TC embarrassed himself today. But it is what it is. We just are never going to know 100% what really happened.
Official Graham Spanier trial thread.
- Thread starter BobPSU92
- Start date
Will you please just STFU and go away you babbling buffoon? You are clearly flummoxed by the way the trial went and are now making less sense than even your norm. Seriously just go away.
Yeah, we will have to see. We all know that MM watered down what he said to Paterno. The context of the question and answer should be interesting.
Does John McQ yet remember about testifying at the Grand Jury?
Regardless, what McQueary told Curley and Schultz is far more important. If Schultz reported what Paterno said instead of what McQueary said when giving updates to Spanier he's really incompetent. The words of the witness would trump anything Paterno had told them.
Absolutely. It should have always been about what MM told them. Hence why I said that if there was a coverup, it was likely from TC and Gary. But again, I doubt we will ever know the full details of those exchanges.
Ah, so Joe was pulling the strings! So why then did they go to Spanier at all?
But Joe then lied to Curley and Schultz (even though McQueary testified that he didn't provide Joe with a detailed description). But they talked to McQueary who maintains that he told them exactly what he saw. Yet, Joe was simply able to wash all of that away through his influence.
Okay, now I get it. You believe that Joe orchestrated a coverup of Sandusky's crime. Why didn't you just say so?
Have you remembered to file your Tree Climbers IRS paperwork?
I'm sure he's aware of what's in his erstwhile unemployable coward son's brokerage account, and he recalls other things from there.
But you also said that it was their plan to report the incident to the authorities (no coverup) which they changed after Tim spoke with Joe (coverup). So which is it?
Some of these people sound like Cruising66 - whatever happened to him? Did Frazier cut off the paychecks?
You have had it all figured out for months while trolling this board, but now after the underwhelming OAG case has has been put forth we will never figure this thing out? The only thing that is certain is that you have been right about precisely nothing important from post 1. Get lost.
Ugh. After YEARS of this nonsense from you, that's the best you got?
Stick to making fun of Rutgers.
I've said that we will never get the truth for quite awhile now. That is why we should move on. Either support PSU or don't... but it's time to make that choice. This thing is done.
Often (always) wrong, never in doubt.
It's not over til we say it's over. And you aren't "we". GFY.
Never knowing the full truth doesn't mean that we are in the dark about everything. The men who had the information (all of them) ultimately failed. I've accepted that long ago, are you willing to accept it now?
We don't know what information they had. MM has zero credibility.
I've never disputed they failed. Neither have they. It's not some grand conspiracy, Sandusky is a pos monster that fooled professionals let alone milquetoast admins and a 80 year old football coach, but it's pretty disengenous to suddenly say, awe shucks "we'll never know" vs the reflexively bash PSU bent you've had for 6 years, on multiple sites.
You've actively contributed to the bullshit narrative we all deal with in the real world. That we enabled something. That a culture existed that cared about football above all else. That's your side of the pendulum swing, and you're just now saying "oh well".
Excuse me, but where have I bashed PSU? I have said that the men failed PSU just like the failed the victims. Never have I said anything negative about PSU.
I'm not sure where you think you will find out more info (actually, I'm guessing it is in the Paterno lawsuit), but if you have learned anything from this it's that people aren't going to just give up information if they have it. You will get a bunch of "I don't recall" and "I have no recollection". I'm sorry, I'm just not seeing where we will get more information. The public's mind is set.
The public' mind is set because the extremely likely failure to act appropriately (not conspiracy, not coverup, not collusion) has been allowed to be twisted into some mangled PSU football-first bullshit active protect Sandusky, ignoring all the other actors, political and otherwise. You say now "we'll never know"; awfully convenient. 6 years ago it should have started with "we must find out" instead of "we already know". We've all been painted with this bs brush.
You've had the patience of Job. GMJ has been stuck on the GJP since 2012. GMJ cannot get past it.
The PennJive faction is not happy because even Charlie Tuna wrote up today's proceedings as a win for the defense.
PennJive decided not to feature that article on their feed.
Instead they featured Iron Woman Ditka who is no hero for children from what I've seen so far. She keeps bypassing the report to TSM as if the procedures of the 2001 CPSL don't matter. I'm from Chicago. I like Mike Ditka and his nephew was one of my favorite players at Illinois.
I'm so sorry for them that Laura is besmirching the family name by participating in this travesty of justice and ignoring the duties under PA law of a State-sanctioned child charity to take PSU's report and protect their clients whenever they receive any type of questionable report no matter from whom, even the one from the PAOAG in 2008/09. Just shameful.
