Lawyers say Beta members tried to help

[jerseylion109]

http://www.philly.com/philly/education/Lawyers-Frat-members-didnt-know-Piazza-was-in-danger-.html

if this is the way it went down..not as malicious as the media is making it seem

 

[BobPSU92]

"We don't need the truth."

-- president eric barren

 

[MtNittany]

"We don't need the truth."

-- president eric barren

The Penn State effin' way man...

 

[NittPicker]

So Shubin is representing a fraternity member?? It'll be interesting to see where that goes.

 

[PSUArnie]

http://www.philly.com/philly/education/Lawyers-Frat-members-didnt-know-Piazza-was-in-danger-.html

if this is the way it went down..not as malicious as the media is making it seem

Typical media. Hopefully the truth comes out but none of us should be shocked that the media picked a narrative and ran with it....

 

[no1lion99]

http://www.philly.com/philly/education/Lawyers-Frat-members-didnt-know-Piazza-was-in-danger-.html

if this is the way it went down..not as malicious as the media is making it seem

So the defense lawyers say it wasn't a crime? Color me stunned. Willing to bet someone took pics and/or video of what was going on inside the house. Let's see what else comes to light.

 

[lionroar88]

So the defense lawyers say it wasn't a crime? Color me stunned. Willing to bet someone took pics and/or video of what was going on inside the house. Let's see what else comes to light.

Why start waiting for the truth now?

See - this is why people call your ilk 'trolls'. You run around spouting off through your diarrhea fingers trying to act all intelligent and holier-than-thou, all the while exposing your agenda and ignorance. But you'll still claim you are right even after having been proven wrong 1,000 times to Sunday.

 

[bjf1991]

http://www.philly.com/philly/education/Lawyers-Frat-members-didnt-know-Piazza-was-in-danger-.html

if this is the way it went down..not as malicious as the media is making it seem

The fact that Damon Sims already convicted them probably makes everything else moot (When did he get a Badge or a Robe? When was he placed into a position where he had any accountability?)

Now remember all the folks lining up to crucify the student-athletes at Minnesota? Or the Oklahoma running back recruit - and the "inadequate action" by OU's admin?

All those folks? Who reacted with such vitriol when anyone ( ) suggested that empty-suit, untrained, unaccountable, agendized University Administrators - just like Mr Sims - shouldn't be pissing all over Criminal Court matters?


All those folks - if they whisper a peep of discontent wrt Mr Sims and "Beta" - those mental-midget hypocrites can lick my b$lls.

LOL

 

[Pardlion]

http://www.philly.com/philly/education/Lawyers-Frat-members-didnt-know-Piazza-was-in-danger-.html

if this is the way it went down..not as malicious as the media is making it seem

It's obvious that his condition was simply not understood by the other drunk kids. The alternative is that they committed a homicide. Duh, that didn't happen.

 

[jerseylion109]

Will never understand why these administrators can't wait for ALL of the facts to come out before condemning 17% of the student population who contributes a good deal to the university. Last i heard, one of the VPs was going around to the houses on parents weekend and writing up violations

 

[BBrown]

http://www.philly.com/philly/education/Lawyers-Frat-members-didnt-know-Piazza-was-in-danger-.html

if this is the way it went down..not as malicious as the media is making it seem

Wow nice house. I don't remember it. Where is it located?

 

[MtNittany]

Wow nice house. I don't remember it. Where is it located?

Between Rec Hall and the last Fraternity parcel the University took over.

 

[bjf1991]

Will never understand why these administrators can't wait for ALL of the facts to come out before condemning 17% of the student population who contributes a good deal to the university. Last i heard, one of the VPs was going around to the houses on parents weekend and writing up violations

Why?

When shit like this happens elsewhere - many of "us" do what everyone else does.....

Run around like retarded chimps - parroting the media outrage - and screaming about why the Administrators (or Sports Coaches) "aren't doing anything about it?"

THAT is why these dingbats go flapping their dicks out and pissing all over the place, without knowing WTF happened - - - - and certainly before the folks who actually have the training, responsibility, and accountability to handle such matters have investigated.


Only when we see it "up close and personal", do we realize how stupid that is (and sometimes we still don't see it)

 

[mgkpsu]

http://www.philly.com/philly/education/Lawyers-Frat-members-didnt-know-Piazza-was-in-danger-.html

if this is the way it went down..not as malicious as the media is making it seem

You seem to have a real boner over this, so I will try to help you see another perspective: This was all a LONG time coming, and Penn State can't afford the liability any longer over an antiquated social club system. The kid was underage, that house was supposed to be dry day-to-day, and that event (since it was recruitment-related) was especially supposed to be dry. Good for some rich kid whose parents are trying to bail him out for giving the injured party some water, but the new standard is "When in doubt, call the authorities". This kid probably could have lived if he had gotten checked out in a timely fashion, and you seek to minimize that fact based on an incessant need to "Fight the man".

