Outlook for next year's newcomers

[Ja1339]

I'll certainly miss Nico, Jordan, McIntosh and all the seniors after they depart after a spectacular season and fantastic careers. I hope they go out in grand style with a fantastic showing at MSG.

In the anticipation to the Nationals, I've begun to think about next year's squad. Anyone care to project how Suriano, Cortez, and Joseph will do next year?

I realize it's very early to ask, but please don't chastise me. Like many of you, I am wildly optimistic about our future prospects, and I'd love to hear from those much more knowledgeable than me.

 

[matter7172]

I think all three mentioned will do pretty well (and assume Hall and Manville will be shirting in some way). It's always hard to project recruits, but we have a couple of years experience with Cortez at least. His redshirt year was darned good and his winning the NLO and beating Conaway in the process is a good indication of what we can expect - an AA contender. Joseph has looked really good in his redshirt year and has a good resume, so I would expect a solid year from him - realistically, R12/AA would seem to be within reach for him. Suriano will, I think based on the few times I've seen him wrestle in person this year, surprise people next year. He's got incredible defense on his feet. He's tough on top and bottom and really strong. An AA finish next year would not shock me at all. Sometimes I'd like to see him open up more, but it's impressive that he doesn't get really frustrated when people try to slow the match down. Just my semi-informed opinion.

 

[ronsie]

Is Cassar (sp) with the team and what weight will he be at?

 

[tjb249]

Is Cassar (sp) with the team and what weight will he be at?

ronsie, yes at 197lbs. Expect either him or McCutcheon moving up to be the starter at 197lbs next season.

 

[Ja1339]

There was allot of chatter about that on the RU thread, and I believe the consensus was he'd be there competing for 197. Forgot to mention him in my question about new prospects.

 

[katsujinken]

I'm always surprised that when people start talking about projected line-ups and what not, K Stout never gets mentioned.... He definitely has the pedigree, and there have been some good reports floating around about him. The thing that intrigues me is that he didn't really strictly focus on wrestling until he committed to the good guys. All of his junior year losses were close matches with Zavatsky, and senior year he ran the table.

 

[matter7172]

Is Cassar (sp) with the team and what weight will he be at?

I really like Cassar's potential. He wrestled at a high school (Montgomery) in NJ that is not a traditional power. He was the first state champ from the school and was something like 47-0 his senior year after not qualifying for states as a junior. His rise in performance continued last summer when he went to Junior Worlds in freestyle, where he unfortunately was injured. But I thought coming in his upside was tremendous and it's seeming I wasn't wrong. Really looking forward to seeing him wrestle next season.

 

[matter7172]

I'm always surprised that when people start talking about projected line-ups and what not, K Stout never gets mentioned.... He definitely has the pedigree, and there have been some good reports floating around about him. The thing that intrigues me is that he didn't really strictly focus on wrestling until he committed to the good guys. All of his junior year losses were close matches with Zavatsky, and senior year he ran the table.

I guess the question is does he jump ahead of Mouse at 184 or Cassar at 197? I don't know enough to answer that question, but that's two pretty tough hombres to topple.

 

[nitlion6]

Joseph will be as difficult to deal with next season as Jason Nolf is this season.

Cortez beat Jordan at the NLO and he will be better after a year in the PSU room
So I would imagine he will be pretty darn good.

Suriano will be solid. Simiarly to true freshman Nico he will be pretty good at the beginning of the season but greatly improved by the end of the season.

 

[El-Jefe]

Rather than look at the individuals, I'll look at them collectively (and including Cassar/Stout).

Our guys will do well. There will likely be a drop-off in NCAA scores from those weights combined, simply because we're replacing (hopefully) 2 national finalists, and NCAA scoring escalates with higher placement.

I don't think that drop-off will be huge, and I think it can be at least mitigated and possibly overcome with others improving next year -- Gulibon will be better, Mouse will be better, Nevills will be healthy, and there will be significant attrition at 184 and 285.

I'd expect the overall team to be maybe a little more vulnerable in duals but similar to this year at nationals.

 

[letsgohawks44]

Joseph will be as difficult to deal with next season as Jason Nolf is this season.

Cortez beat Jordan at the NLO and he will be better after a year in the PSU room
So I would imagine he will be pretty darn good.

Suriano will be solid. Simiarly to true freshman Nico he will be pretty good at the beginning of the season but greatly improved by the end of the season.

Has cenzo wrestled much this year? He was an absolute beast his senior year in hs.

