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Forgive my memory lapses, but has anybody ever gotten McQueary (Sr. or Jr.) or Dranov under oath, heard that testimony and simply followed up asking "so based on what you just said, you at no time decided to contact the police...WHY again?"

I mean there can only be three possible answers:
1) "I just lied up here on the stand."
2) "I didn't think we needed to contact the police because we were all cowards."
3) "Well, Joe Paterno was the most powerful man in the state so..."

Not really - if I'm Schultz and MM comes in and gives the same story that he gave Dr. Dranov, I'd probably follow-up with.....So Mike, you heard all these noises after you walked in that you strongly believed were sexual in nature, but you didn't actually see Sandusky physically having sex in the shower with this boy? That's what you are saying correct? (Presumably Mike would respond the same way he did in court under oath.....no, I didn't actually see sex.....I didn't see anything below either parties waist.....etc.....BUT I am certain they were having sex because that is what I heard from the time I walked in the building, etc...). Then what happens if Schultz's next question is just like Dranov's - "Mike, what if the noises you heard were coming from some other form of horseplay in the shower? Can you say with certainty that is not possible because you actually saw what was going on and what was going on in the shower was sexual assault?". (Presumably, MM would answer this consistent with what he said under oath in a court of law.....no, I cannot say with certainty that I know what was going on in the shower, nor can I say that I actually witnessed sexual assault.....).

That would be pretty much meeting over right there - MM would have admitted that the only thing he saw was suspicious behavior at a weird time of night and that anything he said about sexual assault was complete uncorroborated speculation on his part as to what was going on in the shower and that based on his "eyewitness" testimony, the best you could qualify is some form of loud horseplay was taking place in the shower. Why would Schultz send people to further document his testimony any further than that? It is quite clear he is saying that he did not physically "eyewitness" sexual assault and that it is pure speculation on MM's part based on a guess relative to noises he heard as to what was going on before he actually looked into the area himself. Neither Dr. Dranov or Schultz called police detectives into the equation for the exact same reason....because MM's "speculations" and "guesses" are completely worthless once he says that his suspicions were not confirmed by what he actually eyewitnessed (e.g., to the point where he says the diametric opposite when asked if he saw sexual contact of any kind - stating that he SAW no sexual contact of any kind makes his statement dead on arrival which is precisely what happened in court).
 
His actions don't line up to what EVERY other person in this world would have done had they believed a boy was being sexually abused. He would have gone into the shower for absolute proof, break it up, take the boy, and call the police right then and there. No way does someone walk away and what...bang a locker door if iirc. Just impossible to believe. MM is a large person and at 25 years old was in the absolute prime of his life. It's not in the human nature to walk away in that situation...just not.

Total mis-characterization of what MM said he did.... MM in fact said he DID WALK DIRECTLY OVER TO THE SHOWER AREA after momentarily glimpsing Sandusky and a boy in the shower. MM testified that he looked directly into the shower area after walking over and both the boy and Sandusky had left the shower and were drying off to get changed. And it was ONLY THEN that MM left. MM's story in this regard is perfectly consistent with what he told Dr. Dranov and undoubtedly told the others - namely: I heard noises that were consistent with people having sex in shower.....then when I got to my locker, I saw a quick reflection in mirror and realized it was Sandusky and a boy in the shower.....I was horrified because of what I was thinking was going on based on the noises so I went directly over to the shower and looked in.....to my surprise, nothing was going on as both Sandusky and the child were no longer showering - they were drying off to get changed and leave. How is that "impossible to believe"? Could he have been convinced people were having sex in the shower based on what he heard? Yes. Could his concerns have proven unconfirmed by what he actually saw? Yes. Him leaving at that point also makes much more sense once he looked in and what he "thought" was going on wasn't.
 
"Very good, Mike. You're telling us almost word for word what the other witnesses are telling us. This guy follows a pattern. By no means are you alone, you must be the eighth or ninth witness that has told us this exact same thing. Begin recording." Those police???
Oh man, I laughed out loud in public. That was awesome.
Yep...MM said that there was no distress and he hear no cries for help or what not.