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SMH Have you no scruples? Towny does. Tim is battling cancer. It's why he would only have confined to house "sentencing". On top of these things occurring 16-19 years ago, you want him to remember every little detail?
They were also probably restricted by what they said at the GJ with no preparation. IIRC, Baldwin did not allow them to review a thing. I would assume they have reviewed what they could get afterwards which may account for some of the slight differences.
IDK what's up with Schultz, but I do know they both took a plea and were "obligated" in some way to help "throw Spanier under the bus". They didn't really do it. Schultz only gave them a weak version of what they wanted, "I THINK" it was Spanier.
Because they have a conscience, they took the medicine and fell on their swords rather than completely lie thru their teeth, IMHO.
OMG - THIS ^^
NO ONE from the media has picked up on the hypocrisy of that woman grandstanding in front of the jury while she had Jack "just wear swim trunks" Raykovitz in her witness chair for the prosecution?
And where did I ever say that football had anything to do with it?
Life isn't fair sometimes. It is what it is... we all know that this wasn't about football. We all know that PSU fans/alum have been put through shit that they didn't deserve. We would all love to know exactly what happened, but we are never going to get to that point. Joe's dead and people with the info aren't going to cough it up. It's over. Move on... help make PSU even better. Rehashing this scandal does us no good at all.
You can always nail it in 180 characters or less. I'm up at 2 a.m. unable to sleep thinking about child victims because a woman actually made this performance in a courtroom yesterday and today. If she wins in this way, at risk children in PA LOSE.
O/T slightly - but to goes to show the corruption of a prosecutor - Seth Williams, Patrick Blessington (who worked with Frank Fina bringing the PSU3 case to charging)
I simply can't believe the PA press corps allows this to go on.
I simply can't believe the PA press corps allows this to go on.
Yes, I think that Tim should remember SOMETHING about this. I'm sorry that he is sick, but his lack of recollection is BS. He has had over half a decade to remember those things and nothing? Nothing at all? Not even a vague recollection? I'm not asking for Tim to give details, just a summary of what was said. He couldn't even do that.
I was already asleep, woke up and had do something about Laura Ditka.
This has been bothering me since I sat there and watched that performance with her and Jack go on.
I'd write the reporters covering the story - BUT THEY'VE IGNORED THIS ISSUE FOR 5 F*CKING YEARS ALREADY.
He did remember "something". He remembered he was the one who made a specific decision and took a specific action. He should not need to be in a courtroom having to declare his remorse (which anyone and everyone who missed the signs has but will not own up to -Jack Raykovitz and several others), for what ended up being the right thing to do.
I would suggest that you don't know how memory works. I challenge you to remember details from any conversation from 16 years ago. Even if you THINK you remember, the chances of your memory being accurate are pretty slim. If fact, it's entirely possible if you work hard at trying to remember something you will actually reconstruct a false memory.
Is this something that I have been thinking about everyday for the last 6 years because I was charged with a crime?
Again, I'm not even asking for specific details. I'm asking for an overall summary... Tim couldn't even do that.
Agreed. Graham Spanier has shown courage and character. He would have led PSU to a better fate. That is precisely why John Surma and his posse had him removed. The OGBOT needed puppets to execute their plan.
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Judges can overturn convictions, they can't overturn not guilty verdicts.
You mean the coverup that included Dr. Dranov, MM, the entire McQueary Family, Schultz, Courtney, Curley, Spanier, Paterno and Jack Raykovitz.....to name a few....getmyjizzonmyself?
Man, getmyjive.. piece of advice: pack up and leave while you still can! Save your face.. whatever that's worth. Move on you say? Hell no! Its people like you who helped spread this false narrative in the first place. So kindly excuse us while the true penn staters (wensilver et al) do all they can to reverse this bs and right the wrongs that have been done by people like you.
Schultz's handwritten notes from his meeting with Tim Curley BEFORE they talked to McQueary say the original plan included to contact the DPW if JS didn't 'confess'. If anything, it suggests that the original plan was to confront, then they decided not to, but eventually Curley went back to the original plan.
Here's his notes dated the day after he and Curley met with Paterno.
The exact words are:
"unless he 'confesses' to having a problem, TMC will indicate we need to have DPW review the matter as an independent agency concerned w child welfare."
So there was no change in plans. It was optional from day one (or day three depending on when you start the clock).
That's partly the problem. The more often that you think about something, the more likely that you are to insert a false memory into your recall.
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