PSU Pre season rankings - guesses.

[diggerpup]

Assuming Bo goes 174.
Assuming Cassar is ready at 197.
Assuming new starters will be initially ranked conservatively.
Knowing the only rankings that matter are in March:

Anyone want to take a guess ?

Suriano - 9th
Cortez - 8th
Jimmy G - 12th
ZPain - 1st
Nolf - 1st
Joseph - 9th
Bo - 1st
Shakur / Mouse - 11th
Cassar - 12th
Nevills - 10th

 

[Ian]

Assuming everyone is healthy 125, 133, 141, 165, 184, 197, 285 could end up top 8. This will be a very potent lineup in March. All have a shot to AA at Nationals.

 

[T J]

Assuming everyone is healthy 125, 133, 141, 165, 184, 197, 285 could end up top 8. This will be a very potent lineup in March. All have a shot to AA at Nationals.

So ZPain at 149 and Nolf at 157 won't be in the top 8 at their weights?

j/k - Your point is a good one Ian. That if they stay healthy and achieve the kind of success that is possible, the Nittany Lions could have 10 AAs this season.

We'll see how it all unfolds.

Am with you on your pre-season observation and optimism. Good stuff Ian.

 

[Real-Lion]

Assuming Bo goes 174.
Assuming Cassar is ready at 197.
Assuming new starters will be initially ranked conservatively.
Knowing the only rankings that matter are in March:

Anyone want to take a guess ?

Suriano - 9th
Cortez - 8th
Jimmy G - 12th
ZPain - 1st
Nolf - 1st
Joseph - 9th
Bo - 1st
Shakur / Mouse - 11th
Cassar - 12th
Nevills - 10th

Suriano top 4....

 

[tomsc]

Suriano top 4....

Suriano could very well finish the season in top 4--but no way he's going to be top 4 pre-season as a true FR. Most polls won't rank him at all, and if they do rank true FR pre-season I doubt he'll be higher than 11-15th at best. Remember last year Bo was a RS FR and was ranked something like 19th pre-season.

 

[Ian]

TJ, the assumption was that 49, 57, and 74 were given #1's...

 

[T J]

TJ, the assumption was that 49, 57, and 74 were given #1's...

Expected so Ian.

Am with you in your comment. Glad you posted it.

 

[lobo lion]

Assuming Bo goes 174.
Assuming Cassar is ready at 197.
Assuming new starters will be initially ranked conservatively.
Knowing the only rankings that matter are in March:

Anyone want to take a guess ?

Suriano - 9th
Cortez - 8th
Jimmy G - 12th
ZPain - 1st
Nolf - 1st
Joseph - 9th
Bo - 1st
Shakur / Mouse - 11th
Cassar - 12th
Nevills - 10th

Pretty good list. I doubt that Nevills will make the preseason top-10 list given his performance last season. I think he is ultimately a top-10 heavyweight for the coming season, but it will take time to get up there.

 

[dunkej01]

Assuming Bo goes 174.
Assuming Cassar is ready at 197.
Assuming new starters will be initially ranked conservatively.
Knowing the only rankings that matter are in March:

Anyone want to take a guess ?

Suriano - 9th
Cortez - 8th
Jimmy G - 12th
ZPain - 1st
Nolf - 1st
Joseph - 9th
Bo - 1st
Shakur / Mouse - 11th
Cassar - 12th
Nevills - 10th

I would have no problem with Suri (we need a nickname) and Cenzo in the 12-18 range given historical starting places.

Cortez at 6-10 range is fair for now.

Jimmy 8-12 fair

Mouse 7-14 fair

Corey 12-18 fair

Cassar top 20 ok, even low to mid 20s would be fair. Same for stoudt to start

Nevills 10-14 ok with.

Nolf and Zain No.1

BoN at 1, but expect to BoJ in a few early rankings at No. 1 too. Makes no difference to me here.

 

[1stplacehawk]

Suriano will not be ranked in any preseason poll. He has wrestled zero college matches

 

[burnsie1983]

Suriano will not be ranked in any preseason poll. He has wrestled zero college matches

Doesn't Flo rank true freshmen? I bet they rank him.

 

[1stplacehawk]

Doesn't Flo rank true freshmen? I bet they rank him.

Flo ranks redshirts

 

[dunkej01]

Flo ranks redshirts

most rules I know of are either broken or exceptions are made for.

the kid is clearly our starter and I might be bias but I think our room grants him a pass.

 

[edquinn06]

CP probably won't rank him tell he gets a quality win against a ranked guy.

 

[NYWRESTLER94]

CP probably won't rank him tell he gets a quality win against a ranked guy.