Also I agree, it would be physically impossible for intercourse to be happening since MM testified that both were standing upright with their feet on the ground and the kid was about chest height compared to JS. Bizarrely when the prosecution was trying to recreate the shower scene they had to prop up the mannequin on a chair (which obviously doesn't match MM's testimony).....apparently the judge so no issue with this.
Glad you mentioned the mannequins. That's one of the weirdest wrinkles about the trial that nobody mentions.

Also, does anyone have a link about McQueary's surprise by the wording in the Grand Jury Presentment and how he emailed the OAG to say that's not what he described?
 
Oh man, I laughed out loud in public. That was awesome.

Glad you mentioned the mannequins. That's one of the weirdest wrinkles about the trial that nobody mentions.

Also, does anyone have a link about McQueary's surprise by the wording in the Grand Jury Presentment and how he emailed the OAG to say that's not what he described?

I've wondered from time to time if MM might flip on the prosecution as it relates to CSS.
 
Oh man, I laughed out loud in public. That was awesome.

Glad you mentioned the mannequins. That's one of the weirdest wrinkles about the trial that nobody mentions.

Also, does anyone have a link about McQueary's surprise by the wording in the Grand Jury Presentment and how he emailed the OAG to say that's not what he described?
"A previously undisclosed email sent by McQueary to authorities demonstrates he had thought the prosecutors' description in the presentment of what he had seen -- and what he reported to Paterno -- was not accurate."
http://espn.go.com/college-football...tant-said-was-sexual-abuse-victim-sources-say
 
Total mis-characterization of what MM said he did.... MM in fact said he DID WALK DIRECTLY OVER TO THE SHOWER AREA after momentarily glimpsing Sandusky and a boy in the shower. MM testified that he looked directly into the shower area after walking over and both the boy and Sandusky had left the shower and were drying off to get changed. And it was ONLY THEN that MM left. MM's story in this regard is perfectly consistent with what he told Dr. Dranov and undoubtedly told the others - namely: I heard noises that were consistent with people having sex in shower.....then when I got to my locker, I saw a quick reflection in mirror and realized it was Sandusky and a boy in the shower.....I was horrified because of what I was thinking was going on based on the noises so I went directly over to the shower and looked in.....to my surprise, nothing was going on as both Sandusky and the child were no longer showering - they were drying off to get changed and leave. How is that "impossible to believe"? Could he have been convinced people were having sex in the shower based on what he heard? Yes. Could his concerns have proven unconfirmed by what he actually saw? Yes. Him leaving at that point also makes much more sense once he looked in and what he "thought" was going on wasn't.
The story I heard is what I typed however what you typed is even worse. He waited until the sounds stopped and they were already drying off? Wonder how much time between hearing the sounds, deciding it was sex, and walking in to check took? No, this didn't happen. MM is an effing liar. Again, if he believed that child abuse was taking place he would have taken the boy and called the police. EVERY other person, hell I'll even include the dredge of society, would have taken the boy away. Didn't happen the way MM described.
 
Given how weird the explanation was that he gave about being that locker room that night, I've always wondered if he really went there alone. He obviously didn't go there to put sneakers into his locker. That's just plain stupid.
Maybe he went with Joe Paterno.
 
It is my assumption that MM had used that shower previously with a woman. Thus the reason why he assumed before he even saw anyone, sex was going on in the shower. His prior experience or maybe knowing someone else who used the showers for that purpose I believe tainted Mikes perception of what he believed was happening in there.

Theres no doubt in my mind that this is so. (not necessarily that he used it for that, but that this was his thinking. When he heard slapping sounds and maybe some voices, one higher pitched, he absolutely expected to peek in & catch a player & coed. This really is the only explanation for his immediate reaction to slam the locker door & leave. At the time, it just didn't compute.
 
What it really boils down to is this....the only thing MM knew for sure (which is the brass tacks that anyone who he was relating his story to would want to know--see Dr. D's questioning) was that JS was taking an inappropriate late night shower with a kid that made him uncomfortable (which is exactly what Joe/CSS/JR/JM/Dr D all testified to being told). If he strongly believed a child was getting abused based on the sounds he heard and positioning he saw he certainly could have filed a written statement with UPPD so they could then find JS/go to TSM and find out exactly who JS was with that night and what the heck they were doing. MM would also be aware that JS was a foster parent and also was heavily involved with TSM so maybe that skewed his skepticism a bit. If it was any other person besides JS pillar of the community that was always around his foster/TSM kids maybe MM would have taken the step of filing a written statement.