 

[Ja1339]

I'm always surprised that when people start talking about projected line-ups and what not, K Stout never gets mentioned.... He definitely has the pedigree, and there have been some good reports floating around about him. The thing that intrigues me is that he didn't really strictly focus on wrestling until he committed to the good guys. All of his junior year losses were close matches with Zavatsky, and senior year he ran the table.

I'm a newbie, so you'll have to my excuse my ignorance regarding Stoudt. I am amazed at the incredible depth this team has.

 

[matter7172]

.
I'd expect the overall team to be maybe a little more vulnerable in duals but similar to this year at nationals.

I don't know about the vulnerability in duals. I think it will be a stronger dual team. There may be more bonus points coming at 125 and 133, 165 should be stronger, 285 will almost definitely be stronger. Jimmy should do better next year. I don't think you can get much more from Zain and Nolf but even Nickal might be higher-scoring in duals next year. 197 is probably the one place you would expect a drop-off but it would be likely to be seen at the end of the year at Bigs and Nationals and I don't think it would be a huge. Health is the key question, imo. Can 184, 197 and 285 stay healthy? If so, I think Penn State will be stronger in duals and the tournaments next season.

 

[dunkej01]

I don't know about the vulnerability in duals. I think it will be a stronger dual team. There may be more bonus points coming at 125 and 133, 165 should be stronger, 285 will almost definitely be stronger. Jimmy should do better next year. I don't think you can get much more from Zain and Nolf but even Nickal might be higher-scoring in duals next year. 197 is probably the one place you would expect a drop-off but it would be likely to be seen at the end of the year at Bigs and Nationals and I don't think it would be a huge. Health is the key question, imo. Can 184, 197 and 285 stay healthy? If so, I think Penn State will be stronger in duals and the tournaments next season.

I hope your right about the bonus at 125 and 133 but the matches I've watched of Suriano and Cortez don't scream out to me as bonus machines. Would love to be wrong.

 

[katsujinken]

I'm a newbie, so you'll have to my excuse my ignorance regarding Stoudt. I am amazed at the incredible depth this team has.

The depth seems to be at an all-time high... I love the interview from a few years ago when Cael talked about the National Championships coming through the PSU room. Took that to mean that if you can climb to the top of your weight in the PSU room, then you will compete for the national title.

 

[RoarLions1]

Actually, Cassar is not really "with the team", he's practicing with the NLWC, but not a rostered Penn State wrestler at the moment.

 

[07mantle]

There was allot of chatter about that on the RU thread, and I believe the consensus was he'd be there competing for 197. Forgot to mention him in my question about new prospects.

having been at practice a couple weeks ago and talking to Anthony for a good 10 minutes , he never in any way shape or form indicated he would be anywhere else but wrestling 197 for Penn State next year

 

[Roar More]

And don't count out Rasheed at 184. We are crazy deep.

 

[BruceK-PSU83]

ronsie, yes at 197lbs. Expect either him or McCutcheon moving up to be the starter at 197lbs next season.

Given Cutch's stature, it's hard to see him at 197. And he is already pretty well filled out; so 197 seems like a real stretch IMO.

Also, I would like to see what Rasheed can do at a weight where he isn't cutting a ton. I don't know if 184 is realistic for him, but it might be very interesting.

 

[Real-Lion]

I guess the question is does he jump ahead of Mouse at 184 or Cassar at 197? I don't know enough to answer that question, but that's two pretty tough hombres to topple.

Cassar will be the starter at 197....He gives Morgan all he can handle and more....

 

[jschrantz]

Cassar will be the starter at 197....He gives Morgan all he can handle and more....

All he can handle and more? Where do you come up with this stuff Spyker, seriously. You seem like a good dude, but why go there?

 

[jack66]

I expect the biggest drop off at 197. Either Stout or Cassar will be solid, but neither have shown the resume to think they can come close Smack's production (#6 most dominant wrestler) ... at least not next year.

Stout this year was 12-3 with a Major loss to the only ranked wrestler he faced. Last year Cassar was 11-6 in open tourneys. I know he had valuable training with the Jr World team this past year, but still, Morgan is leaving behind big shoes to fill.

To compensate, I see a big improvements at 165 and hwt.

 

[jschrantz]

I expect the biggest drop off at 197. Either Stout or Cassar will be solid, but neither have shown the resume to think they can come close Smack's production (#6 most dominant wrestler) ... at least not next year.

