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Seven Years Ago Today

I think the testimony of V13-16, V20-24, and V27-31 would corroborate the allegations. It wasn't necessary at the first trial.

Why were the guys not asks to testify at the first trial? The prosecution only brought V9 and V10 to testify. V9s testimony contradicted Aaron Fisher’s. V10, who didn’t even know Sandusky on a personal level, contradicted his testimony in a post-trial media appearance. Half of the post trial accusers also did not know Sandusky personally. I see no indication that any of these guys are even close to credible.
 
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You never say what evidence you are looking for. You go on and on about this report or that report, some book that Bob Costas endorses, how some of the victims maintained relationships with him, that he wasn’t found to have pornography, etc..... You disingenuously say that his inexplicable showering activities with underage boys were a bad choice when you know damn well that no grown man would ever be in that situation unless they were getting off on it. You know better than that. You ask any grown man that you know if they would have ever put themselves in that situation after being investigated by police for it previously and not one of them would say yes. People like you are the reason people don’t come out when they have been sexually abused. It’s not worth it for them to deal with deniers like you. It’s easier for them to just bury the pain then doubling up on the pain by having people like you deny them.

Here is another notable case from Central PA. A 12 year old girl accused his mother’s boyfriend of lying on top of her in bed and rocking back and forth. The guy was questioned by police and gave them an answer even worse than the one Sandusky gave to Costas: “What consequences are there if there’s no penetration”. The jury decided he was not guilty. If behavior that weird doesn’t automatically result in a guilty verdict, I’m not sure how you can say the same about horsing around in a communal shower.

http://www.altoonamirror.com/news/l...VDZtRxN6IagLO6P9mz5SJv2AznXQsmWm4z3zakYJTYJLQ

As for your last couple sentences, do you ever think it’s appropriate to point out falsehoods and contradictions in the stories of sexual abuse accusers?
 
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Here's a quiz for you guys. Which of the following happened in the Dec 2000 to Feb 9, 2001 time frame?
  1. QB Kerry Collins played in his 1st and only Super Bowl.
  2. Wally Richardson played QB for NY/NJ in the inaugural XFL game in Vegas against He Hate Me.
  3. QB Rashad Casey's scramble vs. Illinois was named the ESPN college play of the year.
  4. Fran Ganter's son, Chris, signs with PSU to play QB.
  5. QB Michael Robinson signs with PSU
I'd guess all of them.....
 
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Right, if each case was looked at individually, there's not enough evidence to convict. They needed multiple victims to have any prayer. I do think several of the convictions would get tossed with a new trial. And if just one of the repressed memory cases is fraudulent, then it would open it up for a full acquittal.

If it shown that Sandusky has committed individual acts of CSA, then all of the times that Sandusky got the least bit physical (hand of the knee when driving, horsing around in the swimming pool, wrestling, blowing raspberries, bear hugging, showering) he is very likely grooming or worse. On the other hand, if it can’t be shown that Sandusky committed individual acts of CSA, then there is no evidence that Sandusky’s physical touching had a sexual component and is CSA and against the law.

Let me repeat that I find Sandusky’s touching to be inappropriate and extremely bad judgment especially in light of being investigated for CSA previously.

However in light of his patently unfair trial and the limited (if any) credible evidence of CSA, I believe that Sandusky deserves a presumption of innocence. I know that isn’t going to happen. I just hope that the courts treat him fairly going forward. If that happens, I am confident that Sandusky will be exonerated.
 
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Right, if each case was looked at individually, there's not enough evidence to convict. They needed multiple victims to have any prayer. I do think several of the convictions would get tossed with a new trial. And if just one of the repressed memory cases is fraudulent, then it would open it up for a full acquittal.
Regardless of Sandusky's guilt or innocence, repressed memory is fraudulent by nature. Should never be allowed in court.
 
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If any is true, Jerry is where he belongs.

I agree. The problem is that if none are true then Jerry is a victim of a miscarriage of justice. Given that Jerry's trial was patently unfair and that there is little to no credible individual evidence that Jerry committed CSA that would stand on its own to convict Jerry, then there is good chance that none are true. Regardless of whether or not you buy in to the OAG narratives, Jerry still deserves a fair trial and the presumption of innocence.
 
Let me repeat that I find Sandusky’s touching to be inappropriate and extremely bad judgment especially in light of being investigated for CSA previously.

And Dr. Swimtrunks should have done something about that.
 
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And Dr. Swimtrunks should have done something about that.

People like to say that, but there were no allegations of Jerry ever doing anything inappropriate in a shower afterward, so Jack Raykowitz’s advice must have worked.

Same with Bruce Heim. The guys gets a lot of flak for allowing Sandusky to use the Hilton Pool after he was no longer allowed to bring boys to Lasch, but no accuser alleged abuse in the Hilton pool
 
When you have no case to support your "guilty" statements, you always seem to go back to generalities which can not be verified.