Apparently MM never felt strongly enough about his belief (b/c he didn't eye witness ANYTHING criminal) so he never even took that first basic step of submitting a written statement or asking Schultz to send someone from UPPD so MM could file an official police report.

9 years later along comes unethical scumbag fina who convinces MM (perhaps with a little blackmail re: his betting habits/dick pics to coeds) that what he saw that night was criminal and he needs to make a written statement to that effect so they could get JS off the streets, etc...the 2 alarm fire MM reported to everyone in 2001 then becomes a 5 alarm fire and it goes from there
 
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The story I heard is what I typed however what you typed is even worse. He waited until the sounds stopped and they were already drying off? Wonder how much time between hearing the sounds, deciding it was sex, and walking in to check took? No, this didn't happen. MM is an effing liar. Again, if he believed that child abuse was taking place he would have taken the boy and called the police. EVERY other person, hell I'll even include the dredge of society, would have taken the boy away. Didn't happen the way MM described.

Huh??? You're latest post above demonstrates that you are nothing but a flaming troll. MM testified that he heard the sounds the moment he walked into the facility and recognized that they were coming from the shower area......he also testified that he had no idea WHO WAS IN THE SHOWER. Now you have him knowing that it was Sandusky in the shower with a child from the moment he walked into the building and that it was "child rape" taking place in there. You are getting more absurd with every post you make which kind of puts into perspective your first sentence..... Don't you mean that it doesn't fit the story that you decided to make up goofus? BTW, MM's testimony is that the brief glimpse of the reflection in a mirror was the first time he realized it was Sandusky in the shower with what he believed to be a child - he testified that he walked directly over to the shower after momentarily seeing the reflection in the mirror. So the answer to your question is that he went over to the shower immediately when he realized it was Sandusky and a child.....and upon going over, there was nothing going on other than the parties drying off.
 
Given how weird the explanation was that he gave about being that locker room that night, I've always wondered if he really went there alone. He obviously didn't go there to put sneakers into his locker. That's just plain stupid.

No doubt, maybe his girlfriend was with him and they were going to use the facilities - sauna, whirlpool, etc.... Who knows, but I also tend to doubt that he got fired up to watch some film after seeing Rudy in early February and needed to drop some new sneakers off.....doubt it.
 
Huh??? You're latest post above demonstrates that you are nothing but a flaming troll. MM testified that he heard the sounds the moment he walked into the facility and recognized that they were coming from the shower area......he also testified that he had no idea WHO WAS IN THE SHOWER. Now you have him knowing that it was Sandusky in the shower with a child from the moment he walked into the building and that it was "child rape" taking place in there. You are getting more absurd with every post you make which kind of puts into perspective your first sentence..... Don't you mean that it doesn't fit the story that you decided to make up goofus? BTW, MM's testimony is that the brief glimpse of the reflection in a mirror was the first time he realized it was Sandusky in the shower with what he believed to be a child - he testified that he walked directly over to the shower after momentarily seeing the reflection in the mirror. So the answer to your question is that he went over to the shower immediately when he realized it was Sandusky and a child.....and upon going over, there was nothing going on other than the parties drying off.
Dude, chill out. According to MM he looked into the freaking mirror and saw who was there. Maybe brief, but he saw non-the-less. Any other person on earth would have proceeded to walk in right then, and not walk away and to only go back later. It doesn't make any sense, non. The only thing that does make sense to me is that MM heard sounds, and later saw Sandusky and boy leaving. He then put it together in his head that they were having sex. That however leaves everyone asking why he didn't do more. This is my theory and you don't have to like this theory but stop with your attacking nonsense. Why is this hard for you to understand?
 
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Dude, chill out. According to MM he looked into the freaking mirror and saw who was there. Maybe brief, but he saw non-the-less. Any other person on earth would have proceeded to walk in right then, and not walk away and to only go back later. Why is this hard for you to understand?

