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Population trends in PA (link)

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Philly practically built Comcast's HQ for free. They also get huge subsidies for their mass transit....Rendel stole $250 mil in federal fuel taxes for Philly mass transit.

Meanwhile there should have been a racesino built in Lawrence Co 15 years ago. Developer wanted no grants, no tax incentives, already owned the land, was going to build an outlet mall, motel, indoor water park and more. He paid $50 mil for a racing license but the state denied him a gambling license...never guess why. Because his grandfather 'may have' loaned a Youngstown mob boss $60 grand 40 years prior! No proof just a big maybe.

Meanwhile a group was given a license for a casino in Philly called Foxwood...they owned no land and had no financing. Seven years later they had to pull the license because the group had still squat. Also, they gave a license to a guy in the Poconos and later it came out he was a mob guy. So what did they do? Forced him to sell it.....TO HIS DAUGHTER! And that was just fine for the state.

W Pa should break away along with W NY and form a new state.

You didn’t really answer. What should the government be doing to attract jobs to rural western, PA. An example of Rendell capitulating to Comcast doesn’t make your point.

One casino also does nothing of note for a local economy
 
we can agree to disagree. Why not also have a class on watching TV, wine tasting, coke/pepsi, Veronica & Betty, Texas Hold'em, Fortnight, etc? I don't need a class on how to entertain myself nor does anyone else. Entertainment is entertainment. You do it in your spare time.
You can cut physical education and save some money BUT given the obesity problem you will most likely spend the savings on increased health costs. A well rounded education is essential to well rounded citizens. I once knew an engineer at PSU who was convinced that the whole state should be strip mined and paved over for the betterment of all. Holy Crap, what a plan!
 
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Ah, now I think I see what I was missing. I believe your point is that no county went from losing population in the '00 decade to gaining population in the '10 decade.

Correct, poorly phrased on my end.

I would have expected with the energy boom in PA over the past decade (mostly in the counties losing population), that at least one county would have gone from losing population in 2000-2010 to gaining population in 2011-present.
 
You can cut physical education and save some money BUT given the obesity problem you will most likely spend the savings on increased health costs. A well rounded education is essential to well rounded citizens. I once knew an engineer at PSU who was convinced that the whole state should be strip mined and paved over for the betterment of all. Holy Crap, what a plan!
Well, based on obesity records, they are failing. I am not sure an hour a week of dodge ball is gonna do it. Plus, if you are not in shape at age 14 good luck when you are 50 or 60. I would postulate that Phys Ed isn't worth the time they take to teach it. I recall having to memorize how wide a tennis court is. Wow, great life experience!
 
Simple--money is fungible. So the lotto money gets used to pay the basic school stuff that used to be in the general budget. And then the politicos spend the money they used to spend on schools on what they really want to spend it on--what ever that may be, but likely not anything useful.
In Pennsylvania, the Lottery is used to benefit senior citizens, so that blows up your story.
 
Well, he also put ketchup on his scrambled eggs. Arts? That is entertainment. I don't need a class on how to entertain myself. In fact, I am probably better at it than I need to be.

Arts education isn’t about how to entertain yourself.
 
Well, based on obesity records, they are failing. I am not sure an hour a week of dodge ball is gonna do it. Plus, if you are not in shape at age 14 good luck when you are 50 or 60. I would postulate that Phys Ed isn't worth the time they take to teach it. I recall having to memorize how wide a tennis court is. Wow, great life experience!
Sorry you had such a piss poor phys. Ed. Department. They should be teaching you to find life long sports and physical recreation skills that you continue to appreciate and enjoy throughout your lifetime. This not only keeps you healthy but increases the number of great experiences/activities you can participate in during your life. Carry on.
 
Sorry you had such a piss poor phys. Ed. Department. They should be teaching you to find life long sports and physical recreation skills that you continue to appreciate and enjoy throughout your lifetime. This not only keeps you healthy but increases the number of great experiences/activities you can participate in during your life. Carry on.
well, I appreciate your concern. However, nobody needs to tell me to run, jump or skip. I kinda figured that out on my own. And if a teacher had to tell me to jump it wouldn't be fun. Honestly, as a young teenager, if you have to be told to move, you've failed before you've begun.
 
You didn’t really answer. What should the government be doing to attract jobs to rural western, PA. An example of Rendell capitulating to Comcast doesn’t make your point.

One casino also does nothing of note for a local economy

I’ll answer. LOWER TAXES.