First...get a grip on the "..showering activities with underage boys...". We have ONE 1997 incident which was investigated and found legally, morally and socially FINE. In 2001 (most likely Dec 29, 2000) we have a "boy in the shower" who is a fiction of MM. Why would MM create a "sexual" incident when in 2001 (his meeting with Paterno/ C/S/S) no one who MM spoke to - that is AT LEAST 5 people: including friends and family - told him that a crime was was NOT committed - In fact CSA only appeared as a component of MM's "Story" after 2011 when he was "interviewed" by PA investigators. So why did MM have multiple versions of what he saw? You only need to look at the KNOWN AND CERTIFIED manner that this entire case was conducted. MM was coerced into providing what the State needed to support its fictitious account of criminality in PSU's football program. This is validated of illegal tampering with the facts of the case is 100% supported by the tapes and perjury charges that the State of PA "conveniently" ignored.

This was and is a "Hit Job" and a criminal conspiracy that involves multiple PA officials. Its motives are much more compelling that what the Public believes is PSU's motives. The state's motives include Personal abuse of power by a Governor/OAG (a personal vendetta) AND $60M + in slush funds available to the criminal politicians.

Get over it - all the generalizations you state can't cover up the REAL facts of this case.
Political corruption here in Pa? I don't believe it. ;)

https://wnep.com/2019/07/01/scranton-mayor-bill-courtright-to-resign/

Scranton Mayor Bill Courtright Resigns After Federal Plea Deal on Corruption Charges
  • Stacy Lange
  • 4 hours ago
bill-courtright.jpeg

Bill Courtright


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SCRANTON, Pa. -- Scranton Mayor Bill Courtright has entered into a plea agreement on three federal charges, including bribery, conspiracy, and attempt to obstruct commerce by extortion.

Courtright resigned Monday, according to a memo sent to members of Scranton City Council.




Minutes after Courtright filed his letter of resignation, city officials were in an emergency meeting discussing what comes next.

Newswatch 16 was there as that meeting ended. According to city rules, council president Pat Rogan will be acting mayor until council appoints someone to fill out the mayor's term.

"Went through what the parameters are in this situation. As council president, I'll be the acting mayor until a permanent mayor is chosen by council, so there won't be any changes to city services, to residents. Police are still going to be working. Our firehouse will be staffed. Garbage will be picked up, so the residents aren't going to see any change. We did have a good meeting with our solicitors, how it's spelled out in the home-rule charter, and then we'll take it from there," said councilman Pat Rogan.

Rumors started swirling about Courtright's possible resignation earlier this year when his office and home were both targeted in an FBI raid.

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We now know Courtright plans to enter a plea agreement with federal prosecutors. He's facing charges of bribery, conspiracy, and attempt to obstruct commerce by extortion.

Courtright could see a lengthy prison sentence and may have to pay $750,000 in fines.

Court documents show that the alleged corruption stretched over the entirety of Courtright's five and a half years as mayor. Prosecutors claim Courtright received cash payments, campaign contributions, even landscaping work at his home from businesses looking to do work in the city.

Courtright's accused of keeping businesses from working in the city if they did not support him or his campaign.

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City Hall was somber after the news broke. Some employees were seen wiping tears from their eyes. Officials say despite it all, all departments will continue to function.

"I absolutely am proud of what we've accomplished in the last four years, five and a half, actually. At this point, I'm just letting the facts come out and develop as they're going to over the next coming weeks and I'll keep my personal feelings to myself," said city solicitor Jessica Eskra.

U.S. Attorney David Freed says Courtright is expected in federal court Tuesday morning in Williamsport and that appearance will be followed up by a news conference in Scranton.

Courtright was re-elected last year to a second term as mayor.
 
https://www.apnews.com/a1776d93d79b4d9ab04b1a90d7b813dd



“But..... but..... but....... all these contracts are put out for bids!!”

Nothing to see here :)

Or at PSU



F-ing Morons. Ugh.
Word to the wise. They can all become bus drivers after prison. :eek:

Ex-Lackawanna official granted prison furlough


BY BORYS KRAWCZENIUK, STAFF WRITER / PUBLISHED: JUNE 17, 2019
SHARE THIS

MICHAEL J. MULLEN / TIMES-SHAMROCK Former Lackawanna County Commissioner Robert Cordaro was sentenced to 11 years in prison in 2011.

Once a lawyer, radio station owner and Lackawanna County commissioner, federal inmate Robert Cordaro may soon be a licensed truck or bus driver.

Federal prison officials will furlough Cordaro between July 8 and 26, according to a notification provided to the County of Lackawanna Transit System, a victim of Cordaro’s crimes.

“While on furlough, the inmate will be in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania,” the notification says. “Releasing on furlough for day trips to participate in CDL program.”

A CDL is a commercial driver’s license, one necessary to drive trucks or passenger buses.

A Dunmore native, Cordaro, 58, remains an inmate at the federal prison in Schuylkill County, still serving an 11-year sentence on corruption charges.