You're the one with a comprehension problem moron - MM has testified HE DID WALK DIRECTLY OVER TO THE SHOWER AREA after briefly glimpsing a reflection in the mirror which demonstrated that it was Sandusky in the shower with what he believed to be a child (Sandusky was partially obstructing his view of the other party). Why is this so hard for you to understand? Actually, I know what it is hard for you to understand MM's actual testimony....because it doesn't fit your narrative, which is false and contrary to MM's testimony, because you are a troll and making bull$hit up as you go along.
 
You're the one with a comprehension problem moron - MM has testified HE DID WALK DIRECTLY OVER TO THE SHOWER AREA after briefly glimpsing a reflection in the mirror which demonstrated that it was Sandusky in the shower with what he believed to be a child (Sandusky was partially obstructing his view of the other party). Why is this so hard for you to understand? Actually, I know what it is hard for you to understand MM's actual testimony....because it doesn't fit your narrative, which is false and contrary to MM's testimony, because you are a troll and making bull$hit up as you go along.
Nice response. You should try and lay off the bottle.
 
Yes, I very much agree with this viewpoint - essentially, IMHO, the prosecutor's asked MM leading questions and to SPECULATE based on his "experience" of the entire event -- NOT SOLELY on what he could testify to based ONLY on what he actually saw! The prosecution knows that the only thing which is permissible evidence in a Court of Law is what MM ACTUALLY SAW and that SPECULATION based on what he heard prior to what he saw is INADMISSIBLE! The defense destroyed this charge by prosecutors with one simple question to MM in the courtroom just as you say - Did you SEE and can you testify that you absolutely SAW sexual contact....?.... to which MM absolutely answered - No, I did not see that. I think that is what was going on, but I cannot say that I de facto saw it. I in fact did not see it - in fact, I never saw below the waist of either party....etc....

IOW, prosecutors routinely asked MM to SPECULATE on what he specifically eyewitnessed via what he was thinking prior to whatever he actually eyewitnessed due to what he had HEARD UPON ENTERING THE FACILITY and continued to hear until shortly before he EYEWITNESSED what he eyewitnessed via a momentary glance in a mirror and then directly looking into the shower area after walking over from his locker. They destroyed their own case and then laughably, and repeatedly, claimed that this was MM "testifying" that he SAW "anal rape", "sodomy" and all the other words the OAG used in the "Presentment Statement of Fact" which they knew all along was complete bull$hit as "speculating" based on what you had HEARD is not admissible evidence in a Court of Law and the OAG damn well knew this!

MM told Dr. Dranov (and his father), immediately following the incident, that he was convinced that people were having sex in the shower from the moment he walked into the facility DUE TO WHAT HE HEARD, NOT WHAT HE SAW. MM had already made up his mind that people were having sex in the shower BEFORE HE SAW ANYTHING - the only thing he didn't know when he went to his locker is who was in the shower. This explains MM's shock-&-horror when he learned who was in the shower via a momentary glimpse in the mirror and then a direct look into the shower area after he walked directly over to see what was going on DESPITE NOT SEEING ANYTHING that he could attest was sexual contact between the parties! (again, he had already decided that this was what was taking place based on what he HEARD, not what he saw). Dr. Dranov told MM multimple times the very night of the incident that police needed to be called, and he needed to make a report, if he saw and EYEWITNESSED a sexual assault, but MM kept telling him not to call police because he only thought that is what was going on based on what he heard, but had not actually eyewitnessed such a thing which is PRECISELY why Dr. Dranov and MM's Father did not call the police - e.g., MM could not make a statement and the accusation that this is what he SAW which is what is required to make the CRIMINAL CHARGE STICK!