Stout this year was 12-3 with a Major loss to the only ranked wrestler he faced. Last year Cassar was 11-6 in open tourneys. I know he had valuable training with the Jr World team this past year, but still, Morgan is leaving behind big shoes to fill.

To compensate, I see a big improvements at 165 and hwt.

Don't worry jack, Spyker says Cassar is giving little Morgan all he wants and more, hahahaha. Nobody can get to Cassar's legs, I heard in the last month he's been giving up legs to Morgan just so he can get work in.

 

[PortlandLion]

Don't worry jack, Spyker says Cassar is giving little Morgan all he wants and more, hahahaha

Actually, there was a quote from Cassar himself saying that he thought he could win 97 THIS year. That was before he was injured. But I would guess, that several guys on the team would think they can beat the starter prior to the season.

 

[nitlion6]

Has cenzo wrestled much this year? He was an absolute beast his senior year in hs.

He has wrestled several tournaments and has been very dominant, but the competition has not been all that great. He did not make weight for the NLO nor the Scuffle.
My take on Joseph is what I have been told by everybody I know who has frequent access to the room and practices.

 

[jschrantz]

Actually, there was a quote from Cassar himself saying that he thought he could win 97 THIS year. That was before he was injured. But I would guess, that several guys on the team would think they can beat the starter prior to the season.

Ya, I'll wait on that one.

 

[a_mshaffer]

goes to show.... go to PSU, make varsity, and national championships is reasonable and expected realistic goal.

 

[El-Jefe]

All he can handle and more? Where do you come up with this stuff Spyker, seriously. You seem like a good dude, but why go there?

Gotta apply the Spyker Filter ... English and facts take a back seat to excitement. If Cassar really gives Smack more than he can handle, then that means we could have a national champ who is #2 in his own room. Alrighty then.

 

[El-Jefe]

Actually, there was a quote from Cassar himself saying that he thought he could win 97 THIS year. That was before he was injured. But I would guess, that several guys on the team would think they can beat the starter prior to the season.

Even if it's false bravado, good for him. Better than saying he has no shot.

 

[Callthestall]

Even if it's false bravado, good for him. Better than saying he has no shot.

Last year (2014) at the ESU open Cael brought in all his redshirt freshman and redshirts. I could see Nickel and Nolf were special. Cassar must have really improved on his feet since I saw him. I think Rasheed will be able to compete with Cutch and probably beat him if his stamina situation gets corrected. I don't look at him going up 2 weights he truly was a 174pounder this year.165 will be better next year with Joseph sliding in.125 will be not as consistent to start but Suriono is darn good and should be able to look for the podium in March. Cortez will be simaler to Conway in won-lost record but should get more bonus points. Nevill's should be much improved unless those injuries are career changing, like the Altons.

 

[fen103]

Morgan's natural weight class is 184. He only wrestled up because of Q and Ruth at 184 and the team needed him at 197. He has already said he will moving to 189 for freestyle. My point is that during our first few national titles, we didn't have a lot of depth. Now, we debating whether our back up could win the national title and what back ups this year could AA next year. Cael and company has build a phenomenal system at getting the most out of every guy on the roster.

The wrestler I want to see the most next year is Suriano. I think he will have a really good year and turn some heads. Will definitely have a shot at getting a spot on podium at the end of next season. I think Cortez gets there too. Not sure on Joseph and not completely sold on him till I get to see him wrestle more. I haven't got a chance to see any of his matches this year.

 

[RoarLions1]

One thing to look at is eligibility. Not perfect, as there's redshirts coming back, and some kids will move up or down in weight class. Here's a look at the weights discussed in this thread;
125 - Only 2 departing seniors (Nico and Klimara) in top 12 of Intermat. This has the looks of a brutal weight class for whomever goes, likely Suriano as a true FR.
133 - 8 guys departing in top-14, including #1, #4, and #5. Cortez should be able to step right in and easily be top-10 to start the season, and work his way up the rankings.
165 - 7 of the top-13 are leaving, opening up the weight class some for whomever our starter is.
197 - 5 leaving in the top-9, and 8 of the top-20. This includes #1, #3, and #5. Upper weights are harder to step in and have immediate success. Lots of speculation at this weight class for the Lions, excited to see how it all plays out...

...but first things first...we have 9 guys going to New York City to wrestle for a National Championship!!

 

[jtothemfp]

Has cenzo wrestled much this year? He was an absolute beast his senior year in hs.

