed off. I guess they had a hard time "driving" the rods in with those funny plates welded to them. It wasn't funny seeing the stands upside down in the middle of the field.
For wind loading, consider them to be like a lightweight sail.
RE: Bleacher Design
steve1 (Structural)3 Jun 09 11:21
Many years ago I worked for a firm that designed and manufactured bleacher systems. There are many unique problems associated with this type of structure. If you're not familiar with their design parameters then perhaps you are working outside of your area of expertise.
a certain dude has mentioned a Blacksburg visit. I'm really looking forward to Auburn. It will be like a trip from Scranton to State College.
Definitely going to Blacksburg in 2020. Roanoke isn't too far (actually closer to PA on I-81) with lots of hotels.
Drop by Mac and Bob's if you have a chance. My wife graduated from Roanoke College and we stay with close friends there (huge Hokie fans with connections) when we go to VT games.
Will do. Thanks for the tip. The problem with us stopping in Roanoke, however, is that no matter where we're going, it's not far enough on the way there and too close on the way back...if you know what I mean.
Absolutely will be there. My oldest son just graduated last month from PSU, younger son will be senior at VT when we play there in 2020.
So, son no.1 and I will be in our blue and white, son no. 2 maroon and orange, and my wife will go totally neutral, like green.......
As I tell everyone, oldest chose PSU, younger was down to choosing between PSU and VT and chose VT. It was his call, but he has chosen to be my 2nd favorite son....
Sounds like your younger son just gets the concept of a cost/benefit analysis.
I did the UVA game when Zack Mills fumbled the ball on the goal line and the kid from Cumberland Valley took it 99 yards for a TD.The end zone was all Penn Staters that game.This was before they closed it in with bleachers.The Last game I saw in Blacksburg was against East Carolina in a sleet storm.
Absolutely will be there. My oldest son just graduated last month from PSU, younger son will be senior at VT when we play there in 2020.
So, son no.1 and I will be in our blue and white, son no. 2 maroon and orange, and my wife will go totally neutral, like green.......
As I tell everyone, oldest chose PSU, younger was down to choosing between PSU and VT and chose VT. It was his call, but he has chosen to be my 2nd favorite son....
The campuses, towns, and local folks are very similar. The first time I visited with my eldest (who just graduated), I said it was like they took PSU and dropped it into Blacksburg. I bleed blue and white, but VT is a great family "second."
(Oh, and the youngest will be a senior this fall at UGA. Broad Street there is like College Avenue, although the SEC influence is certainly noticeable)
Congrats on the recent grad and one at VaTech, too. What's your take on hotel availability? Just plan on checking out Roanoke? Will the prices be bumped up considerably?Absolutely will be there. My oldest son just graduated last month from PSU, younger son will be senior at VT when we play there in 2020.
So, son no.1 and I will be in our blue and white, son no. 2 maroon and orange, and my wife will go totally neutral, like green.......
As I tell everyone, oldest chose PSU, younger was down to choosing between PSU and VT and chose VT. It was his call, but he has chosen to be my 2nd favorite son....
Thanks!! Also, in big news, son no. 1 started a job last week!
Hotel situation is no better, even less availability, than in State College. In fact, going to Blacksburg this October when VT plays Rhode Island, and there is no local availability or prices are beyond ridiculous. So have booked near Roanoke, about 40 min drive. Though for PSU(sold out stadium) that may even get tight, Radford area is another option. BTW, avoid at all costs the Days Inn in Blacksburg it is a dump. Stayed there once his frosh year, and still get the yapping from my wife about it.....
Separate, but related note. The hotel situation in BBurg will be worse this year. As they over admitted students this year, and are turning the on campus Hokie Inn and a local Holiday Inn into student housing. Not just PSU that f's things up.....
Another option is to head west to Wytheville and then up 77. Or...keep going west on I-81 to Bristol and/or Johnson City, Tennessee. Probably the wrong way for most, but Johnson City! OK, so it's not quite Morehead City (on the NC coast), but they do have an IHOP. And Wagon Wheel.
Yikes, man. Johnson City,TN is 160 miles from Lane Stadium in Blacksburg.
I think Roanoke is the preferred alternative to Blacksburg itself