Again, the OAG understood this, but went right on polluting the waters by not distinguishing descriptions MM told others based on what he HEARD (SPECULATION and not admissible in a COURT OF LAW) versus what he ACTUALLY SAW and was willing to testify to seeing (otherwise known as giving "eyewitness testimony") which is the only thing that is admissible in a Court of Law. They polluted the waters in regards to their questioning of Dr. Dranov, JM, JP, TC and GS -- when talking to all of these people, it is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT as to what MM "speculated" about based on what he "heard"; the ONLY THING that matters is what MM told these parties as to what he specifically SAW and COULD, AND WOULD, TESTIFY TO HAVING SEEN (again, what is known as "eyewitnessing"). And the RECORD is quite clear on this topic, including what MM actually testified to in a COURT OF LAW -- MM has consistently stated that he did not WITNESS, NOR COULD HE TESTIFY TO SEEING, "anal rape"....."sodomy"......"intercourse"......or "sexual contact" of any kind -- MM also testified that he NEVER TOLD ANYONE he had....this despite the prosecution claiming that MM had told them that he had which is why the wrote the Presentment the way they did. IOW, just as you say, MM's ADMISSIBLE testimony (e.g., testimony as to what he SAW, not what he "heard" or what he "thought based on what he heard and saw", etc....) only points to one party in this entire affair INTENTIONALLY and REPEATED LYING and that would be the OAG, not technically MM or his family (e.g., they only "speculated" that something of a "sexual nature" was taking place, but they were being asked to discuss their INADMISSIBLE "speculations" by the prosecution rather than the prosecution sticking to a discussion of what MM told ANYBODY what he actually SAW and EYEWITNESSED, because according to none other than MM in a Court of Law, the prosecution is BOLD-FACED LYING when they say that MM told them he "saw"...."eyewitnessed".....etc...Sandusky sodomizing a boy in the shower [which they repeatedly claim in their Presentment and Indictments] -- MM flatly stated in a Court of Law that not only had never SEEN any such thing, but that he NEVER TOLD ANYONE that he had [e.g., a clear indictment of the OAG's claim to the contrary that MM had told them that he did "eyewitness" such a thing!]).
Hemingway is your idol, right?
 
Wow, that's really clever troll-boy - you should lay of off changing the facts to suit your needs especially when you don't know what the phuck you're talking about tool.
I'll try one more time for your simple mind so try and keep up. This is my theory; MM heard noises and thought it was possibly sex taking place. He waited around to see who would come out of the locker. When he saw Sandusky and a boy he was probably quite surprised. Upon telling the story to his dad and the Dr. they told him there wasn't enough of anything to get the police involved and that he should talk it over with Joe. He probably told Joe he was weird out (using different words for Joe) and hence Joe didn't see any emergency that weekend. Over many tellings of the story it somehow got embellished over the many years into something far different.

This is the only story that makes any sense to me. I believe Sandusky is guilty, but I don't believe MM saw anything of significance from a legal standpoint that night.

Now, read this response twice before jumping to your ignorant conclusions. And, for the love of God put the bottle down.
 
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I'll try one more time for your simple mind so try and keep up. This is my theory; MM heard noises and thought it was possibly sex taking place. He waited around to see who would come out of the locker. When he saw Sandusky and a boy he was probably quite surprised. Upon telling the story to his dad and the Dr. they told him there wasn't enough of anything to get the police involved and that he should talk it over with Joe. He probably told Joe he was weird out (using different words for Joe) and hence Joe didn't see any emergency that weekend. Over many tellings of the story it somehow got embellished over the many years into something far different.

This is the only story that makes any sense to me. I believe Sandusky is guilty, but I don't believe MM saw anything of significance from a legal standpoint that night.

Now, read this response twice before jumping to your ignorant conclusions. And, for the love of God put the bottle down.

I'm afraid you're the one who needs to put the crack pipe down nimrod -- you've changed your rendition of supposed events for like the 5th time in 5 responses. BTW, lame-brain MM has NEVER said that he eyewitnessed Sandusky and the boy having any kind of sexual contact - the DIAMETRIC OPPOSITE IN FACT UNDER OATH AND IN A COURT OF LAW! IOW genius, it isn't "your theory" -- it's precisely what MM testified to in a court of law under oath!
 
I do not know if you are being serious or not but that is a very interesting thought.
Oh, for chrissakes. He heard slapping sounds which he projected to every man and woman who have had doggy style sex. Tired of the bullshit. That sound could have been other things. Towel slapping, hand slapping wall. He heard, then went through the doors. His testimony is, to me, worthless. He did not see anything and he only heard sounds that he immediately assumed was doggy sex. The position of the two, in his mind (10 years later) did not confirm that, just, well, looked like it.But hold on. Do the physical size calculation. Did not happen. Sound not sight. Bull shit.
 