Spoke with a township supervisor today. He has tried to court several companies to the area. The number one reason companies say “no thank you” are property taxes.
 
My youngest son is in the gas and oil business in Greene County. His company has trouble keeping workers.Every time there's a random drug test on site some workers just leave. That way they didn't fail the test they just quit.They just jump from one company to another staying ahead of the failed drug test.
 
[/QUOTE]
Rural area are transforming for the worse all over the country.[/QUOTE]


Hardly the case. Look outside PA. And so it begs the question. What can PA politicians do better to "reverse the polarity." Maybe a less onerous state government is a start. Just sayin'.
 
I’ll answer. LOWER TAXES.

Spoke with a township supervisor today. He has tried to court several companies to the area. The number one reason companies say “no thank you” are property taxes.
What? The Democratic Governor's plan to tax the state into prosperity isn't working?
 
The coal industry decline has been playing out over a long time, although it definitely acclerated during the Obama years. It has ticked up again recently, but who is going to invest in something so tied to the political winds ?
Manufacturing has also taken a major hit in western PA since NAFTA. The shale gas industry has produced few stable jobs for local communities. I think agriculture is viable, but most of the best soils are in the SE part of the state.
One possible glimmer of hope for some of these bombed out communities is the research going on at PSU and some other universities to find ways of extracting rare earth elements from coal mining waste. This is something we need to be doing, considering China is the main global supplier for these.
 
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so what is it, then? What am I missing?

Well, I can speak for myself and for my friends. I for one do work for many corporations and politicians. I do it so they can sell their products and themselves. In many cases I help develop their products for or with them.

I have a friend who is an emmy-award winning producer with an arts education from Fordham.

I have a friend who is an emmy nominated FX designer for TV.

I have a friend who was at graduate school when I was there who designed a new prescription bottle for a major retailer that would help old people avoid taking the wrong meds.

My friend at school went on to become the Design director of Etsy

My wifes friends from school created AirBnb.

My professor from school went on to create a very popular clothing line. It started when he started painting axes and selling them believe it or not.
https://www.bestmadeco.com

My friend is helping redesign the way systems and user experience of the NYC park system. He also used to design the lead in to the SNL among many other things.

I am leaving out all of my friends and colleagues who are design directors, art directors, producers, photographers, directors and artist.
To be honest, I have a hard time thinking of people I went to school with who didn't go on to become successful in their field of choice.
Then again, maybe I just don't talk to the ones who didn't because more often than not, they were the lazy ones.

Are they entertaining themselves? I guess. Are they creating jobs and solving problems? Definitely.
 
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Well, I can speak for myself and for my friends. I for one do work for many corporations and politicians. I do it so they can sell their products and themselves. In many cases I help develop their products for or with them.

I have a friend who is an emmy-award winning producer with an arts education from Fordham.

I have a friend who is an emmy nominated FX designer for TV.

I have a friend who was at graduate school when I was there who designed a new prescription bottle for a major retailer that would help old people avoid taking the wrong meds.

My friend at school went on to become the Design director of Etsy

My wifes friends from school created AirBnb.

My professor from school went on to create a very popular clothing line. It started when he started painting axes and selling them believe it or not.
https://www.bestmadeco.com

My friend is helping redesign the way systems and user experience of the NYC park system. He also used to design the lead in to the SNL among many other things.

I am leaving out all of my friends and colleagues who are design directors, art directors, producers, photographers, directors and artist.
To be honest, I have a hard time thinking of people I went to school with who didn't go on to become successful in their field of choice.
Then again, maybe I just don't talk to the ones who didn't because more often than not, they were the lazy ones.

Are they entertaining themselves? I guess. Are they creating jobs and solving problems? Definitely.
GreggK, admirable and great accomplishment and achievement without reservation. However, this isn't what is being taught in schools. What is being taught is reading The Crucible and The Grapes or Wrath. What is being taught is the different types of paintings . What is being taught is how to sculpt, paint, sing and dance. These are entertainment. I can certainly get behind and fund UI/UX standards across platforms and devices. I can certainly get behind Video concepts as they pertain to business. But those are much different than learning of the double entendre utilized in chapter 12 of The Lord of the Flies or Catcher in the Rye. That is entertainment. If one wants to make a career out of singing, painting, clay molding, legos, play doh or playing the piano, there is ample time outside of public school or, later, in college to do so. The attention and time spent in grades 8-12 on these is way out of whack with value gained. Take that time and teach kids better programming logic, mathematical skills, statistics and how to find information on the WWW.
 