“Inmate Cordaro will return to the institution nightly and on weekends,” the notification says.

Cordaro, whose sentence began Jan. 31, 2012, is scheduled for release on Oct. 3, 2021,a release date that assumes continued good behavior.

After a June 2011 trial, a jury convicted Cordaro of 18 of 33 counts, including extortion, racketeering and money laundering and his fellow commissioner, A.J. Munchak, of eight of 21 counts, including extortion. Witnesses said both men, while still commissioners, extorted tens of thousands of dollars in cash from county contractors.

Munchak, 72, was sentenced to seven years in prison, was released in May 2018.

COLTS was a Cordaro victim, trial testimony showed, because he insisted the agency replace an existing engineering firm on its downtown Scranton transit center with another engineering firm, Highland Associates, which paid $90,000 to Cordaro and Munchak. The federal government forced COLTS to repay $907,000 in grants on the transit center because the transit agency did not seek proposals for a new engineer before hiring Highland.

Contact the writer:

bkrawczeniuk@timesshamrock.com; 570-348-9147

http://www.citizensvoice.com/news/ex-lackawanna-official-granted-prison-furlough-1.2497424
 
Good sports talk

https://www.mcall.com/news/breaking/mc-nws-pa-corruption-scranton-city-hall-20190120-story.html
'Like shooting fish in a barrel' former Crime Commission head says as Lackawanna probes heat up
By BORYS KRAWCZENIUK AND TERRIE MORGAN-BESECKER
OF THE SCRANTON TIMES-TRIBUNE
JAN 21, 2019 | 3:08 PM
SCRANTON




State and federal investigations of Lackawanna County’s three largest local governments may evoke a feeling of deja vu.

Frederick Martens, who headed the now-defunct Pennsylvania Crime Commission, which investigated organized crime, is surprised by the long lull between major corruption cases in Northeast Pennsylvania — not that investigators are here again.

“It’s 10 years since anything’s been discovered,” Martens said. “It’s like shooting fish in a barrel in Pennsylvania. You just turn over a rock. You are guaranteed to find something.”


A decade ago, federal prosecutors snagged 30 people as part of investigations into corruption that focused heavily on the three largest Luzerne County governments — the county, Wilkes-Barre and Wilkes-Barre Area School District. In Lackawanna County, the feds nabbed only six, but they are back and this time state agents are poking around, too.

[More News] Watch for your Pennsylvania property tax rebate »
Already, the state agents arrested eight people with a promise of more.



This time, all three of Lackawanna County’s largest local governments — the county, Scranton and Scranton School District — face the harsh glare of state and federal criminal investigations.

Whether the latest investigations produce a bounty for prosecutors in Lackawanna County similar to Luzerne County remains unclear. What has happened so far hints at something larger and reinforces the long-standing belief about the corrupt nature of Northeast Pennsylvania politics.


“If you grow up in this area and you see people engaging in politics to enrich themselves and they don’t get caught ... you are basically schooled on how to go along to get along,” said Thomas Baldino, a political science professor at Wilkes University.


David Sosar, a political science professor at King’s College, said a “coal-cracker” mentality still plagues the region.

“We were under the thumb of coal barons for a long time,” he said. “What we did is trade coal barons for financial barons and political barons.”

Too few people are willing to speak up when they see something wrong, partly out of fear, which is an attitude that survived the coal era, Sosar said


“There are the rich, the wealthy and powerful and then there is you at the bottom,” Sosar said. “To get along, you didn’t ask questions or cause problems. They controlled too much.”

[More News] Scranton mayor resigns, faces charges of extortion, bribery »
To date, state attorney general’s office agents arrested seven former Lackawanna County Prison guards and the Scranton School District’s former fleet manager. FBI agents raided Scranton Mayor Bill Courtright’s home and City Hall, but have not charged the mayor or anyone else. Courtright’s private attorney, Paul Walker, said he believes the probe relates to campaign finances and the mayor denies any wrongdoing.

Law enforcement agents need search warrants approved by a judge to conduct raids, and the warrants require providing at least some proof of a crime. Once investigators get warrants, charges usually follow, local criminal defense lawyers said.

“They operate with the assumption that they will find something there,” said Harrisburg attorney William A. Fetterhoff, a longtime white-collar crime defense lawyer who defended corruption cases against state legislators and other officials.


That investigators might find something in the local cases will shock no one, based on past history.


The guilty in Luzerne County included former county Commissioner Greg Skrepenak and three former county judges, Michael Conahan, Mark Ciavarella and Michael Toole. Skrepenak and the judges went to prison; Conahan and Ciavarella remain there.

In Lackawanna County, of the six people federal authorities arrested, they successfully prosecuted county Commissioners Robert Cordaro and A.J. Munchak, as well as former state Senate Democratic Leader Robert J. Mellow and two others in separate cases. One man was acquitted. Only Cordaro remains in prison.

