Wrong how?
The fact anyone is trying to defend those two teams as not doormats is hysterical
The mighty, fighting Minutemen of UMass prepped for PSU by losing
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The fact anyone is trying to defend those two teams as not doormats is hysterical
The SEC schools usually play a game like this in the middle of November.
They also tend to play actual rivalry games around it. I'd be fine with UMass if WVU was upgraded or Delaware was another low-level P5 team.
well good for them, but historically we have not done these types of games after the first three weeks, at least not in the past 30 years
prior to 2000 PSU was sometimes bold in scheduling difficult ooc games. then it just stopped. they have bean counters making the schedule, if we don't have the 7th home game we miss a million dollars from parking fees or whatever. that type of thinking is incapable of processing opportunity costs, like if we go 11-1 we are going to be left out of the playoff because we played freaking UMass and Delaware. turning just one of those into a road game vs a p5 opponent (not even a good one, necessarily), could be the difference in getting into the 4-team playoff. now we have to go undefeated to do it
Didn’t any of you guys ever kick the sh$t out of your little brother? Or get the sh$t kicked out of you by an older brother? In a few days it’ll be forgotten and life moves on. Just like this game. Go, don’t go, watch or don’t watch. Either way, drink and eat whatever you want and enjoy yourself life is too short to argue about UMASS.
Ohio State isn't a rivalry game for us. It's a big game but by "rivalry game" I mean Georgia-Georgia Tech, Auburn-Bama, Ole Miss-Miss State, etc. Actual rivalry games. Not a "big game".
What?
First of all, every teams’ non conference schedule has gotten weaker over the years; that’s not unique to PSU. When the 12th game was added, universally, that lead to teams adding an extra cupcake and a 7th home game a year - under the 11 game schedule most “good” teams played 6 home games most years.
If anything, PSU and most Big Ten have largely playing more difficult schedules than other power conference teams (especially the ACC and SEC). We have virtually always been playing 10 power 5 teams a season, not something all teams can say - and I’ve been critical of upcoming seasons where we play Temple for that very reason; those seasons are valid to be critical of but not this year.
Also, it’s just ludicrous to suggest that our schedule this season would keep us out of the playoffs. Do you think Georgia playing UT-Martin, Ball St and UAB is going to keep them out unless they go undefeated? Or Michigan without any P5 teams on their non conference schedule? The committee hasn’t shown even the slightest concern about the number or quantity of “weak” games on a schedule when selecting CFP participants.
What you are basically suggesting is that PSU play a harder schedule and make less revenue than other teams just because. What is the upside for the team or school?
If it was "only" a million dollars, it might not be as big of a deal...but you're underestimating how much money losing out on a home game would actually impact the bottom line.
We had a lot more flexibility for good non-conference games with an 8 game conference schedule. But there is no way we can, should, or would look into having a 6 game home schedule in the current environment.
if we get left out of the playoff because of our schedule, i don't think we remotely offset the revenue by playing delaware instead of an away game. also that kind of thinking has zero foresight into effects on the future of the program. this is the difference between thinking like an accountant who counts beans and thinking about the actual objective, which is having one of the top nationally successful football programs
Our non conference schedule is perfectly fine and there is zero chance it would impact our chances to make the playoffs.
Playing a more competitive non conference schedule- like adding a P5 opponent on the road as you suggest - is far more likely to prevent us from getting into the playoffs by increasing the chances for another loss.
We play 10 P5 games in 2023 which includes a non conference game against 4-1 WVU (who’s nothing special but perfectly reasonable power 5 opponent). There’s nothing to apologize or be concerned about with our schedule this season.
Now to be fair, I do agree that our weak non conference schedule could affect our CFP chances in 2025-26 - but that is because of the inexcusable decision to play a home and home with Temple not anything to do with the cupcake games at home. We need to drop the Temple series ASAP and schedule a team with a pulse in 2025-26.
well we can agree to disagree on that.
i could live with one of UMass or Delaware.
having both in the same season is likely to keep us out of the playoff if we have even one loss, IMO. and I think that is entirely preventable by finding a two season home-and-away agreement against someone with a pulse
Find a team that has a shot at the playoff that only has one cupcake game. I’ll wait.
we are just not going to agree. even a game against Temple would have been far superior to either of these
We don’t have to agree. You just are making an assertion that has no basis in fact. The CFP has never shown even the slightest care about what or how many cupcakes are played by teams.
i don't think that's true and schedule strength is something that the committee looks at. if there are multiple 11-1 teams we will be on the outside looking in, I can almost guarantee it. and somebody will bring up Delaware and UMass which are embarrassing even by cupcake standards
Let’s schedule Bama, Georgia, and Clemson for our OOC to make some posters happy so they can turn around and bitch when we finish the season 9-3 and don’t make the playoffs….but by God they will have some good games to watch.
Tell me what other team would be taken over us with the same record and how their schedule would be superior? Since you are so certain, please be specific.