I am originally from Greene County PA (I have lived in NC for over 20 years now) and I am one of those people who left and never came back. The reason for the decline has been posted, there are no jobs there or at least not the type or amount of jobs as you find in Pittsburgh or Philly. Drugs have taken over the SWPA area no doubt but who's fault is that really? Coal has been dying since the 80's and Natural gas was suppose to replace that industry with tons of jobs and growth. Well that has not happened and will not happen. It is sad to see but the truth is SWPA looks alot like SWWV. Lastly the brain drain on the area has be mentioned, people that are skilled or have a college degree leave there in droves and that has also affected what type of job force is there.
 
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The coal industry decline has been playing out over a long time, although it definitely acclerated during the Obama years. It has ticked up again recently, but who is going to invest in something so tied to the political winds ?
Manufacturing has also taken a major hit in western PA since NAFTA. The shale gas industry has produced few stable jobs for local communities. I think agriculture is viable, but most of the best soils are in the SE part of the state.
One possible glimmer of hope for some of these bombed out communities is the research going on at PSU and some other universities to find ways of extracting rare earth elements from coal mining waste. This is something we need to be doing, considering China is the main global supplier for these.

Good point about about Agriculture. Another part of Somerset county that is quickly going away are dairy farms. A lot has to do with the regulations and Draconian Milk laws that come out of Wisconsin but also the descendants of the family farms really don't want to have anything to do with it anymore.
 
GreggK, admirable and great accomplishment and achievement without reservation. However, this isn't what is being taught in schools. What is being taught is reading The Crucible and The Grapes or Wrath. What is being taught is the different types of paintings . What is being taught is how to sculpt, paint, sing and dance. These are entertainment. I can certainly get behind and fund UI/UX standards across platforms and devices. I can certainly get behind Video concepts as they pertain to business. But those are much different than learning of the double entendre utilized in chapter 12 of The Lord of the Flies or Catcher in the Rye. That is entertainment. If one wants to make a career out of singing, painting, clay molding, legos, play doh or playing the piano, there is ample time outside of public school or, later, in college to do so. The attention and time spent in grades 8-12 on these is way out of whack with value gained. Take that time and teach kids better programming logic, mathematical skills, statistics and how to find information on the WWW.
You are wrong what is being taught in those books is a little more than entertainment, they are relatable topics to life.
 
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GreggK, admirable and great accomplishment and achievement without reservation. However, this isn't what is being taught in schools. What is being taught is reading The Crucible and The Grapes or Wrath. What is being taught is the different types of paintings . What is being taught is how to sculpt, paint, sing and dance. These are entertainment. I can certainly get behind and fund UI/UX standards across platforms and devices. I can certainly get behind Video concepts as they pertain to business. But those are much different than learning of the double entendre utilized in chapter 12 of The Lord of the Flies or Catcher in the Rye. That is entertainment. If one wants to make a career out of singing, painting, clay molding, legos, play doh or playing the piano, there is ample time outside of public school or, later, in college to do so. The attention and time spent in grades 8-12 on these is way out of whack with value gained. Take that time and teach kids better programming logic, mathematical skills, statistics and how to find information on the WWW.

I completely disagree with this.
 
In Pennsylvania, the Lottery is used to benefit senior citizens, so that blows up your story.
In Ohio, where I live and pay taxes, it's used for schools.

In any case, I was replying to a poster from MD where they also use lottery money for education. Unfortunately, the chain of quotes doesn't appear.
 
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You are wrong what is being taught in those books is a little more than entertainment, they are relatable topics to life.
we can agree to disagree. the next time I think "what would Holden Caufield do?" will be my first.
 
sammyk, good job at Parkland and good luck on your new gig

if Wake Forest HS's success is any indication, there must be some football talent in that area!
Thanks I appreciate that. North Carolina has so much talent throughout the state it is crazy. Wake county(Raleigh) is growing so fast they can barley keep up with it and are adding schools every year. I think there is 24 public high schools with 2 news ones opening within the next year My new school is only 5 years old with 2200+ kids in it already. And yes the talent in that area is pretty good only a small step behind Mecklenberg County(Charlotte)
 
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we can agree to disagree. the next time I think "what would Holden Caufield do?" will be my first.
And the next time I use a differential equation in actual practice as a Mechanical engineer will be a first. You learn a lot in school you won't ever use, but you don't know what you'll need while you're learning it.
Are you honestly stating the study of literature or art is not value added? I strongly disagree. I've learned something from every book I've ever read, fiction or nonfiction.
As you navigate life, it's not all 1s and 0s or equations.
I'm in a technical profession and sure, I'll poke fun at liberal arts majors occasionally...but your views of those things being worthless is extreme.
 