The first signal of the new wave of possible wrongdoing happened in September 2017, when agents from the state police and attorney general’s office raided the county’s Administration Building, jail and work release center. Five months later, in February 2018, the attorney general’s office charged seven current and former prison guards with sexually abusing female inmates or having inappropriate contact with them.

None of the cases of the guards arrested — John Shnipes, George T. McHale, Jeffrey T. Staff, James J. Walsh, Paul J. Voglino, Mark A. Johnson and George R. Efthimiou — have reached the trial stage.


The Scranton School District faced scrutiny next. In October 2017, state Auditor General Eugene DePasquale issued an audit that blasted the school district for piling up a massive deficit and dysfunctional operation.

The audit found the district paid more than $672,000 for work on vehicles to its fleet manager, Daniel Sansky, between 2010 and 2016. DePasquale referred the case to the attorney general’s office, whose agents raided Sansky’s Scranton car repair shop in May.

In September, they charged Sansky, 67, a Jefferson Township resident, with overbilling taxpayers — including spending $53,000 to replace 114 tires over a 40-month period on one 2014 garbage truck — and charging the school district for working on the personal vehicles of at least a dozen unidentified district employees and officials.

Two months later, state agents returned and raided the offices of the district transportation director and school board secretary. They left with computers and boxes of records.

The Jan. 9 raid of Courtright’s West Mountain home and City Hall stunned his supporters.

“I have known the mayor for quite some time and he has always been an honest person, both personally and professionally,” said Gene Hickey, a former lawyer for city government, including during Courtright’s five-year tenure. “He never asked me to do anything other than what was legal, regardless of any political fallout. I would tell everyone to let the process play out and stop the rumors and gossiping.”

Beyond confirming the raids, the FBI won’t say anything about its investigation’s focus.

The day after the guards’ arrests, Attorney General Josh Shapiro called it “the opening chapter” in trying to end abusive prison culture. The grand jury presentment charging the guards mentions others who knew about abuse but may have done nothing about it, though Shapiro declined to speculate then about charging them.

Joe Grace, Shapiro’s chief spokesman, declined to comment on the possibility of more arrests in the prison case.
 
I thought this thread was supposed to be about Bobby Bonilla and how he is paid over $1M a year for doing nothing.

Sorry for stumbling into the thread
 
Why were the guys not asks to testify at the first trial? The prosecution only brought V9 and V10 to testify. V9s testimony contradicted Aaron Fisher’s. V10, who didn’t even know Sandusky on a personal level, contradicted his testimony in a post-trial media appearance. Half of the post trial accusers also did not know Sandusky personally. I see no indication that any of these guys are even close to credible.

V10 is an interesting example. Jerry offered no counter at trial to his testimony. If his story is "weakest" and Jerry couldn't counter it, that's s good indicator of guilt.
 
V10 is an interesting example. Jerry offered no counter at trial to his testimony. If his story is "weakest" and Jerry couldn't counter it, that's s good indicator of guilt.

Okay, it appears you are operating under the unconstitutional concept of he didn’t testify therefore he must be guilty. But even so, what counter could he possibly provide other than I never met that man? Dottie stated she never met him (but did state she knew every other accuser). Was she lying? And if so, why not also lie about not knowing the others? Also, No other accuser could confirm that Jerry ever drove a silver convertible, in which V10 claims his abuse took place. And V10 claimed abuse during the same time period as V3, V4, V5, V6, and V7.
 
Okay, it appears you are operating under the unconstitutional concept of he didn’t testify therefore he must be guilty. But even so, what counter could he possibly provide other than I never met that man? Dottie stated she never met him (but did state she knew every other accuser). Was she lying? And if so, why not also lie about not knowing the others? Also, No other accuser could confirm that Jerry ever drove a silver convertible, in which V10 claims his abuse took place. And V10 claimed abuse during the same time period as V3, V4, V5, V6, and V7.

So the counter is that Dottie said he didn't have a "silver" convertible. Did he own a grey convertible? Did he enter pennDoT records into evidence?

Did he show logs of times when he notified TSM of off-campus 1 on 1 visits? The absence of V10 in the logs would be good evidence.... but he didn't make any such logs for anyone.

Did he have a rolodex or other list with contact info (the police would have that preserved from the search. If v10 wasn't in there, that'd be an indicator. But he didn't ... because V10 was probably in the rolodex.

There are likely call records that could be presented from the time frame establishing no calls from Jerry to V10s number... but they weren't presented.

Just an example, for the "weakest" accuser. Jerry made no attempt to put anything on the record for a Jury (and later, appeals courts) to work with.

So, he sits in prison.
 
V10 is an interesting example. Jerry offered no counter at trial to his testimony. If his story is "weakest" and Jerry couldn't counter it, that's s good indicator of guilt.