Not much, but def hasn't struggled against who he *has* seen

 

[LemonPie]

Last year (2014) at the ESU open Cael brought in all his redshirt freshman and redshirts. I could see Nickel and Nolf were special. Cassar must have really improved on his feet since I saw him. I think Rasheed will be able to compete with Cutch and probably beat him if his stamina situation gets corrected. I don't look at him going up 2 weights he truly was a 174pounder this year.165 will be better next year with Joseph sliding in.125 will be not as consistent to start but Suriono is darn good and should be able to look for the podium in March. Cortez will be simaler to Conway in won-lost record but should get more bonus points. Nevill's should be much improved unless those injuries are career changing, like the Altons.

despite he head-to-head victory, I'm not expecting Cortez to be as consistent as Conaway just yet. On a difficult schedule, he gets less bonus than JC, too. Lots of close victories when wrestling a solid opponent. Still, I like his upside a lot. I could see how skilled he was when watching his match against Zach Sanders a few months ago.

 

[jrd23psu]

If Joseph is able to maintain the weight at 165lbs (I'm only worried because he missed weight twice this year) then you're looking at a huge upgrade at 165lbs. You're going to see a kid that makes an immediate impact and is able to compete with anybody in the country. You can look for a lot of bonus points from him, too. His senior season reminded me a lot of the senior season of Jason Nolf before coming to PSU. That's how impressed I've been with him.

 

[BruceK-PSU83]

If Joseph is able to maintain the weight at 165lbs (I'm only worried because he missed weight twice this year) then you're looking at a huge upgrade at 165lbs.

As I recall, Joseph twice missed weight at 157 (not 165). If Joseph can't make 165, then his spots in the lineup may be rather limited.

 

[Annieat285]

As I recall, Joseph twice missed weight at 157 (not 165). If Joseph can't make 165, then his spots in the lineup may be rather limited.

The above match happened in June of 2015. The weight class: 145 lbs (in the round prior Joseph beat Anthony Ashnault, so if there is any question as to how good Vincenzo is, he's beating AA's). Approximately 6 months later Joseph was unable to make 157 on two separate occasions. I know everyone is penciling Joseph in at 165, but what is the chance that this growth spurt isn't over yet? Is there a world were Bo moves up, not to accommodate Joseph, but rather because it's what's best for him, and Joseph wrestles 174? An unlikely scenario, but if Joseph doesn't stop growing 165 might be out of the cards as well.

 

[Needanap]

View embedded media

The above match happened in June of 2015. The weight class: 145 lbs (in the round prior Joseph beat Anthony Ashnault, so if there is any question as to how good Vincenzo is, he's beating AA's). Approximately 6 months later Joseph was unable to make 157 on two separate occasions. I know everyone is penciling Joseph in at 165, but what is the chance that this growth spurt isn't over yet? Is there a world were Bo moves up, not to accommodate Joseph, but rather because it's what's best for him, and Joseph wrestles 174? An unlikely scenario, but if Joseph doesn't stop growing 165 might be out of the cards as well.

Thanks for posting this Annie. I think Joseph's difficulty making weight will resolve itself once he has a regular spot in the lineup and isn't red shirting. As an aside it was interesting to see Jody Strittmatter and Spencer Lee's father as Joseph's coaches between periods.

 

[LemonEars]

I think all three mentioned will do pretty well (and assume Hall and Manville will be shirting in some way). It's always hard to project recruits, but we have a couple of years experience with Cortez at least. His redshirt year was darned good and his winning the NLO and beating Conaway in the process is a good indication of what we can expect - an AA contender. Joseph has looked really good in his redshirt year and has a good resume, so I would expect a solid year from him - realistically, R12/AA would seem to be within reach for him. Suriano will, I think based on the few times I've seen him wrestle in person this year, surprise people next year. He's got incredible defense on his feet. He's tough on top and bottom and really strong. An AA finish next year would not shock me at all. Sometimes I'd like to see him open up more, but it's impressive that he doesn't get really frustrated when people try to slow the match down. Just my semi-informed opinion.

I'm a wrestling newbie but I though Hall was a "once in a decade" wrestler like Gable and Sanderson. I expected he would start next year and be a 4-time national champion. Why would he redshirt?

 

[CSauertiegPSU]

I'm a wrestling newbie but I though Hall was a "once in a decade" wrestler like Gable and Sanderson. I expected he would start next year and be a 4-time national champion. Why would he redshirt?

Redshirting is wrestling is a bit different than in other sports. Hall with likely defer a year and then redshirt to pursue freestyle options and work on other aspects of his game to be able to compete internationally