So he's zeroed in on Thomas Gilman

 

[Ja1339]

Suriano will not be ranked in any preseason poll. He has wrestled zero college matches

Nick lost zero matches and suffered 1 takedown in 4 years in NJ. If he's isn't ranked, well then, really what good are the rankings?

 

[april racer]

Suriano will not be ranked. It is based on college accompaniments. He has zero. CP will move him up quickly and accordingly if he wrestles like expected.

 

[1stplacehawk]

Nick lost zero matches and suffered 1 takedown in 4 years in NJ. If he's isn't ranked, well then, really what good are the rankings?

He will certainly be one of the top 20 wrestlers in the country the second he steps on the mat, but high school accomplishments don't get you ranked in college

 

[Ian]

Top 5 at end of December.

 

[El-Jefe]

Top 5 at end of December.

By then he will have faced Schram and Cruz, plus whomever is entered at the Keystone Classic and Reno (Piccinnini among others). If he's still undefeated, top 5 isn't far-fetched.

 

[tikk10]

Just rewatched that marathon Suriano Fix overtime match from last year. I don't know how far Suriano's going to go this year but I can't see him losing by more than two points in any match he's in. He's next to impossible to take down, and he's as ripped as anyone at 125. Still hesitates to shoot but I imagine he'll start to see offensive openings better with time in the room.

 

[Ja1339]

He will certainly be one of the top 20 wrestlers in the country the second he steps on the mat, but high school accomplishments don't get you ranked in college

If the rankings can't tell us who should be in the top 20, then I'd argue the rankings aren't very useful.

 

[NYWRESTLER94]

By then he will have faced Schram and Cruz, plus whomever is entered at the Keystone Classic and Reno (Piccinnini among others). If he's still undefeated, top 5 isn't far-fetched.

I don't think picc will be at Reno because the scuffle isn't that many days away. They've usually sent their backups to that and a couple of guys who also wrestle in the scuffle

 

[Sean Harp]

Top 5 at end of December.

That would mean Suriano is undefeated having collected pelts from Connor Schram, Darian Cruz, and possibly Nick Piccolo (Jenny's younger brother) in Reno.

Man, I'm a homer but that is a tall order. Even Nico couldn't major Schram or Cruz last year. Nick P (One Piccininni, Two Piccininni, BLITZ!) has had the benefit of a year in a big boy room.

Come New Year, I'd be happy if Bob from Accounting (cross thread, yo!) were in the top ten and healthy.

 

[Sean Harp]

Bollocks! I should have read El Jefe's response first. My bad.

 

[a_mshaffer]

rankings or predictions. there is a difference. Hang on, he'll be ranked when it counts.

If the rankings can't tell us who should be in the top 20, then I'd argue the rankings aren't very useful.

 

[SetonHallPirate]

I don't think picc will be at Reno because the scuffle isn't that many days away. They've usually sent their backups to that and a couple of guys who also wrestle in the scuffle

Last time Oklahoma State sent a full team to Reno was 2014. That year, the following guys wrestled in both events (and Reno was three days later that year than it is this year):

125: None
133: Crutchmer, Harding
141: Dolan, Heil
149: None
157: Collica, Koo
165: C. Rogers
174: J. Rogers
184: Boyd
197: Bean, Schafer
285: None

Based on this, not sure I expect all of the starters to show up at both, but I'd bet you'll probably get (at a minimum) a half-dozen guys who show up at both...especially given that the Cowboys wrestle Cornell the Friday night before Reno (disclaimer: I'll be at all of the 2016-17 events listed in this post).

 

[El-Jefe]

Oh boy, I can hardly wait for the annual rankings vs. predictions debate.

 

[21Guns]

After a few matches:

Suriano: 6th
Cortez: 5th
Gulibon: 10th
Zain: 1st
Jason: 1st
Cenzo: 5th
Bo: 1st
Mouse/Shakur: 9th
Cassar: 15th
Nevills: 11th

 

[slushhead]

If the rankings can't tell us who should be in the top 20, then I'd argue the rankings aren't very useful.

rankings or predictions. there is a difference. Hang on, he'll be ranked when it counts.

But here is the thing -- rankings are not "used" for anything beyond fan discussion. They do not "count" for anything. Not for seeding at Nationals, nor for any of the qualifying tournaments. No bonuses or other payouts. Just discussion.

 

[redblades]

But here is the thing -- rankings are not "used" for anything beyond fan discussion. They do not "count" for anything. Not for seeding at Nationals, nor for any of the qualifying tournaments. No bonuses or other payouts. Just discussion.

Actually - the Coaches' Rankings ARE used as a component in NCAA qualification and seeding criteria (1 of 3 criterion to determine automatic qualifiers); and it's not a stretch, IMO, to think that Coaches' Rankings might be influenced by some of the other ranking services (Maybe Intermat, TOM, SHP's Computer Index?).