It appears that you might be attempting to make a claim that v10 (RR) made credible claims that Sandusky abused him that could stand on the own to convict Sandusky. If that is what you are attempting, you are not even close. I would love to see him testify at a new trial. I am confident that his story would easily be shown to not hold water.

I don’t believe RR’s accusations are at all credible. There was no contemporaneous reports and RR’s story got worse over time. There is a serious question of whether that Jerry and Dottie even know RR.RR has a rap sheet that includes burglary and assault so he is character is questionable at a minimum. His silver convertible story is easily refuted. I will give 3 sources of information on RR. From framingpaterno, from Professor Crews’ book review, and from an observer from trial.

http://www.framingpaterno.com/important-facts-about-each-sandusky-accuser-media-never-told-you

Victim #10:

§ Was added to the case after Sandusky was arrested after calling the hotline number and only claiming having been groped in a pool.

§ He came to his allegation after speaking with his friend, Victim #3.

§ He was twice incarcerated for burglary and assault.

§ His timeline would also have required Sandusky to miss significant practice time at Penn State, for which there is no evidence whatsoever. It also appears to overlap the story of Victim 4.

§ He claimed to have been abused in a silver convertible, which does not exist in this case.

§ He claims to have met Dottie Sandusky but she does not know who this person is.

§ Contradicted himself at trial with regard to Sandusky’s demeanor when he refused to give in to Sandusky’s sexual demands.


RR/v10 as described in Professor Frederick Crews’s review of “The Most Hated Man in America” in skeptic magazine


https://www.skeptic.com/reading_roo...cxdNHHqzLh3KIkKjQeftGxtLCpWM-Gp1pEBylvQpJAxpg

RR (b. 1988) had attended a Second Mile camp, but neither Jerry nor Dottie Sandusky could recall ever having met him. He hadn’t turned out well, having been incarcerated for burglary in 2004 and again in 2007 for having robbed, beaten, and permanently injured an elderly man. He was probably hard up for money when the Sandusky hotline posed an opportunity for sudden improvement in his fortunes.

Unlike the accusers who had felt Sandusky’s kindness and may have suffered pangs of conscience about betraying him, RR wholeheartedly embraced the role of prosecution witness. He had seen Sandusky once or twice a month, he stated, through 1997, 1998, and part of 1999, and on nearly every occasion the man had made sexual contact with him. At last, supposedly, they had begun to take turns committing fellatio.

RR’s story, fitting the general pattern, was a tissue of physical, temporal, and motivational absurdities. But the jury, without having been shown that Sandusky and RR were even acquainted, found it compelling. Indeed, the jurors believed all eight of the Second Mile veterans who testified—forming, collectively, a portrait of a man with little time to do anything but scurry from one unreported molestation to the next. Even v1 and v9 would have had to take turns getting ravaged in Sandusky’s basement, as their supposed ordeals there overlapped between 2005 and 2008.


This observations are from a trial observer.

RR (v10) DOB 1998

Attorney: Andrew Shubin

Spoke with friend JS (v3) before allegations. Was roommates with him during 98 Second Mile camp.

In 1998 RR lived in Moshannon with his mother, stepfather and stepbrother. He last saw his father at the age of four. He attended Second Mile in 1997, 98, 99 . In 98 his roommate was JS (v3). In ’98 he was placed in foster care with Cheryl Sharer in Milesburg and attended his second Second Mile summer Camp. After being in the foster home for eleven months he lived with grandparents in Maryland and later lived again with his mother and stepfather.

He was incarcerated twice. For burglary in 2004, age 17, and in September of 2007 for burglary and assault. He and a 17 year old attacked an elderly man on the street, punched him in the face leaving him with permanent injuries, and robbed him of his backpack which held a camera and three books but no money. He was sentenced for 21 months and served until 2009. At time of trial he was married and his wife was pregnant.

November, December 2011

Following the arrest on November 5, 2011, Linda Kelly published a hotline number which RR called.

At the first interview with Sgt. Cranga, he told him he knew JS (v3), and that Sandusky. had groped him in the pool. He did not tell Cranga anything about oral sex.

During the second interview, he said that he performed oral sex on Sandusky. in a silver convertible. The Sandusky’s never owned any kind of convertible.

In the Grand Jury, he told them Sandusky demanded oral sex but he refused and then Sandusky got quiet. At trial he said that Sandusky demanded oral sex and he refused and Sandusky made a threat and got angry, then apologized and told RR he loved him. When confronted with his dissimilar stories, he resolved it by saying Sandusky was quiet but had a displeasing look on his face.