 

[Talpsu]

I still don't understand why State College police are running this investigation. Someone said earlier because its in state college but this was on campus so wouldn't this be the University Park police (aka campus police). I only mention this because of the JS situation of who has jurisdiction. Can anyone clarify this for me. Don't take this as a troll post. Im just trying to understand where the line is drawn on who is responsible for what

 

[njlion73]

No need to worry, Stacy Parks-Miller is on the case.

 

[Fayette_LION]

http://www.philly.com/philly/education/Lawyers-Frat-members-didnt-know-Piazza-was-in-danger-.html

if this is the way it went down..not as malicious as the media is making it seem

Media agenda............you are guilty until proven innocent. Make sure everyone understands that agenda BEFORE any facts are known.

 

[BobPSU92]

You seem to have a real boner over this, so I will try to help you see another perspective: This was all a LONG time coming, and Penn State can't afford the liability any longer over an antiquated social club system. The kid was underage, that house was supposed to be dry day-to-day, and that event (since it was recruitment-related) was especially supposed to be dry. Good for some rich kid whose parents are trying to bail him out for giving the injured party some water, but the new standard is "When in doubt, call the authorities". This kid probably could have lived if he had gotten checked out in a timely fashion, and you seek to minimize that fact based on an incessant need to "Fight the man".

 

[Pardlion]

You seem to have a real boner over this, so I will try to help you see another perspective: This was all a LONG time coming, and Penn State can't afford the liability any longer over an antiquated social club system. The kid was underage, that house was supposed to be dry day-to-day, and that event (since it was recruitment-related) was especially supposed to be dry.

It's not at all clear that PSU can or will have any liability. Granted, they love to give away money like it's someone else's money . . .

 

[mgkpsu]

It's not at all clear that PSU can or will have any liability. Granted, they love to give away money like it's someone else's money . . .

Penn State might be relatively clear here, but Beta, and likely its members, is/are toast. And whether one agrees with the rules PSU subsequently put in place, they appear to be well-crafted to ensure that the liability falls squarely on the individual organizations going forward.

 

[PSU_Nut]

If only there was a trained medical professional who was living in the house and who was home at the time of the party who could have checked him.

 

[Nitt1300]

I think it's obvious that these kids didn't intend any harm- but that doesn't mean that they did the right thing, either. I think they do and should bear some responsibility for this tragedy, but they are not criminals.

But the idea that anybody else (other frats or the university) is somehow responsible? Only a scumsucking lawyer or a lifetime tenured toady would ever reach that conclusion.

I am so done with my alma mater, and that's not something I ever expected to say.

 

[Pardlion]

Penn State might be relatively clear here, but Beta, and likely its members, is/are toast. And whether one agrees with the rules PSU subsequently put in place, they appear to be well-crafted to ensure that the liability falls squarely on the individual organizations going forward.

PSU is always going to be insulated from liability to a large degree, except where it creates rules that can be said to have contributed to the liability. Ironically, the more rules that PSU implements and power that it exerts over fraternities, the more likely it is to be drawn into litigation.

 

[kentuckycb]

You seem to have a real boner over this, so I will try to help you see another perspective: This was all a LONG time coming, and Penn State can't afford the liability any longer over an antiquated social club system. The kid was underage, that house was supposed to be dry day-to-day, and that event (since it was recruitment-related) was especially supposed to be dry. Good for some rich kid whose parents are trying to bail him out for giving the injured party some water, but the new standard is "When in doubt, call the authorities". This kid probably could have lived if he had gotten checked out in a timely fashion, and you seek to minimize that fact based on an incessant need to "Fight the man".

That "new standard" isn't reasonable in practice. Responsibility also falls on the individual who chose to drink dangerous amounts of alcohol.

 

[JmmyW]

So the defense lawyers say it wasn't a crime? Color me stunned. Willing to bet someone took pics and/or video of what was going on inside the house. Let's see what else comes to light.

There was video recovered by police. You must've missed this part of the story linked in the OP:

At one point, Piazza got up and appeared to walk into walls and fell again, the lawyer said, citing information he received from police, who had seen video from the house. Beta Theta Pi had an extensive surveillance system, and police recovered video from that night.​

That surveillance system was in installed back in 2009 at the behest of Don Abbey.