Oh, for chrissakes. He heard slapping sounds which he projected to every man and woman who have had doggy style sex. Tired of the bullshit. That sound could have been other things. Towel slapping, hand slapping wall. He heard, then went through the doors. His testimony is, to me, worthless. He did not see anything and he only heard sounds that he immediately assumed was doggy sex. The position of the two, in his mind, confirmed that. But hold on. Do the physical size calculation. Did not happen. Sound not sight. Bull shit.

Exactamundo! As soon as MM told Dr. Dranov, Schultz or the Court that what he was willing to testify that he saw (or didn't see as the case may be) was actually "exculpatory evidence" that demonstrates his belief that sex was occurring in the shower was complete conjecture on his part not what he actually "SAW".....his testimony is worthless. Worse than worthless actually as it supports the defenses' case and directly contradicts the State's claims! Clearly, Dr. Dranov realized this.....Schultz realized this......and ultimately the prosecution failed on this specific count because MM's own testimony PROVED BEYOND ANY QUESTION that what the prosecution listed in the Presentment and that specific count in the indictment was a LIE (MM didn't just say that he didn't see sexual intercourse [sodomy or whatever other term the prosecution wished to use], he said he never even saw anything below either parties' waist AND FINALLY said that he NEVER TOLD ANYONE that he had [which DIRECTLY CONTRADICTS THE PRESENTMENT and INDICTMENT ON THAT COUNT!]).

MM can conjecture and theorize from the here to the moon as to what he "thinks" was going on in the shower before he actually witnessed anything -- it all becomes worthless once he says.....well, I actually did witness them in the shower area both via a quick reflection in the mirror and then when I walked over and looked in, but I cannot say that I saw them having sex....in fact I can't even say that I saw anything below either parties' waist..... Game over once he makes that statement which was precisely the outcome in court - his conjecture was inadmissible and the only admissible testimony he gave SUPPORTED THE DEFENSES CASE AND DIRECTLY CONTRADICTED THE CLAIMS OF THE PROSECUTION IN BOTH THE PRESENTMENT AND INDICTMENT IN REGARDS TO THAT INCIDENT.
 
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Exactamundo! As soon as MM told Dr. Dranov, Schultz or the Court that what he was willing to testify that he saw (or didn't see as the case may be) was actually "exculpatory evidence" that demonstrates his belief that sex was occurring in the shower was complete conjecture on his part not what he actually "SAW".....his testimony is worthless. Worse than worthless actually as it supports the defenses' case and directly contradicts the State's claims! Clearly, Dr. Dranov realized this.....Schultz realized this......and ultimately the prosecution failed on this specific count because MM's own testimony PROVE BEYOND ANY QUESTION that what the prosecution listed in the Presentment and that specific count in the indictment was a LIE (MM didn't just say that he didn't see sexual intercourse (sodomy or whatever other term the prosecution wished to use), he said he never even saw anything below either parties' waist AND FINALLY said that he NEVER TOLD ANYONE that he had (which DIRECTLY CONTRADICTS THE PRESENTMENT and INDICTMENT ON THAT COUNT!). MM can conjecture and theorize from the here to the moon as to what he "thinks" was going on in the shower before he actually witnessed anything -- it all becomes worthless once he says.....well, I actually did witness them in the shower area both via a quick reflection in the mirror and then when I walked over and looked in, but I cannot say that I same them having sex....in fact I can't even say that I saw anything below either parties waist..... Game over once he makes that statement which is precisely the outcome in court - his conjecture was inadmissible and the only admissible testimony he gave SUPPORTED THE DEFENSES CASE AND DIRECTLY CONTRADICTED THE CLAIMS OF THE PROSECUTION IN BOTH THE PRESENTMENT AND INDICTMENT IN REGARDS TO THAT INCIDENT.
The word is verbose.
 
4 years later sane people same arguments mostly based on lack of any new publicaly known facts.

Someday with some luck some of you will learn more... And be open to the truth. Time can only tell.

You seriously need to STFU because you have nothing.

Mike is a putz.
 
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Given how weird the explanation was that he gave about being that locker room that night, I've always wondered if he really went there alone. He obviously didn't go there to put sneakers into his locker. That's just plain stupid.

It was a Friday night. He was in his mid twenties. I've always wondered if he had been drinking. That might explain why his father told him to come home, rather than call and then wait for the police.
 