You didn’t really answer. What should the government be doing to attract jobs to rural western, PA. An example of Rendell capitulating to Comcast doesn’t make your point.

One casino also does nothing of note for a local economy
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I did really answer. The state is a corrupt government that favors its wealthy benefactors in SE Pa and screws W Pa. Rendell shouldn't be using state tax dollars to benefit Philadelphia. And you totally ignored the other issues.

Reread my post; I pointed out that this was to be way more than a casino. It would have created over 2000 jobs.... a horse track, water park, hotel, restaurants, outlet malls ....in a county of 95,000 people that would have had a huge impact. Not only jobs but tax revenue. And casinos are required to put substantial funds into local communities on top of all the taxes. It would have had a massive impact.

E Pa gets tons of tax benefits inducing companies to bring jobs. Better roads, better schools, water, power, sewer...the whole gambit. W Pa gets screwed. W Pa needs to break away from this corrupt government along with W NY.
 
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I did really answer. The state is a corrupt government that favors its wealthy benefactors in SE Pa and screws W Pa. Rendell shouldn't be using state tax dollars to benefit Philadelphia. And you totally ignored the other issues.

Reread my post; I pointed out that this was to be way more than a casino. It would have created over 2000 jobs.... a horse track, water park, hotel, restaurants, outlet malls ....in a county of 95,000 people that would have had a huge impact. Not only jobs but tax revenue. And casinos are required to put substantial funds into local communities on top of all the taxes. It would have had a massive impact.

E Pa gets tons of tax benefits inducing companies to bring jobs. Better roads, better schools, water, power, sewer...the whole gambit. W Pa gets screwed. W Pa needs to break away from this corrupt government along with W NY.
And form Pennsyltucky ? I do think if my history serves me right that a state called Westylvania was proposed way back when. It was made up of Western NY, Western PA, WV, Western MD and part of KY
 
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Good point about about Agriculture. Another part of Somerset county that is quickly going away are dairy farms. A lot has to do with the regulations and Draconian Milk laws that come out of Wisconsin but also the descendants of the family farms really don't want to have anything to do with it anymore.
Yeah, my Grandad did this. It’s hard work and you never get a day off. It seems like people consume less dairy now that other protein options are readily available.
I still think agriculture is a solid base. If you have cheap land and a relatively humid climate, it will work. People always need to eat.
 
The coal industry decline has been playing out over a long time, although it definitely acclerated during the Obama years. It has ticked up again recently, but who is going to invest in something so tied to the political winds ?
Manufacturing has also taken a major hit in western PA since NAFTA. The shale gas industry has produced few stable jobs for local communities. I think agriculture is viable, but most of the best soils are in the SE part of the state.
One possible glimmer of hope for some of these bombed out communities is the research going on at PSU and some other universities to find ways of extracting rare earth elements from coal mining waste. This is something we need to be doing, considering China is the main global supplier for these.

I worked in the coke region for J&L in the 70's. I saw it dying then. Most of the mills were built in the 19th century. The coal mines were getting no capital or just barely enough for environmental complance(rightly so). I left in 1980 and followed the coal industry to the west and overseas. I saw the demise coming again but got out before it hit. I then spent a little time in uranium
 
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I did really answer. The state is a corrupt government that favors its wealthy benefactors in SE Pa and screws W Pa. Rendell shouldn't be using state tax dollars to benefit Philadelphia. And you totally ignored the other issues.

Reread my post; I pointed out that this was to be way more than a casino. It would have created over 2000 jobs.... a horse track, water park, hotel, restaurants, outlet malls ....in a county of 95,000 people that would have had a huge impact. Not only jobs but tax revenue. And casinos are required to put substantial funds into local communities on top of all the taxes. It would have had a massive impact.

E Pa gets tons of tax benefits inducing companies to bring jobs. Better roads, better schools, water, power, sewer...the whole gambit. W Pa gets screwed. W Pa needs to break away from this corrupt government along with W NY.