June 22, 2012

New stories emerge during trial. RR described being invited to a football game. At some point in time, although he couldn’t remember days or times or connected events, he was taken to the basement and after wrestling around, and Sandusky abruptly and silently pull his shorts down and began to perform oral sex on him. His reaction to that was to freak out, get nervous and scared. It lasted a couple of minutes. Sandusky went upstairs after the couple minutes. RR said Sandusky told him if he ever told anybody he would never see his family again. Later Sandusky apologized to RR and told him he loved him. On cross he said Dorothy was in the house. He said he went to Jerry’s house five times. RR said that Sandusky reached up inside his shorts as he was sitting on his shoulders in the pool, and grabbed his genitals. He testified that after a trip to Nittany Mall he was taken to the house and had oral sex performed on him and he returned the favor. He was taken home to Ms. Sharer’s after that. He did not tell her about the event. He never told anybody because he was scared, ashamed and embarrassed.

Upon questioning by Amendola RR regarding the attack in the basement story, trying to pin down a time, RR said the first time he went to the Sandusky residence was in 1997 before a football game and there were other children and his wife. Next he said the first time he went to the house nobody was there, not even Mrs. Sandusky. He said he did not tell JS (v3), his roommate that Sandusky grabbed his genitals in the pool during camp in 98. When asked to provide information about the alleged times JS picked him up and took him to his home to assault him, RR was vague and said he couldn’t recall days. RR said usually later in the afternoon to evening time, nobody else was in the home and he was always taken home at night. This is an unlikely scenario due to Sandusky’s duties as Penn State Coach during fall when RR alleges abuse.

On cross, RR strayed from saying abuse only happened in 98 and included 99. Confronted with a statement on an application to attend the 2000 Second Mile Camp, indicating he enjoyed the camps, he said that was a wrong statement.

RR’S testimony was inconsistent and contained obvious fabrications.


Does anyone what to take a stab and explain why they think RR’s(v10) testimony is credible and can easily stands on its own to convict Sandusky on his own? My guess is that at a minimum, one would have to do a lot of stretching to make that case. Anybody else want to take a stab and make the case for another specific claimant that can provides a story that makes a credible accusation of CSA by Sandusky sufficient enough to convict Sandusky on its own?

This basic question has been asked consistenly for the past few years. It has been asked many times in this thread and I don't believe anybody has come with anything close to credible evidence that would be capable of convicting Sandusky of CSA on its own. Does anybody else think that this revelation says something?
 
It appears that you might be attempting to make a claim that v10 (RR) made credible claims that Sandusky abused him that could stand on the own to convict Sandusky. If that is what you are attempting, you are not even close. I would love to see him testify at a new trial. I am confident that his story would easily be shown to not hold water.

I don’t believe RR’s accusations are at all credible. There was no contemporaneous reports and RR’s story got worse over time. There is a serious question of whether that Jerry and Dottie even know RR.RR has a rap sheet that includes burglary and assault so he is character is questionable at a minimum. His silver convertible story is easily refuted. I will give 3 sources of information on RR. From framingpaterno, from Professor Crews’ book review, and from an observer from trial.

http://www.framingpaterno.com/important-facts-about-each-sandusky-accuser-media-never-told-you

Victim #10:

§ Was added to the case after Sandusky was arrested after calling the hotline number and only claiming having been groped in a pool.

§ He came to his allegation after speaking with his friend, Victim #3.

§ He was twice incarcerated for burglary and assault.

§ His timeline would also have required Sandusky to miss significant practice time at Penn State, for which there is no evidence whatsoever. It also appears to overlap the story of Victim 4.

§ He claimed to have been abused in a silver convertible, which does not exist in this case.

§ He claims to have met Dottie Sandusky but she does not know who this person is.

§ Contradicted himself at trial with regard to Sandusky’s demeanor when he refused to give in to Sandusky’s sexual demands.


RR/v10 as described in Professor Frederick Crews’s review of “The Most Hated Man in America” in skeptic magazine


https://www.skeptic.com/reading_roo...cxdNHHqzLh3KIkKjQeftGxtLCpWM-Gp1pEBylvQpJAxpg

RR (b. 1988) had attended a Second Mile camp, but neither Jerry nor Dottie Sandusky could recall ever having met him. He hadn’t turned out well, having been incarcerated for burglary in 2004 and again in 2007 for having robbed, beaten, and permanently injured an elderly man. He was probably hard up for money when the Sandusky hotline posed an opportunity for sudden improvement in his fortunes.

Unlike the accusers who had felt Sandusky’s kindness and may have suffered pangs of conscience about betraying him, RR wholeheartedly embraced the role of prosecution witness. He had seen Sandusky once or twice a month, he stated, through 1997, 1998, and part of 1999, and on nearly every occasion the man had made sexual contact with him. At last, supposedly, they had begun to take turns committing fellatio.

RR’s story, fitting the general pattern, was a tissue of physical, temporal, and motivational absurdities. But the jury, without having been shown that Sandusky and RR were even acquainted, found it compelling. Indeed, the jurors believed all eight of the Second Mile veterans who testified—forming, collectively, a portrait of a man with little time to do anything but scurry from one unreported molestation to the next. Even v1 and v9 would have had to take turns getting ravaged in Sandusky’s basement, as their supposed ordeals there overlapped between 2005 and 2008.


This observations are from a trial observer.