More Information on the Reestablishment of Beta Theta Pi - Onward State, 10/22/2009
http://onwardstate.com/2009/10/22/more-information-on-the-reestablishment-of-beta-theta-pi/

The new Beta Theta Pi will feature an alcohol-free chapter house and a hazing-free pledge education program. While the chapter will still have a healthy social life, the alumni (read: Don Abbey) hope that the focus will be on traditions, values, leadership, and character development. The fraternity will offer a Leadership Program (funded by the Abbey Leadership Program) to supplement the pledge education program and extend real world resources to members through the entire experience.

Having a dry house does not mean that Beta will be a dry fraternity. The brothers will still be allowed to host socials involving alcohol at bars, restaurants, hotels, and through partnerships with other fraternities. There won’t be much opportunity to break the dry rule either. The house now has a security system featuring security cameras covering internal and external common [areas]. The system’s purpose is ostensibly to safeguard the property, its residents, and their guests… but considering the house’s history, it might also be intended to protect the property from its residents.​

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

Wow nice house. I don't remember it. Where is it located?

It's one of the "on-campus" Fraternity houses on North Burrowes below West Halls as you are heading towards Downtown State College on the west side of the street (i.e., to your right as you are walking toward downtown State College)..... Phi Delt is catty-corner to West Halls (which also happens to be the same lot where Figi is located - Figi is on corner of lot) - Beta is a few doors down from Phi Delt as you are walking towards Downtown State College on N. Borrowes.

 

[Talpsu]

It's one of the "on-campus" Fraternity houses on North Burrowes below West Halls as you are heading towards Downtown State College on the west side of the street (i.e., to your right as you are walking toward downtown State College)..... Phi Delt is catty-corner to West Halls (which also happens to be the same lot where Figi is located - Figi is on corner of lot) - Beta is a few doors down from Phi Delt as you are walking towards Downtown State College on N. Borrowes.

So is Burrows not on campus?

 

[mn78psu83]

It's one of the "on-campus" Fraternity houses on North Burrowes below West Halls as you are heading towards Downtown State College on the west side of the street (i.e., to your right as you are walking toward downtown State College)..... Phi Delt is catty-corner to West Halls (which also happens to be the same lot where Figi is located - Figi is on corner of lot) - Beta is a few doors down from Phi Delt as you are walking towards Downtown State College on N. Borrowes.

Phi Delta Theta was demolished in 2010 (now a lovely little parklet).

 

[bjf1991]

It's not at all clear that PSU can or will have any liability. Granted, they love to give away money like it's someone else's money . . .

The Kid's Parents' Attorney is Tom Kline (Lubert's BFF).
Same situation as "V5" in the Sandusky case (the guy who's case lead to an Acquittal in the Sandusky trial, but who got one of the largest paychecks from Lubert/PSU - approx. $10,000,000).

"Its good to be King!!"

PSU will open the vault and pay out whatever they ask for - - - - - -maybe more than they ask for (seriously).


And not ONE of our "Responsible Stewards" (the ONE group that WE have the power to hold accountable) will say a word or bat an eye.........you can make book on that.



How's that vote working out?

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

So is Burrows not on campus?

Burrowes runs both "on-campus" and "off-campus"...."North Burrowes" (Burrowes north of College Ave) is the "on-campus" portion of Burrowes, which is specifically what I stated (I said Beta was one of the "on-campus" Fraternity houses located on N. Burrowes just south of West Halls on the west side of N. Burrowes). IOW, I have no idea what your "clarifying" question is supposed to be asking when I never said or implied that Burrowes does not run "on-campus"....

 

[Pardlion]

The Kid's Parents' Attorney is Tom Kline (Lubert's BFF).
Same situation as "V5" in the Sandusky case (the guy who's case lead to an Acquittal in the Sandusky trial, but who got one of the largest paychecks from Lubert/PSU - approx. $10,000,000).

"Its good to be King!!"

PSU will open the vault and pay out whatever they ask for - - - - - -maybe more than they ask for (seriously).


And not ONE of our "Responsible Stewards" (the ONE group that WE have the power to hold accountable) will say a word or bat an eye.........you can make book on that.



How's that vote working out?

Too bad for PSU that they allowed an administrator to live in the house. That's gonna bite them in the ass.

 

[bjf1991]

PSU is always going to be insulated from liability to a large degree, except where it creates rules that can be said to have contributed to the liability. Ironically, the more rules that PSU implements and power that it exerts over fraternities, the more likely it is to be drawn into litigation.

You mean like having a "summit meeting"?

Setting up a Committee with the stated purpose of enacting steps to curb alcohol abuse.