I've lived in rural PA, rural upstate NY, and now rural Northern Nevada. Everybody in these communities constantly piss and moan about "the big city." People in PA hate Philadelphia. People in upstate NY think they have to pull NYC's weight. People in Northern Nevada want Arizona/California to take Las Vegas/Clark County. I don't get it. They just don't understand that the big cities are typically the economic engines that put money in the coffers to support rural areas.

You want a new state made up of Western NY and Western PA? You going to name it North Mississippi?
 
I've lived in rural PA, rural upstate NY, and now rural Northern Nevada. Everybody in these communities constantly piss and moan about "the big city." People in PA hate Philadelphia. People in upstate NY think they have to pull NYC's weight. People in Northern Nevada want Arizona/California to take Las Vegas/Clark County. I don't get it. They just don't understand that the big cities are typically the economic engines that put money in the coffers to support rural areas.

You want a new state made up of Western NY and Western PA? You going to name it North Mississippi?
Well, probably because the big cities reap massive financial rewards while the rural areas get no benefits beyond leaning how to make awesome crystal meth.

giphy.gif
 
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Yeah, my Grandad did this. It’s hard work and you never get a day off. It seems like people consume less dairy now that other protein options are readily available.
I still think agriculture is a solid base. If you have cheap land and a relatively humid climate, it will work. People always need to eat.

Excellent point about other options like Soy and Almond milk and I must confess I am in with the Almond Milk craze although its not the greatest to cook with.;)
 
Well, probably because the big cities reap massive financial rewards while the rural areas get no benefits beyond leaning how to make awesome crystal meth.

giphy.gif

Reap massive financial rewards? The money they get back is typically proportional to the money they put in. The rural areas are the places that get more than they contribute.
 
GreggK, admirable and great accomplishment and achievement without reservation. However, this isn't what is being taught in schools. What is being taught is reading The Crucible and The Grapes or Wrath. What is being taught is the different types of paintings . What is being taught is how to sculpt, paint, sing and dance. These are entertainment. I can certainly get behind and fund UI/UX standards across platforms and devices. I can certainly get behind Video concepts as they pertain to business. But those are much different than learning of the double entendre utilized in chapter 12 of The Lord of the Flies or Catcher in the Rye. That is entertainment. If one wants to make a career out of singing, painting, clay molding, legos, play doh or playing the piano, there is ample time outside of public school or, later, in college to do so. The attention and time spent in grades 8-12 on these is way out of whack with value gained. Take that time and teach kids better programming logic, mathematical skills, statistics and how to find information on the WWW.

You have a problem with people reading books in school? Reading those books or double entendre usage isn't about the those things in and of themselves, it is about finding greater meaning. Of course, it is only a part of a well rounded educations, but I am almost thinking you are joking by saying this.

Legos and play doh is a silly example of what you think an art education is and really speaks to your lack of understanding of it. They do teach UX, production, and programing as it pertains to design at high schools in NJ. I know because my nephews just graduated. If you go to a place like RISD these days, yeah, there are people learning painting, but there are also people learning programing, mathematics, UI/UX and entrepreneurship. These things are very much intertwined these days.

Jony Ive studied sculpting and chemistry. Do you think his studying sculpting was a waste of time? I mean clearly you do, but how can you not see how it put him on the path he took?
 
I've lived in rural PA, rural upstate NY, and now rural Northern Nevada. Everybody in these communities constantly piss and moan about "the big city." People in PA hate Philadelphia. People in upstate NY think they have to pull NYC's weight. People in Northern Nevada want Arizona/California to take Las Vegas/Clark County. I don't get it. They just don't understand that the big cities are typically the economic engines that put money in the coffers to support rural areas.

You want a new state made up of Western NY and Western PA? You going to name it North Mississippi?
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I want a state that has a government that understands and represents the people within it. Buffalo and Pittsburgh have similar issues that Philly and NYC do not.

Philly and NYC are economic engines for the surrounding communities. But more distant counties are ignored.

Want another example? How about that wonderful, very expensive super highway from Harrisburg to State College that was built so SE Pa people can go to PSU easily and faster. And extended to Phillipsburg. It was financed and built very quickly. Meanwhile, the Mon Valley Expressway has been floundering for 30 years. If it had been built it would have help save hundreds of companies and thousands of jobs. But it W Pa with little political clout so it still isn't finished.

Rendell once visited W Pa and ha said he shocked at how bad things were. He had no idea.
 
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