Michigan or Ohio State; Oklahoma or Texas; Alabama or Georgia
all would be taken over us if it came down to us vs any of them with the same record
Texas because they played Bama on the road
Ohio State beaches they played ND on the road
Michigan: plays East Carolina, UNLV, Bowling Green [no P5 teams non-conference]
Ohio State: plays Youngstown St, Western Kentucky
Oklahoma: plays Arkansas St, Tulsa, SMU [no P5 teams non-conference]
Texas: plays Rice, Wyoming
Alabama: plays Middle Tennessee, South Florida, Chattanooga
Georgia: plays UT-Martin, Ball St, UAB
It's entirely possible that one of those teams could get into the playoff over PSU with both at 1 losses. It would have absolutely nothing to do with PSU playing two cupcakes and the quality of those opponents. Everyone else you have mentioned has similar or even worse opponents on their non-conference schedule - including teams that didn't even schedule a single Power 5 team out of conference or have 3 non-Power 5 cupcakes.
This is entirely possible. And playing a "better" cupcake than UMass or Delaware or playing a middle of the road P5 team instead of one of them wouldn't change that in the slightest.
Again, the cupcake games don't matter at all. The committee has never even penalized anyone who plays more of them than other teams.
And that may change next year with a 12 team playoff
My issue isn't Delaware and UMass. It's those 2 WITH West Virginia as your big game--that can't happen.
No, we don't, Lando.
We play in the toughest division in college football. I'm happy to have some cupcakes on the schedule...just like the big, bad SEC teams do. Hell, they get the equivalent of an exhibition game in November.
The secret to winning national championships is not only top-notch talent, coaching, and recruiting...but also smart scheduling...and that means one legit, challenging out-of-conference game plus a couple walkovers.
At the end of the day, if we beat Ohio State and Michigan, we're in the playoffs. And even if we only beat one of them, we've still got a decent shot, assuming we take care of business with all our other opponents. The OOC slate won't change that equation in the slightest.
i don't know why people believe we have a decent shot at the playoff if we only beat one of OSU or Michigan.
If we beat both, then yeah, because in that case we are 12-0 and ranked #1 or #2. but if we lose to either one, that team is taking a spot and we are behind the other (OSU or Michigan) even though we defeated them.
Temple can't be our big game
WVU can't be our big game
We aren't going to be playing Michigan and Ohio State every year moving forward. The non-conference slate must improve. I'm fine with the two cupcakes but the other game must be at least Auburn's level
Ohio State plays Texas next year--if we finish with the same record as either of them we're out if it's between the two of us for the last spot. There's not an even an argument because they played that game.
I am not as worried about the schedule moving forward.
not playing OSU or Michigan every year means that we are more frequently facing USC, Oregon, Washington, etc. I think that's going to work out fine for us and PSU was smart not to get locked into a "traditional" rivalry (because they would have given us one of the stupid trophy games - Minnesota or MSU).
but this years OOC is a joke other than WVU. If there was any inkling that the 2023 could be a contender they should have tried harder on the schedule
…which the same can be said for every other school with CFP hopes
Say we beat Ohio St and lose to Michigan...Michigan then runs the table. An 11-1 Penn State is ranked ahead of a 10-2 Ohio State. And that 11-1 Penn State would be in the mix, but would depend on what happens elsewhere.
yes it is, but, the reason it is our big ooc game is because we scheduled Delaware and UMass as the other two.
i don't really have any problem with us scheduling WVU per se. it is a fine game to schedule
And how about Oklahoma or Michigan’s non conference schedule?
Is having Georgia Tech as your “big” non conference game not a joke? And 3 cupcakes on top of that?
What if Michigan State is your best non conference game?
Our non conference schedule is fine. Would it be better if we had a top notch opponent instead of WVU? Sure. But outside of maybe 15 or so teams we could have played, WVU is just as good as most any P5 team.
I've bashed Michigan nonstop for their non conference share.
It isn't fine...not sure why you're desperate to sell that it is.
Because ultimately it’s a comparison to other teams and PSU’s non conference schedule is exceedingly typical for most contenders. It’s not “bad” or “weak”. Michigan’s is an example of one that is actually weak and not acceptable.
There’s nothing special about PSU’s non conference schedule but it’s not a “joke” at all
I'm sorry but pretending WVU makes it acceptable isn't true. Our schedule is weak and we're getting zero credit for any of those games.
WVU isn’t weak. I agree we aren’t getting “credit” but we also aren’t getting any “criticism”. The schedule is just… there.
Only like 15 or so teams would really “move the needle” and beyond that it just matters that you played a P5 team which we did.
We disagree on WVU completely which is fine. We can all have different standards.
Pretty much any SEC team would carry more weight than WVU. They're on par with something like Vanderbilt in the minds of the voters. Might as well take Michigan's route if that's your best game IMO
I think WVU is well above Vanderbilt with voters, but, I think the problem was the other two games in the same year . If our OOc was something like WVU, UMass, Oregon or WVU, UMass, USC we would not be having this discussion
If we played USC/Oregon and WVU, we’d have far and away the toughest non conference schedule of any team aspiring for the CFP. that’s an absurd standard to suggest.
Again, every single team plays at least two cupcakes.
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