 

[matter7172]

Still hesitates to shoot but I imagine he'll start to see offensive openings better with time in the room.

I don't know if that's true anymore (the hesitation to shoot). I think he may have learned a lesson from his loss at the Journeymen's Fall Classic last year. We shall see.

 

[NoVa Lion]

Actually - the Coaches' Rankings ARE used as a component in NCAA qualification and seeding criteria (1 of 3 criterion to determine automatic qualifiers); and it's not a stretch, IMO, to think that Coaches' Rankings might be influenced by some of the other ranking services (Maybe Intermat, TOM, SHP's Computer Index?).

The first coaches ranking doesn't come until some time in January right? So by then you have the results from half or more of the season which makes all the preseason rankings moot. Also, I doubt to many D1 coaches spend much, if any, time looking at rankings. They already have 80+ hours of work to do each week during the season.

 

[tikk10]

I don't know if that's true anymore (the hesitation to shoot). I think he may have learned a lesson from his loss at the Journeymen's Fall Classic last year. We shall see.

He definitely showed more O in the rematch a month later against Arujau. It's not that he doesn't have the ability to generate offense, it's maybe (and I'm wildly speculating here) that he doesn't trust that he's as good as he is. But you look at some of the scrambles he came out on top in that match against Fix, and you get the sense that maybe the coaches would encourage him to initiate those sequences more. The PSU coaching staff doesn't push guys to one style but if there's any commonality across the team it's that the guys aren't afraid to give up takedowns. The video on him over the years suggests a guy who didn't have that view. Sky's the ceiling for Suriano though, in my opinion, and he's in the right place to grow.

 

[El-Jefe]

The first coaches ranking doesn't come until some time in January right? So by then you have the results from half or more of the season which makes all the preseason rankings moot. Also, I doubt to many D1 coaches spend much, if any, time looking at rankings. They already have 80+ hours of work to do each week during the season.

At least in football, a lot of "coach's" ballots are done by interns.

 

[RoarLions1]

Actually - the Coaches' Rankings ARE used as a component in NCAA qualification and seeding criteria (1 of 3 criterion to determine automatic qualifiers); and it's not a stretch, IMO, to think that Coaches' Rankings might be influenced by some of the other ranking services (Maybe Intermat, TOM, SHP's Computer Index?).

I don't think it's a stretch that they use the ranking services at all. Everyone might find it interesting that the Coaches Ranking is a compilation of only a few coaches doing the rankings. Each of the 8 Conferences have 1 Coach rank 1 weight class. In the Big Ten, for example, the 10 weight classes are each done by only 1 Coach. In 2016, Cael had 125, Tony Ersland had 133, Barry Davis had 141, Jim Heffernan had 149, etc. Not much work to only rate the top-33 guys at a single weight class, until you consider that they don't get to see half or so of the wrestlers during a year. They'll have to use the ranking services.

 

[21Guns]

Somebody needs to tell the gang(haters) over at TheMat that Bo Nickal is going at 174 and Mouse at 184....the haters are out in full force predicting a Tan Bed U. national championship, while putting Bo at 184, Mouse at 197, and Shakur at 174. They also have Nato rolling to a title over Clark, Richards, Cortez, and everyone else, and they have KeShawn Hayes in the finals over McKenna, Ashnault, Jimmy, and everyone else also. I think one of the five is ACTUALLY a real tan bed fan, the rest, of course, just hate PSU, lmao.

 

[Media Fan]

So what. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but actions today and always speak much louder than words.

 

[21Guns]

So what. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but actions today and always speak much louder than words.

Yes they do.

5 titles in 6 years is pretty good for "actions".

 

[diggerpup]

Back to this topic ...

.... After the latest FLO podcast, sounds like they're gonna rank our guys very conservatively starting out, citing a limited body of work will trump potential.

I'm guessing FLO will have:

125 - Suriano - Unranked (TrueFR)
133 - Cortez - 10th-15th
141 - Jimmy G - 10th-15th
149 - ZPain #1
157 - Nolf #1
165 - V. Joseph - 12th-20th
174 - Bo #1 / Cutch or Rasheed 10th-15th
184 - Bo Top 5 / Cutch or Rasheed 10th-15th
197 - Cassar / Stout ... Probably Unranked
285 - Nevills 15th to Unranked (previous injury)

Add up all those (lack of) points, and brace yourself for FLO giving PSU a preseason tournament ranking from 8th to 12th or so.

( PS - and before Roar & a few others say 'rankings don't matter in October', I say "Yeah, I know - this is just a discussion point & not the end of the world - it is a message & discussion board last time I checked )