Where the empty-suited wonders bring all the "interested parties" together ....... and then ignore whatever conclusions/recommendations are brought forward?

Something like that?

.

 

[BBrown]

The Kid's Parents' Attorney is Tom Kline (Lubert's BFF).
Same situation as "V5" in the Sandusky case (the guy who's case lead to an Acquittal in the Sandusky trial, but who got one of the largest paychecks from Lubert/PSU - approx. $10,000,000).

"Its good to be King!!"

PSU will open the vault and pay out whatever they ask for - - - - - -maybe more than they ask for (seriously).


And not ONE of our "Responsible Stewards" (the ONE group that WE have the power to hold accountable) will say a word or bat an eye.........you can make book on that.



How's that vote working out?

Just mention Joe's name and insinuate he must have known and the pay day will be HUGE.

 

[Nitt1300]

Too bad for PSU that they allowed an administrator to live in the house. That's gonna bite them in the ass.

only if he was there

 

[Pardlion]

You mean like having a "summit meeting"?

Setting up a Committee with the stated purpose of enacting steps to curb alcohol abuse.

Where the empty-suited wonders bring all the "interested parties" together ....... and then ignore whatever conclusions/recommendations are brought forward?

Something like that?

.

Yup. And having a whole cadre of administrators specifically designated to design and enforce "da RULZ."

I mean, how about one rule that says: "We expect you to comply with the law."

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

Too bad for PSU that they allowed an administrator to live in the house. That's gonna bite them in the ass.

PSU is now responsible for where their Administrators choose to "live"....as in they are legally responsible for "allowing them to live" there??? Huh??? WTF??? The Pennsylvania Nazi trolls and fans of State prosecutorial tyranny relative to anything PSU-related are showing their true colors yet again, go figure!!! What in the phuck does, "PSU....allowed an administrator to live in the house." even f'ing mean as a supposed legal argument in this case??? Unreal.

 

[NittPicker]

Phi Delta Theta was demolished in 2010 (now a lovely little parklet).

When that frat was demolished there were some legalities which needed to be worked out. The problems dated back to the construction of the house and had to do with the lease agreement between the university and the frat. I can't recall the details but I believe it dealt with the university still owning the property and whether or not it was a lease in perpetuity as long as the house was occupied. Once it became vacant the university wanted it back. I'm sure someone here knows the full story.

The resolution of that situation could very well be a preview of what happens to the frat involved in the current situation. IIRC, the chapter pumped a lot of money into fairly recent renovations. While it would be a shame to get rid of a perfect good house, I'm sure the university would love to regain control of that prime piece of land and use it for something else. Dambly and Lubert probably already have a plan to personally make some money from it. If the Piazza lawsuit ultimately finds some liability on the part of the national chapter, they could very well forfeit any claims to the house to satisfy the judgement. Control of the land would revert solely to the university and it's anyone's guess what would happen after that. However that scenario is well into the future.

If I was a member of one of the three other on campus fraternities I'd be very careful about doing anything wrong in the house. Barron seems to be anti-Greek and while the off campus houses are a bit out-of-sight and out-of-mind, the on campus houses will be under a microscope. The university would love to regain control of those properties too.

 

[Pardlion]

What in the phuck does, "PSU....allowed an administrator to live in the house." even f'ing mean as a supposed legal argument in this case??? Unreal.

You'll have to ask Tom Kline about that, but I'll bet the short version of his answer is: "everything".

 

[no1lion99]

The Kid's Parents' Attorney is Tom Kline (Lubert's BFF).
Same situation as "V5" in the Sandusky case (the guy who's case lead to an Acquittal in the Sandusky trial, but who got one of the largest paychecks from Lubert/PSU - approx. $10,000,000).

"Its good to be King!!"

PSU will open the vault and pay out whatever they ask for - - - - - -maybe more than they ask for (seriously).


And not ONE of our "Responsible Stewards" (the ONE group that WE have the power to hold accountable) will say a word or bat an eye.........you can make book on that.



How's that vote working out?

This is nothing like the Sandusky case. As Jimmy noted (I thought I had heard such) the police have video from surveillance systems. Obviously they have seen some, or all, of what happened in the house that night. That is absolutely nothing like the actions of Jerry, who were mostly done in private and can not be corroborated with video.

 

[Pardlion]

This is nothing like the Sandusky case. As Jimmy noted (I thought I had heard such) the police have video from surveillance systems. Obviously they have seen some, or all, of what happened in the house that night. That is absolutely nothing like the actions of Jerry, who were mostly done in private and can not be corroborated with video.

What do you mean? McQueary saw it all. That's better than video.