RR (v10) DOB 1998

Attorney: Andrew Shubin

Spoke with friend JS (v3) before allegations. Was roommates with him during 98 Second Mile camp.

In 1998 RR lived in Moshannon with his mother, stepfather and stepbrother. He last saw his father at the age of four. He attended Second Mile in 1997, 98, 99 . In 98 his roommate was JS (v3). In ’98 he was placed in foster care with Cheryl Sharer in Milesburg and attended his second Second Mile summer Camp. After being in the foster home for eleven months he lived with grandparents in Maryland and later lived again with his mother and stepfather.

He was incarcerated twice. For burglary in 2004, age 17, and in September of 2007 for burglary and assault. He and a 17 year old attacked an elderly man on the street, punched him in the face leaving him with permanent injuries, and robbed him of his backpack which held a camera and three books but no money. He was sentenced for 21 months and served until 2009. At time of trial he was married and his wife was pregnant.

November, December 2011

Following the arrest on November 5, 2011, Linda Kelly published a hotline number which RR called.

At the first interview with Sgt. Cranga, he told him he knew JS (v3), and that Sandusky. had groped him in the pool. He did not tell Cranga anything about oral sex.

During the second interview, he said that he performed oral sex on Sandusky. in a silver convertible. The Sandusky’s never owned any kind of convertible.

In the Grand Jury, he told them Sandusky demanded oral sex but he refused and then Sandusky got quiet. At trial he said that Sandusky demanded oral sex and he refused and Sandusky made a threat and got angry, then apologized and told RR he loved him. When confronted with his dissimilar stories, he resolved it by saying Sandusky was quiet but had a displeasing look on his face.

June 22, 2012

New stories emerge during trial. RR described being invited to a football game. At some point in time, although he couldn’t remember days or times or connected events, he was taken to the basement and after wrestling around, and Sandusky abruptly and silently pull his shorts down and began to perform oral sex on him. His reaction to that was to freak out, get nervous and scared. It lasted a couple of minutes. Sandusky went upstairs after the couple minutes. RR said Sandusky told him if he ever told anybody he would never see his family again. Later Sandusky apologized to RR and told him he loved him. On cross he said Dorothy was in the house. He said he went to Jerry’s house five times. RR said that Sandusky reached up inside his shorts as he was sitting on his shoulders in the pool, and grabbed his genitals. He testified that after a trip to Nittany Mall he was taken to the house and had oral sex performed on him and he returned the favor. He was taken home to Ms. Sharer’s after that. He did not tell her about the event. He never told anybody because he was scared, ashamed and embarrassed.

Upon questioning by Amendola RR regarding the attack in the basement story, trying to pin down a time, RR said the first time he went to the Sandusky residence was in 1997 before a football game and there were other children and his wife. Next he said the first time he went to the house nobody was there, not even Mrs. Sandusky. He said he did not tell JS (v3), his roommate that Sandusky grabbed his genitals in the pool during camp in 98. When asked to provide information about the alleged times JS picked him up and took him to his home to assault him, RR was vague and said he couldn’t recall days. RR said usually later in the afternoon to evening time, nobody else was in the home and he was always taken home at night. This is an unlikely scenario due to Sandusky’s duties as Penn State Coach during fall when RR alleges abuse.

On cross, RR strayed from saying abuse only happened in 98 and included 99. Confronted with a statement on an application to attend the 2000 Second Mile Camp, indicating he enjoyed the camps, he said that was a wrong statement.

RR’S testimony was inconsistent and contained obvious fabrications.


Does anyone what to take a stab and explain why they think RR’s(v10) testimony is credible and can easily stands on its own to convict Sandusky on his own? My guess is that at a minimum, one would have to do a lot of stretching to make that case. Anybody else want to take a stab and make the case for another specific claimant that can provides a story that makes a credible accusation of CSA by Sandusky sufficient enough to convict Sandusky on its own?

This basic question has been asked consistenly for the past few years. It has been asked many times in this thread and I don't believe anybody has come with anything close to credible evidence that would be capable of convicting Sandusky of CSA on its own. Does anybody else think that this revelation says something?

You didn't actually list anything from a credible source that discounts his testimony.
 
I’ll just tiptoe back in here. If we’re going to question this victim because he has a criminal record, we should probably point out that Sandusky was convicted on 45 of 48 counts associated with criminal sexual abuse.
 
You didn't actually list anything from a credible source that discounts his testimony.

On the contrary, I believe that Fred Crews is extremely credible and his book review in Skeptic magazine destroys v10's testimony.