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Oh, for chrissakes. He heard slapping sounds which he projected to every man and woman who have had doggy style sex. Tired of the bullshit. That sound could have been other things. Towel slapping, hand slapping wall. He heard, then went through the doors. His testimony is, to me, worthless. He did not see anything and he only heard sounds that he immediately assumed was doggy sex. The position of the two, in his mind (10 years later) did not confirm that, just, well, looked like it.But hold on. Do the physical size calculation. Did not happen. Sound not sight. Bull shit.
8 years of HS and College Sports, 15 as a HS FB coach and 23 as an AD. I have been in and out of many locker/ shower rooms. I cannot believe the story that MM heard slapping sounds. The acoustics, running water from the showers and all behind closed doors. That did not happen.
 
Well, the judge was wrong ----- but at least the NCAA's position there was 10000x times more defensible in terms of being relevant than trying to subpoena a man who had no association with Penn State during the November 2011 - May 2013 time period (nobody is addressing this point of fact!).


No one cane be as stupid as you portray yourself to be. Obviously, any Jackass can say Barron was not at PSU in the time period in question..... as you have so vehemently and emotionally done over and over again in this thread.

Hiere is a question for you MichDipShit: Is it unreasonable to conclude that Barron, or others, hired into positions with privilege and access to university archived and historical information during that time period, might have come across such information in the course of their work. This is especially plausible given Barron's decree to the world that he was doing a 'post mortem' of the DWI (documenting while under the influence) Louie Freeh once 'fact' now conveniently 'op ed' report.

So, I have addressed this fact. Once Barron states publicly that he is doing a post mortem on the Freeh Report, it is reasonable to assume that his review would not be done without access to the information necessary to conduct the review. The problem here is that Jackasses can't reason.

You and 66 are two of the biggest tantrum throwing cowards I have ever had the displeasure to read, not just here, but anywhere. Which begs the question.....just why do you both fear due process? What makes you weep on your pillows at night?
 
No one cane be as stupid as you portray yourself to be. Obviously, any Jackass can say Barron was not at PSU in the time period in question..... as you have so vehemently and emotionally done over and over again in this thread.

Hiere is a question for you MichDipShit: Is it unreasonable to conclude that Barron, or others, hired into positions with privilege and access to university archived and historical information during that time period, might have come across such information in the course of their work. This is especially plausible given Barron's decree to the world that he was doing a 'post mortem' of the DWI (documenting while under the influence) Louie Freeh once 'fact' now conveniently 'op ed' report.

So, I have addressed this fact. Once Barron states publicly that he is doing a post mortem on the Freeh Report, it is reasonable to assume that his review would not be done without access to the information necessary to conduct the review. The problem here is that Jackasses can't reason.

You and 66 are two of the biggest tantrum throwing cowards I have ever had the displeasure to read, not just here, but anywhere. Which begs the question.....just why do you both fear due process? What makes you weep on your pillows at night?

That's easy - it's because "sunshine is a disinfectant".
 
Theres no doubt in my mind that this is so. (not necessarily that he used it for that, but that this was his thinking. When he heard slapping sounds and maybe some voices, one higher pitched, he absolutely expected to peek in & catch a player & coed. This really is the only explanation for his immediate reaction to slam the locker door & leave. At the time, it just didn't compute.
 
Oh, for chrissakes. He heard slapping sounds which he projected to every man and woman who have had doggy style sex. Tired of the bullshit. That sound could have been other things. Towel slapping, hand slapping wall. He heard, then went through the doors. His testimony is, to me, worthless. He did not see anything and he only heard sounds that he immediately assumed was doggy sex. The position of the two, in his mind (10 years later) did not confirm that, just, well, looked like it.But hold on. Do the physical size calculation. Did not happen. Sound not sight. Bull shit.
I have always thought that he did see something in that shower, something very wrong. I'm not a fan of using buzzwords like "grooming" or "pushing boundaries", the term "molesting" seems to fit the bill. I believe he saw the kid getting molested.
 
I have always thought that he did see something in that shower, something very wrong. I'm not a fan of using buzzwords like "grooming" or "pushing boundaries", the term "molesting" seems to fit the bill. I believe he saw the kid getting molested.
In two to three seconds?
 
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