Frederick Campbell Crews (born 20 February 1933)[1] is an American essayist and literary critic. Professor emeritus of English at the University of California, Berkeley,[2] Crews is the author of numerous books, including The Tragedy of Manners: Moral Drama in the Later Novels of Henry James (1957), E. M. Forster: The Perils of Humanism (1962), and The Sins of the Fathers (1966), a discussion of the work of Nathaniel Hawthorne. He received popular attention for The Pooh Perplex (1963), a book of satirical essays parodying contemporary casebooks. Initially a proponent of psychoanalytic literary criticism, Crews later rejected psychoanalysis, becoming a critic of Sigmund Freud and his scientific and ethical standards. Crews was a prominent participant in the "Freud wars" of the 1980s and 1990s, a debate over the reputation, scholarship and impact on the 20th century of the founder of psychoanalysis.

Crews has published a variety of skeptical and rationalist essays, including book reviews and commentary for The New York Review of Books, on a variety of topics including Freud and recovered memory therapy, some of which were published in The Memory Wars (1995). Crews has also published successful handbooks for college writers, such as The Random House Handbook.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Crews
 
I’ll just tiptoe back in here. If we’re going to question this victim because he has a criminal record, we should probably point out that Sandusky was convicted on 45 of 48 counts associated with criminal sexual abuse.

I don't accept the verdicts from a patently unfair trial. The results of an unfair trial are inherently unreliable.

Sandusky's record from before 2011 is clean.
 
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I don't accept the verdicts from a patently unfair trial. The results of an unfair trial are inherently unreliable.

Sandusky's record from before 2011 is clean.

Fair enough. I don’t accept this other guy’s conviction on burglary and assault charges.
 
Fair enough. I don’t accept this other guy’s conviction on burglary and assault charges.

The burglary and assault charges doesn't make his story incredible on its own. It is the entirety of his story that makes it incredible and his criminal record doesn't help.
 
The burglary and assault charges doesn't make his story incredible on its own. It is the entirety of his story that makes it incredible and his criminal record doesn't help.

Likewise, Sandusky’s history of showering alone and having physical contact with underage boys. Boys claiming him he sexually assaulted them alone doesn’t cut it. Backing it up with his known propensity to shower alone with them adds to it.
How carefully have you studied this guy’s burglary and assault cases?
 
I’ll just tiptoe back in here. If we’re going to question this victim because he has a criminal record, we should probably point out that Sandusky was convicted on 45 of 48 counts associated with criminal sexual abuse.

And the fact that he contradicted his testimony in a post trial interview, which was pointed out by Ray Blehar, who does not believe in Sandusky’s innocence. Blehar has also sent messages to a man to Adam Clark, in which he states that Jim Clemente also believes Victim 10 to be a fraud (along with V5 and V9)

https://notpsu.blogspot.com/2013/08/victim-10s-tv-interview-inconsistent.html?m=1
 
And the fact that he contradicted his testimony in a post trial interview, which was pointed out by Ray Blehar, who does not believe in Sandusky’s innocence. Blehar has also sent messages to a man to Adam Clark, in which he states that Jim Clemente also believes Victim 10 to be a fraud (along with V5 and V9)

https://notpsu.blogspot.com/2013/08/victim-10s-tv-interview-inconsistent.html?m=1

It wouldn't be surprising for a victim (or anyone) to confuse small details 12 years after an event. It would be more suspicious if he claimed to be certain.

Who fabricates a story, with cooperation of an attorney (in the hope of getting a settlement without settling in on a set of facts?) Nobody.

If he's a real victim, his memory would be foggy. If he's fake, his memory would be spot on.
 
And the fact that he contradicted his testimony in a post trial interview, which was pointed out by Ray Blehar, who does not believe in Sandusky’s innocence. Blehar has also sent messages to a man to Adam Clark, in which he states that Jim Clemente also believes Victim 10 to be a fraud (along with V5 and V9)

https://notpsu.blogspot.com/2013/08/victim-10s-tv-interview-inconsistent.html?m=1

Well there you go. Free Jerry!
I’m heading down to the Smoky Mountains for the weekend. Have a great Independence Day everybody.
 
So the counter is that Dottie said he didn't have a "silver" convertible. Did he own a grey convertible? Did he enter pennDoT records into evidence?

Did he show logs of times when he notified TSM of off-campus 1 on 1 visits? The absence of V10 in the logs would be good evidence.... but he didn't make any such logs for anyone.

Did he have a rolodex or other list with contact info (the police would have that preserved from the search. If v10 wasn't in there, that'd be an indicator. But he didn't ... because V10 was probably in the rolodex.

There are likely call records that could be presented from the time frame establishing no calls from Jerry to V10s number... but they weren't presented.

Just an example, for the "weakest" accuser. Jerry made no attempt to put anything on the record for a Jury (and later, appeals courts) to work with.

So, he sits in prison.

No, he did not own a grey convertible. Why would he enter PennDot records? They obviously wouldn’t list what he did NOT own. Even so, you would then just claim he borrowed the car. The other accusers from the same time period as RRs were asked by the defense about the convertible. All answered they never saw Sandusky with one.

How does the fact that Sandusky did not keep logs of his visits with TSM kids off campus prove his guilt? I’m not sure if old call records are even accessible.
 
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